Veeky Forums guide to choosing a martial art - ultimate edition

Long time martial arts practitioner here. Don't know what to practice? Stop making threads and just read this one.

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Disturbingly bad information.

Absolutely accurate you mean. Ive trained my whole life, have a bjj black belt, fought as an amateur in boxing, practiced shaolin kung fu and capoeira as a teenager , and have sparred/am friends with fighters of countless styles of karate and grappling and it's 100% correct.

I could have added catch wrestling but it's dead aside from Japan and maybe Erik Paulson in the US... I dont even know who teaches it anymore. Also at this point it's indistinguishable from submission wrestling as well as no-gi BJJ except for some submissions which you'd find in Sambo anyway.

Karate is point sparring except for Kyokushin. Point sparring is a joke.

Everything in that post is accurate, sorry if it busts your kung fu mental masturbation pal

So should I go boxing or krav maga?

Are you afraid for your life? Are you a security guard who needs to immobilize drunk people and throw them out? Krav Maga.

Are you just a regular dude who occasionally might need to get rough but don't necessarily fear for your life? Boxing of course. In fact, do both. Do a few months of krav maga and get some solid techniques to use in tough situations and keep drilling them forever.

Just find a school that has full contact sparring with gloves and headgear. Do NOT fall for those bullshit "self defense" schools that only teach you locks like "he does this then you grab here then you twist there"

this shit will give you a false sense of security and you will get knocked the fuck out the first time you try to grab someone's wrist

That's the thing, there are no boxing mcdojos.

boxing hands down. you will learn to slip punches and move. you dont learn that anywhere else.

once you can box, add whatever you want.

boxing is the SS of fight sports.

boxing will be better for nearly every situation you might encounter. also better overall fitness and form.
krav maga will be better if you find yourself in an actual close combat life or death situation. this is very unlikely unless you live in syria, ukraine, mexico or chicago.

You learn that in every single striking art with full contact sparring, including savate and kenpo. The thing is though they aren't as realistic or they're too stylistic and they definitely don't focus enough.

Boxing is amazing. I watched a dude beat the fuck out of bigger guy at a Target. It wasn't special techniques or anything like that, he just knew how to avoid a punch and punch the shit out of that dude's face like there was no tomorrow.

You literally list boxing as better than Muay that for the only fact that it's more available, yet say Muay Thai is better than boxing because you have more options, then list kickboxing as lower than boxing and Muay Thai, shitty logic.

Where did you get your bb from? Who gave it to you? What's your lineage? You don't fucking know what you're talking about stop misinforming people.

To add to this you don't even bring up the point that if someone wants to protect themselves they should probably have a stand up game and a ground game.

WTF are you talking about.

Muay thai offers more TOOLS in a fight, and it is a more complete martial art but finding a legit gym is impossible. Are you fucking stupid?

Kickboxing doesn't use hands and knees and has a far LOWER TECHNICAL LEVEL IN COMPETITION than boxing, meaning that a good kickboxer will not likely be as good a fighter as a good boxer.

If you're going to punch and kick, don't kickbox, look for muay thai. Kickboxing is 99% ass in most schools I've seen and most fighters I know are mediocre. The same can not be said for boxing.

I wont disclose personal info, so fuck right off pal

>wasting money learning martial arts
>not buying a gun for self-defense

Because Im discussing which martial arts to pick, and not a mix and match. There's enough information there for anyone who might want to mix and match if they have the time and energy.

I hate cunts like you.
It's akin to stolen Valor.

there's always some psycho cunt such as yourself looking for shit to get riled up about over absolutely nothing

I guarantee you've been to 2 MMA sessions

I taught more than that this week.

I like the idea of boxing but isn't it pretty dangerous? I don't want brain damage or something.

i did boxing for a while and while i did get hit in the nose/head and it hurt i never had headaches or verigo

if you fight you might get hurt but if you just spar your good

What's good for a small lady? I'm never ever going to be able to punch out a big dude so I feel like boxing wouldn't really help me. Running game's already on point but I would like to learn a little defense anyway

This shit is actually hilarious. Anyone with a legitimate black belt in jiu jitsu would not be LARPing in a thread on Veeky Forums

You're at best a white belt at one of these McDojos that you're so sure everyone but you goes to.

t. blue belt from the most notable coral belt that isn't Rickson.

Just let them rape you.

I kicked major ass in kenpo sparring as a young lad simply by doing some boxing on the side as well. OP is right: any style done right is awesome, but except for boxing most stuff is McDojos with little or no sparring and way too much "practice" with opponents that don't actually resist.

