Can we have a running thread?

Wow really? Thanks for explaining how averages work, user!

Now maybe, since you're posting in the /running/ thread and you're presumably a runner, you could answer the simple fucking question of
>How slow is this

too slow

run faster

Is this coming from a twink or someone who is Veeky Forums? No offense

I'm asking you guys because I don't really want the opinions of 145lbs runners on Google, I want the opinions of lifters and strength athletes.

Short of Spartan races or any shit like that, I will almost certainly never run more than 3 miles, but I WOULD like those 3 to be as fast as my squat ass can take me.

couch 2 5k

How long are your runs?
Running more often is not enough, you need to do longer runs, Increase your mileage steadily and you'll already see results after a few weeks

I think it's a decent time for a beginner considering your size

anybody have any experience running in low/zero drop minimalist shoes? Im jonesin for a pair of new balance minimus

They teach you to run properly, that's for damn sure.

I love them, honestly, but after a while it's just too much to bear if you're semi old and/or don't have perfect form.

Also, I wore some 5 fingers to a mud run, since I lost an entire normal shoe to a pit of mud the previous month, and they were great.

....Until I got to a section where I had to run down jagged rocks on a trail. It was like running on razor blades. Fucking sucked.

I think if you have the money and they aren't your main shoe, they can be worth it.

What shoes should i get iif i have flat feet. Comfort is my priority, anything under 200$is fair game

Thanks for the info. even though I have never been a fan of the 5 fingers shoes, even though people say they're really nice. I cant get over how goofy they look. I've got a pair of nike fs lite run 3s right now that are my first pair of low drop minimal running shoes and when i first started using them i actually started to enjoy running for once, so now im hooked

i'll probably cop a pair of the minimus the next time i get a chance, then

Go to a running store and ask them. They'll make you jog up and down the store or outside and watch your stride and foot strike and make a decision based on that.

Don't be a dick and order online afterwards, spend the extra $10-15 on customer service.

Yeah they're goofy but great at the river, on SOME trails (see: jagged rocks) and for whenever I need a waterproof and slip resistant shoe with good grip that stay LOCKED to my feet.

Not like I run around town in them.

>it's either a stress fracture or shin splints
>gonna have to go to a doctor

I think I'll just keep running instead

So I think I may have damaged my left knee. Was doing 10k, and felt a sharp pain on thr knee. Decided so wear wraps and not run for a few months. Tried again and had to stop running after 15 minutes. Im afraid I am super fucked. Was a 3 month no run not long enough? Help me Veeky Forums I wanted to go half marathon as a recovered fat.

my knees always hurt just deal with it

describe the pain a bit more, when it happens during the stride, where specifically you feel it, does it hurt when you're not running, etc

I managed to run my way through an IT band issue, so good luck, m8

It's along the inside of the tibia, about 4 inches below the knee. There is a sharp pain when pressing on the bone from the inside and a dull pain when pressing on the bone from the top. There is a dull pain when walking, also along the side of the tibia.

That's what I thought. 3 years later is still present. I'm pretty much locked into cycling now.

Take care of those shins.

Brah, you got hills on yer route bruh,

Try squeezing in some HIIT running

Use a stopwatch Bruh

90% mental pick a pace and stick with it when your testing for improvements

90% mental bruh Make sure you have good for every step of the way.

A pace bruh pick a pace bruh

Don't eat like shit either, pay attention to what you eat on the days and weeks when you run like shit.

Eat some oats 45-75 minutes before you run bruh k brah

Running? Fuck running
>dedicate myself to run for cardio
>trying couch to 5k, and just jogging in general
>no matter what it's the same bullshit each time, I get a god damn cramp in my right abdomen, making me have to stop or run like in ducking having a stroke
>don't know if it's breathing pattern or running technique or both or what the fuck it is
>want to do swimming for my cardio but can't find the time or place compatible
Fuck my heart

I never ever run because I hate it and it blows, but I actually just learned to dunk, and I've done it so much that I think I gave myself shin splints. I have really old gym shoes with no padding, so I've been landing pretty hard, not to mention that I jump with my right leg, so I've been putting a lot of force through my calf.

How do you guys get rid of shin splints?

If it get cold I feel it like a pressure. I feel it when I jog or run with a slight amount of pain and after a while it's just a sharp pain. I can feel it if I lay down and put my other knee on it (on my side). However if im just sitting down doing nothing special I get no pain.

run slower you nerd

Thinking about it, it feels like lower part of knee.

enjoy your early death

Anything to get me there faster, user

Running a hilly route isn't balanced out by the downhill parts If I run flat I get about 22 mins for three miles and 40 minutes on my gay hilly route.

my half marathon is between 1:45 and 1:55 with a gay hilly route

When I lose discipline and stop focusing on form and pace I use a stopwatch so its done in intervals

Thank you for sharing twat

R.I.C.E.

