Can you guys give me a rundown on all side's claims for Israel...

blatant lie

They took it from the people before them

>Arab Muslims and a small Christian minority live on modern Israel circa the late 19th century
>Faster means of communication is letting Jews coordinate and debate more easily as a diaspora
>anti-Semitism has many Euros discussing "the Jewish problem" and what to do with their Jews
>pogroms is Eastern Europe particularly the Odessa riots make Eastern Jews start wanting their own state
>Theodor Hertzl and others start a Zionist conference to find a Jewish Homeland
>Some Jews are not into this because they think it will make anti-Semitism worse, or because they think only God can end their exile.
>Zionists look to Israel for historic reasons (Jewish litirgy is full of references of the return to Israel. But Uganda and Argentina are prime targets as well.
>Jews begin settling in Palestine and buying land from 1880s on.
>At first locals don't care but it's a backwards underdeveloped area so conflict over resources quickly escalate.
>Jews think Jaffa looks as shitty as their ghettos and form Tel-Aviv.
>Arabs get even more pissed as Jewish communities become more prosperous than them, riots continue
>Sultan is ok with Jews though
>WWI
>Armenian genocide causes Jews to freak out about Turks and spy for the Brits
>At the end of the war Brits endorse Jewish state in Palestine
>Foot dragging and more riots, more Jews move
>anti-Semitism gets big boost on 30s, lots more Jews
>Holocaust and refugees mean mass influx of Jews. Way more riots and conflict.
>Britan is exahausted from the war and doesn't want to play police for the Jews anymore.
>Jews start terrorism against Brits to get them to leave.
>UN sets up plan for Palestine and Israeli borders.
>Brits leave, Arab powers all invade to "help the Palestinians drive the Jews out" but really to get land for themselves so instead of working together they all try to get land under their own control
>Jews win
>Palestinians want land back
>Arabs expel all their Jews and they mostly move to Israel.

That's pretty much it.

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Jews claim they came to the land of Israel from Egypt, but there's a good chance they're actually derived from a local Philistine tribe. The Jews had a couple kingdoms through history, but these kingdoms had a habit of being conquered and subjugated by bigger and more badass nations. Examples include: the Egyptians, the Babylonians, the Assyrians, the Greeks, and finally the Romans. The Jews fought 2 desperate and bloody wars of independence against the Romans, both failures. After the second, Emperor Hadrian destroyed Jerusalem and expelled Jews from the area. He renamed Jerusalem "Aelia Capitolina" and renamed the Province "Syria Palestina". (This is where the term "Palestine" comes from.) Jews would continue to the present in the area around Jerusalem from then until today, but this is the point where the Jews ceased to have a state of their own (until 1948) and started settling in diaspora communities. Over millennia the Jews managed to keep the core of their religious and cultural traditions as they settled all over the planet. What they were not all able to hold onto was their genetics. There's four main groups of Jews. Ashkenazi, who settled in slavic lands and look the most white. Sephardi Jews who went to Spain and look white but also a little like spics. Mizrahim, who look like Arabs because Jews in their natural habitat look like Arabs. And then Ethiopian Jews, Jews that went to Africa a gorrillion years ago and became BLACKED. They look like a halway point between subsaharan blacks and Arabs. Over time, many Jews were able to find success for themselves in the west and carved out a niche of their own. As nationalism fever started taking Europe by storm in the 1800s, people of Jewish descent started thinking about making a state of their own, and this concept became known as Zionism. This fever for statehood grew and grew until the early 1900s when mass numbers of Jews started moving back to Ottoman Palestine. And the state of Israel came out of this.

Claims wise:

Arabs - we were here as part of the Ottoman Empire before Jews began migrating

Jews is - we trace our cultural roots to Israel. Also we wanted to share the land and still do (Israel is 20% Arab citizens), you kept trying to genocide us. Also we had nowhere else to go.

Most of the surrounding countries gave up on reconquest after 1973 and have more problems with the Palestinians (who've royally fucked up the countries they went to with civil wars and terrorism against the Arab states, so at this point the issue is kind of dead. Basically no one wants the Palestinians on their land and the Palestinians don't want the land their on.

