/CofD/&/wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness & World of Darkness General

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>Question
What is the best part of your favorite line?

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youtube.com/watch?v=cAg2VXRY7Os
youtu.be/ojm74VGsZBU
youtu.be/3zUkT9YAPDY
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_NCAA_rifle_programs
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Summoning.
Supernal, Shadow, Astral, Underworld, Abyssal, Hellmenth.
It's all good

Chronicles of Fagness

>What is the best part of your favorite line?

I love the Court politics in Changeling.

I remember a bunch of different animals were made available in the original Werewolf game, where you could be a Crow or a Shark or a Snake and a few others.

Is that still in the new/current edition?

Not as such a big thing, no. Changing Breeds is a vestigial and ill-considered book (though, if you listen to some Werewolf diehards, so were the Fera in oWoD, so eh).

>Is that still in the new/current edition?
Do you mean Forsaken?

If so, then yes. But its a Eco-terrorist furry sim. Its what basically everyone hated about Werewolf.

>Hellmenth
What is/are Hellmenth, anyways?
The first time I saw it I thought it was a typo of Hellmouth, re: Buffy.

If you're talking about the non-Changing Breeds version, you can find them in the back of War Aginst The Pure or whatever. But no, beyond a passing mention in the Neolithic werewolf setting in Dark Era's there isn't anything about other shifters.

I remember weresharks
Those things are cool.

Yeah, they where like, the most deadly (Physically) Changing breed in werewuff the apoclable

Skin stealers aren't really 'shifters'. More form taking druids.

The Hellmenth are evil worms from below the underworld that want to eat reality. Likely lower depths entities.

No, I'm talking about things like werewolves, like the bull-shifters that follow Helios. Not Skin-thiefs in Aztec demon, the bull shifters mentioned in a scenario for Neolithic Werewolf.

I just feel uncomfortable with not sticking to some semblance of veracity. I know it's not something that actually matters, but I hate that anything I do will essentially be shooting in Vancouver. I ran a few sessions of a VtR2e game based on VtMB for a friend (though that got trampled on by her job) and it was really frustrating think of all the ways that VtMB was clearly made by people who had never been to LA. Like the constant rain, and the fact that basements are common. I've never been to LA and even I know that's not how it works.

With Gotham--or more often a place I completely make up--I can get away with whatever I want because there isn't a real place, so there's no veracity. Gotham itself only works as a place to run a game because it's been through so many incarnations. Some fictional city that only has one or two versions I couldn't do.

Then again, I had a player get really pissed off when they realized Ashcroft might not necessarily be in the US, or any other set location. They didn't notice when I used "Detective Inspector". They put two and two together when there was both speakeasies and a front line WWI hospital. What's weird is that one of the reasons they said it would be important to know the specific location was for gun laws. Their character didn't even use a gun...

So basically it's my same argument with canon play. If you're going to just use the name and images and vague surface level similarities, why not just play an expy/OC and have more freedom?

Fera were basically always an afterthought. That's why the book was Werewolf and not Therianthrope or something. They were always "sure, I guess you can be other shapeshifters".

Terrifying worms that live in the deepest part of the Underworld and will one day devour everything that exists until all of reality is Underworld, because some shitty Mage will become Obsessed with figuring out the code of the ghostly run Numbers Stations, travel around the world, and destroy six of the sixty-six black obelisks that hold the Hellmenth back from being unleashed upon the world.

Cant you just use the translation guide for the other shape shifters for the new system? Or hell use the old system with new lore.

Oh are they? Weird, I didn't see them brought up in there.

I've no idea honestly, I got little interest with crossing things across additions beyond like, corporations or cults.

Both were really shitty in terms of mechanics and fluff. You'd really have to start from scratch with the core concept of "animal shifters"

Page 64 of Dark Eras talks about the Gudthabak under the heading Unstoppable Souls. You can read more about them, including their own special 1e powers, in War aginst the Pure on page 215 to 222. They're literally the last thing in the book.

It's important to remember that these are stylized cities. Seattle suffers from perpetual rain, San Francisco and Los Angeles have fog and smog respectively, and Miami is always sunny until the story is about to conclude with a Hurricane.

Besides, you should always play fast and loose with cities. The big city your players have to deal with is San Angeles, in the 33rd State of the Union, New Arkansas.

...

>tfw no Street Sharks campaign.
youtube.com/watch?v=cAg2VXRY7Os

Basically, I prefer to go the GTA route with cities instead of shooting in Vancouver.

(To explain that reference, a lot of shows that are set in New York or LA or Seattle or somewhere else are actually shot in Vancouver, Canada, youtu.be/ojm74VGsZBU I basically want to avoid doing that kind of thing with games)

You know LA is sunny and right by the beach, right?

