In the Bible, didn't God commit more acts of "evil" than Satan? Was Lucifer as much of a genocidal maniac as God?

I assume God could have put us on this Earth to determine which souls are good and which are bad. If you spend an eternity in Hell, that's the bed you made.

>he put us on this earth to determine something he already knew

Maybe he just really likes burning our asses

Lkewise for you. Think on that for a bit.

"Evil" is any act against God. So no. God didn't commit any evil. If you oppose God and his works, you're evil.

yeah "Evil" is a loaded term. Lets stick to things like, vindictive, malicious, sadistic, capricious.

God is none of those

Vindictive: God cannot be petty
Malicious: God is love
Sadistic: The Lord is not willing that any should perish
Capricious:God does not change

You seem to have some platonic conception of deity that is irreconcilable with Yahweh. Especially the last one because even Moses manages to convince God to reconsider various actions.

>n the Bible, didn't God commit more acts of "evil" than Satan?

Everyone would like a God that only protects only "them" and destroy their enemies. The old testament and the bible in general is full of these things. Man has a certain difficulty in accepting that God loves everyone.

Okay, then go ahead and elucidate it for us, big brain

>In the Bible, didn't God commit more acts of "evil" than Satan?
Zero is less than any so no.
>Was Lucifer as much of a genocidal maniac as God?
Considering that "Through Devil's envy death entered the world" then Lucy is the most genocidal maniac that ever was.

all things good and evil come from God

Theoretically he knows whether our souls are good or bad when he creates them (since he is omniscient)

this guy gets it

but free will tho

god is completely responsible for literally all the evil. get with the theology.

>reads Paradise Lost once

Freewill wasn't provided to man by god. Only after eating the fruit man became able to understand good from evil, therefore also able to choose one or the other.

so Adam didn't have the free will to make the decision to follow God's orders in the first place?

wow, this stuff unravels itself

No. This world is essentially a forge which God uses to create souls of specific qualities for a yet unknown purpose. Those that'll end up in Hell are waste product.

From what I've read and what I've heard (of course this is open to interpretation) is that god created the concept of good and evil, and put himself at the highest good. Lucifer is someone who did not agree with his concept of good, and because of this he was evil by default because he did not follow god's definition of good.
We can't use our own logic to define god or lucifer as good or evil because we aren't the ones who dictated what good and evil meant. If god says it's evil, it's evil.

nah m8 ur dum

>sending someone to hell is not evil

>be hindu infant
>die
>spend eternityin hell
>that's the bed you made
This is what christlarpers actually pretend to believe

>God cannot be petty
>because I your god am a jealous god

>genocidal maniac
Now you're just shitposting. Your question is charged with the idea that God did unjustifiable, evil things against mankind.

>Punishing someone for the sinful choices they made is evil.

see

My favorite part is how the OT acknowledges the existence of other gods, and just wants Christians to hold the christian god above them; not in place, or without, just above; it doesn't care if you have house spirits or crop gods or whatever, which implies that it's not only acknowledging, but accepting the worship of other deities.

-then you get to the NT and everything that isn't Jesus is evil now.

>be God
>be all-knowing
>create a guy with the sole purpose of having him rebel already knowing it will happen and how
how is this fair

That's how debating with atheists is. You start to see how simplistic atheism really is.

They'll use the same arguments over and over again. Usually revolving around free will or how just because God is omniscient, this somehow means he should intervene whenever Billy Joe Thornton sexually abuses his hick inbred daughters.

Stop questioning the Lord, ya shitter.

hindus are savages. maybe they shouldn't go to hell forever. But they should be tortured to death in this world and the next.

Not true at all. The Old Testament states that the God of Israel is the true god, that worship of any other Gods is like worship of idols.

>calvinism
No.

>they'll point out the same things that we have no argument against over and over again

No you fucking moron, you have been proven wrong again and again, the problem is you read the responses with a stupid smirk on your face and you shitpost all these fucking threads to death and think you've won.

Clearly you are not smarter than your average college freshman atheist, if you really are above the age of 22

Where did you prove him wrong though? Because it seems like you've just been calling him names since he presented the argument.

The devil in the bible isnt some god of evil he just a really powerful archangel that is simply absolutely fucking evil.

