Is SS good or not

>I've been doing brosplits for a year
6 months of SS for me
5 reps across:
>Bench 176lbs
>Squat 315lbs
>Deadlift 315lbs
>Press 121lbs

I don't understand why you would waste your time with brosplits
I assure you you do not look anywhere good enough to justify those weak lifts

make up your mind OP
but if you're gonna do SS you gotta do it right and inform yourself
sticky only tells half the story

>85 press

Holy fuck my dude

>You will never get a good looking body on strength routines
STRONGLY disagreed

there are 2 differences between strength and "aesthetics" routines

you get strong on strength routines
you don't get strong on aesthetics routines

you reduce your bodyfat% below 10% for aesthetics
you reduce your bodyfat% between 10-20% for strength

notice how muscle is not the difference
you can't not gain muscle on a strength routine

and I'm not talking fat powerlifter mode
novice and intermediate lifters are best suited for 10-20% bodyfat which presents a perfect environment for muscle growth

>You will never get a good looking body on strength routines if you're aiming for muh aesthetic
Yeah bro you need those 3x12 cable flys bro your chest won't grow aesthetic without them bro

I do Reg Parks and no one ever talks about it.

OP here,

This is more or less what I'm coming to realize, hopefully SS will work better for me because I'm not happy with my progress at all.

What do you mean by inform? Buy the book?

Read the book and do the program. Stop asking for spoonfeeding just lift.

you don't need to buy it, there's a pdf if you google starting strength pdf

the most important thing the sticky won't tell you about SS is that you have to
eat
like
mad
it's the only reason Rip makes skinny guys who don't know how to eat 3000+ cals a day do GOMAD

the second most important thing is resting time between sets
don't be scared of resting up to 10 minutes if it means you'll be sure to finish the next set

the third most important thing is linear progression
you will and have to add 2.5lbs to your lifts
EVERY
SINGLE
WORKOUT
and because you eat a lot and rest enough you'll be able to do your fives every time
if you stall (meaning you just can't make 3x5 happen no matter what for 2 workouts) reduce weight by 10% and start increasing by 2.5 every workout again

also, read the book for proper form, too
but I'd argue you can gain the same information from Rip's youtube videos on the lifts

>I've read the sticky, a shit ton of articles, all of the reviews and personal experiences, the Bible
>didn't read Starting Strength: Basic Barbell Training by Mark Rippetoe
Not gonna make it.

Just do a bro workout, I tried all the meme shit with no success just did a bro workout and made mad gains

It's ok. I already lifted today bro.

Good to know, but I'm a fatbro, I would assume the only difference is that I need to pay some more attention to eating only the right foods?

Thanks for the adding 2.5 lbs comment, will be sure to be disciplined in that.

well depends on how fat you are
Rip advises 10-20% bodyfat and recomp when above 20%

oh wait hold up I mixed up lbs with kg

5lbs increase every workout
2.5lbs will be useful for when your The Press(tm) starts stalling too much or won't go up

Not OP but should a 6'1 235 pound fatty be doing SS for my resistance training? i've been doing it for about a month and have been making decent progress but im stalling on OHP very very early on and i'm wondering if this program is ideal for someone like me trying to lose weight

>When should I stop?
Read the program... you stop when you aren't adding 5lbs to your lifts every week even though you're eating and sleeping enough.

>wasn't thrilled with my gains
You're not eating enough

The 'right' food matters a lot less than 'the right amount'. If you're fat you need to drastically reduce your calorie intake yesterday.

Looking for the pdf right now.

I'm probably 25%.

I'm 6 foot even 205lbs.

Routine doesn't matter. If you're trying to lose weight your strength will stall regardless of routine. Also lifting burns hardly any calories regardless of how it's done. Just focus on losing the weight and doing whatever routine you want and practicing form and mobility.

I am currently calorie tracking, eating 2000 cals a day, high protein. Should I up my calories a lot in order to add mass with the risk of getting fatter?

Thanks for all the help btw Veeky Forums.

I've lost about 100 pounds and only started lifting recently (was 330+ now 235) I just want to maximize my time in the gym so I'm wondering what routine would be ideal for my goals

I really just want to lean out and look good. Everyone and their mothers says doing a full body routine like SS, SL, or some other variation of a 3x5 or 5x5 is the way to go but these all seem towards skinny people trying to make gains.

