Why has Russia's economy failed to benefit from the transition from communism to capitalism under authoritarian...

communist states don't exist.

Neoliberal shock treatment as well as massive corrupt deals for insiders who made a storming amount of cash asset stripping the state between 1991-1998 is the real answer senpai.

This.

This being said, it was hardliners in the politburo preventing real reform until a total collapse became inevitable.

Good post

>transition from communism to capitalism under authoritarian government
Because that never happened. Yeltsin was the opposite of authoritarian, he was an incompetent liberal democrat.

This

Because soviet 'government' willingly dismantle USSR and lose control on the situation.

Because China now is about as wealthy as Russia in the 1980s. Totally different situations.

>Transition from State capitalism to mixed economy.
Fucking retard. Not all communism is your meme construct. Marxism-Leninism is a TYPE of communism. Among the umbrella of communism are some fairly diverse ideologies. You don't own a monopoly on the word. If any one deserved it though, it'd be them because unlike you and your fantasy meme communism Marxism Leninism was tangibly practiced
Bad post
Not this

China's government has an unspoken pact with the people, as long as they continue to deliver economic prosperity the people will tolerate authoritarian one party rule and not destroy them the same way so many Chinese dynasties have been destroyed. Russia's people by contrast have given up, they expect that all the wealth will be sucked up by a handful of corrupt oligarchs and don't see what could change that. "You pretend to pay us, we pretend to work".

This is correct

t.samefag

nope

>phonefagging

Get off your phone and clean your room.

Fuck off peterson, go misread nizche

China's economy is built on manufacturing and industry and is transitioning to high technology, Russia just exports raw materials. Where's the Russian Shenzhen or the Russian Huawei for example?

Maybe it has something to do with China having almost 10 times more people than Russia, China having clear access to the Pacific with countless prospering ports, China maintaining a greater influence on Asia than the USA and Russia combined, China having strong diplomatic and economical relations with the rest of the planet, China not uselessly spending fuckloads on the arms race and military in general, etc.

Not only did they play their hands better but they had natural advantages.

>nizsche

bahhahaha too good

Basically the entire soviet system basiczlly collapsd overnight and was transformed into a free market system with exactly zero planning or foresight and also run by some of the most corrupt motherfuckers on earth and so obviously collapsed and now is still struggling with the massive structural flaws this created

China on the other hand is very much still in transition and never underwent such turmoil. Neoliberals like to pretend that china is suddenly not socialist but they still have 5 year plans and half of the economy is still state run. They introduced the bits of the free market system they liked, on their terms and graducally, rather than completely levelling the previous system and hoping it worked.

Because Russian genetics are fucked for another 50-100 years. The 20th century was a nightmare for a large part of the globe and, for Russia, a Neverending torture room where the bad man comes every so often to violate you, without end for decades and decades...

This.

The CCP has been blessed by Heaven to have Tianxia over the Chinese people.

You think Russia's 20th century was bad, you should see China from 1840 to 1980.

>Century of humiliation
>Opium wars
>Taiping Civil War
>Boxer Rebellion
>First Sino-Japanes War
>Qing collapse
>Republic collapse and Warlord Era
>KMT-CCP Civil War
>Second Sino-Japanese War (WW2)
>KMT-CCP Civil War Round 2
>Great Leap Forward
>Great Chinese Famine
>Anti-Rightist Campaign
>Cultural Revolution
The Chinese suffered just as bad if not worse than the Russians.

China is 91% Han whereas Soviet Union was 50% Russian. one is obviously more likely than the other to split along ethnic lines thus causing economic chaos

It's actually pretty impressive how all those people who have different genetics and varying culture and historically spoke different languages still consider themselves a single Han people, it's as if Italians, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Romanians, Greeks etc. all considered themselves Romans

>$18,000 PPP
>$8,700 nominal
>Russia 1980’s

Maybe at their 1988 peak. Then again, that was a shitshow held together by oil, debt, and arms sales. Russia barely even surpassed that 1988 peak in recent years.

I think it's more analogous to how Venetians, Sicilians, Tuscans, etc. all consider themselves Italians despite different genetics, culture, and languages.

>having 1.42 billion starving illiterate peasants in a land with close to the lowest arable land per capita is better than the biggest country and oil producer in the world

I think the Russian experience wiped out more of a percentage of stoic, hard working, future-oriented/low time preference people from a wide variety of professions and disciplines...

