Warmachine / Hordes / Warmahordes

>Watch for an Insider all about Jack Marshals
>from Jason in the next couple weeks. There's
>been some significant changes!"

It's a probably a leftover habit from playing other games. If you've touched 40k you know that every space marine chapter has their own scheme and you either follow it or make your own chapter.

I noticed PP is trying to push custom schemes with their latest mk3 videos and I think it's funny they felt the need to do this because they've had alternate color schemes in the books since Escalation.

Maybe players are having difficulty trying to justify why an army would adapt alternate colors other than camouflage. It really doesn't make sense for Khador to be blue.

can't disagree with that, it's very hard to interchange colours on a ret model, once you pick a scheme you have to see it through on most of a models surface.

I don't have a good enough cam to take em, but I'll post some very similar ones that I semi based my palette from

...

I did used to love making 40k custom chapters, but then I started playing the actual game at my local store and realized how unbalanced and disgustingly progressive it was (every codex forces you to buy new more and more expensive models to remain viable/competitive)

yeah that doesn't look bad, do you have a similar one for jacks?

Honestly, I go with studio colors because there are in depth guides about what kind of shading they did on them and shit that helps a lot. I know the colors work together well already and these models are expensive.

...

^ not actually very close to my palette at all now that I look at the pic more carefully,
more like pic related

What is this Ret = Australia meme, you dank fuck

Has PP updated the conversion policy for mk3?

I use resin shale bases from another company and it would suck to rebase them.

...

Yeah of course, that makes sense.

sure, here ya go.

are those LEDs or are you really good at OSR

So what's up with ret anyway

Why do they spend all these resources making laser guns and shit that aren't any more effective than the black powder rifles humans are using

They talk about how expensive it is to outfit riflemen but then you have pirates with what appear to be flintlocks that have the same range and damage as their laser guns

Legion of Everblight has a bunch of parallels with Zerg from Starcraft.

Shredder - Zergling
Afflictor - Mutalisk
Incubus - Infected Marines
Scythean - Ultralisk
Absylonia2 - Kerrigan
Everblight - Overmind

Ret looks very Protoss to me as well. what do you guys think?

LEDs haha

Well, for the Retribution, everything is expensive cause they're a renegade faction, so they don't have the full financial backing like most of the other warring nations / groups.

Fluff wise, I think your point about the laser guns being exactly the same and flint-lock pistols is a fucking good one. Surely some user here has an answer?

Elves aren't as great as they'd have you believe.

Notice how they're a dying race in nearly every setting since Lord of the Rings?

YOU MUST CONSTRUCT ADDITIONAL PYLONS

I don't play the game, but my cousin has that model, painted green and purple. What does it do?

At present? Not a hell of a lot. But hopefully that will change.

Fires a long range weapon similar in profile to one mounted on a myrmidon half the cost, slightly buff ranged attacks made by myrmidons in B2B with it, and spend points on melee defense abilities despite being an obvious artillery piece.

>The Iosan elves are endangered because they aren't being reincarnated anymore and their gods are dying too.

>The Nyss elves are endangered because the dragon Everblight corrupted them.

>The mercenary elf unit Cylena Raefyll and the Nyss hunters are extra endangered elves because they're the uncorrupted remnants of the endangered Nyss elf race.

Those have always been allowed. Stop trolling.

They actually use a crappier version of the alchemical blasting powder that the rest of Immoren uses. It is said that their guns are lower velocity, so they use a higher caliber to compensate. (Not actually how physics works, if it was lower energy then a larger bullet would be even slower). Their magic guns are pretty much just jacks.

So why are the riflemen drawn firing lasers in the art, idgi

Poorly drawn muzzle flare

What about in Gargantuans when the Hyperion's gun is basically described as a black hole gun?

Muzzle flash?

I fail to see how that would stop you from using the bases you'd want.

Like compare the way ret stuff is drawn to the ways these riflemen are drawn

If the ret ones are meant to be depicting projectile rifle they failed miserably

(also, this guy's rifle has identical stats to a ret rifle for whatever reason)

Artist may have missed a memo, but in you can see the revolver chambers on their guns, they're clearly projectiles.

Most of Ret's tech isn't actually better than mainline IK tech, it's just a bunch of weird sidegrades and fancy looking sleek design.

They are clearly different artists, so comparing the two pictures is pointless.

Comparing rules to lore is just as pointless. You'll find dozens of inconsistencies with stuff like this. Compare stuff like bows, crossbows, and guns between each other and the differences between all of them is usually minimal.