Try drinking more water and to be honest I usually just ignore cramps and they go away.

Unless its happening because I chose to fast of a pace but still i'd recommend trying to push through those cramps a little bit.

Would you say that your running style gets sloppy and turns into a really mild jog with quite small steps.

>If so really open your legs and take larger strides after a while that becomes your more normal running pace.

your form is probably bad. Post video of your stride.

Rest, ice, ?, and elevation?

usually breathing pattern, i was always told to breathe out when your right foot is hitting the ground so you don't put pressure on a certain organ that gets compressed, cant remember specifically which one it is. But it was a problem that plagued me too when i first started

Is there a better running breathing technique than 3-2-3? I've been working with it and while it is much better than the lack of technique I had before, I still feel like there's something better out there.

Are my lungs just fucked?

If i die while working out i'll die happy, bring it on Doc

Compression

gotta work on your VO2 max baby boy

>Have to do a 3K on wednesday

fucks sake

work harder user

How the fuck?

i always get this shit, every single day. and im a sprinter lol

It's not that, I'm a sprinter with 0 stamina and I'm doing a 3K and I feel like I need to run a good time even though I will run pure shit

Quick question are you suppose to wear underwear under tights?

I do but that's because my lady bits smell straight up disgusting after 10 minutes

I don't know what's wrong with them

8 minute miles ain't bad if you can sustain it.
Do at least 1 speed workout and long slow run a week and whatever else you feel like, pay attention to form, and you should improve. Cross training can help a lot too.

are running tights worth it? Ive always had the opposite desire, which is to wear the shortest acceptable shorts so i have full freedom of movement

No but you should wear shorts over the tights

but cross training is the worst can't I just always run

Good. Not terrific. When it comes to running, just doing it puts you ahead of most people.

Don't go straight into it. You'll injure yourself. Gotta strengthen your lower legs and feet first, lengthen the calves, and stuff. Altras are zero drop and you can get a much more substantial shoe to protect you. They're also foot shaped.

I wear minimum for crosstraining, mizuno hitogami and altra for running. I've tried a lot of shoes along the way.

Ignore half the shit in this thread.

Running more frequently doesn't help you get faster, it just builds endurance.

For improving run times you need to do 2 things:

Hill runs.
Find the tallest, longest hill (or incline) you can find near you. Then run up and over it. At the bottom, turn around, and do it again.

Do that until you cannot do more that day.
Then rest for at least one day, preferably 2-3.

WHY? hill sprints add anaerobic activity, which helps explosive power, while the downward slope forces your legs to move faster to keep from falling over, helping work on your pace.
Its also been proven that hill running builds endurance, which for some reason decays slower than that of someone who doesnt regularly hill run.

NEXT: Sprints.

This is simple; sprint your heart out. Then slow jog for a while to catch your breath. Then sprint again.
You can do it over set distance like a lifting set (sprint 50m, jog 100, sprint 100m, jog 100 etc) until failure. Or you can just run a X mile route, and sprint as much as possible throughout.
The latter I found easier to maintain over time, keeps things varied too.

Finally, to supplement: do unweighted squats, calf raises, and burpees in your regular routine. Squats in general help a ton for running, but all help build muscle endurance and joint strength, which lessens the likelihood of injuries when running (which are more prominent when you weigh more, such as when you're weighed down by dense muscle...)

I know this because:
British commando training is intense. Run times are bottom-of-the-barrel, bare minimum at 9:00 mins for 1.5 miles. You're expected to be sub 9 before training. Some get to sub 8, but not many. Most hit that after training.
I did this and shaved a consistent minute off of my run times every month from a shite 13 minutes, to a PR of 7:43. All from running at first 2 then, 3 times a week (one hill, one sprints, one light 30 min run)

To be fair though, I incorporated distance too

I'm already going slower from exhaustion.
I'm pretty well hydrated but drinking a lot of water before hand would if anything give me a cramp faster and also potentially get me to puke.
I also do try to push through, first couple of times it happened just at the end of the run so I was able to get away with it. But the program naturally gets more intense so as it got more intense I would end up stopping earlier due to the cramp. And yes as I'm hyperventilating and gasping for breath my breathing pattern and running technique becomes shit. Not that it was ever that great. but I would hope that with doing it, i would get better at it. But no program accounts for potential cramps. I'll keep the longer strides thing in mind

Start training to fix your flat feet. It can be done. A store will just point you to some support or motion control shoes which I personally think are a worse solution than buying shoes that force you to run properly and strengthen your feet.

