If SS is such a shit program what should beginners start with?

If SS is such a shit program what should beginners start with?

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youtube.com/watch?v=7TB0PpIGcX0
jtsstrength.com/articles/2016/03/07/considerations-for-beginners/
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muscle_hypertrophy#Myofibrillar_vs._sarcoplasmic_hypertrophy
twitter.com/AnonBabble

SS

SS is great. don't listen to idiots and start with a 3x/week full body as your first program. don't fall for some shitty PPL or split meme as a beginner

>with
Rippetoe is a credible name. look at the trainers who read it and used it: alan thrall, omar isuf talked about it, elliott hulse, you name em. and isnt SS a book with thiings like 5x5? 5x5 is the oldest trick in the book, any book for that matter. i need to buy and read and use it otherwise i wont consider myself a good trainer

>SS
>5x5

'I need to read the book'

Yeah. Big time.

>don't fall for some shitty PPL or split meme as a beginner

Not unless you want to make any progress in aesthetics.

Or you can spend 6 months getting no where, that's fine.

>trainers who read it and used it: alan thrall, omar isuf talked about it, elliott hulse
that's some dream team right there

Not all of us wanna look like fuccbois

>start at 40kg/60/60/60 at 68 kg with bodyweight dips and chinups
>after 7.5 months 65/90/130/170 at 82 kg with 40kg dips and 30kg chinups

yeah, you're right, i didn't get anywhere

>Or you can spend 6 months getting no where
except twice as strong as some skeleton on a brosplit :^)

Minimal increases in size because you avoided hypertrophy rep range with an autistic passion

if you wanna be dyel forever hop on texas method now

it's great you can train for years, hit 2/3/5/5.5 without looking like you lift at all

There's no way anyone can do SS for six months

>so this... is the power.. of SS... wow

kek

>I lift for strength

>I can get aesthetic without being strong
lmao

>2/3/5/5.5 without looking like you lift at all
good one

dont talk shit, people have their own goals

the problem is people advocating SS to people that want to look good

yeah you can I've seen it

if you're weak enough when you start

he now squats 350 for 5x5
can you do that?

youtube.com/watch?v=7TB0PpIGcX0

Hi clown. Sorry you never made it past 165lb bench. My muscles already look bigger and stronger 2 months of SS. Keep doing your puffy bodybuilder routine, the one that you think will get you female attention

an upper/lower split. a push/pull or horizontal/vertical split. focus on compounds with healthy amount of assistance to cover neglected areas, such as upper back and arms.

even if you want to look good you should start with a full body routine. it has been proven time and time again that it gives you the best results as a beginner

This
jtsstrength.com/articles/2016/03/07/considerations-for-beginners/

Monday

Hi Bar Squat 3×8-12 Reps at 3 RIR

Bench Press 3×8-12 Reps at 3 RIR

Deadlift from 3” Blocks 3×8-12 Reps at 3 RIR

Chest Supported Rows 4×10-15 Reps

Walking Lunges 2×12 Steps

Pushups 2×10-15 Reps (Weighted If Necessary)

Back Raises 2×10-15 Reps
Wednesday

Front Squat Squat 4×8-12 Reps at 3 RIR

Widegrip Bench Press 4×8-12 Reps at 3 RIR

Cable Rows 4×10-15 Reps

Leg Press 2×10-15 Reps

DB Incline Bench 2×10-15 Reps

Good Morning 2×10-15 Reps
Friday

Bench Press 4×8-12 Reps at 3 RIR

RDLS 4×8-12 Reps at 3 RIR

Lat Pulldowns 4×10-15 Reps

DB Step Ups 2×6 Each Leg

DB Military Press 2×10-15 Reps

Back Raises 2×10-15 Reps
Saturday

Box Squat 4×8-12 Reps at 3 RIR

Closegrip Bench 4×8-12 Reps at 3 RIR

One Arm DB Rows 4×10-15 Reps

Goblet Squats 2×10-15 Reps

Incline Pushups 2×10-15 Reps (Weighted if Necessary)

Good Mornings 2×10-15 Reps

>best results

In strength gain? Yeah

As far as gains of lean muscle mass, no, no, no.

A full body routine in the hypertrophy rep range gives the best results.

> My muscles already look bigger and stronger 2 months of SS

Yeah this is the level of delusion that people advocating SS have

>eat at a miscalculated or excessive surplus
>gain 20 lbs in 2 months
>tell yourself it's muscle
>'wow SS sure is effective'

Slow your bulk down you're looking for 4 lbs a month idiot, half of it would be muscle on a decent routine, in reality, like maybe 1/10th of it is muscle.