It is for fat fucks so they have an excuse to eat ridiculous amounts of food and play off their disgusting fat assess like it was their goal.

SS is shit.

Do a proper split routine (push, pull, legs). You will hear the term "brosplits" referred to anything that isn't SS, this is generally said by fat retards. You obviously don't want to target a single few muscle groups a day, but generally doing a split that involves several "push" exercises, several "pull" exercises another day, and dedicating a day to legs is incredibly efficient with proper rest days.

i did SS at an SS gym and still snapped my back on OHP

Said a fat ass.

>notice how muscle is not the difference
Aesthetics is about putting on muscle in the right places. SS leaves you bottom-heavy with no shoulders, arms, traps and upper back that give you the aesthetic look. Who cares about your 1RM when you hardly look like you lift.

Pic related is what you get from SS.

It's a modern, extrapolated, and backed up mash-up of Reg Park's (ridiculous) 5x5 routine, Bill Star's weight-training for football, and Rippetoe's own little additions.

It's had 3 editions to be called out on it's bullshit, but instead each edition has added refinements and has continued to be backed up by results, amateur and professional opinion, and even science (which Rip admits has now been corrupted to the point of not being worth even half of what any study says).

It's a linear strength-building program, which means that once you start stalling on most of your lifts and you are certain that it's not your diet or sleep, then you can switch to a variety of other programs. Texas Method, Madcow, even hypertrophy like PPL, Brosplit - or fuck it, just keep doing the program but add more volume (look into how this is done, don't just deload and slap on a guess-worked number of reps).

Teaches you the importance of good form, and to be honest: Discipline. It makes you do the program, then slaps you in the face for daring to asking stupid questions around the line of, "Waaaahhh! Mommy Rip! Why aren't my my muscles big and stronk! My progress on your program stopped and it's all your faaault! Not miiine!". The answer to that is always: You're not doing the program. You fucked up. You didn't read the book, and what's worse is you didn't even try to fix it.

It doesn't teach good diet or sleep.

Most people can stay on it for 3-9 months, then it's time to switch up. Yes some stay on it for a year or more, but that's rare and I'm willing to bet they might have added in some volume somewhere.

Nice cherry picked photo

Only way you'd continue to make linear gains after a year is if you only made weekly progress as opposed to daily.

Still better to switch to an intermediate program. After a novice period, you should have a nicely activated CNS and developed posterior chain. Now you can use that muscle, whereas before you were too weak to engage them.

Also, lol, you are now trained and AWARE that those muscle exist, can feel them, and know HOW to engage them. Seems to be something a lot of people forget...

Not ss related, but learning how to use my ass changed my life.

All I want to do is do bb glute bridges and build a super ass to aid in everything.

Your point? That dude still looks like shit.

That guy is actually an amature enhanced power lifter who fucking lifts like a bodybuilder as well.

He'll outright laugh in your face if you claim he only does SS or ever did SS in the first place.

Fucking tell me about it, last rep of OHP on my last set yesterday was at a stand-still in the middle of the lift until...
>CHEEK CLENCH
>BUTT SQUEEZE
>POSTERIOR CHAIN ENGAGEMENT
>GLUTE DRIVE
and from there it was up until finished.

Upper/Lower is the GOAT

What's so ridiculous about Reg Parks 5x5? Ive been on it for more than a year rigorously and its working absolute wonder for me

Note my aim is fat loss (former hamplanet)

If it's fat loss, you're fine. Normally I'd say it's too high volume, but I'm also viewing it from the perspective of his ACTUAL workout he was doing when he wrote the 5x5 program in the 1950s. Motherfucker would spend 5-6 hours in the gym Every. Single. Day.

The 1950s were a volume freakshow.

If you're skinny, you're trying to put on mass so less volume is generally accepted. Skinnyfat boils down to personal opinion/choice.

SS is fucking shit.