The "Palestinians" are Arabs, mostly Muslims but there's also many Christians. The idea of Palestine being an Arab state comes from the fact that it was a majority Arab state under the Ottoman Empire. After WW1, the Ottoman Empire died and Britain and France stepped in to take almost all of its clay, minus the Arabian Peninsula. Post WW2, the British Empire was victorious, but tragically was then diagnosed with terminal brain cancer. Knowing death was fast approaching, Britain began hastily decolonizing its empire. The Mandate of Palestine was an especially problematic place to decolonize because there was a large Muslim and minority Christian population and a large Jewish population and both parties wanted to be in charge of the region. Britain didn't really know what to do, and really didn't care all that much considering the decolonization of India was the bigger and more pressing clusterfuck it had to resolve. It tried to pawn off the decision on the UN. The UN proposed 2 states, a Jewish state and a mostly Muslim state. The terms were denied by both Jews and Muslims (because both wanted the entire thing) and civil war broke out. Britain just decided to fuck off and hope the matter resolved itself. Jews got the upper hand, declared themselves as a state and the US and USSR fell over themselves in a race to acknowledge it. Both parties wanted this new state to be in their camp. The fact that this was going to be a state run mostly by westernized Jews, meant that it had the potential to become a real functioning nation unlike all the nations run by Muslims at the time so it was a real juicy target to put in their sphere of influence. After this point, Israeli history is too much of a clusterfuck for even me to follow.

desu its crazy how civil this thread is

your attitude is the real problem, you'll find a way to be miserable anywhere you go

Burgerstinians ate all of "their" land. All that reminds is Israeli

Attached: starving palestine.jpg (561x347, 64K)

this meme again

Didn't the Jews accepted the partition plan while the Palestinians declined it?

Yes. Arabs invaded instead of accepting the plan, the result being Israel beat them and got even more land. Arabs provoked war again in 1967 and Israel got even more land.

Syria claims the Golan Heights as it was taken from them during the Six Day War. Israel has not officially annexed the territory, but it has effectively been annexed. Israel has stated it will return the Golan Heights in exchange for a peace deal, as stipulated in UN Resolution .

Shebaa Farms is an area of the Golan Heights. Israel claims it was Syrian territory before 1967 and is therefore within Israel's right to control until a lasting peace deal. Lebanon claims it is their territory, and Syria supports Lebanon's claim.

The Gaza Strip is not claimed by Israel and maintains self-rule, but international law still states that it is under military occupation despite the lack of a physical presence of troops in the region. Israel and Egypt maintain a joint blockade of Gaza which they justify on the basis that Gaza is a hub of terrorism and any supplies beyond what is necessary to prevent a humanitarian crisis are severely restricted. The Palestinian Authority officially supports the blockade until Hamas steps down from government in Gaza. There are strong disagreements over the legality of the blockade, although the most recent UN report on the subject says it's legal.

1/2

The West Bank is occupied by Israel and has been since 1967. The official Israeli government position is that the territory is disputed, not occupied, because when it was captured in 1967, it was not captured from a "legitimate and recognized sovereign" since Jordan's annexation of the West Bank was considered illegal. The Israeli supreme court has ruled that it is a military occupation, however. Israel establishes settlements in the West Bank to secure their position, mostly along the border and in East Jerusalem. While this is considered illegal under international law, the Israeli government argues that settlements became legal with the signing of the Oslo Accords, which allows for settlement construction. The Palestinian Authority is the internationally recognized government in the West Bank and Gaza, and claims the entire territory for themselves on that basis. Jordan claimed the West Bank from its annexation in 1950 until 1988 when it revoked its claims on the area.

Finally, East Jerusalem is territory within the West Bank which was effectively annexed by Israel in 1980, when it was declared, together with West Jerusalem, to be one united city of Jerusalem and the capital of Israel. Israel doesn't have any legal basis for annexation, but argues more of a pragmatic stance (Access to holy sites, Jews living there, higher quality of life, etc.)

They were those people.