Satan is the good guy. He just punishes the bad people and isn't god's bitch. I'd rather chill with him for eternity than be cucked by the all powerful hypocrite.

>He just punishes the bad people and isn't god's bitch.
Book of Job proves both these things wrong.

Pretty sure omnipresence is a Christian meme.
The God of the Old Testament doesn’t seem to be omnipresent, he has to look for Adam and Eve and calls out to them when they’re hiding, and he’s not present when the serpent tempts eve or when eve gives the fruit to Adam, it seems omnipresence is incompatible with these plot points.

I'd argue that God is infinitely more fucked up. God creates hell and will banish you there for all eternity for being a shitbag, while Satan will only try to lure you into being a shitbag for shits and giggles.
God can see the future, and thus the future of a man who will die a shitbag, but will take no action in preventing him from being sinful and thus damn him to the hell God himself created.
What gets me is that Christianity is about love, forgiveness, and redemption. And I do believe that there is good and bad in everyone, and nobody is beyond redemption. Yet God refuses to give someone he knew would be a shitbag a shot at redemption? For simply following the destiny that God himself created?

are lucifer and satan the same people? lucifer only gets mentioned once in isaiah

What are you talking about dude, it literally starts in Genesis and is pretty explicit in Exodus.

>Satan

The job of the big bad. May or may not work for god.

>Lucifer

The nickname of a babylonian king who later on become the name of the Satan.

So yes and no depending on your interpretation.

>believing there actually is evil and good
those are religious concepts. Just how religious are you actually? Do you also believe in evolution? Were you spiritual ancestors monkeys? What about free will? Haha do you actually believe that choises by humans create alternate 'universes' Ahahahahaha. cute

>May or may not work for god
you're talking about job?

Exodus implies the existence of other gods, but most of the OT denies them. The first verse explicitly expressing monotheism is Deuteronomy 4:35 if I recall correctly
> To you it was shown so that you would acknowledge that the Lord is God; there is no other besides him.
Deuteronomy was probably written considerably later than the rest of the Torah.

Satan didn't do much at all, honestly

Not him, but knowing what someone will do doesn't affect the actions they themselves will take.

Lucifer never appears in the bible.

Satan is a generic label for anyone that is a deceiver.

isaiah 14:12
job

Yeah. Basically Satan may be an angel whose job is to test human by tempting them and shit. Mastema is the name of that Satan I believe.

Also bogomilism believed that Satanel created the world. He tried to create Man but failed to create his soul. So he asked God, his father, to help him. God created the soul. Satanel tried to split it in two to steal God's power and created Eve to do so, but he failed. Then he tried to steal Eve's soul by raping hear and God, furious, removed his divine power, thus making him become the simple Satan.

Another Satan is Iblis(Satan for the muslim). He's the most powerful djiin( another race created before the human) and is made of smokeless fire. He was sent to earth to kill every djiin on it because they were corrupt and God needed the earth clean for the human. After doing his job, Isbil comes back to heaven and find God, with Adam. God tell his angels to bow before Adam. They all do but Isbil is much too prideful to obey. He claim that Adam is inferior because he's made of clay while he is made of fire. Thus God kick him out of heaven and Isbil swear to take revenge on Adam.

Lucifer in Paradise Lost is kind of like that he's a prideful dick of an angel who try to take revenge for his fall on men (he fell before Adam was created) but deep down he knows it's fucking stupid and he's acting like a child.

In the Divine Comedy, Lucifer is a giant with 3 heads who is prisonner at the deepest level of Hell. He is stuck into a frozen lack who goes up to his waist and he is eternally mauling a traitor in each of his three mouths(Judas, Brutus and some other dude who killed Caesar). In this version he seems to be completly mindbroken and he is reflexivly flapping his giants wings, trying to break free of the lake but this is only making the air colder.

>bogomilism
is all that in the apocryphon of john or the ascension of isaiah? i never heard or bogomilism until now and i read things on wikipedia.. or should i look elsewhere for such badass stories?

Bogomil was a buthurt slav living around the 12th century who teached his own interpretation of the bible. Bogomilism was a gnostic sect but with less autism than usual. It was a bunch of heretical sects who teached that the creator of the material world was imperfect and that the true god is someone else. Go do some research about that there is all kind of crazy twists on the christian mythos. You may want to look into Manichaeism too. It was the religious equivalent of a modern movie trying to pander to as many people as possible.

no, i just want to know where that story is from

begone heathen, you're lies will not work on me

Oh wait I meant 10th century sorry.

