I lean towards believing it. BUT I am very confused by the blatant lies, I think you have all heard of the magical mine carts that went at impossible speeds and 'shot women and children into the ovens', products made of Jewish bodies (soap, lampshades, 'beds for German women').
Sure Jews love money, that could explain why so many of them lied about being "Holocaust survivors" and exaggerated/falsifies accounts of extermination methods. Also why is the "Holocaust" focus SOLELY on Jews which were allegedly 'exterminated'. I don't know of laws being in place to protect other tragedies/civilian deaths during war. Very strange that the Holocaust has such laws.
>Inb4 ebil Nahtzeeee or raycizzzzzzzz
Please provide sources and insight. Thanks Pic related is the book detailing blatant lies.
The New York Times printed a story in the 1980s where a 'holocaust survivor' with a straight face tells the story of how the Nazis had a cage in the camp with a bear and an eagle in it. And every day the meanie in charge of the camp would take a jew and put it in the cage where the bear and the eagle would rip the jew to pieces. And we have to sit there and pretend to believe the pathetic old liar. Because he's Jewish? Simply wow. I personally don't know much about the Holocaust. But I'll be fucked if I believe that old liar's story. The hide of the man. He ought to have been whipped in Times Square for that.
Elijah Thomas
>I don't know of laws being in place to protect other tragedies/civilian deaths during war, because I am retarded. I leverage my retardation into actual historiographical doubt.
It happened, about three million were gassed and the rest were shot all over Europe. The process was well-planned, efficient and kept extremely quiet,which is part of the reason the well is so poisoned today. There's another thread about it already in progress, check that out.
Ethan Smith
oh so 3 million were gassed, the rest shot? how many died in 'ovens' then? and how many wear ripped to pieces by a bear and an eagle in a cage?
Ovens were for cremating corpses though. Putting live Jews in an oven is mostly a white supremacist meme because they feel emasculated by the Jew and it is his petty revenge fantasy.
Aiden Russell
>Very strange that the Holocaust has such laws. What?
Evan Wright
>I am also illiterate, and retarded. Rwandan genocide denial is illegal, same as Holocaust denial. In both cases, the laws illegalizing denial happened after the war and genocide in question. They are equivalent, and if your head wasn't stuck so far up your ass, you'd see this.
Joseph Sanchez
Yes but you have these eyewitness accounts of them putting people in ovens like a factory making widgets. And one guy really did say they had a bear and an eagle in a cage and would put a new jewish person in there every day for them to eat. Wouldnt the bear and the eagle kill each other? The story is patently false. Agitprop. Of course WWII happened and not just Jews but over 75 million people died. In horrific ways. Shrug. Maybe someone really did get put in a cage with a bear and an eagle. I highly doubt it was an everyday thing, tho. Shit, maybe it was. Theyd need plenty of bears and eagles, tho.
Hunter Green
newsflash the rwandan genocide was a lightning affair. a few belgian troops got BTFO by rampaging mobs as the entire society was whipped into a frenzy aided by popular songs, radio broadcasts, people literally instructing their neighbours to kill so and so. 1 million people died in a very quick time. Laws had nothing to do with that. Decades later were some held responsible? I guess... but that's not the point you were trying to make. And you dare call me illiterate, or retarded? Shamefur.
Michael Sullivan
>Yes but you have these eyewitness accounts of them putting people in ovens like a factory making widgets. Of course, they were efficient cremation processes. What's your point?
>Wouldnt the bear and the eagle kill each other? How is an eagle going to kill a bear? How is a bear going to reach an eagle perched up high?
>Theyd need plenty of bears and eagles, tho. Is your strategy to find some ridiculous claim then embellish it even more?
How big is this cage youre imagining man? This story is getting pretty elaborate. So they had a gigantic 50ft high by 50ft wide cage for the bear and the eagle to roam in?
Julian Rogers
>And you dare call me illiterate, or retarded? Yes, because you are illiterate AND retarded. Let's take this from the top, shall we?
>I don't know of laws being in place to protect other tragedies/civilian deaths during war.
Notice how the laws being referred to aren't against murdering civilians in war, it's protecting the tragedies themselves. They're often referred to as memory laws. OP (you) is asserting that the holocaust has such memory laws and other tragedies do not.
I then link . to two newpaper reports of people being arrested for denying other atrocities, in one case, the Rwandan genocide, in the other, the Armenian genocide. Clearly, the Holocaust is not alone in having such memory laws.
