Why haven't you bought me yet, user-kun?

right, its an option, i did hear that much. i dont think privacy should be forced, but i do think it should be default.

zk-snarks, yes, zcash? doesn't come close.

if it isn't forced it simply can't compete with monero. there's no question.

>i dont think privacy should be forced
it doesn't work if it isn't

what? i dont get why it needs to be forced. there could be circumstances where i want to send something that i want people to be aware of

Regardless of your other shitcoin shills monero will win out!

Two reasons!

- Established early
- Replacing the deep web is preferred payment method

Coin has made me $$$$, just wish I had invested more!

>there could be circumstances where i want to send something that i want people to be aware of
like what

thats not how modern protocols work, you dont let people pick and choose when something should be encrypted, the same for privacy. if it's default-off it's worthless, if it's default-on any option to disable it shows poor design.

are you even reading the thread? it will win as long as something better doesn't come out. privacy coins arent there for pump and dumps, they're the only other class of coin outside of meta-blockchains like ethereum, and bitcoin that have any use today.

and that use evaporates when monero 2.0 comes out with an even better privacy system that monero can't simply fork in, just like bitcoin can't fork monero's privacy.

public donations, i pay off a friend and want people to see that i actually did, anything i buy from a company that i can use later as proof i paid for a specific product, etc...

heres what you just said:
>no thats not how programming works
>you should let people choose things (wut?)
>default-off is worthless (i mean, i can agree with this one)
>default-on with option to get rid of it is poor design
still need this explained

shouldnt*

payment IDs solve these problems

With XMR you can make the tx non-private by manually putting info in the tx field. It's just that you'd have to go out of your way to do that, which makes it so private txs don't stick out.

Waiting on a dip to 100, guess I'll have to hop on at 120

so your "forced" private isnt actually forced at all then? just more forceful than zcash? lol ok...

isn't ZCL basically a fork that addresses this?

If you're holding long term, which imo you should, just get in now.

no i said that's not how modern protocols work. you don't build a protocol with encryption then let users disable it. https doesn't come with a "leak my key to all parties" option.

there's no situation where you would elect to use monero, or another privacy coin, and yet want the transaction to be public on-chain. what you might sometimes want is the ability to prove you made or received a certain payment, which monero lets you do, and any other well designed encrypted blockchain will have methods for.

DO YOUR KEGELS OP. NO MAN IS WEALTHY IF HIS MANHOOD ISN'T WORKING. 20 REPS.........GO.

Payment IDs don't interfere with privacy. It just allows for verification that a transaction occurred.

Put in $1000 a few days ago then big daddy bitcoin justed me.

you don't understand the protocol. it's specifically providing information off chain for verification, its like sending a signed message with a bitcoin address. it only means something outside of the blockchain.

no, it also has a premine, and no worthwhile developers.

This. I didn't explain well enough. Txns will always be private no matter what, but if you want to tell someone what you're doing you have that option. There's no way of stopping someone from doing that with any coin.

> dev calls himself FLUFFYPONY
I can't get past that. I want to invest but how can a man call himself that ?

If you think that's bad then I hope you aren't invested in ETH.

monero's had a good run but i wouldnt really call it much of an investment, the entire benefit of monero is transaction privacy, so theres no reason to store large amounts of money in it providing you just move small amounts into monero at a time and use it for spending.

its like a lightning network that's usable today

Isn't the transaction ID still hidden from everyone but the recipient though?

So here's the thing with Monero. Yes, it's one of if not the only legit cryptocurrency in existence. But that really doesn't actually matter if you're trading for short to medium term gain. The Amazons and eBays of the world crashed along with everything else in the dotcom bubble, and like them, just because monero is the real deal in the very long term, that doesn't mean it's the best thing you should be trading in the midst of the bubble days. There are better opportunities right now if you want to make money.

Monero has a long way to go yet, there's a ridiculous amount of development that needs to be done before it'll become what it seems at the moment like it one day will be. In the meantime, it's still overvalued just like everything else, and when big market corrections happen it'll tank along with the rest. So when we get extended bull markets, it's not actually smart to necessarily have all your holding in monero just because it's the best cryptocurrency. The opportunity cost isn't worth it. Put your money in whatever is about to pump, and when that happens to be monero, sure, put it in monero. But if you want to make money, holding your nose and riding shitcoin pumps is the way to do it, not feeling superior about having your money locked up in the coin that's going to be the eventual winner years from now.

monero doesn't have the luxury of being an entrenched coin (bitcoin) or being a platform other coins/services use (ethereum).

i'd say it's a much worse long term bet than those two, simply because it has one feature, and that feature is in an area of research that is only getting more attention.