I did and do a self prescribed brosplit since day 1.

been 1.6 years lifting, cant deadlift or squat due to injury but other stats are:

1RM:
Bench: 120kg
Overhead press: 95kg
Weighted pullup: 40kg (at 100kg bw)

6'0", 220lb, 20-22%bf

SS is literal garbage, if you do it youre setting yourself up to fail

He was doing RTS last time I checked and came back to Youtube and then left again. Don't know about his powerlifting but he will make one hell of a bodybuilder, should he decide to go that rout.

SS is a great program to start on and every beginner that wants to get into weights should take it up to at least 6 months or up to a year. It will get you strong and bring your numbers up to a respectable level. However, the problem with SS is people treat it like a bible and the mascot for SS is literally a fat man that believes abs are pointless. Thus, the outcome of SS wont leave you "aesthetic" which is about what 80% of people want when they lift weights

SS needs to be more refined by adding more movements but the movements that need to be added are more intermediate exercises. That and just doing the program alone while on a bulk will leave you "heavy". Rip should really incorporate a cardio day and talk about the importance of cardio while on a bulk, YOU NEED TO DO CARDIO, unfortunately people dont while on a bulk and miss on all the health gains.

SS is a good stand alone program but doesnt cater to the goals of what everyone wants when they get into lifting. Everyone wants the triangle V shape, big arms, abs. This could be easily fixed if the program was adjusted. My proposal:

A:
ATG high bar Squat 3x5
Bench 3x5
Pendlay 3x5
Arm Accessories: (light weight rest 1min between each set)
Hammer Curls 4x8
Wide Grip Ez Curls 4x8
Chinups or pullups; Add weight once you can 3x8

B:
ATG high bar Squat 3x5
Bench 3x5
OHP 3x5
2 Arm Accessories:
Snatch Grip Behind the Neck Press 4x10-12 (Klokov Pressed

Cardio Day
1-2 Mile jog
Inclined Treadmill hike (~3mph at 9 incline) will give you calves if your bulking

As youll body grows youll notice youll have weaker parts than others, adjust accessories. Somewhere in this program there should be front squat as those build aesthetic legs but theyll have to be rotated. (2weeks with BS, 1week with FS ?) Problem with this its an intermediate lift and the flexibility of a beginner is absolute dog shit. Program is for a novice, ALL LIFTS SHOULD START AT BAR (65lbs for Pendlays and deadlifts).

>i wrote this program myself
>but i injured myself
>but you still shouldn't do programs by doctors, coaches, authors. No no sir, for I know better, and here are my results to prove it!

Please. 1/10, got my reply.

Why not just do WS4SB? You can easily run a program like that indeffinetely without worrying about "stalls" and "plateaus".

He made a program that allows him to train around his injury and get good results. I think he knows what he is doing.

Thanks for the input bro. I will have burnt all the fat by this summer. Finally. Made some sweet noob gains along the way.

What program would you recommend once I get to normal bf%? I will have some intermediate muscle development at that point.

Years of lurking Veeky Forums makes me lean towards PPL, without actually being able to form a substantiated argument. I just like to follow my gut instinct. What are your thoughts?

>WS4SB
Too many meme-y exercises. To much variation of choices, a beginner will want to experiment with all the exercises. They need something concise, simple and time effective all will pushing the body.

bait

t-nation.com/workouts/westside-for-skinny-bastards-1

>difficult
It just requires you to pay attention for 10 min to read the article. A top set of 5 will push their body to the max

>meme-y exercises
Not an argument.

I'm a fan of PPL because it works, but do whatever you want when you reach that point. Maybe you'll change your mind and you'll want strength, but I bet not since you'll be feeling the highs of your newly earned weightloss.

What are your goals? Generally, aesthetics = hypertrophy. Leanness = endurance.

Like said above, you could just stick with a strength program (the lifts are balanced against one another) by add more volume to it. This will lessen your in-between sets rest periods, and you'll need to calculate the deload & rep-ranges accurately.

I like it.

Yes. Before it became a meme it was fits most suggested starting place for newcomers. In the past few years or so for some reason fit has turned from a genuinely good fitness community to being obsessed with penises (like three no faps are up at any given moment for instance) stupid memes, retards drinking energy drinks and calling it healthy and legitimate autism.

If it's in the sticky it's good. The sticky is from a better time.

