How will keto fags every recoer?

>eating only plants is unhealthy!
>eating only meat is healthy!

Ketofags and vegans are fucking dumb. Just because someone understands keto is for retards and diabetics with no other options doesn't mean their a veganfag.

>Entire human physiology
>Except ketones and all the related fat burning physiology
>Besides that, THE ENTIRE PHYSIOLOGY

I don't like vegan oregano gains, but his videos on disecting bullshit are top notch.

>The body is so dependant and efficiently designed to run on glucose that it stores fat for energy and is literally poisoned by high glucose

>>eating only meat is healthy!
Except that's not what keto is. Why do you feel the need to be dishonest about this, user?

Keto people do eat vegetables. And I don't see how it's FUCKING DUMB to only eat plants. You still get protein, fat, and carbs.

>entire human physiology is built to run on glucose
>even though humans have never eaten glucose before the last 200 years.

This. I had chicken, bundle of spinach with oil, and an avocado for lunch.

>Who are Jeff Volek and Stephen Phinney

>im literally retarded
What is glycolysis?????

I polish off a bag and a half of those spinach or kale or mix green salad bags a day. I've started just buying two big ass bag from costco every week

You retards think that everyone on keto eats bacon dipped in queso for every meal. Which is like thinking that all vegans eat oreos and wonderbread for every meal.

I'm on keto for myself, so I eat mostly protein and greens. Vegans are on keto because they saw Charlottes Web, or Okja or Babe or something and actually do eat like shit as long as they're not eating animals or animal products.

My vegan friend literally eats potatoes with margarine, bread, and salads drenched in sugary dressing all day long and snacks on candy and cookies.

Guess which one of us is the fatty?

>vegans are on keto
fuck, you know what i mean

You can eat pretty much any green vegetable on keto though, you've got roughly 30g net carbs to play around with per day on keto. I don't even do keto but most people who are stress the importance of eating a hell of a lot of leafy greens.

Why can't vegans grasp basic scientific principles?

Paprika and tomatoes are nice too. I like to make pic related without onions as a side dish.

Used to think keto was a meme and was retarded but i have been reading a lot about it and the research.
Seems quite decent desu,
Started today, and hopefully i wont regret it, carbs seem kinda useless if the body can adapt to use fat. And sugar is shit, you cant argue that. Ketone bodies here we go!!

I started doing keto as a meme to ironically joke about it with my faggy vegetarian/vegan friends, but it turns out it really fucking works.

>never bloated
>mental clarity and physical energy is INSANELY HIGH
>used to have to pound adderal to function, now only take it once every two weeks or so

I feel amazing on keto, and to be honest family I haven't lost that much weight. I have no desire to switch from it anytime soon, even if I'm being roasted 24/7 by faggotass vegans and environmentalist judgemental assholes.

If you have some research, you should be aware of the long term effects of running on ketone bodies. Ketoacidosis mainly.

Also metabolic damage and insulin resistance development.

You have been warned.

Yh until you collapse and your go to ER.

Doctor says
>You did what? Keto?

do you have any links on those?
Ketoacidosis only happens on diabetic people. On keto diet its supposed to be .5-5mM and on ketoacidosis is 15-25mM , so its a huge diference.

Havent seen anything about metabolic damage so thats kinda new desu, and insulin resistance makes no sence. Blood sugar stay the same, and the whole idea is to reduce insulin, how can you build a resistance when it reduces it? plz post links man. I do not want to fuck up.

>
>If you have some research, you should be aware of the long term effects of running on ketone bodies. Ketoacidosis mainly.

Kek. People actually believe this but say that there is absolutely no connection between eating too many carbs and da betus.

He's retarded. Insulin resistance causes ketoacidosis. The body doesn't absorb glucose because of insulin resistance so it releases ketones. The combination of high blood sugar and ketones causes the blood to become dangerously acidic.

His ability to read must be limited to four letters per word, thus his inability to comprehend the actual issue and the difference between keto and ketoacidosis.

Diabetic ketoacidosis is not the same as dietary ketosis. Ketoisis doesn't lead to ketoacidoisis in non diabetics. And the insulin resistance is a feature not a flaw and doesn't mean what you think it means. And decreased metabolism is due to severe calorie restriction and only gets lumped in with keto because people often go on keto to eat at a deficit. Eat 400 calories of berries a day and see what that does to your metabolism.

I was keto for about 8 months, with very few cheat(carb) meals.

Lost about 70lbs.

Felt awesome every day.

Became fascinated with nutrition, read every piece of literature I could find. Actual scientific stuff with references, not bullshit blogs. For anyone interested, I suggest Lyle Mcdonalds book.

Keto is certainly not the end all be all, but you keto bashers can really be a bunch of retards.

