So I've been doing:

So I've been doing:
1. Meet your protein requirement
2. Then eat whatever you want to meet your calorie limit. (Sometimes junkfood. Sometimes restaurant food. Whatever.)

For bulking.

And my gains have been pretty bad.

Does it really matter that you eat "unprocessed" food or something? Have people made gains without a super "clean" diet?

Other urls found in this thread:

youtube.com/watch?v=Wex_yKfrTo4
engineering.com/DesignerEdge/DesignerEdgeArticles/ArticleID/12761/Burnt-Bread-Makes-Strong-Carbon-Foam.aspx
health.harvard.edu/diseases-and-conditions/glycemic_index_and_glycemic_load_for_100_foods
twitter.com/SFWRedditVideos

>Are you natty
>How long have you been bulking

Natty.

I've been lifting for years now and it just goes like:
1. Bulk for a couple months and make like zero muscle gains, just slowly accumulate too much fat
2. Start cutting for a couple months until back down to 10-12% bf.
3. Repeat

Nice trips, I've made decent gains that way but I also take vitamins,omega X's and ZMA to avoid deficiencies.

>Nice trips, I've made decent gains that way but I also take vitamins,omega X's and ZMA to avoid deficiencies.

Yeah, I take a lot of vitamins.

Well, nice to hear at least one person saying this diet didn't give them too many problems.

My gf was just telling me:
>You've been lifting for a while now and you're not much bigger
>My gay friend on facebook just eats like broccoli and chicken everyday and he got big super fast. You should do that.

I don't know though. She's retarded and often can't tell the difference between low bodyfat and high muscle mass though.

That's what you get for being a commie, you fat fuck

If your natty and lifting for a 2-3 years you need to
check you volume, frequency, reps, rest and food.
I guess your a advanced novice-low intermediate, what is your programming like?

One can always go one step further but its fine to just go at a pace one is comfortable with, else one might end up quitting, there could be a bunch of reasons for lack of gains but if you're getting enough proteins and supplements what food fills in the extra calories in your meal plan isnt super important imo

I've been doing PPLPPLx

But I was being "lazy" and splitting the second L into two workouts, such that I don't have a rest day.

Like:
PPLPP[Legs part 1][Legs part 2]

Veeky Forums told me this might be a bad idea, so I stopped doing it like 1? 2? weeks ago, and gave myself a full rest day. Too soon to say whether it's helping.

For volume, reps, I compared myself to a lot of routines, such as the intermediate routines given in the sticky:
bill starr's linear 5x5
Jim Wendler's 5/3/1
Joe DeFranco's Built Like A Badass
The Texas Method

And I felt like volume per muscle group was similar, or sometimes a bit higher.

I do like 130 reps per week per muscle group, and these routines ranged from like 70-160 reps per muscle group.

>food

If I'm gaining fat, I can't be eating too little. Too much? Maybe.

I don't know. I have trouble finding my TDEE. The scale varies too much. How can I tell whether I legitimately gained a pound of fat/muscle when my weight varies like +/- 3 lbs just day to day?

>And I felt like my* volume per muscle group was similar, or sometimes a bit higher.

>there could be a bunch of reasons for lack of gains but if you're getting enough proteins and supplements what food fills in the extra calories in your meal plan isnt super important imo

Yeah, I just feel like there's something seriously wrong and I don't know what.

If you are working your body, eating right and resting enough you should be getting results. Maybe the issue is expectations or your view of your own body being distorted

I really think I'm not getting good results, so I think I must be doing something like that wrong.

Would anyone hear mind telling me their routine that's worked all right?

All right. How about:

Can you make decent gains with junk food + whey?

Anyone had success with that?

I would do 5/3/1 or phul if your an intermediate
Also it takes a long time to gain muscle , if your looking to gain muscle then focus on strength at 8 reps.
5x5 works to

WELL GEE SCOOBY I DON'T KNOW MAYBE YOU LOOK LIKE SHIT BECAUSE YOU EAT LIKE SHIT???????????????