>lifting burns hardly any calories
Hold on a sec are you trying to bamboozle me? I thought lifting burns crazy calories?

The problem came when retards started doing the routine for more than 3-4 months and treating it like the be-all-end-all of lifting. The mentality was that it was the absolute best place to start and a damn good place to continue.

If you started working out its great.

Hell, i really regred that i didnt know ss when i started. It give you all kind of gains. Strenght especially.

Great for first 6-12 months. Next move to somekind FBW if natty or split if gear.

Cheers

This is the end result of Veeky Forums logic.

They get a hold of real info, i.e.
>cardio burns more calories than weightlifting, per minute.
and turn it into
>LOL LIFTING MAKES YOU ACTUALLY *GAIN* CALORIES

Veeky Forums.

4. Chan.

My end goal is aesthetics I think. Pic related is my goal body but I feel like I want better legs

I'll consider your advice on staying on current program with more volume, thanks

Roids help, especially with a body like that (look at his delts).

Your choice. I'm staying off them until I go naturally bald (currently have MPB but dunno how far it'll go. Don't want to encourage the hair loss)

surely this is bait

I'll never do roids. Not my cup of tea. Don't want to sound like a fag but I don't even use creatine or protein shakes.

I just eat healthy and a lot, and lift heavy. Are you saying that physique is unachievable? That would bum me out. I just thought he had a good frame

I found an even better goal body in another thread but anons are convinced he roids

Not using creatine/protein shakes is fine. Creatine is for when you're slowing down in gains, and most people don't even get to that point anyway. Protein shakes is for convenience sake, like my wacky-ass schedule.

That physique isn't unachievable, it will just take less work and time on roids than if not on roids. That's all.

Also don't get bummed out if you don't look exactly like that after X number of years. You do have different genetics than everyone, and it's your responsibility to recognize your strengths and weaknesses, and work on those areas to get the results you want. That's what bodybuilding is - "My upper body looks small/unimpressive, maybe I should add more delt/lat work" or "I want my arms to be wider but I already do loads of curls. I should do more dips and tricep work to widen them in the opposite direction" and etc.

And yeah that 2nd pic looks like roids, he's just too bubble-muscled in every direction. He looks like a series of balloons.

Thanks for the information and inspiration. We're all gonna make it.

>tfw this used to be my goal bod

SS is good, BUT t rex mode is actually not just a meme. Once you move into intermediate mode reduce the focus on squats, do higher reps, more accessories obviously. But SS is good for a start like the name implies. rippetoe literary doesn't give a shit about aesthetics so always keep that in mind when you read his stuff.

No, not all of us are going to make it. Please realise that.

that dude's not natty

It does and even does after you are done lifting. Its better then cardio for calorie burning too. No idea what that idiot is talking about.

I know that we aren't supposed to do any workouts during the weekend, but is it fine to do cardio, like running a 5k/10k? For some reason SS has helped me with my 5k times, even though I run less ever since I started (only once every week).

You must be a hit at parties

>"coach" whose "specialization" is beginner training

It makes you strong, nothing more and nothing less, and in my incompetent opinion fucking with machines is a waste of time for newbie. But If you are planning on doing it, then please, read the fucking book. It is not only sqauts+bench+deads 3 times a week.

Its is good. But nobody here red SS or Practial Programming. Basically go google GreySkull LP and do that program.

It modification of SS that follows all the rules given in Practical Programming, it has a bigger upper body focus.

Once you get up on intermediate level here
symmetricstrength.com/
Switch to something like The Texas Method.

After that you can go 5/3/1...but that faaar faaar away down the road.

There, thats my grain of salt

>Switch to something like The Texas Method.
not even Rip advises non-athletes to do texas method
it's for people who want to compete

>I've read the sticky, I've read a shit ton of articles on starting strength.
Have you read the book? Have you even touched a barbell yet?
It's not going to fucking kill you.

>or will I turn into a fat person
Not if you have eyeballs and can monitor your progress. People always bitch about this shit, it makes no fucking sense, as if you just commit to this plan and then go into stasis for 6 months with no agency and wake up with the consequences.
If you think you're getting a bit too fat for your liking, cut the calories back. Badabing badaboom. Your progress might slow down, but that's about what's important to you.