That seems pretty specific.

He said London and LA have "fog and smog respectively". London has the fog, LA has the smog.

Yeah, but how am I supposed to combine the Beach Boys with Vampire?

Besides, isn't San Diego considered to have better cared for beaches?

>cant combine LA and vampires

You never seen Angel?

Holy shit, I just realized I need to set a Mage game in Vancouver. A hook will be that it literally has NO IDENTITY of its own in the astral.

Nah, the MC looks like a total fag and I've never seen Buffy.

Nah, LA has Malibu. The best beaches and surf in California. San Diego has warmer water, though.

>I've never seen Buffy

It honestly baffles me how little people actually know about LA.

everyone just thinks of hollywood and gang violence

I'm in California and I barely know about it. Heck, I barely understand the San Jose/ San Francisco megacity an hour away.

But this is the truth.

San Francisco has hippies.
San Jose is where computers come from.
Los Angeles is the crime center of the world.
And the rest of the state is meant to grow weed.

I've actually wanted to set a game in Vancouver, but then I realized that all the problems I have would still be there if I actually did set it in Vancouver :V


I've never actually seen Angel either, and barely remember Buffy even though I watched it for like a year and a half. But I like David Boreanaz as an actor.

Also, what's faggy about this, I mean, come on?
youtu.be/3zUkT9YAPDY

Niggah I'm hella serious, I ain't never seen that shit. No one ever sold me on it and It was just never on when I was watching TV.

Honestly, having lived here my whole life? If you stay out of a) South Central b) Compton and c) Downtown? It's pretty peaceful. Santa Monica is line the best part of the area, and Hollywood Blvd can suck a bag of dicks.

>>Also, what's faggy about this, I mean, come on?

Within context, that episode is fucking great.

>alienate your core fanbase
>bring in people who used to hate your product

Did Mage 2e fuck up?

What did they change that would ward off the old fanbase?

I have no context and I've been tempted to watch the show just for that episode, but I'd probably also need to watch Buffy for Angel, and that's like five billion hours of late 90s/early 00s television.

>Implying the core fanbase was alienated

I feel like you're trying to stir up shit.

There's 7 seasons, and except he first half of the 4th season being kind of a chore because they had an awkward transition of setting after not being sure if they were getting cancelled or not, it's all good.

Yep. Without any context, it is just a stir post.

Like I said, I used to watch it, even if I don't remember any of it other than Willow becoming an evil lesbian, Seth Green being a werewolf, and the fact that I want literally every WoD game I run to be like Buffy but more 'realistic' or at least gritty.

I want the players to be teenagers who deal with supernatural shit and have to keep it on the down low for the sake of their family and social standing and also not wanting to get locked up for sounding like they're batshit crazy.

I've mentioned it before, but think about it:
You're a teenager. You've been thrust into the supernatural, occult world that lies beneath the surface. You can't close your eyes and ignore the horrible shit, and you can't avoid noticing when your friends are preyed on by vampires, or getting pulled into cults to strange Gods. You go out at night--if you can avoid doing it during class--and you fight back. You do what you can to make your corner of this shitty little world less shitty, but it's getting harder. Your mom and dad are fighting. Your teachers question how tired you are. People ask where you got those bruises.
Your little brother got a wooden sword from some anime convention. You hammered nails into it and it works pretty well, and you hope he won't remember he had it. Your parents want to know where you keep taking the car. They think you're doing drugs, or involved in crime. I guess technically, you are. How long before the cops catch you breaking into an old building with a can of gasoline, a box of salt, and a bunch of matches? What happens if they think that corpse was a hobo or something? Will "he was already dead before the fire" really be a good excuse? Would anyone even believe it?

So the sorority compact from Hunter? Giles could be the campus Librarian or a teacher.

>tfw have the v20 pdfs
>tfw want to run a short campaign with the intent of worldbuilding
>one friend only likes one kind of settng for roleplay
>one friend refuses to play vampire because "it's a poltical dickery sim"
>only two friends willing to play

I mean, I guess it's better in the long run to just start with two since I'm not as familiar with the rules but still it's a pain in my ass how few of my friends are interested

I prefer High School Hunter, but yes, that's exactly why I like the Maiden's Blood Sisterhood. Although they actually don't have to deal with most of the problems I like to focus on. In fact, they're a Compact specifically to help the members AVOID most of those problems.

My first (and so far only successful) WoD game was a Geist game with high school characters, intentionally inspired by the first few episodes of Bleach (to the point that I called it Sin-Eater Soul Reapers).

The first plot actually involved reconstruction on the school stirring up an old ghost from the 60s of a nerd who got killed by the other nerd who had a crush on him when he started going out with the head cheerleader.