GOOD THING YOU'RE TAKING ALL THOSE SUPPLEMENTS AND PROTEIN POWDER, THE TOILET WILL LOVE THOSE NUTRIENTS AFTER YOU PISS THEM OUT!!!!!!!!!!1

KEEP EATING THOSE SIMPLE CARBS PRO, THEY TOTALLY AID GLYCOGEN PRODUCTION OR SOME BULLSHIT BROSCIENCE AND DON'T JUST TURN DIRECTLY INTO FAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Well, that's what I'm worried about.

I'm wondering if there are people who've made serious gains with a rather shitty diet though.

Why, so you can justify your unhealthy lifestyle?

Chad could eat dog food and twinkies and make gains, that doesn't mean it's advisable for him or for you.

Trust me, you're not some special snowflake that turns ice cream into spinach in your stomach. Eat like a human.

I honestly don't understand why junk food is bad though.

It seems like it's just high calorie, and if you count calories, who cares.

I mean, your body can't tell a fat or protein molecule from chicken versus a cheeseburger.

youtube.com/watch?v=Wex_yKfrTo4

That's a video of a man taking a piece of regular ass wonderbread, stripping away the organics, and then being unable to melt the leftovers with an oxy-acetylene torch.

Look at the size of the left over piece. That's most of the food item. That's the exact same shit thats in fast food burger buns. That's the exact same idea behind all that garbage you're eating. Just because it looks and tastes like a piece of bread doesn't mean it's made of wheat dip ass.

No, but it can tell the difference between the simple carbs in the cheeseburger bun and the decently complex carbs in the brown rice you're eating with the chicken.

Simple carbs: Huge short insulin spike, your body can only build so much muscle in that time and the rest is directed towards storing fat

Complex carbs: Insulin released slowly and steadily, and muscle can be continually built with little excess to be used for fat

Most supplements are not absorbed in vitamin form, calcium for example. If you aren't eating a shitton of fruit and vegetables a day, your body can't function well enough to do anything nearly as demanding as a bulk. It's really that simple.

Then there's all other sort of health effects besides "muh gainz," red meat is bad for your heart, processed foods can even cause cancer I've heard and it's not hard to believe.

It sounds like you get that from any bread: engineering.com/DesignerEdge/DesignerEdgeArticles/ArticleID/12761/Burnt-Bread-Makes-Strong-Carbon-Foam.aspx

>stripping away the organics, and then being unable to melt the leftovers with an oxy-acetylene torch.
>"carbon" foam

I want to call you out on this, then I realized you probably don't mean the chemistry term.

Yeah, carbs are a bit different so I can see an argument there.

So. What? Eat a shitload of rice + whey for huge gains?

Yeah, I noticed that, but I didn't make the video, i was just using it to illustrate the point that I made at the end of the post.

I don't know, man.

Glycemic index:
Burger bun
>61
Brown rice
>50
Chicken nuggets
>46
Pizza hut supreme
>36

health.harvard.edu/diseases-and-conditions/glycemic_index_and_glycemic_load_for_100_foods

So pizza hut is better than brown rice?

All right.

I don't know what you're talking about at this point.

Your point seemed to be:
>That isn't really bread!

But you have no evidence beside that black shit which is all bread apparently.

Rice was a bad example, even brown rice is pretty high glycemic. It's definitely better than hamburger bun white bread.

>So. What? Eat a shitload of rice + whey for huge gains?
Did you even read my post? You need fruits and vegetables, first and foremost. Without those, you simply don't really have the nutrients needed to build muscle and have a stable metabolism.

Fruits are a great source of carbs as well. I get probably 40% of my carbs from fruit. Whey is alright but not as good as chicken. You want protein consumption distributed throughout the day and drinking protein shakes usually means it's very concentrated.

So yeah, a truckton of fruit, vegetables, and a shitton of meat. Then you can fill out those last 1000 or so calories with medium glycemic carbs and fats like rice, peanut butter, beans, pasta, etc.

Eating sugar on a bulk is literally just sticking fat straight onto your stomach. No reason to ever eat it, or white bread or french fries.

>peppers
>onions
>olives
>tomato sauce
You don't know how GI works. It refers only to carbs, pizza hut is unhealthy cuz of all the fucking cheese. The crust isn't great, but the rest of the carbs in a pizza hut supreme are actually gonna be really solid.
Also, brown rice isn't that good for you, lol. Besides the fiber.

Fail rationalization, what else you got fatty.

You're correct, I only came into this thread to point out that the piece of bread I posted was not actually bread.