These are my stats after a month of SS

>not even Rip advises non-athletes to do texas method
>it's for people who want to compete
This shitty program for competitors? LOL

Why is there never advice for bodybuilding programs and methodolgoies - only shitty minimalist routines that peak your strength (apart from 5/3/1 which can be made into something beastly). Not once have I heard someone recommend DC or hell even Mountain Dog.

Rip has stated that TM is for aspiring powerlifters.

I am skeptical of all bodybuilding programs, since almost all are written by steroid driven or extremely genetically gifted individuals.
Also gym 5 day splits are way too much for people with different life goals and responsibilities.

I follow what SS, practical programming and Brawn have to say.
>Focus on incremental weight addition
>Focus on big compounds
>Add some extensions to specialize
>Do the compound that you care the most first when in the gym

Beginners do the increments every training.
Intermediate weekly
Then monthly.

>Have more rest than training

SS, TM and 5/3/1 fit neatly into everything i described.
If somebody not on juice, who wont spend more than 3-4 days in the gym weekly can point to the flaws of this i would be very grateful.

It is, and you can get a copy of the E-Book here
slimdownload.co/598543

Lifting does. Gym time, not so much. A set lasts, what, 30 seconds, then you fuck around for 2-5 minutes.
The combined results takes less energy than semi-intensive cardio.

If you read the book first, it is good.

If you see an image on the Internet and follow that image, you will fail.

Assuming you've read the book, I would say that the "old guy" (i.e. no power cleans) version of Starting Strength is what average guys should do:

MWF

Squat 3x5
Bench/Overhead Press (alternating) 3x5
Deadlift 1x5
Chin-ups*

*Bodyweight till 15 reps, then 3x5 weighted.

Now, for a balanced asthetic, I would try to get the 1/2/3/4 plate overhead press, bench press, squat, and deadlift.

The bigger problem is that your squat and deadlift will get twice the work and can handle twice the increase in weight, so you will have to change the training after a while.

Estimated progress rate:

Squat 45 -> 315 lbs (4.5 months)
Deadlift 65 -> 405 lbs (5.5 months)
Overhead Press 45 -> 135 lbs (6 months)
Bench 45 -> 225 lbs (12 months)

This assumes 5 lb average jumps for squat/deadlift and 2.5 lb jumps for bench and OHP. In truth, you will probably start with greater jumps and end with lesser jumps.

Starting Strength is $10 on the Amazon Kindle app which you can get on any phone or tablet.

Stop being so cheap.

what about this?

What are your lifts? You type like a guy that spends hours on fitness forums every day, but has a 160 lb bench and 235 lb squat after lifting for 3 years.

lol everything is free on torrent only pay for a hard copy

Idk if this a stupid question but just wondering been lifting 2 years never looked at SS. If I started SS as a new regime woul I make gainz since I never started it?

What is the general consensus on dogcrap routines? I've never heard of them on here at all, don't see them in the sticky whatsoever, but my brother who's a marine and can diddly 600+ swears by it.

yes

>squat 2x5
>light squat 3x5

that doesnt make any sense
light or heavy is determed how many reps you make

>what is intensity

Because its not a beginner program no matter what anyone says.

A lot of people can't do pullups/chinups when starting, they maybe auschwitz or fat as fatass.

And doing negatives or switching to another exercise misses the whole point of the program.

Arnold used to do Reg Parks for 3 months a year when he was compeeting in Mr.Olympia.

>Now go kys.

That does not sound conducive to making gains user, i dunno.

i know what intensity is

high volume = low intensity
low volume = high intensity

this

how can xou change the instensity in a 5 rep workout?

That's on literally transcribed from PPTS 3rd. Ed. It's simple meant to be lighter squats (80% of 5RM) or the following:

> "The first option for the trainee is to continue to try and hit a new 5RM at every session, but for only one set, keeping the light squat day in the middle. It is a good idea to try and add in two back off sets of 5 after the 5RM, at about a 5-10% reduction. So with this method, the trainee is still hitting 3x5, but he is doing it with a 5RM and 2 back-off sets."