You then start talking about "The story describes events after the war, not during" which has absolutely nothing to do with either what I linked or to the claim that the Holocaust is unique in having memory laws protecting it.
I try to explain this to you, using short words and simple sentences.
You utter more nonsense.
Now that this has been cleared up, you need to kill yourself, because you are a waste of oxygen that could better be employed by bacteria that break shit down into its component elements.
Grayson Anderson
How is this even relevant? I am talking about laws denying genocides, not the genocides themselves. You would know this if you had a 5th grader's reading comprehension.
Leo Anderson
The majority of holocaust denial revolves around circulating ridiculous fake claims about the camps and using them as a precedent to discredit any and all eyewitness accounts.
IMO the people who go publish books and go to journalists saying that wild crap are just as irresponsible and morally bankrupt like the deniers themselves.
Jose Foster
>I try to explain this to you, using short words and simple sentences. I think we've isolated user's problem. It only understands ideas if they are presented in terms of the lowest common denominator. This is because its mind is not so agile. Hailing from the lower echelons of the brainiological meritocracy, it trudges through life on 'low power' mode, only able to comprehend its peers when they speak with the average complexity of a second-grader.
Nathan Morris
>Asks how the assassination of Habayarimana is relevent to the Rwandan genocide.
Nathaniel Green
Do they not have zoos where you live? Because apparently you've never seen a large animal cage and think bears can jump 50 feet.
Jose Ward
KL
Bloodlands
Read either, both have tons of citations from archives, interviews, etc.
The eagle bear thing is like reading top anti Tiberius and Theodora propaganda and saying "lmao, some dude who fills up a cliff with all the kids he raped and a mega harlot taking 1,000 dicks a day ran an empire. No way dude. Rome is fucking fake because this one story about it is.
Joshua King
It happened for sure. But for all the claims about tattooed skin being cut off and human lampshades and soap and stuff which get repeated to this day I don't think there is any real evidence
Colton Brown
So you're admitting to the thread you believe they had a 50ft cage with a bear and an eagle in it, which they fed a new victim to every day? Even the NY Times story has a listener to the story call the old guy on it, and say he doesn't believe him/ The old guy just says no it's true, it's true. Mind you he didn't say the cage was 50ft high. But if you wanna make it that big, cool, man. Were the lions, too? Maybe even tigers? Oh my!
Matthew Miller
>The eagle bear thing is like reading top anti Tiberius and Theodora propaganda and saying "lmao, some dude who fills up a cliff with all the kids he raped and a mega harlot taking 1,000 dicks a day ran an empire. No way dude. Rome is fucking fake because this one story about it is. I actually agree with this point completely. Agitprop what you might call it today, they might even call an incendiary in ancient Rome. Some of the worst punishments were for anonymous pamphleteers, at one point in time. If I recall correctly? Makes you think. "Not so funny now, is it? Funny man!"
Tyler Bell
I am talking about LAWS denying the genocides, not the genocides themselves. Again, what does the assassination of Habayarimana have to do with the equivalency of Rwandan memory laws to Holocaust memory laws?
Ryder Rivera
No, I'm saying your argument doesn't make sense even if we accept your premises.
Colton Jones
Ever since I was a kid watching Holocaust documentaries and articles in the media I was baffled how EVERY SINGLE Holocaust survivor Jew ever claims to have met Mengele. Some of them even claimed to meet Hitler in the camps. It's mind boggling.
Ryan Nguyen
My argument is pretty simple. In war lots of lies get told because you know the sides are at war. That means they aren't on each other's team! So they aren't "nice" to one another! Is the simpleton following along? When you have an enemy, it's generally considered not just okay, but advisable, to lie to them. Right? Whether that is ethical or not is besides the point, as it is plainly the common practice. Thus: many of the more absurd claims you read about the war, may just be tall stories. This does not mean atrocities did not occur. And no doubt many atrocities that might sound far-fetched, actually did occur. Duh. The OP's salient point, if there is one, seems to me, that many of the more absurd claims made about the Holocaust might not be true. It seems eminently reasonable to accept this as a possibility without denying the reality of the Holocaust. Furthermore you could go to any conflict in history and encounter similar exaggerated claims, which are generally considered by historians to be fabrications. As another poster here said, the fact that these tall stories exist does not mean the people about whom the stories are told did nothing wrong. One fact is not strictly related to the other. Are you still able to comprehend what is being written? Or are you about fourteen years old? Whatever, I've grown tired of explaining.
