were they seen as a germanic people even before the anglo saxons?
So were the original Britons germanic as well
Kevin Cook
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Dylan Smith
No.
They were Brythonic-speaking Celts and Picts (also probably Celts)
How can you be this retarded?
Bentley Gonzalez
I like this map better.
Christian Cox
so that is Cheddar Man then
he would of been a brythonic-speaking celt right?
Nathan Williams
The Britons weren't Germanic and they weren't seen as Germanic either. They were Celts and were acknowledged as such. However, there is speculation that Germanic peoples may have been living on the coast of Britain during the Roman period or even earlier.
Oliver Cook
No, Cheddar Man was a western European hunter-gatherer. These hunter-gatherers were absorbed by farmers who originated in Anatolia. The farmers were then almost completely replaced by incoming steppeniggers from the Netherlands who originated on the Pontic steppe. Later, during the Iron Age, the Celts established themselves in the British Isles. The Britons were one of these Celtic peoples.
Aiden Nelson
so when did the celts arive in britain
2000 BC or something?
Nolan Sanders
way after that
probably around 700 BC
Ryder Thomas
lmao you're several thousand years and many, many invasions/settlements too early
Ian Lee
>no Celts in Britain & Ireland before 700 BC.
Does that mean the Celtic languages in Ireland & Britain have some non-Indo-European loanwords?
I remember reading up on Picts, suggesting that their matriarchal society & tattoos may have been inherited from the previous population.
Ian Wilson
>germanic
no
Henry Martin
The Celts did not settle in Britain.
The Celtic, Brythonic-speaking peoples of Britain were descended from the same Pontic Steppe settlers from 2500BC.
Recent genetic evidence shows this.
Zachary Myers
>They were Brythonic-speaking Celts and Picts (also probably Celts)
Celt and Germanic aren't mutually exclusive terms.
Lucas Watson
>probably around 700 BC
W R O N G
Celts were always in Britain, Celtic culture did not originate in mainland Europe.
Barry Cunliffe co-authored a book with a few others arguing and proving with genetic and archaeological evidence the Celts are native to the British Isles and the Celtic influence in France, Germany, Spain, Southern Scandinavia (Denmark), and Eastern Europe is the result of a Celtic conquest beginning in Britain.
Aiden Sullivan
>his family came to England in the 1500s from Spain
>shilling this hard against Anglos
Thomas Lopez
Bell Beaker is far too early for the dispersal of Celtic if that's what you're implying. The Middle-Late Bronze Age is the earliest any scholars have tried to place the beginning of Celtic influence in the British Isles, while Bell Beaker spread to Britain around 2500 BC and the culture disappeared in the early Bronze Age. And even then, most scholars believe that the Celtic culture was spread to the British Isles during the early Iron Age (Halstatt C) through a combination of trade and cultural diffusion with limited population movement.
Lucas Myers
>if Celts came from Bell Beakers then all Bell Beakers would have become Celts
user....
Adam Ward
>if Celts came from Bell Beakers then all Bell Beakers would have become Celts
I am saying nothing of the kind. What I am saying is that it's impossible for Celtic to have existed during the Bell Beaker period, full stop. Yes, it's true that the Celtic culture is ultimately derived from Bell Beaker culture, but that doesn't mean Celtic existed during the Bell Beaker period. Even as late as the Tumulus culture (1600 BC - 1200 BC) it's likely that the Celtic and Italic language groups had not yet diverged. No scholar takes seriously the idea that the Celts were a distinct people as far back as the Bell Beaker period.
Michael Lopez
>Even as late as the Tumulus culture (1600 BC - 1200 BC) it's likely that the Celtic and Italic language groups had not yet diverged.
Pls give me any study that implies it, I have always read otherwise.
Levi Thomas
>Kortlandt, 2007, Italo-Celtic origins and prehistoric development of the Irish language
>Eska, 2010, The emergence of the Celtic languages
>Mallory, 2013, The Indo-Europeanization of Atlantic Europe
Also I should add that even if Celtic did split off during the Bell Beaker period, it could not have occurred in the British Isles. There's direct cultural continuity in central Europe between Unetice culture and Hallstatt culture, the earliest definitively Celtic culture, so it couldn't have originated in the British Isles and spread to central Europe. There's no archaeological or genetic evidence for it, and in the transition from Tumulus to Urnfield, for example, there was far more influence coming from the east than from the direction of the British Isles.
Christian Lopez
>so it couldn't have originated in the British Isles and spread to central Europe. There's no archaeological or genetic evidence for it
youtube.com
Cooper Rivera
I didn't watch the whole video, but I've read about his and Koch's theory and from what I understand the idea is that Proto-Celtic derived from south-west Iberia and developed as a lingua franca in the Atlantic Zone. It's an interesting theory but if it is accurate, it still means that Celtic isn't native to the British Isles since it would have only reached there in the Late Bronze Age.
Adrian Foster
Anglos aren't pigskin vermin like you.
Michael Thompson
>since it would have only reached there in the Late Bronze Age.
I think you mean late Neolithic, no?
Sebastian Foster
No, the theory specifies the Atlantic Bronze Age.
Jose Ortiz
Barry Cunliffe is also a hack on par with Mary Beard and is not taken seriously by the wider academic community.
Tyler Cooper
>we wuz germanicz
stop grasping for straws boy
Henry Hall
>celebrities are representative of a country
Look mom, i can do it too!