Israel's claims are on what constitutes present day Israeli, plus modern day Judea.
Beyond that, it's quite plainly what they expect to hold by military force, such as the golan heights.

I'll admit I'm Israeli so I'm probably biased, but I don't understand why the international community considers the Golan heights as illegally occupied territories.

Yes, it was gained through warfare, but so is basically every area of every nation on earth. The problem with Gaza and the west bank is that a) the locals are under military rule and not given equal rights, and b) they don't want Israeli control.

The Golan heights were formally annexed in the 80s, with all the local Druze and Arab population given full rights and citizenship, and there is no real resistance to Israeli control (Druzes even conscript to the IDF despite being exempt from the mandatory draft). How is that different from Alsace-Lorraine or Kaliningrad?

>The Golan heights were formally annexed in the 80s, with all the local Druze and Arab population given full rights and citizenship, and there is no real resistance to Israeli control (Druzes even conscript to the IDF despite being exempt from the mandatory draft). How is that different from Alsace-Lorraine or Kaliningrad?

merriam-webster.com/dictionary/point of honor

Why are you guys so evil. Just give the land back to the arabs.

I mean by that logic then the Negev and the Galil are also occupied territories (gained in '48), but they are recognized by the international community. Why is the Golan different?

To who? Assad, Al-Nusra, or ISIS?

Yes. In the 30s Britian offered to cut Jewish migration by 85% and cap it and they rejected that and kept killing Brits too.

In 2000 Arafat was offered 87% of the West Bank and all of Gaza at Camp David and he rejected a Palestinian state. The Palestinian elite are better off and richer with a weak and poor populace. Having a nation makes them responsible for success and corruption.

Don't forget the PLO tried to take over Jordan and fought their military too and took over southern Lebanon and started a 15 year civil war there. Israel and Syria were ironically on the same side when Syria invades Lebanon to fight the PLO.

Egypt even lets Israel operate drone strikes in the Siani for to Palestinian insurgents. Their leadership is retarded.

They tried.

A. Egypt doesn't want Gaza. They blockade it and fight with Islamists there too.

B. Israel offered the PLO all of Gaza and they rejected it. Gaza later elected Hamas to rule it knowing Hamas would never accept statehood that didn't include the destruction of Israel.

C. No one can rule Gaza. It's one of the densely populated, poorest regions on Earth with and African tier birthrate.

D. They offered to give up the West Bank, or most of it. The agreement would have ended settlement too. The PLO rejected it because they were afraid they would lose power to Hamas of the radical side, or a new functioning government that developed after statehood.

E. Israel tried to give up the Golan in exchange for peace terms. Syria couldn't accept this because they had a minority coalition in power and had large Sunni radical revolts in the 80s. Islamists think Allah will give them Israel any day now, so they don't want peace. Politically Israel is a big propaganda tool for them so they can't make peace. Moot point now as there is no Syria bordering Israel to turn Golan over too and you're not going to give it to Islamist rebels.

Why is the Golan different?
Because in 1967 at the Six-Day War, Israel was the aggressor, attacking first with a preemptive counterattack because they knew the surrounding Arab nations would attack them...
First Egypt, then Jordan and Syria.

Why do people think this would matter when Mizrahim and Sephardim would invite Ashkenazim and other Jews to their country anyway?

>he US and USSR fell over themselves in a race to acknowledge it. Both parties wanted this new state to be in their camp. The fact that this was going to be a state run mostly by westernized Jews, meant that it had the potential to become a real functioning nation unlike all the nations run by Muslims at the time
This is completely absurd to anyone who understands the geopolitical context at the time.

> All Jews can trace their roots back to the area.

Nonsense, virtually all Jews are genetically European, as their European ancestors converted to Judaism after the Roman Diaspora and had never set foot in Israel (or the MidEast for that matter) but even if we were to accept a cultural / religious connection, the Jews have been gone from the region for 2000 years and no longer have any valid claim (the Old Testament isn't a legal document).

That said, what’s done is done and as the Jews have nukes, they ain’t going nowhere and the only logical solution is a population transfer of non-Jews to the surrounding Arab states, at which point the U.S. cuts off all aid to Israel and they’re on their own.