In such a 'big market correction' what coin is safe though? How could you accurately predict where you should put your money when that's about to happen. BTC and ETH are likely to go down with it, shitcoins are generally unpredictable. Unless you want to pull to tether because you think a big crash might be happening I don't really see what you can do.

Comfiest hold. Next month or so is going to suck for alts, but a coin like Monero is going to go ham.

All we need is a little more volume and $200 will be reached, just look at the charts.

you can't, you weather the storm or have the foresight to get out early

i have enough shit invested that i can comfortably live through another 2013-2016 if not worse. do the numbers. if you would consider selling your now $1500 BTC or $75 ETH then you probably should get out when things are looking good.

Yeah I dunno. What I am considering doing while Monero is up a bit is redistributing some of what I put into it to ETH though. I'd do the same to BTC except I can just see it hitting $5000 as soon as I do.

none of them are. Corrections are when you short.

When something that does what monero does better than monero comes along, everyone will know. I bet a huge proportion of the monero team themselves will be working on this hypothetical new coin.

Alternatively, there is the not unlikely scenario that monero will stay the best at what it does as it just continues to get better at it. It'll take some pretty significant new developments for something to be well positioned to replace it.

It also serves to hide large amounts of money since there is no rich list user, it functions even better then BTC for this purpose

monero got lucky that zcash fucked up their coin so badly, its developments like that which will cause turmoil for them. there aren't many monero loyalists willing to stick by them if the one feature it has gets up-ended by something else.

and i doubt they'll be any easy upgrades for it, if there are the new tech isn't that great, but try adding zero knowledge proofs onto monero and you'll see what i mean. when something genuinely new comes along it will need it's own coin.

that said i think the more likely scenario is that whatever replaces it will simply be a second layer network for bitcoin or ethereum that provides the same level of privacy in chain, only it offers a 1:1 conversion with btc or eth.

which is unnecessary if you always spend through monero. you only reveal yourself on bitcoin if you pay directly with it, which is my point. monero services as a superior payment network more than a store of value

Zero knowledge proofs are trash retard, it requires a TRUSTED set up, a PREMADE BACKDOOR.

Holy shit you are retarded, Monero's team is constantly looking at new technologies regarding the efficiency, size and speed of the blockchain.

eh Monero is a private transaction coin, unless you want to privately transact it's not really needed

and if you needed to use it, just buy some when you need to at current price

Like I want to transact $100 privately, so I buy $100 worth of Monero, whether monero is worth $1000 or $1, I just buy $100 worth to transact privately

zcash :DDD

>you only reveal yourself on bitcoin if you pay directly with it
ANY SITE that lets you pay by converting BTC to Monero will be logged, every fucking site. BTC is not private and every way possible. It is worse then the fucking banking system, everybody can see how much money you have.

If you do anything it is logged and anybody can see where you got your BTC from, Monero is payment network AND a store of value.

I don't think it's impossible that there's going to be some new privacy ideas that won't be possible to implement with monero and will require a new coin. I just think that when that day comes, everyone will know. Fluffypony himself will jump ship, just you watch.

lol no, that's just how zcash fucked it up, do your own research.

monero won't be able to add new privacy to their coin because new privacy simply isn't compatible with the way monero's blockchain works. they'd effectively be forking to a completely new coin if they tried.

holy fuck you're a retard. if you send bitcoin to monero, they pay via monero, nobody can link your payment with the bitcoin you used. if they can, it means monero is broken.

please stay out of this thread.

Something of a noob question here, but say the team discovered they fucked something up and could do it a lot better if they did it all over again. Is there no way for them to migrate the existing coins in Monero to MoneroNew? Is this just impossible with how blockchain tech works?

if monero breaks hard enough then monero is dead, moneronew wont be affiliated with monero, it'll just be whatever the next best options for privacy are

of course you can, with a fork. but where's the incentive? if the new tech isn't coming from a core monero developer they might as well launch a new coin themselves.

monero will and has been keeping up within their realm of privacy. rinct was a completely necessary upgrade, and i expect them to keep adding better verificable privacy within their mixing/ring signature niche. but new tech is going to come along at some point, which makes monero a risky long term bet.

i prefer to use it as it was intended, for actually making transactions.

isn't this essentially what happens every time a hard fork is implemented, but on a larger scale?