>States studies show this
>cites youtube

Kill yourself

I'll add, he may cite a study on rats and ignore the ones on people. There is a minor increase in IR in muscles in humans, because the body priorities glucose for the brain since that is the only organ that requires glucose albeit in small amounts. Working out, the reduction in inflammation ketosis leads to and loss of weight all increase IS. Also if you switch back to a high carb diet the effects reverse pretty quickly.

Carbs and fat are generally just a bad idea, you can have one or the other, you can't have both.

>Carbs and fat are generally just a bad idea, you can have one or the other, you can't have both.

Pretty sure that no human has ever lived and not eaten both...

Sould I eat a stalk of brocoli or a piece of toast? Hmm...

The difference between Keto, Veganism and the SAD diet is that the toast isn't an option for the guy on keto and since most vegans are ethical vegans they really just stick with a SAD minus protein.

>humans have never eaten glucose before the last 200 years

they don't need to, any form of complex or simple sugar is broken down by the body into glucose

Sad that people actually get facts from anons like this if no one is around to check you

>entire human physiology has been designed to get proteins from meat
>thinking depriving your body from it will somehow make you healthier

Vegans are fucking retarded

>the body is designed to run on glucose

Interesting how the liver has no problem converting glycerol from fat metabolism into glucose.

Interesting how fat metabolism in mitochondria and ketone metabolism produce less reactive oxidation species than glucose

Interesting how high carb diets are associated with neurological dysfunction, epilepsy, and psychiatric disorders.

Interesting how high carb athletes need to suck down sports drinks and energy gels unless they want to hit the wall at 15 miles while fat adapted athletes run for 100 miles on water.

Interesting how vegans ignore the fact we have a higher photo stomach acid than any herbivore on the planet and is squarely in omnivore territory.

Interesting how vegans ignore the massive piles of animal game bones in every human settlement we've found.

Okay, I've watched Cowspiracy, What the Health, Okja, and a video of a a 170lb guy working at a slaughter hitting a 2400lb cow with a tire iron. It's 2017, I'm vegan now we have to be a steward to the animals.

Just one question? Is Jizz still vegan? Because I drink a lot of it.

i fucking hate hearing this guys voice so much

>but say that there is absolutely no connection between eating too many carbs and da betus
Only retards think there is a connection.

You know plants are living beings with feelings and shit, too, right?

You gotta kill to live, welcome to Erf.

It's all a Jewish conspiracy, you see! Oatmeal? Beans? That's peasant food!

Anyone has actual proof that this diet is harmfull?
Im starting to get really scared of the long term damage. Tho the more i look and research, it seems its all good, and all "side efects" are reversible.
Im not even a fat fuck, i want to bulk on keto for health gains.

Carbs in veg doesn't even count given that most of them are inaccessible fiber. So you can pretty much eat as much green veg as you can stomach without ever going over the carb limit.
I eat more veg now than I did before. Don't know where this bullshit about keto being a never ending buffet of greasy bacon and burgers comes from.

no

If you eat too much protein your body will make carbs out of them via gluconeogenesis which is said can kick you out of ketosis, so it's even more bullshit.
Guess they lump it in with paleo.

I have a question, does this happen with a proportion of protein to fat? or is it if you eat more than x amout of protein daily? i eat like 70-90g of protein. Most studies i have seen talk about droping out of ketosis after like 200-300 gs of protein. So im wondering if 100gs or less can drop you out

Found this, Some people dont like youtube and i do understand, but there are type of youtube chanels. Either way, youtube.com/watch?v=pd7HXVdwv8Q

Also, he said protein becomes Insulin wich is retarded, but i think he meant, that its transformed to glucose and that creates insulin an insulin spike. Wich does make sence.

Read lyle mcdonalds book on keto. It really is the most complete source of information on the diet. He mentions to get kicked out of keto through protein you have to not be working out and eat a substantial amount od protein (~350+g)

comes from shitty herbivore LARPers who want everyone to eat animal feed because they like pictures of baby animals

And fat adapted athlete never win anything even those ultra :^)

Keto is good for someone sedentary or a week-end warrior , but stop talking shit about muh athlete , did you even read the art and science of low carb performance ?

Day 2 of keto, not so bad senpai, not so bad. I have no hunger which is really odd, I can eat, but I'm not really hungry. I'm trying not to fall into a caloric deficit, but it's kinda hard to get food with no carbs were I live.

What are good sources of healthy fats? Eating raw avocado sounds disgusting lol

>Anyone has actual proof that this diet is harmfull?
Google.

>i want to bulk on keto for health gains.
>bulk on keto
lmao
>for health gains
LMAO

>Eating raw avocado sounds disgusting
Fat fuck

WFPB vegan here.

Keep going keto. I love watching you meat brains die young from cancer, obesity, diabetes, and strokes. it's funny that you need need boner pills by the time you hit mid 30's.

