How well does Russian knights stack up to their western European counterparts?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Druzhina

How about you learn something about the shit you're spewing. I'm Russian and there's no such thing as "druzhma", you fuckwit. If you're talking about druzhinas, then you're even more of a fuckwit, for they're not knights, but just infantry retinues in the service of a knyaz.

literally every time I come here its worse

Mods don't do their job :/

Russia definitely didn't have the culture of knighthood, but OP probably just means "noble heavy cavalry".

Well, medieval Russians weren't fighting against western-style enemies very often but judging by the record we can say that they were at least equal.
There were multiple wars and raids between Sweden and Novgorod, and most times Novgorod had the upper hand. Most notably see the battle of Neva, the destruction of Landscrona and the burning of Sigtuna. One time Novgorodians also burnt Abo, the main Swedish city in Finland. They also defeated the crusade of king Magnus in the 14th century.
Beating the Swedes isn't a very impressive achievement though, because medieval Sweden was a shithole, whose knights were very few in number with obsolete armor and weapons.

The Rus armor was inspired by Turks, Persians, Mongols, and Arabs, plus it had some elements so i guess it was superior to western European armor.

>implying we didn't make up the existence of mods on Veeky Forums
Moot is dead, mods are dead

Full plate is better by a mile

>russian knights
retard

defeating swedish cucks is not an achievement

>russian knights
HURR LOOK AT ME I'M AN AMERICAN LET'S TALK ABOUT RUSSIAN KNIGHTS, ITALIAN SPARTANS AND HOW HITLER LOST TO NAPOLEON

I'M 1/16 IRISH, 1/25 APACHE, 1/40 GERMAN AND 9/11 ARABIC

I RELLY LIKE SENDING YOUNG AMERICANS TO DIE IN RANDOM MIDDLE EASTERN COUNRIES TO DIE AND FURTHER JEWISH AGENDA

HURR HURR HURR *pig squeal*

BTW I ALSO GET HYPED FOR DISNEY MOVIES BECAUSE EVERYONE IN MY COUNTRY IS MENTALLY 12YO

Empire of Rus had slightly different feudalism but yes still had a mounted middleclass
They were inferior to Western Europeans due to not adapting plate but staying with lamellar, however Russian knights needed to be lighter to catch the light enemy cav they fought. Whilst the need for plate was not as great in Western Europe as East Slavic states would just have muskets en mass which could destroy enemy horse archers.
But if hypothetically England and Kievan Rus met in open field they'd lose, the same with France and Kievan Rus

Sorry forget to mention Pic related is what the Italians at least had achieved whilst those Osprey Russians exist

>en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rus'_Khaganate
>Thirty years later, in spring 871, the eastern and western emperors, Basil I and Louis II, quarreled over control of Bari, which had been conquered from the Arabs by their joint forces. The Byzantine emperor sent an angry letter to his western counterpart, reprimanding him for usurping the title of emperor. He argued that the Frankish rulers are simple reges, while the imperial title properly applied only to the overlord of the Romans, that is, to Basil himself. He also pointed out that each nation has its own title for the supreme ruler: for instance, the title of chaganus is used by the overlords of the Avars, Khazars (Gazari), and "Northmen" (Nortmanno). To that, Louis replied that he was aware only of the Avar khagans, and had never heard of the khagans of the Khazars and Normans.[11][12] The content of Basil's letter, now lost, is reconstructed from Louis's reply, quoted in full in the Salerno Chronicle, and it indicates that at least one group of Scandinavians had a ruler who called himself "khagan".[13]
WIKIPEDIA ADMITS IT, the HRE was an empire

Is the guy on the left holding maracas?

Iam highly sceptical about the effectivity of Russian armour compared to the stuff from places liek Milan, but iam sure that they had another reason to make it like that, not just being influenced by Eastern nations that used simmilar armor.

plate wasn't needed against enemies they fought

No drummer, look at his horse
See

>muh plate
You realise Western Europeans got BTFO all the time by lamellar wearing Rus/Lithuanians/Tatars/Timurids, right?

No, not at all
Kinda wondering how the timurids got to Central Europe tho

Fuck off, Nietzsche, your defeatism isn't helpful here

never happened

>mounted drummer
man that had to be fun

Western European knights and Russian noble heavy cavalry would be equal. It all depends on the tactical situation and leadership. As another poster said - there were occasions when either of the sides would win.
Armour type make little difference and in some periods was the same old chain mail for everyone.

>russia
>existing during medieval period
>orthodox world
>having knights

I don't know how accurate these Osprey illustrations are, but I find nothing obsolete for the 14th century on it.