Your strength gains are purely neurological

>alan thrall
Weak as fuck, no upper body

>omar isuf
Did something like 3-4x8-10 fullbody, it's more like Lyle McDonald beginner routine or New Rules Of Lifting routine.

that's exactly the point. neurological gains are the slowest after noob gains taper off so you want to max them as fast as you can and then continue lifting heavy compounds so you are constantly improving.

who do you think will look better after a year and half? someone who did SS then switched to PPL/split or someone who starts with it?

obviously the guy who did SS properly will be 2x if not even more stronger than the guy on PPL, meaning he will be able to lift much heavier weights and get better progress in terms of hypertrophy.

>not taking advantage of newb gains and getting as strong as possible within a year

yeah have fun getting big benching 135 3x10

Someone who starts with it duh.

They spent 1.5 years making(optimal) increases in size not 1 year.

>obviously the guy who did SS properly will be 2x if not even more stronger than the guy on PPL,

Lol.

In reality, the guy who started with SS will be 10% stronger and the guy who started on PPL will be 10% more aesthetic.

It doesn't work like you think, you'll see.

>better progress in terms of hypertrophy.

Progress in terms of hypertrophy is made by simply increasing the weight you push over time, (overload) and lots of volume.

There is a common misconception that you need to be pushing huge weights to make progress on hypertrophy routines, when many anons have proven you don't.

Obviously, guys that have trained for the 5+ years it takes to get big get strong, even if they train for hypertrophy. This results in a mistaken thinking that getting strong will get you big.

Doesn't work like that.

Simply look around your gym, you'll see plenty of frail skeletons benching 2pl8 and then see some pretty swole-ish looking dudes benching 2pl8.

The difference is training methodology

TIL that someone who does 100 kg squat for 3x12 will look the same or even better as someone who can squat 160 kg for 3x12

if weight doesn't matter, why don't we all just do bodyweight squats at home and slowly increase the amount of reps for that progressive overload?

>If SS is such a shit program
If.

>alan thrall
I saw his beginner routine, it's upper/lower 5/3/1-like split with 8 reps for main exercises and some accessories. It has nothing similar with SS

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muscle_hypertrophy#Myofibrillar_vs._sarcoplasmic_hypertrophy

the 10% part is only true for looks, but not in pure strength.

Why would I want to be bigger than someone who is smaller and can lift the same weights or more? Thats gay as fuck. You aesthetic obsessed fuckboys are women on the inside. And there are no frail skeletons repping 2pl8 m8.

>And there are no frail skeletons repping 2pl8 m8.

Just popping in this thread to say that I 5 rep max 190 and look like an emaciated african child

So it's totally reasonable that when I 5 rep max 225 I will look like a frail skeleton.
And with full rom too, not powerlifter quarter rom. you are not correct.

why do u care about why other ppl are lifting

So you dont rep 225 and youre taking a guess at what you will look like. Was there a point to posting this?

Why do you care about why I care m8. In fact why are you even posting in a fitness forum with a sub 225 bench. You should be reading not talking

It's pretty simple.

To get bigger you need to get stronger. To keep getting stronger, you need to do more volume.

It thus follows that beginners should not start out on a high volume hypertrophy routine - simply because they don't require high volume to get stronger and therefore bigger.

Do SS until linear progression ends (a few months usually) then move on to a routine with slower progression and more volume.

Are you implying I will not look like a skeleton when I add a measly 35 lbs onto my BP?

I've never attempted one rep max BP but I bet it would be 200+ lbs, maybe even like 210?

You're saying with an added 15 lbs on BP I will go from skeleton to juicy? You're retarded.

> Was there a point to posting this?

Discredits your nonsense and shitposting.

It's obvious from your posting you hit 2pl8 bench and you're oh so proud of it when it's a shit lift.

>Rippetoe is a credible name.
>alan thrall

Youre still pushing baby weights and masturbating over "what ifs". Nobody gives a fuck what some dyel thinks. Be quiet and come back in 6 months when you can 1/2/3/4 for 5 reps at minimum

>Nobody gives a fuck what some dyel thinks
>everyone on Veeky Forums gives a fuck what Rippetoe thinks

you bench bitch weight (2pl8) just like me but have convinced yourself it isn't bitch weight and u aren't dyel because dysmorphia

Bro split. Just implement squats, deads, bench, bb row and ohp.

>squats 3 times a week for 8 months and not even 3pl8 squat
lmao you would've made much better gains if you switched to an intermediate program earlier.

I read SS and it's a great book. That is, for teaching you the squat, bench press, deadlift and ohp. It's program and especially the nutritional advice just aren't based on what people on this board want. If you want to become a pure powerlifter - great, this is the way to go for you.