I remember in my kenpo dojo that I and my friends who took it seriously would come in a few hours before class and sparr for real, like truly beating the shit out of each-other, testing the techniques we where taught: maybe one thing in ten truly worked. When we told the "masters" they just ignored the problem.

>All that shit
Jeez, keep it simple.
>Pick one striking and one grappling.
>Make sure it's actual martial arts and not mystic bullshit.

Really that simple.

Can anybody who is calling op out on his bullshit please clarify what he has said that is wrong.

I came here because I'm interested, so if OP is wrong somebody tell me what is right, because all I'm seeing is autism.

I would prefer not to do that

Womens' self defense courses. Those bitches fight dirty.
Keeping mace and keys handy and learning awareness.

Yeah but which ones? Which striking one and which grappling? And how to know which ones are legit? Laypeople can't tell. They watched too much Matrix and anime.

BB under Wendell Alexander, Nova Uniao

lol blue belt... i knew there was a reason why u talk so much and know so little

Grappling, then. You're too weak to beat someone up, you need to learn techniques for bringing larger people down. Also this:

Gracie jiu jitsu for women is excellent, Krav Maga also

youtube.com/watch?v=e7NpXQkw5pU&t=76s

this shirt choke is excellent for women

Learn grappling and get a gun. If you can't get a gun, then get OC spray.

>Which striking one and which grappling?
IMO, honestly doesn't matter. The core concepts are basically the same.

>And how to know which ones are legit?
Laypeople can't tell.
An easy way to tell is by the consistency and quality of sparring. You want to spar as realistically as you can, as often as you can. All of the C-Tier's in the OP are characterized by lack of sparring or script-tier training.

Which would you recommend starting with?
I have keychain pepper spray thing and I've take a few courses, but they didn't feel helpful

If you are a woman, I recommend finding a good krav maga gym, with certified instructors.

Also BJJ is good especially against rape, as there are dozens of ways to break something or put a guy to sleep when he's between your legs.

Everything else... will be pretty useless. As a small and weak person you need to put a guy out and knocking him out is not an option, so you need to either choke him out, break something major, or hit the throat/eyes/balls.

A good krav maga gym will include also striking and basic grappling so all in all, this is the way to go for you.

Glad someone else picked up on this.
OP is listing boxing as the Best martial art ever which is dumb. It's limited and it expects people to do nothing but assume a boxing stance and trade blows with you.

He criticises Muay Thai as there only McDojos outside of Thailand which isn't true. Any decent MMA gym in America with prestige will teach Muay Thai/kickboxing and teach it well. In the U.K. I've been to a couple of good Muay Thai gyms too but kickboxing is generally bigger over here.
Which brings me onto my 3rd issue, OP trashes kickboxing and puts it with a bunch of martial arts nobody has ever heard of, even though it's what got ken Shamrock into UFC 1. It's effective, if less so than Muay Thai. And certainly more well rounded than boxing.
Another issue is that OP holds judo and BJJ as the same thing. They compliment each other, and are both useful, but are not the same thing. He over hypes it at an early stage, and honestly if you've done it for 3 months and try to submit someone 10kg heavier than you that's laying bombs down, you're not gonna do it. That being said it's fucking brilliant when you get further through with it and that's the reason that every fighter in the UFC learns it. Just look at Royce Gracie in UFC 1, who submitted ken shamrock for example. Judo and BJJ compliment each other because judo ignores what to do when you take them down and BJJ ignores taking them down in the first place.

IMO and in the opinion of anyone that actually knows what the fuck fighting is about, you should pick 2 martial arts, one sticking and one grappling, and not try and compare the two types with each other.
I personally believe and most people I've trained with agree that it goes like this.
Effective striking:
Muay Thai > kickboxing > boxing
Effective grappling/submission
BJJ > wrestling > judo.

The 1 thing op got right is everything on the bottom tier.

Just my input, take it or leave it

>I have keychain pepper spray thing
Remember to practice with it. Here are some scenarios to think about. If a big man grabbed you from behind in a choke hold, what could you do? If a big man charged at you from the front, what could you do? If a big man had you pinned on the ground, what could you do?

Start with BJJ or Krav Maga. If what you're learning won't help with the scenarios I described, find another instructor.

Pro tip: if you have to call your teacher sensei, master, sifu, or anything like that, you're probably at a McDojo.

e aí, cara

to há 2 meses no muay thai

faço na academia n1

vamo q vamo bixão

Whichever one has lots of sparring. Good teachers and serious, passionate fellow trainers are more important than the style itself. Any discussion on styles is meaningless given that few places will teach the ideal version of the style in the ideal way. For example, jiu jutsu may be "better" than aikido in an ideal situation, but a good aikido dojo will still prepare you more than a jj McDojo.

