What is the best routine to do after 1 year of SS?

My
Niggers
I'm doing 5/3/1 BBB.
I'm doing the 4 day a week with alternate lifts. So FYI it's 5/3/1 bench with BBB press and so on. Enjoying it greatly.
Anyone else have any thoughts on 5/3/1 bbb?
Also how's triumvirate?

5/3/1 is very fun and low stress

Because you don't actually raise your weights or get stronger.

Can you explain this and not just shitpost? Is it possible you did the program when you were far to weak?

5/3/1 BBB seems a little outdated, if you're doing it with 5x10. When I switched to FSLx5 my lifts got better.
Also doing only 3 reps of babby weight in week 2 of each cycle is too low. That's why wendler switched to 5s pro on every set

Those are literally the only two accessory styles that make sense, BBB/alternate and triumverate. The base program sucks ass, you'd be better off doing it the style that BiggerFasterStronger does.

Not familiar with BFS? It's the high school football program that wendler did when playing ball, been around since the 70s, and it's what wendler ripped off to "create" his abortion.

Anyways, instead of one main lift a day, BFS did 2, and worked out 3x/week with 2 days of sprints/agility/plyo/conditioning. It also used tighter rampups for the working sets so it wasn't just a whole bunch of warmups with one hard set, and also used a real max so that one hard set wasn't 8+ reps on "3x5" week. It also had a hypertrophy week of 10-8-6 instead of the faggy deload.

Another alternative to wendler's shit base program is to just do sets across in starting strength style for the main lifts, with 3x3, 3x5, 3x1 (three heavy singles), and 3x8 rep schemes for four weeks. Beats the shit out of those pussy percentages wendler used on a pussy 90% of max.

...

>outdated
Can you explain?
>FSL
What's that?

Appreciate the response

Very interesting
Can you find BFS anywhere online?
Also
Everyone complains about the 90% max thing but does it really even matter? I mean every month you add 10/5 lbs to your maxes anyway so it's going to catch up and be fine after a month or 2 anyway right?

Quality thread. Bump.

You can find out more about BFS at their website. biggerfasterstronger.com/home/ProgramStrength.asp They sell a lot of commercial-grade equipment and tracking apps for schools to use for their athletes.
> The strength portion of the BFS program, in-season, is set up on four-week cycles, with each week consisting of core lifts performed on specific days. The cycles consist of the following Set/Rep cycles: 3x3, 5x5, 5-4-3-2-1, and 10-8-6 (or 4-4-2 for the power clean and Hex bar deadlift).
For those rep schemes, you add weight each set and ramp it pretty tight so that all the sets, even the early ones, are reasonably tough.
The main lifts were squat and bench on monday, clean and deadlift on wed, and variants of the squat and bench on friday (like a box squat or front squat, and a close grip bench, etc). Then you do your aux lifts.
They also have a buttload of downloads of plymetric plans, sprint workouts, agility workouts, and stretching programs.

Do the math on a reasonably strong (like just below 1/2/3/4) person starting at 90% of max and the first cycle of workouts they'll be getting 4+ extra reps on the top set, and the first two sets are glorified warmup sets. So "3x5" is really a few warmups of 5 and then a 9-rep burnout. 5/3/1 is just warmups to a top set of 5. Then do the math of adding the weight and it'll take 8 months before you are actually getting a top single at 5/3/1 that you may not make if you haven't gained strength.
It is totally not challenging at all, the only people likely to get stronger on it are beginners - because beginners get stronger on anything - and it's way suboptimal for beginners because they SHOULD be adding weight every workout.
This is why wendler had to do so much shit in later additions to add meaningful volume at the higher weights. That's why you see shit like "joker sets" in his "beyond" ebook, and adding pump volume like FSL after it. Because the base program sucks.