I think you get the dysgenics of such an experience. I'm sure China had more raw numbers of people dying but I'm not sure if it reached a larger percentage than the Russian experience.

>Where's the Russian Shenzhen

In the East Ukraine.

You forgot Chiang being a corrupt bastard and the 1931 floods + no allies + no trade relations + 1976 tanshan earthquake

I mean, in 1970 China had 0 (zero) real allies. The Albanians were useless in East Asia.

They literally started from the bottom.

>what was 1966-1974

Xi Jinping himself got beaten, humiliated in front of thousands of Red Guards, saw his sister killed, was sent off to rural Shaanxi, worked with pigs and lived in a cave for 7 years just because he was the literate son of a “rightist”.

The Maoists quite literally decimated the upper-classes of China.

Its not only larger percentage but also more middle classes and elites.
Also do not forget that Chinese lacked and still lack Soviet technical expertise and the best they can do is copy stolen designs(and that in not that well).

Moscow? St. Petersburg? retard.

I wonder if seeing the youth get so out of control during the Cultural Revolution has anything to do with the massive ratcheting up of social control under Xi's presidency.

China, culturally, has always been super hardcore into the concept of the youth having social obligation to the older generation. It's those Confucian roots

China used to have 95% Han, I want the lost 4% back.

Most of those "10 times larger" population were illiterate nong farmers who have to be forcibly kept from migrating to the cities under the hukou system because they were draining public resources and infrastructure.

>1.42 billion starving illiterate peasants
I think someone needs to leave his basement and go outside at least for once.

>still lack Soviet technical expertise and the best they can do is copy stolen designs
Only in certain fields, they already fully surpass Soviet(including modern Russia) in civil engineer and computer science.

>implying "state capitalism" isn't a neologism for any defunct form of marxism
Other than that you're right. Modern Russia is pretty much capitalist in name only. There's hardly a company there that isn't at least partly owned by the government.

Modern Russia is more capitalist than the USA.

On the offchance that you're not baiting, please elaborate.

>USA
>progressive income taxation going up to 40%

>Russia
>a flat 13% rate across the board

That is mostly thanks to crash of Soviet in 90'.
Seriously that times were really black times for science and engineering in Russia.

>State capitalism

Retard spotted

Capitalism isn't about tax models, it's about private ownership of business and the means of production.

Do you know Russia once trade their Su-27 to China with Chinese instant noodles after USSR collapsed ? Russian residents live at Russian-Chinese borderlands were often crossed border to buy foods, cloth and all kinds of basic commodities in China almost daily, up until late 1990s. Because after Soviet collapsed, the new government couldn't even provide these basic needs to their own people anymore, for a period of time.

And?

You forgot a few:
>18% VAT
>13% rent tax
>20% corporate tax

Also
>implying capitalism just means low taxes
To name just one example Russian government directly owns more than half of the country's oil and gas industry, whereas in the U.S. it's precisely none.

It's far easier to do business in Russia than in America.

If you know right people and bribe the rest. Also do not forget to make a budget curt for some protection money.

>t. CNN

Nah.
You will pay either local thugs or local authority. Or both.
Corruption and nepotism is on the par with American just less hidden.

Have you ever lived in Russia?

the difference is that russias industrial economy always remained largely dependant on its oil export and its ability to sell confiscated crops internationally.
even after the fall of communism there was very little insentive to devolop any other serious industry.
instead the new magnates positions were just used as a way to gain physical control over something the government was technically not aloud to be screwing with anymore.
china on the otherhans was always a bit more complicated.

vodka? I dunno.

When communism ended in Russia the entire economy was bought up by a handful of oligarchs in a fire sale, and the criminals with long experience in the black market knew how to game the free market the best

when communism ended in China the state was managing everything and quarantining the free market in special economic zones.

Also as shown by their overseas communities in places like Taiwan, Singapore and Malaysia the Chinese are just naturally excellent businessmen if you leave them to their own devices. All Russians are good for is drinking

Let me explain you the terms.
Communism is usually synonymous to Marxism-Leninism. A political system created by Lenin.
Russia was Communist since 1917 till 1989, and Chine was Communist since 1949 onwards

Socialism is a property of the economy, which is determined by who gets the profits, or the surplus value of production (and manages it)
It is disputed what and to what degree was Socialist, and whether Soviet Union was, and when. China, however, never claimed to be socialist, and always claimed to be capitalist (with some epithets, like "with socialist elements")

Market or Planned Economy is also a property of it. It is pretty well determined in regards to both China and the Soviet Union. Soviet Union was mixed economy since the beginning till the 30s, with radical reforms to the Planned economy, with minor reforms towards the Market since 60s, with radical reforms towards the market economy in the 90s. China was mostly Planned economy, with more planned reforms till 60s, and market reforms starting in 70s.