Bogomilism? It's nowhere in the old book. It's just another gnostic interpretation. Go look at wikipedia.

then where did get the idea that they believed what said they did?

Bogomilism was built upon severals other local gnostics religions. Bogomil probably took most of his inspiration from them.

We don't know that much from them because it was considered an heresy by both the catholics and the orthodox. Thus most of their texts were destroyed and we know what they believed in mostly thanks to what was writen about them.

where did get their story?

only because he says he isn't

You cant define a being like God as good or evil.

yes huh

Isbil is just islamic satan
Bogomil I explained
Paradise Lost and the Divine Comedy are both famous epics who strongly influenced people's perception of Hell and Lucifer. Both are non-canon however.

i know you did but i never asked for that i want to know where i can read that story was talking about

>Also bogomilism believed that Satanel created the world. He tried to create Man but failed to create his soul. So he asked God, his father, to help him. God created the soul. Satanel tried to split it in two to steal God's power and created Eve to do so, but he failed. Then he tried to steal Eve's soul by raping hear and God, furious, removed his divine power, thus making him become the simple Satan.

>In the Bible, didn't God commit more acts of "evil" than Satan?
Uhh... No? God didn't commit acts of evil. Unless you mean violence = evil in which case that's a subjective choice , violence doesn't need to be evil

Wikipedia. They may have a link toward wvich book contains the story.

Look user morality is something humans need to not act like animals, God being a creator of a planet would exceed the need to have a morality at all making him amoral by default so anything he does is neither good nor evil.

Everything God did was good; everything the devil did was evil.

So, no. And stop asking stupid fucking questions.

God is the objective basis for our morality; he is not amoral. He is Good, and none others are.

Basically you cannot tell the difference between fiction and reality.

Basically.

Can God limit any of his own attributes, or is that beyond his power?

And how would you know?

satan/the devil/lucifer/dragon/beast/fallen angel is evil.

Christfags are so fucking delusional it hurts.

You can carve a totem pole and call it your god, and it will be your god.

Just a really super shitty one.

And just because it's your god does not make it the creator of the universe, i.e. God.

No empathy is the basis of our morality, God has no morality hes evolved beyond the need of such primitive instinct regulating behavior which is what morality really is a mechanism to stop you from raping, killing and stealing anytime you feel like it.

Anti-Christfags are so delusional it hurts.

Empathy has no connection to morality. You can feel bad watching a child suffer, and you have done neither good nor evil.

Of course none of the christ larpers are responding to this one.

God created hell to confine the devil and his demons away from the good angels and humanity.

Tell me that's a bad thing.

>empathy has no connection
Yes it is does, thats why humans with no empathy otherwise known as sociopaths are the most evil pieces of shit on earth.

Reminds me of how reading the Amonkhet story of Magic the Gathering made me question the necessity of an apocalypse but not exactly remove my intrigue in theology.

And there is no good in you at all; you see good as a relative thing between human beings, but good is God's standards, which are perfect, and beyond human attainment.

You're not going to hell because you sinned. Everyone in heaven sinned.

You're going to hell because you're dead and you have rejected the only means by which to come to life. You have rejected Christ's sacrifice done on your behalf, and you have absolutely no hope on your own.

No, it doesn't. A psycho can sit there and watch a child die of exposure and he has done nothing good or evil.

#
No you fucking moron, you have been proven wrong again and again, the problem is you read the responses with a stupid smirk on your face and you shitpost all these fucking threads to death and think you've won.

Clearly you are not smarter than your average college freshman atheist, if you really are above the age of 22

First off, that's two people. Lrn2samefag.

Secondly, atheists have no convincing arguments. They literally argue from ignorance.

Finally, atheists discard all of the evidence presented to them and then claim there is no evidence.

That's not how rational people operate.

Because he knows before your born wether or not you're going to hell. So he's just creating someone to torture them.

I had that thought too except just simply "Unmaking" them would be a little more reasonable if that was the case.

I accidentally tagged the second post mentioned, to be honest