@all the SS fanboys:
So you do SS exactly the way its prescribed by Rippetoe? Including nutritional advice? Dirtiest bulk of all and GOMAD? With no assistance lifts?
Probably you don't and that's another problem.

"Do SS" most of the time means "do the squats, deadlifts, bench and ohp described in the book, probably add at least some curls and chin ups, exchange the cleans for something like rows cuz who the f has access to bumper plates, feels safe with an olympic lift as a beginner and who even wants to do that exercise? And btw, better don't eat the way Rippetoe wants you too".

In the end "do SS" never really means "do SS". If someone strictly follows the routine the book wants you to do, he will end up exactly the way all the memes predict.

A routine that I really am starting to like is Lyle McDonald's Generic Bulking Routine.
It's more a modifiable template than a routine you have to do exactly the way it's written down and you can include deadlifts and change the rep range to make it more strength focused/more appropriate for beginners and you would have a pretty nice strength/hypertrophy routine

>implying 1/2/3/4 isn't babyweights that average lifters can achieve in 6-12 months of training.

twisted my ankle while hiking and was forced to stop squatting for almost 2 months

>SS is a meme
>Strength routines don't make you aesthetic

don't blame a PROGRAM on your shit diet,effort or genetics. you aren't supposed to do SS for more than a year anyways

to be fair, 2pl8 is not impressive dude. when i was in HS there were kids repping that shit, they weren't fat neckbeards who never played a sport though.

What do you recommend? About to hop off SS.

how badly will I fuck up the program if I add an extra day of rest?

AxxBxxA
xxBxxAx
xBxxAxx
BxxAxxB

Very Badly, it's supposed to be a 3 day a week routine.

how low test are you that you need another rest day?

Why do you need an extra rest day lmao it's already the bare minimum volume wise.

>one person with unknown background from anonymous forum as a proof
lol

GZCL LP, 2SUNS 531 LP, SHEIKO intermediate medium load. Given that your goals are strength+aesthetics.

I don't understand this concept of a program needing to fit neetly in a 7 day week. It's mostly arbitrary

NOT DOING THE PROGRAM OF MUH HOLY RIPPETOE, but ine reality you will be OK

Well, I work construction so my body I'm constantly lifting and doing cardio 6 days a week that I thought it might be better to add more rest days

As long as you don't complain about your shitty gains later on.

You realise chin ups and curls are in the book, right?

the book is about basic barbell training, not just the novice program

chins are in the program, curls are not

If you want to do curls, do Greyskull LP

It's a better program either way so he definitely should.

in that case yeah. or you can do fullbody 2-3x a week

>BECAUSE SS HAS A STRONG ANCIENT MAGIC - YNDTP
>IF YOU ADD SOMETHING TO IT YOU WILL DIE!!!!

Who fucking cares

No one apart from autists give a fuck about your squat

Honestly, if you want both aesthetics and strength (powerlifting strength) just do Stronglifts 5x5-> Madcows 5x5 -> Whatever bodybuilding split you want. Stronglifts and Madcows are great for beginners to intermediates who don't wanna go full out autistic powerlifter or aesthetic-faggot but after that you can start some PPL or w/e because you have laid solid groundwork with strength.

Starting going to the gym when my exams are over. What should I follow?

>do SS
>don't do SS
>start with PPL

Is there anything else generally accepted by this board?

GSLP

>Aesthetics and strength
>MADCOW 5x5
Will give you neither.

this
madcow is a shit program, it only peaks your strength for a few months but gives like 0 long term progress. the volume is just too low.

What is his weight?

>not wanting to look like a dyel twink while lifting 2/3/5/5.5
Bodybuilders and aesthetics chasing faggots are the worst.

so you can't?
what do you have to show for your time in the gym then?

let me answer that for you: nothing.

>the way its prescribed by Rippetoe? Including nutritional advice? Dirtiest bulk of all and GOMAD? With no assistance lifts?
>I read SS
you didn't

Over 4 weeks on SS, you get 12 workouts, using your example you get 10, times that by 13 for a years worth of workouts, you get 156 vs 130, you miss out on 26 workouts, workouts which will increase your strength and size.

This only faggots Squat

REAL MEN care about Bench and Deadlift.

>real men
>bench
try ohp

>Just popping in this thread to say that I 5 rep max 190 and look like an emaciated african child

You are a lanklet or have body dysmorphia.

REAL MAN = Want to fuck women, show others their strenght and impressive body(through Bench and Deadlift, which are known by a wide range of people)

FAGGOTS = Want to impress loser without friends on an Anime Image board with their gay 1RM Squat nobody cares about while having a fat disgusting body

>farts

Why do people think that 5x5 is only for strength, and 3x8 is for size? There is no way you won't gain size with doing 5x5...If you have SS that much, try Candito beginner's program and (yes, I know I'll get rekt for this) Jason Blaha's 5x5.
People here make everything into a meme, but these programs worked for thousands of people, so they will work for you too.