No warm water ports

They could just export with railways. Or make friends with someone who does (like Ukraine). For example China has no direct sea access to the Indian Ocean to get to Africa without having to go through the Malacca Strait, so they buddy up with Pakistan to get that access.

>China, however, never claimed to be socialist, and always claimed to be capitalist (with some epithets, like "with socialist elements")
Wrong.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism_with_Chinese_characteristics

The only reason China didn't collapse was because Mao croaked and mah boy Deng could fix the shitshow Mao had created

But that's not real socialism. Seriously though, it is a purely ideological idea that simply means an intent to construct socialism.

Here's Mao's own words about his economy:
>The present-day capitalist economy in China is a capitalist economy which for the most part is under the control of the People's Government and which is linked with the state-owned socialist economy in various forms and supervised by the workers. It is not an ordinary but a particular kind of capitalist economy, namely, a state-capitalist economy of a new type. It exists not chiefly to make profits for the capitalists but to meet the needs of the people and the state. True, a share of the profits produced by the workers goes to the capitalists, but that is only a small part, about one quarter, of the total. The remaining three quarters are produced for the workers (in the form of the welfare fund), for the state (in the form of income tax) and for expanding productive capacity (a small part of which produces profits for the capitalists). Therefore, this state-capitalist economy of a new type takes on a socialist character to a very great extent and benefits the workers and the state.
The reforms towards the market were launched by Zhou Enlai, Mao's partner and premier.

The Chicago school of economics happened. China never made that mistake, instead it remained protectionist with a strong state.

>ITT: retards

Capitalist China was a Nixon/Rockefeller project. thats when they got modern technological gifts from YT, it started in the 60-70s. Just like Taiwan, Hong Kong, Japan, Korea were pampered by the west with transfer of technology and wealth...

USSR just jumped into an empty pool head first.

Russia was and is way ahead of where China is even now. It has problems, a lot of them, shitty infrastructure, corruption, wealth inequality, alcoholism and crime, but in most respects it's recognizable as a modern European country. Just not a great one to live in.

Most of China is nowhere near that standard. People get too blinded by the press about "THE RISE OF CHINA" to remember that. And most people who have actually been there have only visited like 5 cosmopolitan touristy cities that do not represent how the rest of the country lives.

China ain't made it yet, dudes.

>Capitalist China was a Nixon/Rockefeller project.
Capitalist China didn't happen until Deng took over, over five years after Nixon's visit.

>Nixon 1972
>Mao 1976
>Deng 1979

Hmmmmmmmm yes because Maoist China was clearly capitalist.

>le ratcheting up of social control meme

Meanwhile 65% of Steam is Chinese. It was 10% in 2013 when Xi took over.

1. He promotes Confucianism and traditional Chinese culture because of that.
2. This meme about 2017 China being somehow less free than 2008 when people couldn’t own homes longer than 20 years, 5% had internet access, and there were 3,000 CCP-run political prisoner camps (Xi closed them in 2014 and transferred the convicts to the official prison system) is beyond retarded.

It’s a fucking meme. Stop believing everything written by Westerners about China.

t. Pissed off Chinese guy in Shanghai

1978 China was exactly that.

Okay? Modern China has been poorer than Russia per capita its entire existence. I am correct. China has no natural resources but its people.

China’s real reform period began in 1962 though.

Mao sucked, but he left a united China.

[Citations needed]

China surpassed Russia and Brazil in 2016 in nominal GDP per capita.

Partly due to this

>Mao sucked, but he left a united China.
Their Empire is not united and was never united. Or there wouldn't be the gang of eight and all the other atrocities they comit against minorities

>Meanwhile 65% of Steam is Chinese. It was 10% in 2013 when Xi took over.
Only because the Party is slow to react. They've already blocked the Steam Community because Valve won't moderate politically sensitive content for them, soon they'll be working to block it altogether so that Tencent can have their monopoly. If Malaysia can block Steam then so can China.