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Nice try kike, you're from northern iran or turkey
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4860683/

>So are all Muslims....

The difference is, the Palestinians never left and are the true genetic descendants of the Hebrews.

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>Jews claim they came to the land of Israel from Egypt, but there's a good chance they're actually derived from a local Philistine tribe. The Jews had a couple kingdoms through history, but these kingdoms had a habit of being conquered and subjugated by bigger and more badass nations. Examples include: the Egyptians, the Babylonians, the Assyrians, the Greeks, and finally the Romans.

Indeed. There is no historical or archeological evidence for an independent Jewish state until 1948 A.D.

“Israel” was never more than an occasionally rebellious province of one of the surrounding (and historically verified) kingdoms/empires.

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>In 2000 Arafat was offered 87% of the West Bank and all of Gaza at Camp David and he rejected a Palestinian state.

Ohh, 87% of the fraction of what they had before.

So when are you going to give up your house to the Indians, seeing as can trace their decent back thousands of years?...

Attached: indian_tribes.jpg (1675x1080, 1.76M)

It is no different. Please, continue giving reasons for antisemitism to grow.

>So when are you going to give up your house to the Indians, seeing as can trace their decent back thousands of years?...
When Americans voluntarily sell land to the Natives and then they defend it by force.

>voluntarily sell

JEW: “Hay you GTFO, I own your house now.”
ARAB: “What?! No way!”
JEW: “LOL, the UN said it’s mine.”
ARAB: “Well, fuck you!”
JEW: “You’re a terrorist!”

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Not a single Palestinian sold land to kikes, you kike shill.

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>i hate israel's religiousness so i want to live in the most religious western country

I'm Jewish, could give a fuck about America.

Realistically, America isn't going away. Native Americans don't chimp out an riot all the time, suicide bomb busses, Lynch random students, etc.

Are most Israelis actually religious or is it just muh culture?

>I'm Jewish, could give a fuck about America.
GREATEST ALLY.

>Common known historical fact even Palestinians don't deny is a lie

In fact, Palestinians were selling land at such a predigious rate that the Ottomans banned it out of public pressure. Later the Arabs petitioned the British to stop allowing Arabs to sell their own property due.

Even with restrictions, they had sold most of the private land for quick cash payouts. Then in 1948 they tried to take back what they had been paid for and got btfo.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_land_purchase_in_Palestine

I like Israel and all the butthurt it causes. I couldn't give a rat's ass about some asshole Palestinians and as far as I'm concerned they brought their situation upon themselves.

Hmmm

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>No such thing as claims. The British gave it to Israel and the US has been able to defend their country for them.
There, fixed some of your typos.

>Nonsense, virtually all Jews are genetically European
Source or fuck off. Jews are by far the most tested people genetically.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_studies_on_Jews
>Jews living in the North African, Italian, and Iberian regions show variable frequencies of admixture with the historical non-Jewish host population along the maternal lines. In the case of Ashkenazi and Sephardi Jews (in particular Moroccan Jews), who are closely related, the source of non-Jewish admixture is mainly southern European.
Also, most Jews in Israel are Mizrahi. Are you telling me a Syrian Jew is genetically European? How retarded can you be?

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>Unironically quoting Eran Elhaik

Imagine being this retarded

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khazar_hypothesis_of_Ashkenazi_ancestry#Criticism
>Elhaik's 2012 study was criticized for its use of Armenians and Azerbaijani Jews as proxies for Khazars and for using Bedouin and Jordanian Hashemites as a proxy for the Ancient Israelites.

Armenians... as proxies for Khazars..
Bedouins... as proxies for Israelites..

>Azerbaijani Jews are also assumed for the purposes of the study to have Khazarian ancestry, when Mountain Jews are actually descended from Persian Jews.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mountain_Jews

This is why he had to backtrack and claim the originals were Iranian-Slavs.