It's like the original 5/3/1 is just an effective way of keeping strength (Possibly gaining some...) while getting well conditioned. His later programs like "Building the monolith" and such seem like adaptions of BFS

(cont)
More about the ramping of sets in BFS. They are really aggressive in their app. In terms of a real max, it's pretty close to
> 3x3 - 82% 86% 91%
> 5x5 - 70% 74% 78% 82% 86%
> 5-4-3-2-1 - 84% 86% 89% 91% 94%
> 10-8-6 72% 76% 80%
Personally I have found that (I'm over 50) it makes more sense to track each week separately rather than use a max, and reference that week's top set in ramping up, and be a little less aggressive than the high schoolers are LOL, but still WAY more aggressive than wendler's program. Like
> 3x3 - 90% 95% 100%
> 5x5 and 5-4-3-2-1 - 80% 85% 90% 95% 100%
> 10-8-6 and 4-4-2 - 80% 90% 100%
I do a basic setup with Squat and Bench, then Clean and Dead, then Front Squat and "Towel Bench" (it's like a board bench, I use a cutdown pool noodle under my shirt for a spacer) as the main lifts. Then I do aux lifts of Snatch, Chins, Push Press, then Dips, Rows, Close Grip Bench, then Jerk, Pullups, Overhead Press.

Is somebody here doing 3 or 4 days Sheiko and can do some results report?

Before wendler ripped off BFS, he was into Westside style "max effort" training. In his "max effort" ebook he mentions that he learned about Trap Bar Deadlifts from the BFS program, this was 2008. In 2009, he publishes a ripoff of BFS, which program he mentioned on elitefit forums (circa early 2009) that he was returning to b/c it always worked for him.
He changed the percentages, changed the week order (originally 3x3/5x5/5-4-3-2-1/10-8-6 he made it 3x5/3x3/5-3-1), used only 3 sets and not 5 sets, and deleted the hypertrophy week for a deload in order to not get sued. IMHO if it were me that he ripped off I would have sued his ass.
His program is all about him making money. he's a jew-tier motherfucker. When he couldn't make enough sucking off Dave Tate's cock, he ripped off his old hs football program.

BFS is good shit, been around since the 1970s, if you want to know what wendler did to get strong when he was in school playing football, IT WAS BFS. It was made for athletes, and has integration of conditioning in the tue/thu workouts. You can download most of the stuff for free, the book is pirated and it helps, but the percentages for the ramping etc. are on the app, you can jury-rig them yourself though.

Talk to the guys in the powerlifting general /plg/ thread.

>1 year of SS
wew lad

I'd say a good rule of thumb is stalling 2-3 times on the same weight.

There was this one 17yo reaching 250kg squat 250kg deadlift and I don't remember his bench in about 3 months on sheiko :^)

Or when recovery is just too slow. If you need to stuff your face like a pig to not feel like you got hit by a truck it's time to move on. Nothing wrong with eating for recovery and gaining some weight, but there's definitely a huge amount of diminishing returns.

What is Veeky Forums's opinion on this

t-nation.com/training/the-best-damn-workout-plan-for-natural-lifters

>t-nation.com/training/the-best-damn-workout-plan-for-natural-lifters

>The number one mistake by natural lifters is doing too much volume

Dropped.

Even with semi-decent lifts I looked dyel until I upped the volume. Volume has gotten me the fastest size, and strength gains ever. With high intensity shit, you're basically grinding yourself into dust every time you hit the gym, and burning out the CNS.

With volume work I leave the gym actually feeling stronger. After my recovery day I feel stronger instead of more worn down. Just look at the idiots that only promote pure strength work on jewtube like Omar and Thrall. They look like garbage, and Omar in normal lighting is literally dyel...

Meanwhile anyone that hasn't been scared by the volume boogeyman actually looks like they lift, and are still strong.

>falling for the SS meme

Also, the whole article is bitching about volume, but it's fucking 6x a week. So 3x a week I'm hitting my back with 3x6.

How is this not volume?

It's just a waste of time. Who the fuck wants to go to the gym 6x a week to do some weak as fuck workout that's going to take 20 minutes to finish? What's the point in doing that vs 3-4 times a week and actually putting in some real work?

>What's the point in doing that vs 3-4 times a week and actually putting in some real work?
There is no point, that's why the best programs are 3-4 days a week, sometimes 5 when they really want to increase the volume to the max.

It was more of a sarcastic rhetorical question. Thanks though, bb

Oh ok, pic related.

> It was made for athletes
The thing is most of us just want a nice body while we make progress in our main lifts. I mean that program looks good but I dont know if t suits my needs

It seems like there are some real knowledgeable people here.
Any of you shed some light on the 4 day variations I've heard mentioned of TM?

What's a good volume routine?