3k. Two miles. What, you can't run for 10 to 12 minutes? Christ. You NEED to work your cardio.

>run in 50k
>really want to run in a 50m
>the closest one that's soon is in October and is 300 miles away

The abreviated version:
You need both speed/strength/anaerobic workouts AND long slow runs staying below your anaerobic threshold.

You should only ever wear running tights if you're A. A woman.
B. In a country where it gets absolutely freezing. And I mean freezing. I've run in -5°C in just shorts for hours at a time and I'm perfectly fine.
C. If you're a batty boy.

Being a sprinter automatically kills your cardio so you develop speed instead.
Have you not heard of fast/slow twitch muscles?

Do you live in the middle of nowhere? There's loads of ultras near me.

Send me a sample (any fabric with the residue will do) and I'll analyze it in my lab. We can get to the bottom of this if we just cooperate.

thats not true, ive found that after a couple weeks of adding some HIIT intervals into my runs, my LISS gets easier. there's no reason you cant develop both

Not him, but for a rough guide of relative speed over less than 5km, 5min/km is about average for a fit person who isn't focused on running. 4min/km is fast, 3min/km would be considered elite level national athlete who's focused on running.
Your 15min 2mile is about average, respectable but nothing to write home about. If you're doing hills or obstacles to prep for Spartan then it's pretty good.

Running fucked my knees up. Unit PT consisted of a 12 mile ruck march in full gear once a week, and 2 days of 6 or more mile runs. I don't get how people can do it for years.

>GOTTA GO FAST!!!

Eat better
Sleep more
Drink more water
Stop running flat footed
Stop sprinting, run at a pace you can keep
Stretch
Run Regularly (like more than once a week)

>says running ruined his knees
>rucking
No, rucking killed your knees.

I'd love to hear what your HIIT consists of.
Runners HIIT such as tend to be (compared to what sprinters do) have way too short rest intervals which in turn reduces the intensity of the actual runs.

Point is moot anyway this 3k is a one off race and I'll never do it again, until I hit 50 and have no speed.

Rucking wasn't even that bad. Knees didn't start hurting till we amped our running from 2 miles to 6 miles because of "hurr crossfit sgt durr" took charge of our pt sessions.

Without even reading this thread, I can guarantee that the answer can be found in pic related, with citations to supporting exercise phys. experiments conducted by the author over the course of decades. It's the equivalent of SS but for running, and covers a variety of other running related topics (good form, clothing, treadmills, hills, stride rate, breathing, etc.).

Hate to be that guy but, progressive overload, stress, recovery adaptation. Train MEASURABLY harder EVERY time you train (but in small increments). Incorporate a bit of strength, mobility and HIT. The first to for injury prevention and over-all health, the last cardio gains. Your time will improve rapidly.

Good post, first time I've seen it mentioned here, which is a shame because it's mentioned all the time on Letsrun

Speaking as one of those 145 lbs guys (that was literally my weight at 6'0 when I was racing seriously) I would say that's pretty typical. I used to work at a running shoe store and did some coaching for the learn to run programs and worked with some bigger guys. You're doing 2 miles in 15:25 which should equate to somewhere in the mid 24 minute range for 5k. Doing stuff like 5x1k around 4:00 per k with 2-3 minutes of rest will be very helpful for you. That workout should be challenging but not something you couldn't duplicate after a day or two of recovery.

I recommend only using them for a few miles of running per week total, preferably as something you change into for the last half mile or mile of a longer run and then focusing on form and preferably running on soft surfaces. I ran in conventional trainers all through high school and college but did 4-8 x 100m striders barefoot on grass 3-4 days per week, and my form was perfect by the time I was a hs senior.

Can't emphasize this enough. Going online after someone takes you through a fit is like learning the major lifts from a gym that offers free classes to teach good form, then joining some Globo-Gym-esque place and giving them business because they're a few bucks less. If it's a big jump in cost that's fine, but don't gyp good service over a few bucks.

There is nothing you can get from barefoot shoes that you can't get from wearing conventional trainers for 95+ % of your running then adding some barefoot striders a few times per week.

Riding bicycles is the patrician's choice for cardio training.
It combines the power of the human body with the engineering skills of an intelligent, sophisticated mind. It is truly the ultimate combination of mind and body.
Swimming is alright, too, because it is about the human conquering the sea.
Running? That's something even a 3 year old can do

Anyone can run, sure, but few can run well.

You can take an average person and have them swim okay, and bicycle decently without much training. There isn't a really meaningful reference for performance in either of those areas unless you do some research. And honestly, there isn't much of a learning curve to doing either of those safely.

With running, it is usually pretty common knowledge to know what is fast and what is slow. And if you get it wrong, you can sustain injuries quite easily. I feel like running has an adequately high learning curve, and you can truly overcome a lot of genetic inability with proper training.