I loved my old kenpo dojo because there where passionate people there - the girls specifically requested we make our fake-assaults and sparring as realistic as possible, so Id' wind up jumping them while sceeching like a madman about to actually rape them and they could try what really worked and what didn't. Find people like that. You'll wind up bruised but STRONG and also make bros.

Seconded.

The only thing OP is professional at is bullshido

That sounds hot, I'd love to spar-rape girls.

Win win, they learn realistic defending, I get to pretend to rape them a bit.

I literally said that boxing is not as complete as other martial arts, it's simply the most reliable when it comes to choosing which one to practice.

If there are good muay thai gyms in the UK, great! My words were "if you found one and want to put in the time then DO IT"

Judo and BJJ are the same thing in many ways. They are different sparring rulesets for the same martial arts. The techniques are the same, except BJJ allows for more of the ones that Judo has banned on the ground AND on standup. Mitsuyo Maeda was a student under Jigoro Kano and Helio Gracie was considered a judo black belt by the Kodokan.

If after 3 months you cant do a double leg into a mount and armbar/lionkiller choke into a layman then your school is shit and you need to swap. Thats -my- opinion.

Ken Shamrock was a catch wrestler, not a kickboxer. Gerard Gordeau was a kickboxer.

BJJ is brilliant, i would know since Ive been doing it since 2004.

Judo doesnt ignore newaza, it simply doesn't focus on it as much. BJJ does NOT ignore taking people down i dont know WHERE you train but in BJJ all judo AND wrestling takedowns are allowed and every single decent school trains them!!!

Half of what you said is due to not reading my post carefully, and the other half is just plain wrong.

Thanks user. I'm going to look for a Krav Maga instructor then!
Those are good things to think about. I have it on my keys, but normally my keys are in my bag if I'm walking around, even if I feel like I'm in a sketchy area. I wouldn't have time to stop and take out my keys at all...
that mental image is kind of hilarious

I, OP, posted in that forum back in 2005,when i was just a BJJ blue and the world was still infected with the belief that kung fu was hot shit and the UFC and PRIDE were still outlier freak shows.

Irony is here

youtu.be/haZ8g8dMuok
>ken shamrock is not a kickboxer

>I wouldn't have time to stop and take out my keys at all...
Exactly. This happens a lot with women (no offense). They leave their self-defense tools in a purse or bag. You might as well not have it at all. Remember: self-defense isn't a joke. Every time you add something to your self-defense skillset/toolset, think of some example scenarios (like the ones I described) and consider how viable it would be.

I'm sorry OP, but no one actually read your guide. It's good advice, looking at WHAT is actually being taught and HOW and not the brand-name it's ebing done under. Ignore the haters.

More awkward than hot, especially with cute girls.

Oh we laughed about that crap all the time, but it was good practice. Being comfy enough with people to both kick their ass and make a fool of yourself in front of them is important.

OP, nice job on the picture

I've seen flowcharts describing hurr what to choose etc but this is the first time I saw something complete and well rounded. Boxing is the staple of becoming a good fighter, a person that trains box for 6 months can btfo anyone without any fighting experience.

The hands vs feet discussion is also good, TKD, capoeira, kickbox lack this awareness and emphasise the legs way too much while ignoring the hands. Muay thai and boxing would also be on the top of my list, but these two both lack grappling. So cheers for a well rounded list man, the sparring is so important in any martial art and should not be hindered too much

If you're gonna use that logic, then Royce Gracie is also a kickboxer cause he trains in it...?

Ken was a catch wrestler, together with Funaki. This was his primary martial art, he also trained in standup to fight in the early Pancrase tournaments. He was a grappler first and foremost.

PS kickboxing sucks compared to muay thai , give it up man

>Every time you add something to your self-defense skillset/toolset, think of some example scenarios (like the ones I described) and consider how viable it would be.
This is good advice for men too. Always double-check to make sure you're not investing time/money in bullshit.

I am I meant that boxing is a really good foundation and will give you some idea of how to strike evade and muay thai utilising what boxing lacks, the feet, elbows, knees etc

I'm glad you mentioned this. I really don't have it at the ready for it to be useful to me. I'll be more mindful about that.

...

beta faggot detected

>this iz bestest info evar11!!!
>considering martial arts for self defense
Lolz

Carry a gun. If you can't carry because your government views you as an expendable resource, take up cross country. Martial arts for "self defense" is just code for "I wanna act like a tough guy."

Guns are awesome for self-defense, however...
Almost all violent crimes happen from an ambush. Before you can get your gun out and on target, at an appropriate distance, you need empty-handed skills to defend yourself from the initial attack.

>tfw want to learn to fight but don't want to get a bunch of concussions in training

Why not both?

