>*Wins The Great War for the allies*
Seriously how is this up for debate? Until the USA joined in the result of WW1 was pretty much a coin flip as the front-line hadn't budged a bit for the past 3 years and the Eastern front had just been won by the Germans. When the USA arrived the first major assault started taking place and serious land taken by the allies, leading to the defeat of Germany. Is it pride that makes you deny the USA having a crucial role or something else?
This desu. Not even a flag waver, but you can't argue that an extra 2 million Americans boosting Allied numbers did not greatly contribute to the undeserved Allied victory
Burger here.
I thought the British won the war with the Hundred Days Offensive.
Look at the image posted you mong. It should be obvious that the manpower to launch the Hundred Days would not have been available without the extra half a million doughboyz
America's martial contribution in WW1 was less than decisive. America's money and supplies made a much greater impact than anything Pershing or any American did in the field.
Without American numbers the Allies cannot break Germany in the West
The Germans were starving and their military situation was intractable. You're argument is for a faster time-table, not a different result.
True, but if the German offensives against France are not checked by US Marines at Catingy & Belleau Wood do the frogs even keep Paris?
intervention was a mistake.
>but if the German offensives against France are not checked by US Marines at Catingy & Belleau Wood do the frogs even keep Paris?
Yes?
This, Wilson was evil
>not a different result.
Very doubtable. Without America, a German collapse would not be foreseeable in the immediate future, possibly compelling the leadership and the public in France and the UK to start thinking about some sort of white peace. Generally, Germany would have had more strategic options in 1918 without the Americans, e.g. securing order in Ukraine and the other occupied territories in the East, thus enabling more food imports eventually or stabilizing their Allies, especially by striking further blows against the Italians
>Without America, a German collapse would not be foreseeable in the immediate future, possibly compelling the leadership and the public in France and the UK to start thinking about some sort of white peace
The allied position was improving every year with new colonials and ever-greater production of all necessary materials (as well as access to the world market) while the German position was continually deteriorating every moment after the troops from the east arrived in the west and was already reaching crises levels in 1917. Even without American men the German military situation was hopeless.
The british army was severely depleted, and the French soldiers were refusing to attack after the failure of the Neville offensive in 1917.
The Allies weren't able to achieve a breakthrough in the West in 1917 when Germany was still fully engaged in the East, I can't see how there was a short term perspective for a German collapse in the West after Brest-Litovsk in a scenario without the Americans. The inflow of colonials did not come close to what the Americans brought in in 1918. Given that an end of the war was not within immediate reach, I could see how the Allies would prefer negotiating peace
>Given that an end of the war was not within immediate reach, I could see how the Allies would prefer negotiating peace
It could just as well just have ended after another year or two with an allied victory as the German situation became untenable. Even without an Allied breakthrough on the Western front Germany was on a strict time-table to find a conclusion before the strain of running the war economy on their interior would become too great from shortages. Time was on the side of the Allies.
America is truly the greatest nation on earth
The Soring Offensive already faltered without significant numbers of Americans present (although it may have taken a different form without the time limit imposed by US entry) and the blockade was ticking along just fine.
To be honest, whoever sent (or forged) the Zimmerman Telegram is the one who won that war for the allies
Zimmerman admitted it was real.
I only put it in there to prevent a spergout from kaiserboos
The Germans were fucking wrecked by the time the Americans arrived. They sure sped things up but the Germans lost the war the moment they stopped being on the offensive and the French turned it into a war of attrition.
Add in the British finally deciding that they should get more involved and use their navy to its full potential and you can clearly see Germany had no chance whatsoever. It's a farce that it actually lasted as long as it did.
This
America fuck yeah, we n° 1
Pic related, America had more troops than Britain on the final offensive
>America had more troops than Britain on the final offensive
It's almost as if Britain had already lost hundreds of thousands of troops by that point
That's troops present in the theater, not troops engaged in the actual battle. Only a fraction of Americans in France ever saw combat.
This is actually vastly overestimated. If you look at the numbers there were extremely few refusals to attack. It wasn't even refusal of combat or desertion but simply contestation of retarded orders. Nivelle is the best example.
The French soldiers might have had a morale crisis, but they still wanted to fight.
>'had more'
>evidence presents equal numbers
You're not biased at all, are you user?
Operation Michael was stopped by both french and british. Cantigny (US-French) and Belleau Wood (US-French-British) were minor events regarding the scale of the battle. Don't get me wrong, those battles were useful but not determining. Also in american's minds they had a huge impact because those were the first battles the US troops fought. They are kind of uncriticizable symbols and i understand that.
To go further, the USA entered the war because USA basically didn't want to see Germany taking over the Atlantic ocean. Yes the USA won the WWI for the allies imo. They saved the frogs and anglos asses.
But let's admit it, the USA appeared in late war when all sides were exhausted over 4 years in the war already and they basically showed themselves over the parapet of a trench thus scaring the shit out of the germans eventually getting 53.000 fatalities in the process. Their mere prescence on the french soil was enough to win the war. Although being young and without experience, the US troops learnt quickly how to wage a modern war. They also mobilized 4.355.000 soldiers however 1.894.000 were actually deployed in France and only 25% of the 2M troops fought on the frontline. And yet they saved our asses. I'm in no way minoring the global US involvment in the Great War. It was a drop in the sea...but a big drop.