William Ross
Holy shit the autism in this thread.
The bear and the eagle story made up by some random opportunist is not accepted by historians. The Holocaust is. Educate yourself on what historians actually say the Holocaust was and how it happened rather than strawmanning this hard.
Ryder Rivera
But nobody here to my knowledge has said it didn't happen other then the OP's title asking whether it did. But he then starts his post by saying he believes it did. And nobody is denying it did. So, like, what are you even talking about?
Colton Hernandez
He is obviously attempting to seed doubt on the Holocaust by posting random bullshit "survivor" stories that are obviously false, discredited and not taken seriously by any historians.
If you can't see past this obvious propaganda tactic I feel sorry for you.
Juan Anderson
who claimed that?
Hunter Ward
Elie Wiesel. Night is probably the most famous Holocaust survival story and it..... oh wait it doesn't mention Mengele at all.
>what is the Franke-Griksch Report >what is the Gerstein Report >what is the diary of Willhelm Cornides >what is the diary of Hubert Pfoch >what is the Wetzler letter >what are the Sassen Tapes
stormnigger
Liam Williams
all of those are contemporaneous primary sources btw talking about gas chambers, except for the last one but that was before Eichmann could have been interrogated/tortured by the Mossad so theres no reason for him to lie
Jeremiah Long
Hey, can you tell me what Hitler meant by this on July 21, 1941?:
"The Jews are the bane of mankind. If the Jews will be allowed to do as they will, like they are permitted in their Soviet heaven, then they will fulfill their most insane plans. And thus Russia became the center to the world's illness ... if for any reason, one nation would endure the existence of a single Jewish family, that family would eventually become the center of a new plot. If there are no more Jews in Europe, nothing will hold the unification of the European nations ... this sort of people cannot be integrated in the social order or into an organized nation. They are parasites on the body of a healthy society, that live off of expulsion of decent people. One cannot expect them to fit into a state that requires order and discipline. There is only one thing to be done with them: To exterminate them. The state holds this right since, while precious men die on the battlefront, it would be nothing less than criminal to spare these bastards. They must be expelled, or – if they pose no threat to the public – to be imprisoned inside concentration camps and never be released."
As a Jew, this was stupid. Yes, there were Polish collaborators in the Holocaust and the law which stifles talking about this is bad but this was a totally inflammatory and unnecessary way of going about it.
Robert Wright
Jesus Christ and these fucks wonder why everyone hates them
>oy vey poland you are just as responsible as the germans stop denying it or we’ll sicc our Amerimutts on you
Elijah Young
This is the first I've heard of these stories discredited. Granted that means nothing about the reality of the concensus of historians, but my point is, were one to argue against them today they wouldn't be prosecuted under memory laws. That itself speaks louder to the lay historian than whatever the discrediting historians would have to say. Why is it like this?
Christian Foster
Did the Nazis murder tons of Jews? Yeah of course.
Are the numbers accurate? Probably not. I don't think the specific numbers really matter though; whether it was 3 million or 6 million is a mostly immaterial difference.
Do the Jews benefit from it to a sickening degree today? Absolutely. Look at how much sway Israel has in American politics today. And if you even so much as point out that AIPAC exists, you're labelled and anti-semite and the fucking SPLC will have you disappeared.
Cameron Bell
It happened and they deserved it and they deserve another
Carter Campbell
...
Brody James
And there's first hand accounts of the ghosts of Henry V and his archers fighting the Germans and armies of angels descending from heaven to cover the British retreat at Mons. Are we really expected to believe that the so called "First World War" happened when you have people spouting such utter nonsense?
Josiah Ortiz
That’s the wrong arm
Levi Diaz
But that actually happened though
James Scott
The Israeli gov't didn't start using the Holocaust as a justification for it's policies until the late 70s/early 80s. For the first decades it was something that it was deeply embarrassed of. I agree that the Israel lobby has a lot of influence on the U.S. government- when it comes to Israel. But you should also acknowledge that the U.S.-Israel relationship essentially became unconditional under the most anti-Semitic president of recent time, Nixon. Also just because people exploit the history of American slavery does that mean it also never happened/was exaggerated?