The juggernaut method is a great change of pace, from the low volume of the constant 5x5s. Inverted Juggernaut is probably more comfortable and you lift bigger weights for longer, but they are both good intermediate programs.

>falling for the "SS is a meme" meme

You ever seen any high school or collegiate football player (other than the lineman who kinda have to be fat) who DIDN'T look good? Runningbacks, dbs, wideouts, tes, lbs? Or a decathlete or sprinter or weightlifter/powerlifter who wasn't in the SHW class, but in the classes where they have to stay lean?

The whole weider myth of isolation is based on a couple of old jew faggots who like to touch men and sell "supplements." Our current fascination with arm development is literally GAY. B/c that is who it comes from. Ditto with our obsession with abs and vascularity. GAY. Also with the whole shaved body bullshit. 80s Tom Selleck circa Magnum PI drives the chicks crazy, still.

This entire board's perception of what "looks big" is also skewed by drug users (pic related) and the bodybuilders of the past all got big on plans a lot like BFS', main lifts and accessories, compound lifts, being athletic and strong. Nobody today in any supplement ad and no celeb on their "ripped" appearance got that way natty. If you want to look "good" and "big" according to today's internet standard, you should hit up the /fraud/ thread.

>Any of you shed some light on the 4 day variations I've heard mentioned of TM?
The first split version separates the volume and intensity days into upper/lower and deletes the light day. B/c it still alternates working the press and the bench hard, a lot of powerlifter types don't like it, but it does give more room for accessories, typically adding dips and lte (lying tricep extension aka skullcrushers) to the upper days and chins/pullups and rows to the lower days.

“Four-Day Texas Method: Version #2” appears in PP3rd Edition. This is for powerlifters, it benches heavy twice a week. Below is the weekly layout for the two “phases” of the program.
Phase I
> Bench 5x5, Press 3x8, LTE 3x10-12
> Squat 5x5, Clean 5x3, Chins 3xMAX
> Bench 5x1, Press 1x3-5, Dips 3xMAX
> Squat 1x5, Dead 1x5, Row 3x10
Phase II
> Press 5x5, Bench 3x8, LTE 3x10-12
> Squat 5x5, Clean 5x3, Chins 3xMAX
> Press 5x1, Bench 1x3-5, Dips 3xMAX
> Squat 5x1, Dead 1x2, Row 3x10
The Squat and Deadlift will progress on 1x5 until they can’t anymore, and then those two lifts would switch to 5x1 and 1x2. “1x3-5” indicates progression from 1x5 to 1x3 as was used in the original Texas Method template.

>Any of you shed some light on the 4 day variations I've heard mentioned of TM?
This is another one.
High/Low – Low/High Texas Method Split. The overview for this program appears in the 3rd Edition and begins around page 184 of the PDF version and is described as one of the most difficult methods.
> Bench Intensity, Press 5x5, LTE 3x10-12
> Squat Intensity, Clean 5x3, Chins 3xMAX
> Press Intensity, Bench 5x5, Dips 3xMAX
> Deadlift Intensity, Squat 5x5, Row 3x10
Rotate the “Intensity” lifts through a 3-week schedule as follows: Squat and Bench rotate 2x3, 3x2, and 5x1. Press rotates 5x1, 2x3, and 3x2. Deadlift rotates 1x1, 1x3, and 1x2. This keeps you from having the same very high-intensity groups of singles for all the lifts on the same week.

I think y'all can see that some of those 4-day plans have a good bit of volume to them. Add some meme shit like supersets of curls pushdowns and calf raises if you wanna "look good while progressing on the main lifts."

Also about the cleans, if that's a problem for you, then just do some other light pulling instead. NOT ROWS. Do something that hits the whole backside, like 2-3x5-8 of stiff-leg deadlifts with a weight well below what your main deadlift uses.

God damn this seems so complicated. I need to read that book I see. I'm most interested in the first one you mentioned I think. The split of upper lower with different volume and intensity days.

>"look good while progressing on the main lifts."

Because that's so fucking terrible. I'd rather just get a 600lb squat and look like a dyel with a dumpy ass and thighs.

LOLOLOLOLOLOL
You didn't read a fucking thing I said.
Anybody strong who isn't fat will look good. The problem is that old gay jews and /fraud/ have made your perception of what "looks good" into something both faggy and unattainable by natties.