"Lafayette nous voila!"
>Germany had a bigger army than France and UK so much
Hard to imagine there was a time that germans fucked as rabbits
Wasnt Pershing a really stubborn dude that lost a lot of man when he first arrived because he refused to listen to Foch?
*Wins the WWI*
USA in the Great War timeline and numbers:
August 1914: ~50 americans join the Légion étrangère.
April 1916: Squadron 124 "Escadrille américaine" is created at Luxeuil-les-Bains.
April 6, 1917: The United States declares war on Germany.
4 million men were drafted into military service. 2 million men were in France by November 1918. 3 million men were draft dodger in the US.
June 13, 1917: John Pershing, AEF commander, and 176 US soldiers arrives at Boulogne-sur-Mer.
June 26, 1917: The 1st US division arrives at Saint-Nazaire. They are sent near Toul, a relatively calm and stable stretch of the frontline.
November 2, 1917: first engagement. A battalion fights at Bathelémont-lès-Bauzemont. 3 KIA.
May 28, 1918: Battle of Cantigny. The first american battle and offensive of WWI. 4.000 men engaged along with french troops.
June 6-22, 1918: Battle of Belleau Wood. 2 US Divisions along with french and british troops.
July 15, 1918: The 3rd US Division earns the nickname "Rock of the Marne" after the Battle of Château-Thierry (part of the Second Battle of the Marne, the last major german offensive on the western front)
September 26, 1918 - November 11, 1918: Meuse-Argonne Offensive (1st US Army and 4th French Army)
November 11, 1918: Armistice
USA in the Great War timeline and numbers:
August 1914: ~50 americans join the Légion étrangère.
April 1916: Squadron 124 "Escadrille américaine" is created at Luxeuil-les-Bains.
April 6, 1917: The United States declares war on Germany.
4 million men were drafted into military service. 2 million men were in France by November 1918. 3 million men were draft dodger in the US.
June 13, 1917: John Pershing, AEF commander, and 176 US soldiers arrive at Boulogne-sur-Mer.
June 26, 1917: The 1st US division arrives at Saint-Nazaire. They are sent near Toul, a relatively calm and stable stretch of the frontline.
November 2, 1917: first engagement. A battalion fights at Bathelémont-lès-Bauzemont. 3 KIA.
May 28, 1918: Battle of Cantigny. The first american battle and offensive of WWI. 4,000 men engaged along with french troops.
June 6-22, 1918: Battle of Belleau Wood. 2 US Divisions along with french and british troops.
July 15, 1918: The 3rd US Division earns the nickname "Rock of the Marne" after the Battle of Château-Thierry (part of the Second Battle of the Marne, the last major german offensive on the western front)
September 26, 1918 - November 11, 1918: Meuse-Argonne Offensive (1st US Army and 4th French Army)
November 11, 1918: Armistice
53,402 KIA
63,114 any other cause (accident, disease,...)
Total fatalities: 116,516
204,002 WIA
3,350 MIA
Sort of. Honestly the biggest impact American entry had was that it forced Ludendorff to attempt the frankly I'll conceived Spring Offensive. Failing that operation destroying the German army's ability to fight effectively, it's more likely that a negotiated peace could be reached. While the "Million troops freed from the east" is over stated due to the need for occupation forces, the influx of several hundred thousand troops and the resources of the occupied lands would be nothing to sneeze at
While this is true, part of the reason order was restored was because Pétain promised no new offensives until the Americans arrived. The morale boost of America entering the war shouldn't be underestimated
which would have meant the allies won in 1919 probably using a combination of Fullers plan and the new chemical weapons they were preparing.
not so, the allies had finally developed a effective offensive technique that allowed them to inflict heavier losses on the germans while reducing their own casualties.
and yet accomplished far less.
in all seriousness both the british and french forces performed significantly better than the american forces during the hundred days.
>The morale boost of America entering the war shouldn't be underestimated
but nor should their actual military accomplishments be overstated.
the fighting was done by the british and the french, the destruction of the german army was done by the british and the french, the breaching of the hindenburg line was done by the british and the french.
if I roll a rock to the top of a hill, and know I can get it over the crest, how much grattitude should i owe to someone who shows up at the last second and gives it a nudge while I give its final push? the work was mostly done before a single american infantryman disembarked
WW1 had a much bigger impact on America than America had an impact on WW1. The war was the beginning of America's transition from group of rebellious colonies to a global superpower.
>the USA entered the war because USA basically didn't want to see Germany taking over the Atlantic ocean
Even with successful conclusion of the war for Germany, there was no way for them to achieve that. The High Seas Fleet proved unable to evict the Grand Fleet from naval supremacy. We entered the war to protect Wall Streetz loans to the Allies
>which would have meant the allies won in 1919 probably using a combination of Fullers plan and the new chemical weapons they were preparing
>conducting a winning offensive while having a infantry & artillery inferiority over Germany
>in a war that favored the defensive & would until the introduction of field radios to coordinate with artillery
Sorry senpai, but Allied air & armored superiority was not going to overcome those obstacles. The technology was in its infancy to prove decisive