Xavier Rivera
they *would be prosecuted
Julian Allen
>Also just because people exploit the history of American slavery does that mean it also never happened/was exaggerated? I never said the Holocaust never happened. And I even said that I didn't care whether the numbers were inflated or not. The Holocaust happened and was bad. What more do you want?
All I want is for people who are two generations or more removed from the incident to stop playing the victim about it.
I'm a quarter Greek, should I be able to demand reparations from the Italians for what Enrico Dandolo did?
Mason Smith
My ancestors left continental Europe between the end of slavery and the beginning of WWII. Why am I supposed to feel white guilt?
Elijah Reed
It sounded like you said the numbers were exaggerated without providing proof.
Eli Brown
Let that be a waring to anybody who supports or helps Jews; No good deed goes unpunished…
Lincoln Reyes
>I think you have all heard of the magical mine carts that went at impossible speeds and 'shot women and children into the ovens', products made of Jewish bodies (soap, lampshades, 'beds for German women'). Stop cherrypicking things that have little in common with established Holocaust historiography in order to discredit said historiography. Academics don't take these things seriously, and neither should you.
>Also why is the "Holocaust" focus SOLELY on Jews which were allegedly 'exterminated'.
Except it's not.
>I don't know of laws being in place to protect other tragedies/civilian deaths during war. Very strange that the Holocaust has such laws.
It's not strange at all. If you look at the countries in the world, the amount of them that have these laws is pathetic in number. Coincidentally, these countries are also those who were most affected under the Nazi dictatorship. Maybe the only political agenda here is something called "Never Again"? How about that. It's called generic hate speech laws.
Jaxon Clark
>Maybe someone really did get put in a cage with a bear and an eagle. I highly doubt it was an everyday thing, tho. No historian claims such. I've never heard of this "bear and eagle" story outside of Stormfags cherrypicking the stories of literal-whos trying to make a quick buck by pretending to be a Holocaust survivor.
Kayden Hernandez
Citation seriously needed.
Alexander Phillips
>people exploit the Holocaust for fame, money and attention like any other tragedy >therefore because of these specific ridiculous accounts the Holocaust didn't happen >B-B-B-B-BUT I'M NOT P-POL HONEST I SW-SWEAR! fuck off
Austin Price
>People lie and pretend to have been Special Forces, fought in Vietnam, etc for money and attention >/pol/acks don't blink an eye >Some Jews claim to have survived the Holocaust and publish books with three figure sales to get money and attention >WTF CLEARLY EVERY ACADEMIC AND WITNESS IS A PAID LIAR AND THE ESTABLISHED HISTORIOGRAPHY SURROUNDING THE HOLOCAUST IS ALL BULLSHIT BECAUSE OF WHAT THIS ONE LITERAL WHO SAID IN HIS BOOK WHICH SOLD 12 COPIES GLOBALLY This is your brain on /pol/
Caleb Butler
Well, if they're going to say you did it anyway, might as well fire up the camps again.
>Let that be a waring to anybody who supports or helps Jews; No good deed goes unpunished… >shows a picture of a memorial created by the Jews to honor those who supported and helped them
Dominic Lee
Good shit user
Easton Wilson
>shows a picture of a memorial created by the Jews to honor those who supported and helped them
Exactly, are you not following the thread?
Josiah Garcia
Yep. They are snakes who use their host country's power to intimidate and coerce.
>"Unless we're living in crisscrossing parallel universes, this video is the last word on what life was really like inside Germany's WWII prison camps. Unlike the often absurd stories we've thus far been fed by phony 'heroes' of a nonexistent holocaust, what we see here are genuine accounts given by people of transparent integrity."
Elijah Reed
I think they probably are exaggerated because there's so much to be gained by playing the victim, but like I said I don't really care one way or the other. Whether it was 3 million, 6 million, or 12 million doesn't really matter to me. They're all pretty huge numbers; none of them are excusable.
But neither is making up bullshit about Jews being turned en masse to soap.
Logan Turner
>making up bullshit about Jews being turned en masse to soap
lmfao did people really say this?
James Phillips
>what we see here are genuine accounts given by people of transparent integrity
Blake Brooks
>Holocaust survivors are all liars except for these few who agree with me
Dylan Lee
WTF I wish I was in a concentration camp now
Jace Allen
You're right guys, 6 billions Jews were gassed and subsequently turned into soap, and then those soap bars and lampshades were experimented on by the Angel of Death prior to being thrown into immense incinerators by the cart-load.
