Let's build a big beautiful Church

You realize your bizarre caricature of what indilgences are doesn’t match reality, correct?

How much money do you have to raise when you meet in secret in other people's homes? Because those are the actual churches, the strong churches, the blessed churches.

Not decorated warehouses and arenas.

The church wasn't merely the place of worship but where the entire community would gather for public events. It was like that in Catholic Europe until at least the 20th century, if it isn't still like that. Also unlike Protestant-Secular society where public display of Christianity is taboo back then you didn't need to worship in secret. Or in designated places of worship.

afaik indulgences were a way to spend less time in purgatory not to go to heaven

>Be Catholic priest
>Plot against the king
>Kings tell you to cut it out
>Continue to plot against the king
>King decided enough is enough and takes your castle and guards
>Get pissy, ask the Pope for help
>Pope say that they've wronged you
>Plot a war with the help of a foreign king
>Forgein king invades, agree to give everyone amnesty if they give up
>lmao jk brand the enemy as heretics and since no one but God can judge a heretic, start decapitating everyone you previously promised would live since religion prompts any earthly promises
>Kill their families as well
>Burn their bodies since you have to be buried to enter heaven
>Chatolic priest gets his castle back

What did Catholicism mean by this?

>Be Protestants
>get funding from Muslim roaches for your little protest
>Even enslave your own kind for muslims
>Become raging islamophiles that protestants support Sunni Muslims from that point until 911
What did proddies mean by this?

That's a funny way to describe excess and exorbitance like the naked toddlers leaping out of cakes.
Here's another example of Venetic depravity.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castrato

>naked babies are excess and exorbitance
Why are Americans so fucking cringy? If they had their way the government would mandate full body burkas to be placed on all children right out of the womb. The stigmatization of the human body is largely a Anglo-American invention. Most normal people don't have a problem with it and see it as natural.

"While he was reading one mass, a Roman priest would finish seven. He was urged to hurry up (passa, passa!), and to "send her Son home to our Lady." He heard priests, when consecrating the elements, repeat in Latin the words: "Bread thou art, and bread thou shalt remain; wine thou art, and wine thou shalt remain." The term "a good Christian" (buon Christiano) meant "a fool."

So while the Italians were listening to choir boys, Protestants were murdering each other during "witch" trials?

>implying no inquisition
Those were stupid radicals most of the time. The wars occurred because the Vatican Corp. refused to let them alone.

When you consider the atrocities committed during the Crusades, witchhunts, and Inquisitions, not to mention the Church's support for the Enabling Act of 1933 which essentially handed Hitler a dictatorship,the papal Roman Catholic Church is one of, of not the most hideous, vile, disgusting and evil organisation that has been holding back society since Roman times.

Inquisition invented innocent until proven guilty and mostly pertained to internal matters of faith between Roman Catholic Peasants and the Roman Catholic Papacy after implementing the changes made during the Catholic Reformation. Meanwhile Protestants were like 'MUH WITCHEZZ REEEEEE" Proof Germans never stopped being barbarians.

>consider atrocities committed during the Crusades
Consider the good fruit of the crusades
>witchhunts
100% Protestant phenomena
>Inquisitions
Not really bad
> not to mention the Church's support for the Enabling Act of 1933 which essentially handed Hitler a dictatorship
Retarded interpretation of events.

>WE WUZ HAMMURABI N SHEEIT

>>witchhunts
>100% Protestant phenomena
????

>>Inquisitions Not really bad
Not when your the one being tortured to confess

Because works are after salvation, and Christians know this.

The rest of the world, pagan catholics included, think you can work your way into heaven.

They've been deceived by the oldest lie on earth; know good and evil, do good, avoid evil, and thus be like God.

As I stated, which you missed, the churches praised by Jesus met in secret and were persecuted.

Nope. Just suckers losing their money to the most evil institution on earth.

Martin Luther was a Catholic.

>That book
>Being taken seriously
HAHAHA. do tell me of these catholic which trials you seem to know so much about.
No? Before Jesus's Crucifixion he had a public ministry he'd go around with preaching to the public. After Jesus's Ascension the Church was shut in the house of the Last Supper for fear of the Jews, but the Holy Spirit strengthened them to preach in public. You are mixing up Jesus commandment "Pray in secret and your father will reward you in secret" which has nothing to do with what you're saying.