I follow vanilla schemes because, while I can paint at a satisfactory level, picking colour schemes that look anywhere near decent is somehow fucking impossible for my dumb-ass, I imagine there are a few others with just as small imaginations and colour theory knowledge as me.

>pick up Ret and I want to do a cool, unique color scheme
>spend two full evenings running through google image search looking for a cool scheme to use as inspiration
>the third evening I just pick up my first primed model and start slathering it with white and trollblood
Fuck decisions.

At least generic Ret are fairly striking if the white and its shading are done well. Maybe I'll start something based on Samus Aran's power suit or pic related's armor when I get to doing Thyron and his crew.

Is it even possible to paint Ret properly without an airbrush?

You can paint them however you want. Why does no one who plays this game go outside the default color schemes? Make Cygnar wear yellow, Khador can (should) be gray and white; hell, cryx can be hot pink and chartreuse if you want. (Seriously don't do that) But everyone just does the same shit. Show some creativity, if nothing else so two of the same armies fighting isn't just a confusing blob of models.

I painted most of my khador in studio colors, but dudes like winter guard and widowmakers I didn't put any red on them except for the leaders. I did them up in brown leathers, and used whites, light greys, and light blues for their cloth. White shoulderpads except for the leaders which get red.

I like big mean red khador jacks and manowar and pikemen, but the regular dudes in cloth shouldn't really be doing that. Kovnik joe is bright-ass red though.

Do we know which faction insider we're getting later this week, or are we back to mystery mode?

>Not actually how physics works, if it was lower energy then a larger bullet would be even slower
That's actually exactly how it works, there's reason why late blackpowder rifles were 11-12mm caliber which went to 7-8mm when smokeless gunpowder stated being used.

I just bought a second-hand Wraith Engine, assembled but unpainted, for a hair under half it's retail price. Was this an awful decision, or is it finally going to be playable in MK3?

"And holy god, the Wraith Engine… No longer satisfied with merely gathering souls, the Wraith Engine now produces Machine Wraiths from its victims. Soul Bondage states, “Once per round when a living enemy warrior model is boxed while within 2˝ of this model, you can remove the boxed model from play and replace it with a Machine Wraith solo.” Furthermore, it has flat-out gained Incorporeal and been bumped up to SPD 7, and the Machine Wraiths themselves have traded a wall of text for simple effectiveness: now possessing a melee attack, the Machine Wraiths can temporarily take control of warjacks they hit in combat."

Not really, though. Those same rifles you're talking about started using smaller calibers to take advantage of the smokeless powder. It's not like they had the same performance- the new ones had triple the range and power, and we're more accurate to boot. In the IK, they're the same.

The writers/designers can't seem to decide whether this is the case or not.

It's stated that they pretty much have the most well equipped military in western Immoren, and the Ghost Sniper's arcane cannon is explicitly a laser rifle that shoots magic (same with the Destor weapons, IIRC). The heavy rifle apparently fires 'bolts' via some kind of magical/magnetic impulsion, and the Hyperion has a gun that literally deletes space and everything in that space.

But Invictors are using blasting powder for some reason?

Something tells me there are a lot of conflicting ideas within PP about what Ios is supposed to be like.

My Rey has different color schemes based on the subfaction. Houseguard are blue or purple, Shyeelis metallic blue, Mage Hunters are earth tones, Vyre is white and orange, and Dawnguard are bronze. Looks wonky as hell on the table but Ilike it.

On the gun thing, all Ret infantry weapons are projectiles, they're described as such in the Forces book and you can clearly see the revolver cylinder on every infantry gun except Garryth and the Heavy Refile Team. Vyre myrmidons also use projectiles, although they're infused with magical properties. Shyeel myrmidons project a portion of their Force Field as a long range weapon. The reason it's not straight up better than bullets is because balance is a thing and they get special effects instead.

Holy shit these typos, fuck typing on my phone.

So my mistake, the Ghost Sniper doesn't have a revolver.

Rattle cans work fine for large flat surfaces.

Ret are also worried about their tech falling into enemy hands so it's likely they don't just run around with lasers and shit constantly. Magic bolts that can go through walls is enough to kill most things and sneak away, no need to level a city with your lasers and alert the entire barracks to your location.

brb, stealing your color scheme.

>Zerg
>Not Tyranids, who the Zerg are a ripoff of

I mean, I have massive quantities of salt for GW, but at least point out the *tabletop* game they ripped off.

>Tyranids
>not Aliens, who the Tyranids are a ripoff of
I think we can do this for quite a while.

>nids
>>not Aliens, who the Tyranids are a ripoff of
>I think we can do this for qui

That's why I said tabletop game they ripped off of :P

I see. But I don't think the analogies from work as well for Tyranids as they do for Zerg units.