Ethan Roberts
Who claims six million Jews were gassed? (other than Stormfags)
Carter Roberts
Damn maybe Hitler wasn't so bad
Tyler Mitchell
...
Nicholas James
How could anyone not envy these people?
John Morales
>Stormies still posting charts which have been debunked before they were even born
Carter Morgan
...
Lincoln White
tbqh, I'm starting to think you're an ickle slimy lefty false-flagger
Jonathan Hughes
...
Joshua Walker
Wow, Typhus and food shortages do not mix well. What a sad state of affairs.
Perhaps this is why they found huge mounds of clothing everywhere???
Michael Taylor
>Food shortages When the Allies reached the Nazi death camps in Germany, they found the SS personnel well-fed and well-dressed, and the local population was often not undergoing serious hardship, relatively speaking. (On the other hand, the German population in the big cities did suffer a lot.) This is clearly attested to in the film footage of the liberation of the camps, where one can see the people in the nearby towns and villages, which the American soldiers brought over to the camps so they can witness what happened. None of them are starved. There is also a famous photograph of some plump SS women being captured at Bergen-Belsen. Tens of thousands of prisoners starved at Belsen. If you've seen a film of emaciated corpses being bulldozed into mass graves, it was probably taken at Belsen. The contrast to the well-fed SS women is quite remarkable. Scenes from the liberation of Bergen-Belsen demonstrate this beyond question. At the Belsen camp, hundreds of tons of food were found locked up, just a few miles away from where tens of thousands starved to death. Also, hardly any of the Allied prisoners from Western nations starved to death; there were people that the Nazis wanted to keep alive, and there were people they preferred dead. A great number of Soviet POW's died -- over three million -- for this reason. bergenbelsen.co.uk/pages/TrialTranscript/Trial_Day_004.html
Asher Murphy
It didn't happen, but it should have happened.
Colton Harris
>implying one cannot receive a Bachelor of Arts in physics/math and work as an engineer
>Begins with ad hominem
>B-but it had some wind, and it was scrubbed!
Wow, I am thoroughly convinced. :^)
Asher Bailey
Some died from typhus. Numerically speaking, most Jews died from gassing, the next-most from shooting.
Alexander Walker
...
Daniel Taylor
>most Jews died from gassing, the next-most from shooting. Even the main holohoax narrative now is that few died from gassing and most died from mass shooting. Keep up with the times, goyim.
Bentley Price
You clearly don't know what the "main holohoax narrative" even is.
Jackson Adams
2 million Jews were shot on the Eastern Front, the Holocaust was a complex phenomenon that occurred in distant phases using many different techniques and methods. While the idea that exactly 6 million people died in gas chambers is false, there certainly were people killed in gas chambers as a proportion of the millions killed overall. Most Jews who died in the Holocaust did not died in gas chambers but by other means, most commonly through starvation and shooting.
James Sanchez
German Gendarmerie? You're embarrassing yourself, kid. That photo was used on the main wiki page for Babi Yar before it was debunked (they took it down). You see any bullet wounds, any blood on these women? Most of them are even alive. Not to mention these "Gendarmerie" are not even wearing German uniforms.
Jayden Flores
>That photo was used on the main wiki page for Babi Yar before it was debunked (they took it down). Citation seriously needed.
>You see any bullet wounds, any blood on these women? Contrary to Hollywood and videogames, bullet wounds aren't usually that noticeable. Chances are they've been shot in the head. Photo quality isn't sufficient to tell either.
>Not to mention these "Gendarmerie" are not even wearing German uniforms. No reason to believe that. The man on the right has a white line around his neck indicating that he's either wearing a gorget, is an NCO, or both. You can also vaguely make out rank insignia on the left man's sleeve. Weapons are probably MP 34s or 28s
Evan Miller
>Not to mention these "Gendarmerie" are not even wearing German uniforms. They are probably Schutzmannschaft
Michael James
A photo (allegedly) being used in the wrong context on a fucking Wikipedia article isn't evidence of some far-reaching Jewish Holohoax conspiracy
Austin Williams
It's amazing how quickly lies can spread.
Henry Morales
>Not a single source Really makes you think
Joshua Nguyen
I'm sure you'd know
James Powell
Every week stormfags start these threads, every week they get BTFO
Hudson Ramirez
>ronald reagan >not a globalist
Evan Brooks
There's no evidence that Wiesenthal actually said this.