>plate loses to lamellar
>what is Kievan Rus and the polity held together by the Golden Horde
>knights can't be used for any middle military caste

Croatia had knights didn't it?

True

But it would be easier to fully equip more horsemen in lamaller

>Rus
Swedes and Teutonic Knights failed miserably (Swedish-Novgorod wars, Battle on Ice)

>Lithuanians and Tatars
Teutonic Knights got slapped (Lithuanian-Crusader wars, battle of Grunwald, battle of the Vorskla River)

>Timurids
Tamerlane managed to easily destroy almost every single Hospitaller castle in Anatolia, also he defeated and humiliated Bayezid the Thunderbolt, who managed to absolutely slaughter Western knights at Nicopolis.

you conveniently forget about polish knights who were present at Grunwald

guess what those fucking knights wore

Say what you want but Eastern armor is aesthetic.

Neither country could defeat Teutonics at that battle, also check out how "well" Northern Crusades went.
>inb4 they eventually won!

If they were so good why were they raped by the mongols and paid tribute to the golden hord

gonna hijack this shit thread and ask - did Romania have knights or used plate armor?

the fuck are you on about retard? Teutonic Knights lost at Grunwald.

>Neither country could defeat Teutonics at that battle

>Neither country alone could defeat Teutonics at that battle
>Neither country on their own could defeat Teutonics at that battle
>Neither country could individually defeat Teutonics at that battle
Is it all it takes to confuse you, braindead idiot?

those horses look like fucking ponies

Ponies were used for battles too.

It most certainly is not.
>that cap
>those chin-guards

but that's a retarded argument by that logic patritions of Poland didn't count because 3 countries had to attack it

>hurr if it's not 1v1 then it doesn't count
faggot

fuck lamellar shit armor even ruskies you shill so much also used chainmail you fucking zipperhead go eat a dog or get nuked or something because I bet you're a chink fuck you

>croatia
>part of orthodox world
>kievian rus
>petty decentralized federation of various tribes
>totally same thing as imperial russia

Aren't Croats mainly Catholic?

they are mainly muslim like most slavs

>they are mainly muslim like most slavs
?

d

Pretty mediocre compared to most kingdoms.

Croatia is Catholic.

As long as there is no crossbow, chainmail does better job, plus that time of the Kievan Rus, western europeans didn't use plate armor yet, there was the brigandine which was first adopted by russians from Mongols and Persians and Turks .. in western Europe, there was boiled hardened leather + hauberk and as a helmet used The great Helm + metallic gauntlets and metallic boots

Just to point that out: The teutonic knights were eventually defeated in all cases, but they also went against numerically superior forces in their homelands, which is quite a feat by itself. Just how much russians and poles pride themselves on defeating them shows how well regarded they were.

I'm Polish and I pride myself in being throwing rocks at police officers and being able to outrun them.

The vast majority of these battles happened before plate armour was even around, let alone fully developed.

And at the Battle of Grunwald you had Polish troops on the opposing side who were equipped in pretty much the same fashion as their Teutonic counterparts.

t. EU3 pro

What are those masks called?

>Battle on Ice
Modern Russian historians generally agree that this was an insignificant skirmish with less than 1,000 people involved in total that was more or less totally made up by nationalist propaganda. Neither the Suzdalian chronicle (the Lavrent'evskiy), nor any of the Swedish sources make any mention whatsoever, and the Livonian Chronicle mentions it two sentences where it says a couple dozen knights were killed.

Pretty similar, though slightly inferior in equipment (they didn't use transitional armor or plate armor when it finally got around to being created) and likely tactical ability (since the Rus', being sparse, would see nowhere near as many local wars or training exercises in general).

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Koronowo
How do you know, that Poles alone didn't stand a chance? They were equally numbered, and Lithuanian forces fucked up so hard, that they were basically net negative.

Swedes we're backwards whilst the Teutons had a stupid government so no surprise they lost
>Lithuania wars
So is Poland Western European not Central European now
>comic book power ratings
Well done user, 10/10

>just repeating lines no engraving
Wew

Romania doesn't exist, Walachia does, and they used lamellar

No mainly Catholics, I have a friend from there
Then why is Muscovy considered the successor of Kievan Rus
>chainmale is better than plate
Wew

>Then why is Muscovy considered the successor of Kievan Rus
It literally wasn't. They self claimed it, and after few hundred years and when Russia become great power, everyone just went with it.

Holy shit Poles are so insecure.

>h-holy shit Poles are so i-insecure.
fify

Stop stuttering you Slavic ape.

>Rus
>not saying local wars
retard

the fuck this thread have to do with Poles?

Nothing, but there are some ignorant people out there.

I once got baned for posting a thread to bait out inca tard
The very same day i found a anne frank thread that had lasted for days