I enjoy every last drop of the misery and harm done to yourself caused by your stupid eating choices. Eat up healthlets.

I cant find it can anyone share it?

k

magnet:?xt=urn:btih:4f3bedabbc49f8d43805b987155741fd3451edbf&dn=The.Ketogenic.Diet%28Lyle.McDonald%29&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.leechers-paradise.org%3A6969&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Fzer0day.ch%3A1337&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Fopen.demonii.com%3A1337&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.coppersurfer.tk%3A6969&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Fexodus.desync.com%3A6969

>fat adapted athletes run for 100 miles on water.
>because their body breaks down protein into glucose via gluconeogenesis unless they slow down to a crawl

>if you're against keto, you're a vegan XDD

>Eating raw avocado sounds disgusting lol

People cook them? They're fucking amazing, what the hell are you even on about?

>Eating raw avocado sounds disgusting lol

Maybe now but your tastes may adapt as you actually transition into keto.
I used to forced down avocados and hated them.
I really enjoy the taste of them now; a rich nutty sweetness. You can taste the fat. Delicious.

Didn't watch the video but protein does induce an insulin response without high enough levels to transform protein to glucose. I believe whey induces the largest, but it's still far less than carbs induce.

Like other Anons have said, Keto is only good if you are sedentary. Depriving your body of glucose is idiotic at best.

You dont build tolerance to carbs AKA insulin resistance from not eating carbs lmao.

Intramyocellular lipids disrupt the muscles' ability to respond to insulin. Intramyocellular lipids build up from having high triglyceride levels for extended periods.

A keto diet lowers triglycerides.

If you're losing weight, yes. Any diet will do that if you're in a caloric deficit.

Bunch of Biochem flunkies in this thread. I digress.

It lowers them at a caloric maintenance.

Just because something is made with triglycerides does not mean it raises triglycerides in any appreciable amount.

Being overweight increase fasting levels of tris and so does high consumption of carbohydrates.

Any sources? Not even trying to say I'm right you're wrong, prove it. Genuinely curious because I'm undecided about keto.

What is your occupation?

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2716748/

You basically get high tris from fatty liver disease (being overweight). So yes, a caloric deficit will help you lower your tris and a ketogenic diet is a great way to do that.

No significant long term side effects were observed and the diet is recommended to retain a healthy bodyweight and a healthy blood lipid profile.

Thanks man. I think this being healthy or not is more to do with the type of fat intake though.

>20% saturated fat, and 80% polyunsaturated and monounsaturated fat
I don't know about most, but when I think of keto I'm thinking of people living off of butter, eggs, steak, etc because that's all they ever seem to talk about. Obviously you don't have to, though.

So basically just don't eat only steak/cheese and you're good? What the hell do you even eat to get most of your calories from fat that aren't saturated? Avocados, coconuts, nuts and seeds?

My sat fat intake is not particularly high but it's not a chief concern. If you actually read that study they state that previous studies have found issues with diets high in polyunsaturated fats specifically.
I eat butter and eggs pretty much everyday, but not in large quantities. I also eat fish of most kinds, brazil and pecan nuts, avocados, various cheeses (brie is muh fave atm), a lot of broccoli, cauliflower and bell peppers. I drink a glass of whole milk a day. I have olives now and then... Mushrooms, a few cloves of garlic here and there... Even dark chocolate from time to time.

With a limit of 50g carbs (which does not include carbs that are fibre) you can fit a lot of different things into your daily diet without even trying.

I eat much, much better than I ever did before if only because I've cut out *nearly* all sugary treats (yes milk and chocolate have a few grams of lactose), all bread, starches and grains and almost all processed food.

Just watch your electrolytes to begin with; a glass of salt water or a cup of bullion (literally a bullion cube in hot water) and salting your meals will keep you even and will help you avoid pretty much all 'keto flu' issues.

People who think that keto is just a licence to eat a few kilos of beef, fried in utter everyday haven't got much of a clue.

Oh and yeah, I do eat steak fairly regularly (once or twice a week) along with chicken, pork and lamb.

No dumbass, leucine on it's own incites a huge insulin response. It's pretty retarded to bulk on keto because you can't build muscle while your body is actively in the state of ketosis. You need insulin to invite muscle protein synthesis. I'd still reccomend going very lowcarb high protein med fat for anyone wanting to bulk and minimize fat gain

The majority of carbs in vegetables don't count as they are almost exclusively dietary fiber that is not digestible per say.

Look it up man, then talk. ;)

Actually I'm quite slim, that's why I want to bulk. I meant not in guacamole (which I love)
Actually there is a chemical prodded that makes energy from fat, named ketogenesis, look it up.
As far as I know insulin spikes with any glucose added, so yea protein does spike it, the issues arrive if spikes way too much (like on carbs)
Retarded people think keto means feasting on meat and eggs. The idea is to eat healthy fats to enter ketogenesis.