Second plot involved them getting wrapped up in a serial killer case. One of them was kidnapped and tortured by the killer (an Abmortal) and another got beat to hell trying to fight him, and they ended up in the hospital despite their Sin-eater durability. They also saved a cop from being killed, so they were legit heroes.

Third plot, which is where I really pulled in the social stuff, had them in the hospital nearing recovery. There was Silent Hill stuff where they kept getting pulled into an Underworld reflection of the hospital, and had to stop the ~spooky ceremony~ from being retried and killing everyone, but one of the best scenes was where one of the teens had a talk with his mom.

She and Mack's dad had been Hunters, and Mack's dad went crazy and couldn't give up the Vigil when they had a kid. He died homeless, (and became Mack's Geist) and she wanted to keep Mack safe, even if she knew he couldn't talk about stuff, and also wouldn't stop. So she gave him his dad's old trench knife, which had the Hunter Favoured Weapon merit attached to it. It was a fun scene.

Will his ghost possess it if he dies, and become Mack the Knife?

I have always wanted to play a Tomboy who is the Captain of the shooting team and was raised Primarily by her father who taught her to shoot since she was old enough to walk.

>Shooting team
I know this is America, but what?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_NCAA_rifle_programs
You can get a sports scholarship for them bro.

Sport shooting is probably the one useful thing you can do with a gun unrelated to murder.

What about Hunting. Or Self Defense? Or what if you need to protect yourself and other people as a cop? Or maybe you just think shooting is a neat hobby.

>Hunting
Murder, but most people don't care as long as you eat it
>Self defense
Still technically murder
>Protecting yourself as a cop
Also still technically murder, and also rarely actually needed; in fact de-escalation tactics are almost always more useful than pulling a piece. Most cops will never fire their sidearm in the first place.
>Or maybe you just think shooting is a neat hobby
That's just sport shooting without actually doing the sport part

>in fact de-escalation tactics are almost always more useful than pulling a piece.
I agree. But its better to have it and not need it then need it and not have it.

>bring in people who used to hate your product

Has it managed to do that? Kudos if so, it can only be good for the line.

Yeah, but that they have it is one of the reasons the US police is so aggressive and militarized. They have stuff they don't need. British cops don't really need guns. American cops *definitely* don't need APCs that tear up civilian roads.

The definition of murder
>Murder is the killing of another human being without justification or valid excuse, and it is especially the unlawful killing of another human being with malice aforethought.
So, nah. Not murder.

Can't speak for anyone else but I loathed Mage 1e, but 2e has me excited to play

the definition of quibble
>argue or raise objections about a trivial matter.
There's a reason "killing" is listed as the first synonym for murder.

Same. Mage 1e was interesting, but seemed like an overcomplicated mess. It seemed like hell on the ST, and hard for new players to grasp.

2e seems a fair bit better, and it has a stronger purpose now (without needing supplements to spell it out)

Well thats more to poor training, low hiring standards and the weird way police qualifications work more so then the equipment they are using.
Like if you get fired from one precinct you police training is still valid and you can get hired by another precinct. Pretty crazy.

Conversely, I loved Mage 1e. I had so many high hopes for 2e... Which it meet and exceeded. I'm so happy with it.

My only concern, complexity wise, is that it seems like it might be a bit difficult as a ST to manage spell-casting in conflicts with NPCs mages. Like, you have to think about how many free Reaches and free Potency / Duration advances you get, and how much extra Reach you want, and what sort of Yantras to employ, etc.—for EACH spell one of your NPCs casts. That's on top of just being familiar enough with all 10 Arcana to be able to make use of them.

I don't envy the ST who has to try and keep all of that straight.

Well, yeah, but one of the other things is the psychological wage of "I have an argument stopping stick" that a lot of cops will resort to, which is an escalation tactic, and cops are taught to escalate instead of de-escalate.

I actually didn't know you could go to another precinct. Honestly the worst part about America's cops is that they get all Thin Blue Line even when someone abuses their position or is corrupt. It baffles me why that's a thing. Good cops peer pressure good cops into standing up for bad cops.

I mean, that's basically true even in the 1e. I've always been worried about my ability to run a game of Mage. If anything, I think that the more occult heavy nature of 2e and the fact that a lot of time you won't be waving your hands and casting magic means that a lot of the spells that NPCs do will be able to be handled in a more careful fashion, as opposed to "oh shit I have to work this out in the next like five minutes, everyone take a bathroom break"

It depends who you talk to really. I know someone that was a Doorkicker and he was a very friendly and very reasonable person that explained a lot of things to me.

>nd the fact that a lot of time you won't be waving your hands and casting magic

>wasting Reach on sensory casting

Nah fuck that, BEAMSPAM!