Even though it is apparently.

>Did you even read my post? You need fruits and vegetables, first and foremost. Without those, you simply don't really have the nutrients needed to build muscle and have a stable metabolism.

But fruits are high in simple carbs. And similar to rice on the GI list too:

health.harvard.edu/diseases-and-conditions/glycemic_index_and_glycemic_load_for_100_foods

And your argument about vitamins is dumb.

>You don't know how GI works. It refers only to carbs, pizza hut is unhealthy cuz of all the fucking cheese.

No, I know exactly how it works.

The fat and protein in pizza is basically the same as the fat and protein in everything else. Therefore there's no good argument as to why it's really that bad, aside from sheer quantity of fat/calories.

Carbs are different. Simple carbs are actually different from complex carbs, but I'm not sure that carb type correlates well with "healthy" vs "junk" food.

So far all I've concluded from this thread is that m&m peanuts are much better than the majority of fruits (per GI).

Thanks, Veeky Forums.

Oh, and apparently if you burn bread it turns black or something.

Thanks,

>But fruits are high in simple carbs. And similar to rice on the GI list too
Read your own fucking link? Rice GI: 72. Apple GI: 36. The only ones that are even above 50 are the literal candy fruits like watermelon and grape. Even fucking gorilla twinkies are 48.

>The fat and protein in pizza is basically the same as the fat and protein in everything else.
What is trans fat? What is omega 3? There are different types of fats just like there are different types of carbs.

A pizza supreme is a source of ok protein, ok carbs, and bad fat. But in today's society "ok" really means bad, we evolved to eat healthy. Why eat ok when you could eat great?

The daily pizza supreme or cheeseburger royale isn't going to mess up your bulk. But the fries on the side, the medium soda, the stuffing binge, will.

>Read your own fucking link? Rice GI: 72. Apple GI: 36. The only ones that are even above 50 are the literal candy fruits like watermelon and grape. Even fucking gorilla twinkies are 48.

You cherrypicked one of the lowest fruits. Most are 40s and 50s. Bananas, grapes, oranges, peaches, watermelons, etc are pretty high.

>What is trans fat? What is omega 3? There are different types of fats just like there are different types of carbs.

Nah. That shits dumb. It's not going to alter the metabolic breakdown really. You can argue there are other health benefits/dangers, but not really like calorie shit.

And m&m's peanuts are at 33, so really you should be hyping those over typical fruits.

Also I was talking brown rice, which is 50. Similar to typical fruits.

see pilt on autism

someone didn't pay attention in high school chemistry

>You cherrypicked one of the lowest fruits
I "cherrypicked" the most common fruit. Pears have 38, oranges 45, prunes 29. A GI around 40 is standard for fruit. Stop bullshitting.

>It's not going to alter the metabolic breakdown really. You can argue there are other health benefits/dangers, but not really like calorie shit.
Ok well if you care about that, that is heavily effected by fiber, which is in FRUIT and VEGETABLES and not much else.

Again, they have a shit ton of fat and not nearly the micronutrient or fiber content of fruits.

Look dude, you can go through whatever mental gymnastics you want. I can't stop you from eating, and looking, like a fat piece of shit. Enjoy unsuccessful bulk number XXX. Maybe this time those waffle fries will turn into muscles and not love handles!!!

not him but have been silently lurking the thread.
i think i have to agree with you on this one.

someone who eats fruit and vegetables over white bread and rice is going to put on more lean mass over a period of caloric surplus.

it will also probably be easier for them to go from bulking to cutting later on because their gut flora won't be totally fucked from eating shit all the time.

my 2c anyway.

>caring about glycemic index
Perma Fat fuck detected

>I don't know. I have trouble finding my TDEE. The scale varies too much. How can I tell whether I legitimately gained a pound of fat/muscle when my weight varies like +/- 3 lbs just day to day?
What are the macros like of your entire diet? Do you track it? It should be ~80g of valuable fat, ~200g of proteins and 4-500g of carbs during a bulk.

I've made nice gains and I eat some junk food too if it fits my macro. This guy has it right with the portioning. You can for example eat one junk food meal per day, it gives easy additional kcals, but you must make the rest up from good food, just eat some fucking oats, skyr, nuts, chicken, rice.