>boxing
>no defense

i've never been punched full force in the head while training muay thai or boxing.

>Disturbingly bad information
This. I'm a brown belt in jiu jitsu and I don't get the self-defense thing. You basically learn what you need to defend yourself in your first few months of training - it would make absolutely no sense to do that shit for years. Also, it's a sport like e.g. judo, not a martial art

Proof

Tbh boxing is the best, normally streetfights start with two people touching chests.
A quick right hook to the chin always does the trick.

Also an elbow
So mauy thai works just as good

Are you going to pull a gun out for a fistfight? Enjoy your lawsuit.

What would you say an average/standard boxing regiment would be?

In terms of kalisthetics / skipping for a warm up.

I'm curious since I"ve always wanted to check out a boxing gym.

Thanks for the info, OP.

In Burgerland, there are really only boxing clubs in supply, so I guess that settles it for me.

Wish I had taken up wrestling in high school though, since it would have filled the gap for grappling.

/thread

He's talking about real fights dumbasses.

Most fights don't last more than 2 seconds. Boxing is the most practical of them all.

You're a fucking edge lord and it shows in your writing. Go pound another Monster bro.

krav
just rip his eyes out lmao

what if you don't live in usa ?

sambo or judo

I took kenpo. My instructor hit us hard. Said we needed to be ready for when it was real. I saw him punch a 12 year old girl as hard as he could. She cried. He said "now youll be ready for it."

Kind of upset that JJJ gets shat on so much. Sure, my style's reformed and modernised, but the base is still JJJ. It's effective. This is not because I fall in the "10 years plus" category, not only at least, there's real effectivity.

boxing training is usually 30 mins physical 30 mins technical 30mins sparring, the whole time is in rounds 3 mins of activitiy and 1 of rest

physical: ab work, rope, pushups, neck work etc

technical: bag, drills, pads, shadowboxing etc

sparring: u fight

>OP posts objectively good info

>Sport fed rules faggots who have never had someone try to end their life in front of some bar sperd out because OP shittalked their preferred form of aikido

Hate these faggots desu. There's a reason soft normies think boxing gyms are intimidating sweat pits full of violent men yet will happily trot along to their martial "arts" classes to practice their tkd kicks with zero resistance.

I want martial arts weebs to leave and take their anime with them. All these Asian martial arts are so watered down they don't even train how to move out the way of a punch, and like to swing entirely from the shoulder when trying to strike.

Aikido?

Based

Lads, what're some red flags to know wether you're in a McDojo?
What to look for to know if it's a good place to learn?
My friend and I are debating wheter to take boxing or mma, since those are the only two options available to us right now.

couple useful wristlocks

and a whole lot of voodoo

kata? mcdojo
chubby teacher? mcdojo?
chi? mcdojo
secret techniques too dangerous? mcdojo
no real sparring ? MCDOJO

fixd

>no Muay Thai places
Why's your country so shitty? I'm starting with Muay Thai here in Germany and went to an amateur competition with my brother who practices it for seven years. The gym/dojo does a lot of sparring and at the competition every second fight included one of the fighters ending with a bloody face. How come nobody in the US (I assume op is unitedstadian) offers good Muay Thai?

Too bad a lot of gyms in germany are full of muslims

The thing that jumped out at me is that he says judo doesnt allow leg grabs in sparring. This information is outdated as over the last two years most "forbidden techniques" have been allowed back into competition.

Can there be a MMA McDojo?

Most shitty excuse not to join a gym. What do you /pol/-tards think muslims in a muay thai gym will do, try to convert you between your technique practice?

>user! low kick
>left swing
>ashadu an la illaha illa allah
>right swing
>uppercut

Judokan will also suggest that if you can knock someone down w/o falling yourself you can make good distance.

look at the quality of fighters with pro/am records
do they mostly churn out mediocre amateurs?
Have few/none of their fighters gone pro?
is the/was the owner pro?
what was his record?
was it good?
was it bad?
how did he get most of his wins?
apply the same questions to students that have done any pro/am fights

I mean, isn't that a good thing? You get to practice with the real thing from the start
Checked and keked

Fuck I kekd
Also nice quads

>What do you /pol/-tards think muslims in a muay thai gym will do, try to convert you between your technique practice?
Nah, just blow up the establishment for not forcing female trainees to wear burqas during practice

morote gari is allowed again?

...

Possibly modulated by having a really fucking old teacher. At my club theres one guy who insists on being called sensei whos like sixty, and almost twice the age of the youngest blackbelt i workout with.

What about boxing?

Ask yourself the exact same question.

Try to shut down the computer and step into the real world, making /pol/ comments in a bar will get you a fist into your face and not protect you from it