>The decision to cast Bedouin/Hashemites as "proto-Jews" was especially seen as political in nature, considering that both have origins in Arab tribes from the Arabian Peninsula rather than from the Ancient Israelites, while the descent of the Jews from the Israelites is largely accepted

>The study was also criticized as interpreting information selectively—The study found far more genetic similarity between the Druze and Ashkenazim than the Ashkenazim and Armenians, but Elhaik rejected this as indicating a common Semitic origin, instead interpreting it as evidence of Druze having Turkic origins when they are known to come from Syria.

There are so many fucking holes in this dudes argument, yet idiots like you eat it up.

t. Ariel Goldstein

>All ethnic Jews can trace their roots back to the area.

Ivanka Trump doesn't. Only ethnic Jews have roots in Israel.

kys

>Yom Gippur War
Top kek losing even when you had a preemptive strike and double pronged em
>Suez Crisis
Hearty amount of keks,Brits and France got whipped into irrelevance by America,Israeli kicked the Egyptian ass but Egypt still claimed victory,also has an unintended effect of encourage the soviets to crush the Hungarians
>1948 war
Arab league failed to defeat an upstart Israel even with a 7(8) nation army,showing of what things to come later
>6 days war
ohnononono ahahaha

>en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_land_purchase_in_Palestine

Isaac Herzog
Yosef Zahavi
Ruth Kark
Jonathan R. Adelman
Aryeh L. Avneri
Alan Dershowitz

>virtually all Jews

Is English a second language for you?

I am a Jew for one so I'll give you the quick run down.

Jews use the Torah as a claim for the land often citing that they should technically own the land from the Nile to the Euphrates. This of course is a baised source so lets go for something a little more recent. Jews migrated to the Palestinian mandate to escape from DA SHOAH OY VEY. So after the Nazis had fun times in Auschwitz there was a massive amount of Jews without homes so instead of offering to build refugees new homes which would have to extend to all refugees they decided on the cheapest route which was sending them to Palestine. So the Zionist movement gathered funds and used the Muh Holocaust to buy up land in Palestine and cause Terrorist attacks until the Brtish left and as it turns out the best armed group with experienced Militias won.

Palestinians have been in Palestine for debatably since the beginning however Palestinians didn't suffer a genocide and instead suffered horrible poverty because The Sick Man couldn't pay to grow their cities.These Palestinians however bombed the British before the Jews ever did and as a result the British were reluctant to give up the Palestinian mandate to anyone.

Now you have the God's Chosen and the Servants of God fighting over the same land which will be Israel for a while. As for anyone questioning why Palestinian leaders haven't accepted any deal with Israel, it would be political suicide since the majority of Palestinians believe there shall either be 100% of territory returned or none at all.

Israelis were pushing for it since the end of Pompeis campaign.
The movement didnt gain much traction with jews for the most part but there was a pattern of "jews get persecuted in a country and it gets popular among the jews in that country sort of thing"
In WW1 and WW2 a lot of jewish refugees
Started going back for more or less obvious reasons. This lead to two things occuring.
1)the muslims there werent too happy about an increasing jewish presence
2)the zionist leadership felt it could exert greater pressure to establish a sovereign jewish state.

Any how, they eventually did. Jews began a militant style terror war against both the muslims and the british authosities whom they deemed too reluctant to be useful.
Eventually they pushed the muslims back to certain heavily urbanized areas and managed to get themselves recognized by the British and by extention the UN.

On the muslim side of things. They conquered the place way back in 700 A.D or so. They've been there ever since.

That's basically the whole euchrism.

Two sides have legitimate backstories from a "modern moral" standpoint in that multiple generations have been reared on both sides and thus have a right to the land.

The jews think its theirs ultimately because they think of it as their promised land/ancestral home.

The muslims think it's theirs because they think the whole world is there's.

Nice pasta fag

That's still objectively not true.

I can't wait to hear all about how the Chinese takeover of the Pacific coastline was completely justified in a few decades.
list.juwai.com/news/2017/11/how-will-chinese-buyers-react-to-nz-new-ban

Yes, it is in fact objectively true. The vast majority of Jews look like Europeans because they’re descended from European converts to Judaism during the Roman Diaspora.

The true Semitic natives of Palestine and the genetic descendants of the Hebrews look like pic related, as they’re the ones who never left.

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