What I mean is that it feels like a lot of stuff really will be ritually cast ceremonies as opposed to DBZ wizard fights.

I think they could have given you the formulas in ways that are easier to grasp from the outset. For a non-ritual spell cast with no prep time the factors are fairly straightforward - you'll spend an automatic Reach on instant casting, in effect the free Reach you have to work with is just (your dots) - (spell's dots). The potency is equal to your Arcanum dots, unless duration is primary in which case it's 1. You only get two Yantras until you start building serious Gnosis so it's going to be a +1 Tool and +2 for High Speech if you can take a round for it, and as your yantra slots increase you'll mostly still just pile on more tools unless you stumble into a supernal verge.

There's also that, as Storyteller, I think I'm not alone in handwaving the NPC's offscreen casting. If you know roughly what they can do, let them do it, and pull out the dice when their spells might be Withstood by a PC.

>Not wanting every fight to be DBZ
What, are you high?

I'm Yamcha. I definitely don't want that

Wraith is a fucking masterpiece and I have the embarrassing tattoo to prove it.

You can't say that without showing us. We've already seen your cats, so we know you've got a camera.

This photo is like a year old.

Last time I posted this I got accused of being a cis girl.

Your back is disgusting

I had high hopes for Mage 2e and have been somewhat disappointed.

We were promised a streamlined system where the Practices always reflected the effects and with no artificial arcana "speedbumps."

This did not happen. There obviously were some attempts at "balance," likely far too many mistakes that will not receive an errata because they are too substantial, and the different tone, style and capabilities of the Arcana clearly revealed they were written by multiple authors.

The fluff was certainly a major improvement over 1e, but the spellcasting did not meet expectations. I also didn't like the new combination of emphasized importance of mana together with significant mana scarcity (and failure to include any sample Prime spells that could actually acquire Mana outside of its usual sources). It's made spellcasting outside of Ruling Arcana implicitly discouraged and spellcasting generally by restricting a mage's ability to mitigate Paradox from the now essential extra Reach so your spells aren't embarrassingly short, impotent or limited.

I felt like Mage 2e was a draft with a lot of good ideas, but still badly in need of further development. The egregious amount of errata and requests for FAW help in the OPP forum threads are a testament to these problems.

Mana scarcity? You can get it back+1 with an exceptional successes. Praxis spells are mana machines.

You only get one free praxis per dot of Gnosis, and you still need an average of about 9 dice to achieve an exceptional success. Since spell penalties are required to achieve respectable factors on most spells, and Yantras are limited by Gnosis and only provide an average of +1 per Yantra, those exceptional successes are going to be far fewer than you suggest, at least under normal setting conditions and/or until the character has advanced to very high levels of power.

I've seen worse in porn.
>tfw you learn you'd fuck Jakki

Do Platonic Forms function as a real item would, eg. tass made into woood could burn, a tass magnet will stick to a fridge, etc.

Phantasms in 1e didn't, but 2e doesn't say

They do; that's part of being the platonic ideal of something.

The fuck is with those curves? You sure you're not a chick?

It's not like it's got acne or some shit.

I fucking HATE oWoD, but I love wraith and Orpheus. Good taste, Jakki.

So with Prime 3 I can create uranium tass?

I feel like the platonic ideal of anything would have no radioactive decay.

Waz that symbol for? I've only looked a lil at wraith and I'm waiting for 20th to come out before goin' hard on the mother fucker.

Your Auspice should affect the type of Shark you have traits of. Also if you stay in one place for longer than [insert statistic here] you suffer a breaking point towards Flesh.

>Pug Obrimos.gif

I sure as hell wasn't alienated. It's just that 2e bring only the magic system for me, because as it is, 2e has no theme or coherent setting. Okay, I get it, many people dislike Atlantis (for some reason). But Mage desperately need a setting to explore and research, and there is barely anything about setting in 2e book. So I'll do the thing I always did - take mechanics from one edition and fluff from another one.

Ditto.

>I feel like the platonic ideal of anything would have no radioactive decay.

So Platonic Form lava wouldn't cool either?

Odd. I've felt that the 2e book did a much better job of creating theme and tone and setting. I feel that the drive to explore and research is stronger, and more encouraged. In fact, I feel that being a static PC is outright disincentive.

I feel like the platonic form of lava wouldn't exist, because lava is melted rock, and the platonic form of rock isn't a liquid.

Atlantis and finding it's shards was the main theme of 1e. What is it now? Because I didn't get from the 2e for sure.

Finding shards of atlantis might have become the theme in supplements, but I dunno, reading 1e I never got that out of the main book.

if they get damage do they like explode or radiate magical energy?