>It’s a fucking meme. Stop believing everything written by Westerners about China.
So now that the 2017 Party conference is over you can have all the VPNs back now, right?

and yet why is Putin so popular?

>Only because the Party is slow to react
>They've already blocked the Steam Community because Valve won't moderate politically sensitive content for them, soon they'll be working to block it altogether so that Tencent can have their monopoly

Meanwhile the best Chinese singleplayer RPG just released on Steam, which can be bought from all greater China regions, but "blocked on western countries" for now.
store.steampowered.com/app/724970/

Tencent only has 2 months monopoly for selling this games on their own platform, after that mainland Chinese can also buy it on Steam. And there will be more and more 3A Chinese games sell on Steam in 2018 and forwards.

Your "meme" will collapse again.

coming from an ex commy country myself
let me tell you why
>Agriculture failure
>state control Agriculture
>state has theory but no practises
>state recently acquired land from farmers
>farmers said this land are only good for potatoes
>state shoots farmers because traitor
>state said plant wheat!
>wheat fail and no potatoes
>farmer dies

>state needs steel and iron
>state needs more steel and iron
>state said the motherland needs more steel and iron!
>metallurgist said only these grade can be use, anymore would be impossible
>state shoots metallurgist because traitor
>everyone donated any metal thing to an improv self-made mud furnace
>produce many metric tonne of metal
>many unusable metric tonne of metal

meanwhile in some other state
>people fed up with imperialist capitalist pig
>people overthrow capitalist pig
>people pick one smart guy as state chairman
>state chairman understand the people
>tells ppl :Dont fuck up
>ppl work hard and improvise
>only ask state what do if dont know
>state said okay and find a university guy to help
>state needs money
>people said my brother-in-law from the south knows how to make money
>state said okay, make us money
>state become rich
>people become fat
>fat camp
>mfw

chinese are as corrupt as anybody else
except the anti-corruption department is as merciless as any corrupted official

the chinese had a saying
Knows your limit
gone over board and the entire 3 generation family will tank,
take a little bit even the people you took it from would love you alot

>mfw im chinese

>everyone donated any metal thing to an improv self-made mud furnace
>produce many metric tonne of metal
>many unusable metric tonne of metal
This was China though.

>1.42 billion starving illiterate peasants
>1978 China was exactly that
I can't tell if you're just shitposting or really that stupid and ignorant.

What’s that they are eating? Northern or Southern?

Looks like some bun, boiled veggies, milk(?) and tar tea. Don’t know what yellow shit is.

>Modern China has been poorer than Russia per capita its entire existence. I am correct.
Not really, GDP per capita may still looks lower than modern Russia, but the cost of living is also lower than Russia, particularly in rural areas.

>China has no natural resources but its people.
But China still has largest rare-earth mineral so far.

>China surpassed Russia and Brazil in 2016 in nominal GDP per capita.
Uh ... not much I can say here besides "no it didn't."

They do surpass Brazil at least by GDP (PPP) per capita.

>there wouldn't be the gang of eight and all the other atrocities they comit against minorities

That's really strange definition of "United". I guess Russia and "United" States were never united as well.

It's very simple. Russia failed to switch properly to a free market system due to the autocratic nature of the government and the corruption and nepotism that spawns when governmental institutions are not inclusive, pluralistic, and democratic.

The political system was easily exploited by the 'oligarchs' who proceeded to gobble up all of the state owned assets of the USSR for practically nothing, and now they have entrenched their power with Putin taking the lead to protect the regime.

>autocratic government
>corruption
>nepotism
>governmental institutions are not inclusive, pluralistic, and democratic
This describes the PRC too, as well as Taiwan under Chiang Kai-shek.

> But China still has largest rare-earth mineral so far.

Correction, China is the most willing to mine it's rare earth metals.

Mining rare earth is an extremely messy process, cyanide is used to leach the metals out of the rock deposits. Western countries have strict environmental regulations to ensure the nasty stuff stays out of our water supply and stuff, China is willing to look the other way for that sweet dosh.

>Correction, China is the most willing to mine it's rare earth metals.
Correction, no, China already enforce new law to reduce the mining of rare earth mineral. But since most western countries are still so relying on Chinese minerals, they can't just stop, otherwise western countries will start accusing China manipulating mineral market again, like US did around 2011~2012.