Did the holocaust happen? What I mean by that is was there a systematic gassing program to exterminate the Jews

Yes.

Raul Hilberg's 'The Destruction of European Jewry' is the best book on the subject, and I advocate anyone wanting to read about the Nazi holocaust look into it. Probably the most detailed study on the subject; avoids any pop-history versions of the holocaust and is great for debunking /pol/fags delusions.

Why are /pol/ retards obsessed with the holocaust?

>You're retarded if you believe this. Even once someone beats the numbers (which will likely happen) it will still be very important as it was the first industrial genocide
What's important about the first industrial genocide?

What concrete political consequences did the Holocaust have except perhaps more sympathy for Israeli nationalism and wartime propaganda?

Concepts like right of self-determination, international restrictions on ethnic cleansing, etc., would've happened anyway if it hadn't already.

Even the genocides committed by the Turks are more important as it cleansed Christians off Eastern Anatolia, allowing Turkey to be twice its size in the end and securing a role as an important actor in the Middle East for years to come.

It's rhetoric carried over from when stormfront established a reddit colony. After the gamergate shitstorm on /v/, it brought in a lot of new users, who subsequently migrated back to /pol/ once the userbase got big enough

Crypto and Neo Fascists believe that if the holocaust can be 'disproved', then Fascism can be redeemed in the general public's eyes as a legitimate ideology.

As far as I'm concerned there has been no proof of a systematic genocide other than "Yes, goyim, those pesky germies killed all of my family! Now give me money!"
I am convinced people were killed simply for being jewish in the 3rd Reich, but not because of orders from government officials and shit.
But those killings are like saying a guy being killed for being black today means the government is genocidal and racist. And most casualties were from lack of food and medicine in the camps at the end of the war, due to the allies bombing the supply trucks and trains.

yeah, because in 1940-41 when Jews were starving in Ghetto's, it was because of the Allies
retard

>le allies did the holocaust by bombing supplies

Funny how the camp guards and military prisoners from the western allies suffered no where near the same level of disease and starvation as other prisoners. Even wierder when you notice they were sometimes kept in the same camps but still suffered disproportionately.

Really makes you think.

>>>pol

From Goebbels himself

"The procedure is a pretty barbaric one and not to be described here more definitely. Not much will remain of the Jews. On the whole it can be said that about 60 per cent of them will have to be liquidated whereas only 40 per cent can be used for forced labor."

Imma post this and then leave this shithole of a thread

Sage goes on all fields

He's too retarded to realize governments typically try to do this kind of stuff subtly and covertly while maintaining the ability to plausibly deny. The Nazis didn't even do that, but anyway.

I'd like to see holocaust deniers try to tell old Jewish-populated towns (some were even reaching majorities) how it's all a lie.

Yes.

>Gassing were only for those who couldn't work
Does that make it okay?

no wonder Poland got so fucked in the war.

>And most casualties were from lack of food and medicine in the camps at the end of the war, due to the allies bombing the supply trucks and trains.
Please explain how allied bombing had anything to do with mobile killing squads going around executing Jews in Eastern Europe.
Also please explain how at the Belsen camp, hundreds of tons of food were found locked up, just a few miles away from where tens of thousands starved to death.
When the Allies reached the Nazi death camps in Germany, they found the SS personnel well-fed and well-dressed, and the local population was often not undergoing serious hardship, relatively speaking. (On the other hand, the German population in the big cities did suffer a lot.) This is clearly attested to in the film footage of the liberation of the camps, where one can see the people in the nearby towns and villages, which the American soldiers brought over to the camps so they can witness what happened. None of them are starved.

There is also a famous photograph of some plump SS women being captured at Bergen-Belsen. Tens of thousands of prisoners starved at Belsen. If you've seen a film of emaciated corpses being bulldozed into mass graves, it was probably taken at Belsen. The contrast to the well-fed SS women is quite remarkable. Scenes from the liberation of Bergen-Belsen demonstrate this beyond question.

Also, hardly any of the Allied prisoners from Western nations starved to death; there were people that the Nazis wanted to keep alive, and there were people they preferred dead. A great number of Soviet POW's died -- over three million -- for this reason.

Holocaust wasn't done by a fascist regime though.

Yes.

>real fascism has never been tried

>Hitlerism is the same thing as Fascism

>but not because of orders from government officials and shit.
You won't mind explaining these quotes then.

Hans Frank's diary (from Nazi Conspiracy and Aggression, 1946, Vol. I, pp. 992, 994):

But what should be done with the Jews? Do you think they will be settled down in the 'Ostland' [eastern territories], in [resettlement] villages? This is what we were told in Berlin: Why all this bother? We can do nothing with them either in the 'Ostland' nor in the 'Reichkommissariat.' So liquidate them yourself.

Gentlemen, I must ask you to rid yourself of all feeling of pity. We must annihilate the Jews, wherever we find them and wherever it is possible, in order to maintain the structure of the Reich as a whole. ...

We cannot shoot or poison these 3,500,000 Jews, but we shall nevertheless be able to take measures, which will lead, somehow, to their annihilation....

That we sentence 1,200,000 Jews to die of hunger should be noted only marginally.

Himmler's speech at Posen on October 4, 1943 was captured on audiotape (Trial of the Major War Criminals, 1948, Vol. XXIX, p. 145, trans. by current author):

I refer now to the evacuation of the Jews, the extermination of the Jewish people. This is one of those things that is easily said: "the Jewish people are being exterminated," says every Party member, "quite true, it's part of our plans, the elimination of the Jews, extermination, we're doing it."

Goebbels (as translated in Lochner, The Goebbels Diaries, 1948, pp. 86, 147-148):

February 14, 1942: The Führer once again expressed his determination to clean up the Jews in Europe pitilessly. There must be no squeamish sentimentalism about it. The Jews have deserved the catastrophe that has now overtaken them. Their destruction will go hand in hand with the destruction of our enemies. We must hasten this process with cold ruthlessness.

March 27, 1942: The procedure is a pretty barbaric one and not to be described here more definitely. Not much will remain of the Jews. On the whole it can be said that about 60 per cent of them will have to be liquidated whereas only 40 per cent can be used for forced labor.

>However, the primary goal of the camps was slave labor, not to kill people.
Feeding your workers a fraction of the calories you need to survive is murder. You can't really separate the idea of "death camp" from the "work camp."