If you are a natural 3x5/5x5 is all you need...

If you are a natural 3x5/5x5 is all you need. Naturals can't recover from high volume so it makes sense just to focus on strength and use those CNS adaptations to make gains.

Which is totally why all the decent drug-free lifters use 5x5 programs. Or not, since its pretty much unheard of outside of beginners.

Also if you focus on CNS adaptions to the detriment of actual workload you're fucked in the longrun. A perfectly efficient CNS is still bottlenecked by the muscle involved and living forever on low volume/high intensity is not the greatest way to build that muscle.

>not the greatest way to build muscle
A stronger muscle is a bigger muscle so focusing on strength gets you big muscles. It's better to do 1x3 on squats than to do endless sets of volume that you can't recover from.

...

It's actually the other way around. A bigger muscle has more potential for strength, but a stronger muscle isn't necessarily going to have more potential for size (since so much of force output depends on stuff that isn't directly related to muscle mass - you can massively improve both strenght and numbers while doing jack shit to increase size).

If you're small enough to actually get a muscular adaption - as opposed to purely a peaking improvement - out of 1x3 then there's a problem in your training.

ITT: vapid broscience

I was able to continue gaining weight and squatting this way. I went from 150kg on the squat to 170kg on the squat in 3 months. My bodyweight went from 90kg to 105kg at 180cm.

6 months of GOMAD? That's 150 pounds m8, he doesn't look that fat.

DONT

DO

SS

Do Ice Cream Fitness instead, its so much better. Only cons is that its made by a spastic cunt. Also you can add some sets of deadlifts

You gained 25kgs in three months. More than a kilo a week and more than your squat went up.

Want to take a guess how much of that was actually muscle?

>I was able to continue gaining weight and squatting this way. I went from 150kg on the squat to 170kg on the squat in 3 months.
So 1.5kg progression a week?
> My bodyweight went from 90kg to 105kg at 180cm.
You do know that 12 out of those 15kg is pure fat, right?

I mean, I can't see your point, none of that is jaw dropping.

this is a troll thread

Probably most of it because the squat releases the most GH in the human body. I just go in the gym, do a heavy squat session for an hour and leave and I managed to fill out my T-shirts that way. I can strict curl 60kg if that helps.

Do you guys really think that most of it was fat?

so what? His lifts are good. All that matters.

Of course, with minor variations you can't expect more than 250g of pure muscle a week. That's three kilos of muscle in three months. Even if it were double that for whatever magical reason, the weight gain is still mostly fat.

I'm not disparaging his lifts, good on him, I'm just confused what's his point.

So how do I train without getting fat then? I've been told that mass moves mass.

Its about the rate at which your body can actually put on lean mass. Its nowhere near the rate it can put fat on, without steroids you wont be putting over 2lbs of lean mass on your body per month, and thats with perfect diet and workouts.

What's a perfect workout for a natural?

You gain weight slowly (and, if/when you get too chunky, spend some time dropping the fluff).

Mass moves mass is true, but its something people tend to misinterpret. Sheer bodyweight will move up certain lifts (bench especially and, depending on form, often the squat too - hence people deliberately bloating up after weighin in to go above their regular bodyweight. Deadlifts often start to go backwards when you get too tubby). But that's inefficient and kind of unhealthy plus bad for your looks if you care about that sort of thing. What you primarily want to do is add muscle mass in the relevant areas. Which you accomplish through volume over the week.

This doesn't mean 'go out and pretend you're a bodybuilder on a brosplit'. It just means you want to accumlate more work on the stuff you want to grow. There's a reason most successful strength programs put up a lot of overall reps across the training cycle.

Read the sticky, it has better info than random shitposters.

Tl;dr you are having too much of a caloric sufficit. You need to have it while bulking and lean bulking is a pita, but you have too much. Doing some napkin math, you're having over 1000 over your tdee.

But isn't volume training for drug users? Won't I lose strength when I start doing more reps and sets? I can't be able to add 2.5kg on the bar if I am doing 3x10 or something like that.

lol wtf is a sufficit

God damn English is lame, how can you have the Latin based word "deficit" but not "sufficit" as its antonym. Whatever, the world I was looking for is "surplus".

Excessve volume per session tends to be preferable for enhanced lifters. That's not quite the same thing as volume across the training cycle or week. The key is to spread your work out over multiple sessions (ie don't try and load thirty fucking sets into a chest workout. Get your work in by doing a decent number of bench/press sets multiple times a week - how much depends on what you can recover from).

You'll lose numbers temporarily if you up the volume - which can be done by increasing sets rather than just adding reps - but that's not the same thing as getting weaker. Also realise that the same weight added to, say, a 3x10 or 10x3 workout signifies a much bigger increase in strength than if you add it to a 3x5 workout. So you kind of have to expect smaller jumps.

a hypertrophy or volume phase is the staple of every good strenght block on this planet

So you simply add a volume set.

You do volume work as/for/with accessories.

>gogo gadget education system

Use your brain user. Jocks do this stuff. It isn't hard. There are incredible details related to fitness, training, hypertrophy, metabolism etc

But as a beginner, basic concepts cover everything you need to know.

And the sticky covers it all.

Do ss.
Add accessories: pull ups! Maybe an isolation or two if you feel a body part is lagging "aesthetically"
Eat healthy food. Aim for macros. Slightly over maintenance calories, plus a little extra on training days.

Do not quit.

Any examples of this?

>do SS
It got me a 170 kg squat. I read somewhere that it is supposed to end at 250kg but eating to maintain 105 kg is already hard enough. Dunno about bench - I stopped doing it 4 months ago but it was 90kg. Deadlift I tried a couple of days ago again - 200kg. OHP is 75kg.

juggernaut method, sheiko, Beyond 5/3/1

If we want to go oldschool and full body (for a closer comparison with SS) there's also the Hepburn program.

Can you post a pic of your chest? I've been told that you wont get decent chest development before you hit 100 kg+ bench press. I'm currently at 80 kg and my chest looks like shit.

Something in-between but that could be from the fat I have packed on. I have like zero deffinition and I look crap without clothes on lol.

I'm at 260 pounds for reps and my chest looks like shit. Though mostly due to THE GAP

Just workout and don't worry about what numbers will give you a good chest. It's not the same for everyone

I have to be honest there is nothing more manly than squatting heavy weight

when I squat, I feel like a real man.