Joan of Arc was burnt as a witch by the catholic church

Maybe she shouldn't have been a witch.

"And when ye pray, ye shall not be as the hypocrites: for they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have received their reward."

Nigger the brits burned her cause the french didn't want to pay her ransom

>No doubt God, in his mercy, will see the people's sacrifice and reward them

>brits
English, you fucking retard.

Speaking as a decidedly non-Christian philosophical deist, I can say definitively that Protestantism, as an intellectual phenomenon does not and never did deserve to be taken seriously.

Or maybe you should read the transcript of her trial? Church authorities and theologians from the Sorbonne were pressured to find her guilty of heresy, which they did, but only condemned her to have to accept the authority of the Church (that she never denied) and stop wearing male clothes (that she was wearing to defend herself against her captors). This made the English authorities mad, because they wanted her to be legally condemned, to discredit her and avoid creating a martyr for the French cause.
So they stole her female clothing, and presented her in front of the court in male clothes. This made her a relapse, and with a bit more strong arming the tribunal had to condemn her to death.

The judgement was overturned by papal authorities very soon after. If anything it’s a case of state ingerence in Church matters leading to tragic consequences.

and in more news from Catholicsarethegoodguysland:

Galileo wasnt a scientist

It was basically just going the extra mile to extra expiate your sins. It could be donations but also pilgrimages, charity works, fasting, pretty much any actions to reflect on and repair your faults. When Heaven and Hell and Purgatory are real places, places that keep you up at night, it only makes sense that some people might want to do whatever they can to go as fast as possible to Heaven. So they do all these good actions and the Church pats them on the back telling them they did good and that yeah, it’s going to help. That what indulgences were. There were cases of commerciallisation of them, but it shocked people immensely, it wasn’t common practiced and condemned whenever it popped up.

In any case the user was talking about paying taxes to the pope, and that’s retarded even if he was talking about tithes instead of indulgences. You paid 10% of the year’s production to your parish in kind but sometimes in cash, and that was immediately reinvested in the community as the Church took care of most of what we would call public services (education, healthcare, etc).

>the Church took care of most of what we would call public services (education, healthcare, etc).
So they didnt have money during the dark ages?

this but kinda unironically. Opposition to him was because his theory wasn’t scientifically proven and didn’t conform to the times’ scientific method, even if we know today he was right. He was just seen as some guy that was rehashing old unproven and difficult to prove theories, until he decided to be a dick about it.

>Catholic Cucks are still this butt hurt about not being able to sell get out of hell passes.

As an entity, the Church did have a lot of money, it owned a good chunk of the land in Europe after all, it’s just that that money was spent on things for the faithful, shared by all. Even things used by some to say the Church hoarded money, like beautiful churches, were built by the community, for the community, people were proud to have a beautifully decorated church in their village. That’s not to say there was never any abuse, it was easy to get rich for an unscrupulous bishop for example, but these were outliers.

No one other than protestants and atheists ever claimed indulgences could get you out of hell.

Pretty much this.

The Catholics lost everything because they wasted all of there wealth and power doing retarded shit like this and paying enemy nations out the ass for (((((relics))))) like splinters of the cross.

Luther comes along and explains that you won't suffer for 500 years in purgatory if you don't give all you own to the church.

People suddenly have disposable income again.
Commerce picks up.
People can afford to take risks on new innovations.

Goodbye dark ages, hello renascence.

>No one other than protestants and atheists ever claimed indulgences could get you out of hell.
We made up this place where you are in eternal agony waiting to get into heaven, BUT ITS NOT HELL GUYS CAUSE ITS NOT PERMANENT!

Just pay us 80 easy payments of $59.99 and we can shorten your stay from 600 years to 300 years.

And dont forget about mom and pop! You can buy them a ticket to the front of the line as well! Heaven VIP passed for the whole family!

Why do Protestants love to mock the idea of a God who rewards people for good behavior? Why does it trigger them so much?