When you open your yap does shit always fall out?

It wasn't designed for obese people it was initially used at least therapeutically to treat childhood epilepsy.

How it came about or why is more likely just because you know science and research done by people not like you.

The natural Inuit diet is a keto diet for a huge chunk of the year. Is it a health diet maybe maybe not the reality is true long term studies do not exists to support it or tear it down.

The reality is the human body has evolved to go without carbs for long periods of time.

Kek , once keto adapted your muscle will use fatties acids and not ketone , the problem with ketone and FA is that they both are very limited in the speed at which they can be used , you won't be able to sustain a real effort for a long duration with them , you need glycogen and the rate at which your body can burn your muscle to form glycogen is not high enough on top of really damaging your body .

As far as I knew ketone bodies work on most cells, tho the usage of them is slower, studies suggest they don't decrease the maximum output of energy, but they do increase the duration usage of energy. Do take into consideration that kotonbodies are more energy dense than glucose
(Glucose releases 11atp molecules as for ketones it depends on witch one of the two it is , but I do know the average is 22atp molecules)
So it's more energy efficient senpai

you cant bulk on keto dumbass. the protein will pull you out of ketosis due to gluconeogenesis; then youre just doing lowcarb. which is still best to be honest

And look how advanced the inuits became over their many years of thriving. /joke/
Deprive yourself of carbs i.e glucose, see how well you function. If your job is ass and not talking, you'll do fine.

Also, I don't remember the exactly why, but the proces of ketogenesis prevents muscle tissue from being used to form energy, because ketogenesis uses the same enzyme to synthesize as protein.

We don't need all the aminoácids, our body makes some and depending on what you eat, you may have enought of one, so once you reach your protein needs, the rest goes into forming glucose

Sorry, misread that, the amount of protein needed to drop out of ketogenesis is like 200-250gs of protein a day, I eat 100gs man

Ketosis has shown great results when it comes to aerobic endurance activities but, yes, pretty much totally a worse source when intense peak energy is required.

some tribes at north only eat fish so they diet is mostly fat and protein with very little carbs

it's like human body evolved and can adapt to where you live and what you eat

You get more energy from one molecule of ketone sure, but the speed at which you can break down that molecule is too slow to produce energy quickly enough for high intensity , it's the reason why As Vo2Max increase carb oxidation also increase and fat oxidation decrease, it's not as good .

On top of that atp for atp , producing it with ketone require around 6% more O2 ( but it produce 25% less Co2 wew )

No where did I say physical performance is enhanced by this type of diet.

You should learn how to read and comprehend.

If you job is not physical in nature a diet low on carbs may help one function better. If you are one of those manual labor people your work will suffer.

The Inuit thrived in one the worst environments on the planet.

I personally don't follow a keogenic diet as it does not meet my athletic needs my training requires a great deal of glycogen, but even then I could go 0 carbs for 4 days + a transition day into a 2 day re-feed if I wanted to really wanted to get cut below 10 BF%.

And their health shows how poor of a diet option it is.

Yo senpai, and for health benefits? I don't really care if my max reps go a tad bit low, and I'm guessing the issue is replenishing once it has been depleted, or so you mean actual usage makes it so you can't output the same strength?
Is it slower replenish of used energy on tissue or is it that the lower usage rate deminished max output delivered?

>Actually there is a chemical prodded that makes energy from fat, named ketogenesis, look it up.

Ketogenesis is a metabolic function, not a chemical.
Ketones are made because the brain cannot function on triglycerides for energy, and you will literally die if you don't have either glucose or ketones in the blood to feed the brain.

The ATP cycle cannot be replenished at even a moderate level of exertion on triglycerides alone, and ketones are not produced quickly enough to sustain this level of intensity. Protein is indeed broken down into glucose to compensate. You're literally burning your gains on keto if you're exercising with any intensity for even a mildly sustained period. This is the same reason marathon runners tend to lack muscle mass in general, because once their glycogen stores are depleted, gluconeogenesis kicks on to keep them going.

If you're well adapted you may still be able to replenish a small amount of glycogen ( you get good at not using your glycogen unless you're high intensity ) and it can allow you to do some high intensity things like training SS but the replenishing is very slow and not really high , you can still force it by consuming a bit more carbs and being well fat adapted .

But in the long run keto is absolutely not healthy , there is just no reason to deprive yourself of carbs , it allow you to be more energetic more often and thus train more .

Unless you want to do some power lifter program with low frequency and volume it's sub-optimal .

And keto offer no health benefice , it's literally one huge fucking farce were 99% of the studies proving otherwise are done on obese fuckers losing weight ( which always result in health benefice )