Lutheran Churches

Because God never changes. And these words will never cease.
The concept is inherently as conservative as it gets.

Protestant churches don't have much of a diciplinary hierarchy. They are built from bottom to top exactly opposite of what the popists do.

because they're bloody prods, its in their nature to be cucks, God bless the one true faith Catholicism

Genuine Christianity has never conformed to the mainstream of this world.

>But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.

- Matthew 7:14

>Do not conform to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind.

- Romans 12:2

I know that catholic societies are as a rule more conservative and ever so slightly less cucked, but I don't think that's really due to church doctrine.

>Why do you think religion and Christianity are inherently conservative and that being liberal is out of the ordinary?

yes it is. Catholicism wasn't just about Christianity but also about keeping all the cool ancient European traditions and customs from the past intact, it was a mix if paganism and Christianity. Its a far more richer religion than prodescuck, such as the edition of the Latin language, glorious art/architecture and traditions like baptism, confessions, Holy communion e.t.c all that are lacking in the numb and empty-less prodescuck, and when you take away people's heritage and culture they become liberal cucks

You what? Virtually all european lutheran churches have an episcopate (Bishops)

Man christlarping is so cringey.

Protestantism itself is inherently progressive. What do you expect a society to look like that resolves around a religion that preaches the aversion from traditions. Proddies had it coming right from the get go is what I'm saying.

>such as the edition of the Latin language, glorious art/architecture and traditions like baptism, confessions, Holy communion e.t.c all that are lacking in the numb and empty-less prodescuck, and when you take away people's heritage and culture they become liberal cucks
See?
Same for this guy Literally every post christlarpers post makes them appear more pathetic and less educated

>baptism
>communion

Both of those practices are explicitly supported by the Holy Scriptures and are in fact performed by Protestant churches.

>Literally every post christlarpers post makes them appear more pathetic and less educated
Where am I ChristLARPing, fammacino? Protestantism IS more progressive than catholicism. The whole reason it was created was to get away from the status quo. I'm not even denying that it had a dire needed influence on catholicism, indirectly forcing it to modernize aswell, but that doesn't mean that I think its core thoughts of sola scriptura, sola fide etc. are any more valid.

nothing strikes fear into the heart of a papist like a big guy with a hammer

And what does that mean? A pastor is completely free in his tasks. he holds the mess, he takes confessions (rarely used) and teaches the word. That is all. In catholicism you have God's deputy in Rome and his word is law.

I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Dubiously Christian anons telling people to read the entire corpus of every Church Father. Vulgate-only sedevacantists who can't read Latin and aren't confirmed. KJV fanatics who don't know what the Textus Receptus is. All this religious LARPing will be lost, like tears in a jar at Cana. Time to die to the Law.

>Evangelicalism is the only option.
>Hey guys a lack of tradition and an abundance of uneducated people interpreting the Bible is destroying our current churches, how can we solve this?
>How about we get rid of any traditions left and let everyone become their own pastor with 0 experience needed!
>Great idea!
>Anyamericanprotestantsect.jpg

>muh SJW pope
Do you actually think Pope Francis has no critics within the church? Many bishops and even Benedict have criticized him for being too modern in many ways. The head of church being vastly more progressive than his predecessor is the result of church politics, not some ominous subversion. I highly doubt that Francis' successor will be even slightly as progressive as he is right now.

>everyone become their own pastor

It is ironic that you are accusing Evangelicals of being ignorant when you believe falsehoods such as this. Also the apostles themselves were fishermen who never set foot in a classroom and they were sincere disciples of Christ unlike the legions of pharisaical priestlings spawned by the Roman academy.

>a lack of tradition and an abundance of uneducated people interpreting the Bible
A lack of doing what the bible says and educated people reinterprating is destroying the churches.

The Vatican does not have a good track record of dealing with critics within the church, user.

>damn reactionary papists surpress modernist voices
>damn modernist papists surpress reactionary voices
Can't have both, famalam.

Pope Francis is a conservative guy...

>He thinks the Vatican is consistent in its approach
>He thinks the whore won't have her cake and eat it too

The Vatican's only constancy is doing what benefits the Vatican.

per voi

>going against the will of big parts of the church
>making many enemies by this
>all part of the pope's evil mustache twirling masterplan
I hate to break it to you user, but some people just are hopless idealists.

>going against the will of big parts of the synagogue
>making many enemies by this
>all part of the pharisee's evil mustache twirling masterplan

I hate to break it to you user, but some people just want to imitate Jesus Christ.

>Using SJW on the current pope.
Fuck off.

The Jesuits were doing Social Justice centuries before shrill Americans with coloured hair populated the internet.

>DUDE ALL I NEED IS DA BIBLE.
>I'm not going to study ancient languages to understand the historic contexts of the times the bible books are written!
The absolute state of Amerivangelicals.

Our KJV

Who art in bookshelf

Inken be thy words

Thy Proddies come

Thy text be done

In tongues as it is in megachurches

Our Book of Sovereign James, who art bound in leather,

with iron gall are made thine words, on a press, by no quill of papist monk.

Give us this day our daily division of pronouns between thy and you, and forgive us for considering douay-rheims, as we forgive the papists for denying henry his wife.

And lead us not into the temptations of non-textus-receptus translations, but deliver us from vulgate. For yours are the cords and the vellum and the square set type of gutenberg, forever.

Amen.

It was never subverted. It WAS the subversion.

As opposed to what, Roman cucktolicism?