You make it seem like protestants don't think works are virtues and that works are naturally manifestations of faith

that's exactly what they (say they) think

>get funding from Muslim roaches for your little protest
If you're talking about the Holy Roman Empire dealio with the Ottomans, the smaller French Catholics princes also supported the Lutherans so they wouldn't be assimilated into the empire.

The Renaissance began nearly 200 years before Luther was born you brainlet. Luther had absolutely nothing to do with it starting you absolute retard
And the "dark ages" refers to the early medieval period, which was long before the Renaissance

But what about protestant ethics? They seems obsessed with manifesting their faith throudh work as said.

Or they just hate to give it to (catholic) church?

>Schaff
>Completely fabricated anecdotal evidence

This is about what I expect out of Protties now.

Renaissance is responsible for going back on inventions though rejecting everything that was made in medieval times, all because of their hateboner towards medieval times.

>Good behavior
Good behavior should come from the behavior of the person believing IE not stealing, not killing or any sins described in the bible. You can't just wash away a sin because you give some money to some fat guy in Italy

But that’s not how this works. You make a donation to your parish, like peoole today would give to a charity, or other acts of contrition, to repent. The money is irrelevant in all this, any act showing your repentance was enough. It’s just peace of mind for people back then, your sins were forgiven already, this was just going further to repair them. And what is it with you people and your obsession with the pope: unless you were yourself living in the papal states, he would have never seen a cent of whatever money you might have donated, the church wasn’t that centralised.

catholics in protestant countries like Germany are shown to work harder on average, the problem with catholic countries is that the Church mingles with the State, not that catholics themselves are lazy

Before Jesus rose from the dead, there was no Christianity.

So what Jesus did is not relevant to the topic.

>You are mixing up Jesus commandment "Pray in secret and your father will reward you in secret" which has nothing to do with what you're saying.

I'm not, but I don't expect you to understand anything of God. How could you?

Revelation 2
The Persecuted Church
8 “And to the angel of the church in Smyrna write,

‘These things says the First and the Last, who was dead, and came to life: 9 “I know your works, tribulation, and poverty (but you are rich); and I know the blasphemy of those who say they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan. Do not fear any of those things which you are about to suffer. Indeed, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, that you may be tested, and you will have tribulation ten days. Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life.

Her and tens of millions of other people were slaughtered by the Vatican.

>Someone hearing the voice of God is a witch, according to devil worshiping papists.

Yes, as a person completely lacking all spiritual discernment, your ignorance is not surprising.

It raised billions of dollars. Maybe trillions, in today's money.

Because God said your works are as filthy rags to him.

>Cannibals
>Vampires
>That's what Jesus wants as followers

Typical papist.

Is this the only form of argument Prots have?

Rational exegesis does not rest on taking one passage out of its context and applying it to everything. The Bible is quite clear that one becomes pleasing in the eyes of God through obedience, not just passing some arbitrary theology test.

If you think you can understand the things of God without being in the family of God, I'd like to know your authority for that.

John 6
Then they said to Him, “What shall we do, that we may work the works of God?”

Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent.”

I'm sorry you think you can work yourself into God's good graces, as though he needs something from you. As though you can offer something to God. As though you could put God in your debt.

Bend the knee, heathen, and repent.

Yes, the bible suffices.

1 Corinthians 2:14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

then why can't you faggots come to a consensus on what the Bible means? only your special denomination has discernment?

We do. It means what God says it means.

We cannot tell you what the consensus is, because you have no ability to understand what we're talking about.

For instance, you cannot even understand the one verse I posted that tells you, directly, that you cannot understand the things of the Spirit of God, and that they are foolishness to you.

You merely prove that the verse is true.

Romans 2
"God “will repay each person according to what they have done.” 7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. 8 But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. 9 There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; 10 but glory, honor and peace for everyone who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile. 11 For God does not show favoritism. 12 All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. 13 For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God’s sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous."
Stop thinking God is gonna let you into heaven because of your beliefs. Even the devil believes.

>but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous

Again, you have no comprehension of the things of God.

It's not your fault.

You're a dead man trying to grasp the things of the living God with your animal senses.

It's not going to happen.