>isn't this essentially what happens every time a hard fork is implemented

yes

>if the new tech isn't coming from a core monero developer they might as well launch a new coin themselves.
I'm saying if it was though, like if the entire team went 'whoops, should have done it this way' and decided to start over. Not that I see this in its future, it's just a what if.

I haven't really paid attention to any of the bitcoin forks so I don't really know what they've been doing. I heard some people got double coins or some shit though which sounds retarded.

There is no point in that logic since everybody can see you converting to Monero, only the person the Monero is send to is hidden.

In addition when you converted your BTC to Monero you will have to send it to another address else the exchange will know what address you are using to send the transaction from and know you paid somebody with it.

they will know:
- sender
- amount

If the other retard also decides to convert it back to BTC they match the entire transaction by sent amount. IT DOES NOT WORK.

If you want to do it properly you will have to send it again to another address, so you pay for fees 4 times in total. And for what purpose, so you can have BTC?

>Muh BTC

Converting BTC to Monero to BTC is retarded, you still leave a trail that you converted holy fucking shit the ignorance is real.

>Converting BTC to Monero to BTC is retarded
Unfortunately this is still necessary right now since BTC is the only way to either pay for something directly or one of the only ways to pull it out to fiat to pay for something with.

Monero hard forks every 6 months without miners fighting for hash power, there is no need for a new coin when a new hard fork is made every 6 months, everything can be adjusted.

The monero team IS LITERALLY looking at new technologies to implement in the Monero blockchain and if it proves that it works just hard forks Monero to implement it. Again, what would be the basis for a new coin? Just look at BCH, nobody wants that.

I mean, not really. Monero has stealth addresses. The whole point is that the trail goes cold basically immediately once you convert to monero.

youtube.com/watch?v=bWst278J8NA

>If the other retard also decides to convert it back to BTC they match the entire transaction by sent amount.

yeah I mean this is more or less true I guess. Easily avoidable tho.

Bitcoin ATMS also support Monero these days, BTC does not have a monopoly anymore about transactions.

And more and more companies WILL support Monero as the need for privacy continues to advance.

The trail does not go cold, when I sent a transaction to somebody else people can see who I sended monero to.

it just happens by some fuckery people see multiple addresses I sended Monero to, which is the ringsize.

So you have 1 / ringsize (5 by default) chance to guess the address i sended it to.

if both parties convert from BTC to Monero to BTC is is easy as pie to pick out the true address since the transactions happened in rapid successions.

ringCT and ring signatures are not the only privacy features Monero offers

I would have thought companies would be sceptical about adopting it because of potential bad press for supporting a pedo coin or some shit.

I'd say the monero team are at the forefront of privacy technology research right now.
2018 is going to be good, next gen of darknet markets are rising up slowly and xmr is their currency of choice

I have. This shit will spike a$ap to a new level over $150 by the end of the year.

So it's not really needed unless you want to privately transact, as opposed to Bitcoin which you absolutely need for.. what exactly?

It'll pass $150 very very soon. End of year minimum $200, and depending how the main coins play out, could see even higher.

I want to holy fuck but I won't pay more than $120

>i want everyone on earth to know who i give money to and how much
Do you do your online banking without tls then publish the transaction logs too?

>I want to holy fuck but I won't pay more than $120
jeez man you had whole week to buy it ~$120

$$ doesnt mean shit anyway. only the ratio matters, and it's not looking good right now

Why won't it drop back down to 0.38 fuuuuuuck.

cuz you're a dirty whore and i don't know who you've been with

>it will win as long as something better doesn't come out.

Yeah, a fork of Monero. And if that happens we get bagholders get a big dividend as now we're holding both.

>it will win as long as something better doesn't come out.
This is true, but I highly doubt anything better will come out. Why?

Look at the community devs for Monero. Just the way this coin is handled simply amazes me - no flash marketing, just constant progress reports with people researching and making the tech better.

I will be very surprised if a coin comes out better than Monero, and Monero hasn't been able to/hasn't already implemented the features that the better coin has. Even with all of these other privacy coins out already, and people shilling them hard, nothing has yet to come close.

user, if there is something I can share then it is to ALWAYS, FUCKING ALWAYS bet on autism.

Fluffyponny was sitting next Ripple/Augur CEOs who wore $50k suits, do you know what he had? Running shoes.

i have and it's one of my keepers.

I like money so I bought NEO, OP-chan

Fluffypony gets a Heart Attack coz hes fat = -80% XMR

Because I already have Verge and it's better. Core wallet 3.0 is fast af and has proper wraith.

It was actually the first coin I bought, and still holding it.

holy shit you monero shills are right about zcrap