I'm not even Catholic, but Christianity is all about helping the downtrodden, the underdogs, the trash of society. This Pope is sadly the most Christian one we've had, and everyone calls him a liberal cuck. The point of Christianity is humility, you unbelievably DENSE retarded person.

I'm an atheist now, but I was raised Presbyterian, and it kind of triggers me that you don't know your own faith. And that I still remember scripture better than most of you (evidently). But I remember, because I used to take it very seriously. I built houses for the poor every summer for five fucking years. All of you fucking religion LARPers would call Jesus a cuck, because you haven't read the Bible and think the Crusades were some kind of Christian W40k free-for-all. But Jesus was humble as dirt. He ministered to the sick, he washed feet, he fed the poor and was pretty much communist when it came to personal wealth. Mary Magdalene was a whore, beneath contempt to everyone else, but he saved her because he walked the walk. The only violent, Chad-esque thing he ever did was REEEEEEEing at the money changers.

Actually, unironically read the Bible. Thanks.

>what is western Europe and the anglosphere

Man, the current pope might preach acceptance and shelter of foreigners in times if need (and while I think that’s too idealistic, what could he preach else?) but catholicism as a whole never even comes close to the level batshit insane shit some protestant churches get up to. And that’s the major denominations, not even some minor American churches that just go full retard.

>pretty much communist
You're right about all the humanitarian aspects of Jesus deeds but this "Jesus would be a commie nowadays" meme needs to fucking stop. Charity, love of one's neighbour and encouraging people to share out of their own will is far away from denouncing the idea of private property. Politicizing Christ's message is as disgusting as mindlessly calling the pope a le cuck.

>I’m not really X but let me tell you what X is really all about

Christianity is not only about helping poor people materially.

Yes.

That's why I said pretty much communist, i.e. what many would consider communist. Not literally, of course, since communism hadn't been invented. But people would equate what Jesus was advocating with income redistribution, and before long socialism.

But I reiterate that Jesus was absolutely unequivocal about accumulating wealth, in that it was done at the expense of the afterlife. Like, there is literally no way to misinterpret this without being disingenuous. Which is why Joel Osteen is a fraud who is going to BURN.

Let us turn to Matthew 19:21
>Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.” When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth. Then Jesus said to his disciples, “I tell you the truth, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.” When the disciples heard this, they were greatly astonished and asked, “Who then can be saved?” Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.” Peter answered him, “We have left everything to follow you! What then will there be for us?” Jesus said to them, “I tell you the truth, at the renewal of all things, when the Son of Man sits on his glorious throne, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or fields for my sake will receive a hundred times as much and will inherit eternal life. But many who are first will be last, and many who are last will be first.

>But people would equate what Jesus was advocating with income redistribution, and before long socialism.

Christian charity is not "income redistribution" in the socialist sense because it is freely given rather than compulsory.

>le fedora memes
Let's try to discuss this like adults?

I'm sorry I used the word communist, even with the qualifier "pretty much." I see that we can't get past it, so I'm just going to officially state that I regret saying it. Very much.

They were state controlled churches from the beginning when the princes of Germany and Scandinavia went into schism to seize and liquidate monasteries and church funds to get rich and become heads of the churches. So once the countries and their governments themselves became liberal, so did the Lutheran churches and they changed their dogmatic beliefs.

Such as when Sweden made the Swedish Lutheran church accept women pastors.

>You admitted you were a *former* Christian (emphasis on the 'former') so I don't have to reason with your argument on its own merits
Nice rebuttal!

>Muh faith! Muh faith alone!

I forgive you, user. However I reserve the right to post epic memes should the conversation drift into that territory.

Because they're inclusive and follow the will of the people just like Jesus wanted, user

But the worries of this life, the deceitfulness of MEMES and the desires for other things come in and choke the word, making it unfruitful. Mark 4:19

Thanks!

I see how one could use this way of argumentation, especially with the admittededly rather Americanized understanding of communism being more and more rampant nowadays, but for me the biggest point I'm getting out of your quote here is not the focus on redistribution for redistribution's sake but rather Jesus reminding the man to not forget about the virtue of loving one's neighbour, which gets more of a problem the better you are off, as the wealth might blind you from the misfortune of other's. In my eyes, this is more of an argument against sola fide, with living values (like voluntary sharing so not only you but people less fortunate than you can benefit from the wealth) being necessary to be a good Christian instead of just preaching them.

>Even so, every good memer bears good memes, but a bad memer bears bad memes. A good memer cannot bear bad memes, nor can a bad memer bear good memes. Every memer that does not bear good memes is banned and thrown into the fire. Therefore by their memes you will know them.

Who said anything about sola fide? I'm saying that Christianity involves much more than helping the poor materially.

Christianity is not pro-communism, it is anti-greed.

>why did nations that were open to reforming their church keep reforming it

>What is the Council of Trent
>What is a Ecumenical Council
Every Church reforms. It's just the direction in which they reform themselves.

Because they encourage you to think for yourself and thus you begin to use rationale over dogma. Naturally you arrive at liberalism as it is most based in reality. And sjw faggots aren't liberals their autistic so don't pull out that straw man on me.

Lutheran church in those countries still tends to be an ally of the more conservative parts of those societies. The Christian Democratic party in Sweden, for example, is a traditional offshoot of the centre party that is agrarian in its nature.

The outreaches the church makes towards more liberal parts of the societies are a reaction, not a cause. Nordic countries have something like a 2% weekly and 4% annual church attendance.