The verse you just quoted me says OBEY, and you be righteous; under the law, you DIE.

and because you will not be able to understand this either, only Jesus obeyed the Law.

So to be like God, which is what you are trying to do, you must be exactly as Jesus is.

You must be God.

Are you God?

>only Jesus obeyed the Law.
have you actually read the Gospels?

>"God “will repay each person according to what they have done.”

If you think you want this, you are a bigger fool that I can imagine.

Yes, where Jesus obeyed all of the Laws of Moses, and frequently flaunted the takenot of the pharisees.

Have you?

Before you start pulling Jew accusations against Jesus out of the bible, just keep reading. Jesus explains himself to those Jews better than I can explain Jesus to you.

It wasn't just Jesus.

Protestantism was a mistake

Romans 3
As it is written:

“There is none righteous, no, not one;
There is none who understands;
There is none who seeks after God.
They have all turned aside;
They have together become unprofitable;
There is none who does good, no, not one.”

Allowing papists to call themselves a part of the Kingdom of God was a lie from the pit of hell itself.

If you actually go back and read the OT verses Paul is quoting it doesn't mean what you think it means.
Luke 1
"In the time of Herod king of Judea there was a priest named Zechariah, who belonged to the priestly division of Abijah; his wife Elizabeth was also a descendant of Aaron. 6 Both of them were righteous in the sight of God, observing all the Lord’s commands and decrees blamelessly."

>Words don't mean things.

Ecclesiastes 7:20
For there is not a just man on earth who does good And does not sin.

Want to try again?

>lie from the pit of hell

According to scripture Satan is not the master of hell, he is not in hell and will not be until after the final judgement. Hell has no master but God. So saying “it’s a lie from the pit of hell” is saying “it’s a lie from God” and God only lies in Islam. So you’re either a filthy Saracen or you’re just wrong.

Psalm 14
Folly of the Godless, and God’s Final Triumph

To the Chief Musician. A Psalm of David.

The fool has said in his heart,
“There is no God.”
They are corrupt,
They have done abominable works,
There is none who does good.

The Lord looks down from heaven upon the children of men,
To see if there are any who understand, who seek God.
They have all turned aside,
They have together become corrupt;
There is none who does good,
No, not one.

Any other verse you think backs you up?

No?

>pope_kisses_refugee_feet.jpg

The pit of hell is not in the lake of fire. Do try to keep your terminology precise if you want to participate.

Thank you.

Romans 3
Now we know that whatever the Law says, it says to those who are under the Law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God. 20Therefore no one will be justified in His sight by works of the Law. For the Law merely brings awareness of sin.

Overwhelmed yet?

>pit of hell is not in the lake of fire

Other way around prottie. If you think Satan has any dominion over hell or what goes on there or the just punishment of sinners you’re an idiot.

Isaiah 64:6 But we are all like an unclean thing, And all our righteousnesses are like filthy rags; We all fade as a leaf, And our iniquities, like the wind, Have taken us away.

How about now?

What an absurd strawman argument. "A lie from the pit of hell" means the devil started it.

Revelation 9:2 And he opened the bottomless pit, and smoke arose out of the pit like the smoke of a great furnace. So the sun and the air were darkened because of the smoke of the pit.

Are prisoners in charge of the prison?

Shoo shoo papist flu

John 8:44
You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it.

Psalm 101:7
He who works deceit shall not dwell within my house; He who tells lies shall not continue in my presence.

Ecclesiastes is in fact filled with poetic irony, are we supposed to literally believe "the day of death is better than the day of birth"?

quote the rest of Psalm 14

It's not, actually. It deals with matters "under the sun".

And "under the sun", there are none righteous, no, not one.

You, sir, are "under the sun".

Why didn't you? Because it's irrelevant?

Psalm 14
Have all the workers of iniquity no knowledge,
Who eat up my people as they eat bread,
And do not call on the Lord?
There they are in great fear,
For God is with the generation of the righteous.
You shame the counsel of the poor,
But the Lord is his refuge.

Oh, that the salvation of Israel would come out of Zion!
When the Lord brings back the captivity of His people,
Let Jacob rejoice and Israel be glad.