Thanks friendos

>Gotta go fast...er

Best post ITT

Coming from another military guy, the best way to improve your running endurance is a combination of sprints, HIIT, and some endurance running. Sprinting btw means TOP MOTHERFUCKING SPEED not just fast paced running. Some suggestions below

sprint drills
>football field ladder: sprint to the 10 yard line, jog back, sprint to the 20, jog back, and so on all the way to the end zone and back down the ladder so to speak.
>Another sprint drill is to set up cones along a 100m track, trot 25m, jog 25m, run (race pace) 25m, sprint 25m the walk or trot back. Do this 5-10 times based on ability.
>Hill sprints, hill sprints, hill sprints

HIIT
>4-8x400m, with 400m jog in between. Good if you have access to a track, if not you can do 1m on 1m off (or whatever intervals you feel comfortable with) drills along a preplanned route.

Throw in some endurance runs every so often and maybe some swims and rows for active recovery days, but the bulk of your workouts should be sprints and HIIT. A lot of marathoners haven't run more than 5 miles until race day, focussing on HIIT for their training.

When I was in middle and high school, we had these 12 minute runs to measure the athletic ability of students. It was called the "cooper test".

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cooper_test

Basically, you run for 12 minutes, and see how far you can get. Then you look at the table and get graded based on the standardized values.
For example, when i was 16, i ran 1 mile / 1.6km in 12 minutes, and got an F for that. Pretty much every guy was faster than me, only some fat girls were as slow as me.
At age 18 i ran around 1.5miles / 2.4km in 12 minutes, and i got a D for that.
I remember the fastest guys in our class would easily reach ~2miles /3km in 12 minutes.

>not doing both

lol plebeian

>A lot of marathoners haven't run more than 5 miles until race day, focussing on HIIT for their training.

This directly contradicts a lot of current knowledge on building up mileage to be able to run longer distances more quickly.

The best formula for the average person to become a competent runner in any distances past half a mile is to do 1 long run, a tempo run, a day for repeats and 2-3 extra days of moderately easy mileage. And you really shouldn't even be worried about the tempo run/repeats until you're topping 30 miles a week consistently.

>went from 13 minute 1.5 mile to 7:43

All of the sprinting and hill work and speed work you're describing is immeasurably less likely to result in injury if it's performed with a solid foundation of high volume lower intensity running.

Fast twitch and slow twitch certainly both benefit from specificity, but for an amateur athlete they are almost never going to get to the level where training them becomes mutually exclusive.

>>A lot of marathoners haven't run more than 5 miles until race day, focussing on HIIT for their training.

What is the fastest you've heard of someone running a marathon in with a max run of 5 miles prior to the race?

milguy here (USA)
are 1 mile runs really HIIT? I could understand 1/4 mile but 1 mile is long. Such as when we used to do 60/120s...

> A lot of marathoners haven't run more than 5 miles until race day, focussing on HIIT for their training
Oh gee, I guess that's the reason why almost every marathon plan in existence has a minimum of a 20 mile run several weeks before the marathon, with the exception of Crossshit and Hansen's cumulative fatigue plan!

>1 mile is long

Not really mate. Actually that'd be flat out wrong;
Low intensity high volume running doesn't strengthen the joints for the high impact striking of running. If someone is new to running the high volume will strain the joints more than they're used to too quickly. Likely resulting in shin splints or worse.
If they're experienced runners already, high volume will do nothing for them at all.

Running a circuit of squats, calf-raises, lunges, and the like with mobility stretches will do more for preventing injury. And you can always start by walking hills, which achieves the same thing as running them, but for smaller reward.

Most people on Veeky Forums should be capable of jogging or running at least a mile.
If not, start with the most parroted advice on Veeky Forums regarding running: couch to 5k.

You should be noting OP's question was about improving run times though, and what I posted will achieve that and do so while building joint strength for safety.
I also avoided giving set distances because I'm not trying to make someone push themselves further than they're ready.

Running 6 times a week is for real runners. Not lifters and normies.

I don't know how to decipher this reaction. Is it meant to be impressed, or doubting?

There were people who could run a damn sight faster than me regardless. I think the world record is like sub 6 minutes but i found nothing official googling. Sub 7 was rare and fucking godly, but achievable with dedication.

>field ladder
we had 'suicides' that work the same way but each quarter of a football(soccer to you) pitch. Did them til failure as a bloody warmup because of sadistic instructors.

never heard of the marathoner thing though. Most people I've known doing one did generally do shorter runs focusing on maintaining a target split pace (ie 7 mins a mile). But they'd have full or longer distance runs too to build endurance.

fank u 4 ur servis