Is this a dude?

The only thing I don't like about Veeky Forums is the amount of dudes dressed as women. You are confusing the shit out of my dick.

OK here is a sample layout.
Week 1:
> Bench 5x5 and bench assistance
> Squat 5x5, Clean 5x3, assistance
> Bench 1x5, "light" Press 3x5, assistance
> Squat 1x5, Deadlift 1x5, assistance
Week 2: basically swap out the Bench and Press roles. also maybe swap out Cleans for Snatch 6-8x2 for lighter pulling week.
"Light" is like 90% of the 5x5 weight for the lift.
1x5 runs until you can't add weight anymore, then goes 2x3 for a while, then 3x2, then finally 5x1. After that, rotate these 4 rep ranges each week. The Deadlift only does one top set so it does 1x5, 1x3, 1x2, 1x1.
Typical assistance on bench/press days is LTEs 3x10-12 or Dips 3xMAX or similar.
Typical assistance on Squat days is Glute-Ham Raise, Chins or Pullups, or Rows, stuff like that.
Again, if you don't like the Olympic variants, do some light deadlift-style stuff, RDL or stiff-leg deads or similar.

Yes, the book is excellent. It is often available pirated. Get the 3rd edition.

>a strong bench, dead, and squat = aesthetics

No. Unless you directly hit your upper back, arms, and press a shitload, you'll look dyel af.

Having 26+in legs and 14in arms is fucking dumb.
Having 26+in thighs and 14in calves is fucking dumb, and look like chicken legs.
Having 14in arms and 13in forearms is fucking dumb.
Having a gigantic ass that sticks out further than your upper back is fucking dumb.
Having quads as wide as your shoulders is fucking dumb.
Having massive anterior delts, mediocre medial delts, and non-existent rear delts is fucking dumb.
Having zero upper chest is fucking dumb.
Having a thick chest and small upper back is fucking dumb.
Having a thick waist and not having an even thicker/wider back is fucking dumb.

Your holy trinity leads to shitty aesthetics if that's what you're primarily relying on with minimal accessory work.

gay.

Says the guy religiously working on building a bigger bubble butt. Lmao

...

Texas Method

Lyle McDonalds Bulking Routine

Westside for skinny guys

Wendler if you are a PowerLifter

Building the monolith is fucking awesome. I like to do a cycle of monolith then simple cycle with like 5x5 fsl to give myself a break

PPL

>Not familiar with BFS?
It's shitty meme routine, stop saying it's somehow better than 531

>You ever seen any high school or collegiate football player (other than the lineman who kinda have to be fat) who DIDN'T look good?
You forgot that they did shit tons of bodyweight stuff and conditionung before even touch a barbell. All this MUH PROGRAM FOR ATHLETE are bad for general folk.

nah, you're in the clear it's Kiernan Shipka

>Wendler if you are a PowerLifter
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
> bring da movies
lots of wendler nuthuggers itt. y'all get paid? I'd like to supplement the rubles I get for supporting Trump ...

the main advantage to 5/3/ is that there a re a ton of modules, calculators and is fairly easy to modify

fuck you building the monolith is awesome. It has high intensity 5x5 and fuck off volume. You gain good strength, conditioning on it, the only drawback is it takes forever and you need to give the body a break everyonce in a while. I could see a geared lifter exploding on it

Kys

you fags kept arguing and i ddnt get a straight answer
what should someone do after a beginner program if he wants asthestics with a little bit of strength?

You want the ultimate redpoll on aesthetics cause here it is.
It comes down to genetics and time lifting. That's fucking it.
You see guys doing PL routines for 1 year and look great and you see guys lifting for 5 years on a bro split and look like shit. It's random dude. Get strong and drop to 10% bf and see if you got lucky. If not order test-e and start pinning. That's the damn truth end of story.

What if I don't stall but get sick or injured? Happened twice now.

I get tired as fuck on SS at this point. I could probably gain another 10 pounds or so. Should I just keep going and eat more?

Frequency and volume are different bud.

upper lower split 3-4 wk, mass/strength/explosive phase- bodybuilding: strong bastard 911

9day template-eod training- mass/strength-ws4b assist:
juggernaut method

bodybuilding strength-upper lower split-4 times a week:
phat or phul