Also, while we here debate what's the best program, some chad is doing the bro split and making more gains.

I think SS is pretty gay, but it is good for beginners to do a supplemented SS for about 6-8 weeks because it's important to learn the cornerstones of any weightlifting program, and SS is a good way to do that.

It's 8 reps for the first week then 6 then 4.

I did GSLP for like a year or so. Good shit, got pretty big and the plugins allow for some hypertrophy range work.

it 8 reps for three weeks, then 6 for three and 4 for three

>Rippetoe is dyel
Does a 1600+ total count as dyel for a ~220 lifter?
To be fair, he wasn't natty and lifts less now that he's old but he is still not completely weak

The main "problem" (maybe) with SS is the frequency of upper body pushing lifts versus Lower body lifts.

You hit squats every session, so your squat form and strength go up three times a week. Also, the increase is usually close to 5 lbs a workout, or 60 lbs a month.

You alternate OHP and Bench, so you only see increases in either 1.5 times a week. Add to that the fact that you will have to go to 2.5 lb increases faster on these lifts and your progress stalls to 15 lbs a month for each.

Upper progress at 25% the rate of lower progress creates T-Rex mode.

How do you fix this? You need to choose either OHP or Bench and do it 3 times a week. Then, do isolation work for 3 times a week to fill in the gap created.

You also need to up the volume of chin-ups to every workout.

If you like OHP, your routine would be (same workout 3 times a week):

Squat 3x5
OHP 3x5
Deadlift 1x5
Pec flys using cables or Dumbbells 3x5
Chin-ups for reps

If you like Bench press, do this routine:

Squat 3x5
Bench 3x5
Deadlift 1x5
45 degrees bent over lateral raises 3x5
Chin-ups for reps

The lateral raises can use Dumbbells or cables. The key is to hit the side and rear delts.

The main idea is that he second movement can't use the triceps (since they will already be weakened by the primary lift).

>probably add at least some curls and chin ups

Chin-ups are in the program. Improve your reading comprehension dumbass.

Everybody with no lifting exp should start with a fullbody, barbell based program, and SS is as good as any other, decent, but not the best.
I got tricked by the "1234 in 6months" fags and thought I had to stay on a fullbody LP until I hit decent numbers, and I'm not saying it's not possible, it very well is for people with a different athletic past and body comformation, but it's not for others. Volume is too important in my case

especially if you're a aspie skellyfat novice, which is the main demo of this site (like me), strength training will give you some (mediocre) strength gains and almost no muscle mass. I look almost exactly the same.
I trained SS 8 months ish and then 2 months gslp and I look exactly the same.

lifts went like this, all 5RM
>OHP: from 30kg to 53.5
I used to ohp 42.5 kg sitting in my old gym because stupid rules, just before I switched gym and couldnt even ohp 35 standing
>bench: from 45ish to 80kg
>squat: from not being able to squat ---->2pl8 x
>Deadlift: basically from bar to 125

I finally realized that fullbody + some accessories, which didnt do shit since I was always exhausted from doing 3x5 of my 5RM for 2 compounds every time, is not enough VOLUME, so I switched to PHUL, doing some arm isolation on lower day with less legs

I agree. If you have any desire to actually put on some muscle you'll only stay on a beginner LP for 3 months max. Before moving on to a program with some actual volume.

>not only squatting and deadlifting on the same session but doing it 3 times a week
>upper back nowhere to be foudn and chinups being the only back compound (no dl isnt)
fucking kek

pretty sure he lifts more at his old age than you ever will

>(no dl isnt)
Demonstrably false, why do you even make claims that are so easy to dismiss?

If you wanna develop the upper back the deadlift is a far worse choice than any type of row or pullup variation.
not saying it's a shit exercise, so dont even get triggered

Learning how to lift weights with proper form and a hypertrophy routine to build immediate results.
>5-6 exercises at 8-12 reps PPL

Also teach new people the value of bulking and cutting and remove it from a purely bodybuilding aspect since it's necessary for recomp if you want to change your physique (most people do)

>He lifts for aesthetics as a natty

Fine, I forgot to include that starting strength says you should alternate deadlifts and power cleans once deadlifts stop progressing,

>upper back nowhere
Apparently you don't use your traps in a deadlift. Enjoy your visit to the Lost City of L5-dorado

which is another far from optimal back exercise
the bulk of the work is on legs, lower back and grip.
traps are probably last in the list of hit muscles in the deadlift, but please feel free to continue nitpicking and not addressing the problem