Because two reasons

1) The guns generally have some interesting and useful side effect.

2) their energy guns don't require ammunition and retribution warjacks can recharge literally anywhere by just sitting

Given that the Retribution's forces are drawn from the standing armies of several Iosan families and long-standing institutions/organizations, doesn't this make a degree of sense? Their technology is going to be a bit disparate because they aren't a united army in the same way that, say, Cygnar or Khador's armed forces are. They're made up of contributions from all over Ios. So you'll have Myrmidons with forcefields and gravity-cannons fighting alongside troops with miniature railguns, and next to them there's bumfuck peasents with halberds and simple blasting powder rifles.

>Ret gets the most awesome insider yet
>Overshadowed by new powerfield
>Veeky Forums only talks about bad color schemes

Oh for fuck sake, we have had nerf-bats swinging on Cryx, Legion and Skorne as they where a fucking Piñata. When they finally release a descent update on a team everyone thought "muh... wont be much of a change, apart from ripping the MHSF a new one", we not only get a small (and I have to admit it was small) nerf to the MHSF (who everyone thought would get nerfed to the ground!), and just about everything else is buffed (and in a good way!).

Only thing I have a hard time deciding is, do I get a unit of Sentinels, who seems legitimately great now, or a unit of Invictors, who are more in line of what they should have had in terms or rules (Besides, it has been confirmed that they will keep all their current rules as well as the new Assault. Hell, the bonus mini feat of +4 rng brings this units threat up to 24" with ability to re-roll to hit when doing CRA!).
Oh, and Discordia is a must now for my Rhan list as well! Man I'm so fucking pumped, Ill lay down a huge fucking order tonight with all the goodies I feel is a must have (which is just about everything now)!

So, Garryth has Acrobatics now, and his feat also shuts down Fury and stops placement/movement effects (so you can't just Admo away from him).

With the changes to 'jack efficiency, is this enough to make him actually useful?

You tell me. Not my models, but the guy obviously used a brush to paint this, and it looks gorgeous.

I see. What about Myrmoridons? They must be hell with a brush.

Everything is hell with a brush, because it takes time and effort to get it done good. The airbrush is a tool designed to make good transitions relatively quick compared to traditional brushwork.
Having an airbrush helps cutting down painting time which is a necessity for people like me (family, full time job and so forth), but painting with brush has its rewards as well and you will feel super proud when you finished something that took you blood sweat and tears to complete.

Invictors or Sentinels?

Tell you the truth, sure the Invictors seems more in line with fluff, but man those Sentinels just seems to good to be true now!

Base as before (reach, weapon master, ps12 and so forth) but with Vengeance passive as well as the BtB +2 Arm. Ad to this the Iron Zeal for an additional one round +4 arm, and your walking around with a freaking arm 21 unit thats going to hit you back hard! I dread what having a arm/def buff to these guy can do!

Buuuut, the Invictors are cool (power of cool is not to be trifled with). and they did go down a whooping 2 points, which leads me to believe that both units will land on the confirms 10/16, with a +4 ua, landing nice and flat on 20 points.

So, is the point scale of games essentially doubled? 100 as standard instead of 50?

They do different jobs. One is a frontline hard hitting unit and the other is a combined arms unit.

>Ill lay down a huge fucking order tonight with all the goodies I feel is a must have (which is just about everything now)!

I'll wait until I know everything before ordering more stuff. I do have an unassembled Vyre-Jack kit here, but I want to wait till I know all stats before assembling it. Hypnos looks very cool at the moment, but who knows? For all I know the Sphinx could be a hidden star.
Got to be a bit more patient.

ret jacks are fucking bonkers with power up and the changes to arcanists. Hyperion can have a full three focus every turn with just two arcanists

Fuck, Helios can give all jacks one focus and add that with power up plus whatever arcanists will do, it's trivial to run multiple myrmadons at full allocation with zero input from the warcaster

Problem with that is your support is super vulnerable and Jacks are going to be worse at assassination now.

What do the electro mancers do? I want to order them and magnetize the new heavy jack

Points are essentially being doubled, but 75 will be the new 50 because jack/beast points on casters/locks is being multiplied by 4-5x.

Recommended is 50 if you liked 35 and 75 if you liked 50. Keep in mind with up to 30 jack/beast points you'll have roughly the same model count.

I'm amazed by how shit and unnecessary Electromancers are. There's nothing they do that a squad of Stormfalls don't do better.

Hopefully they'll be retooled into a support/defense tech unit.

Stormfall is like my favourite Retribution unit, I can't wait to run them in MK3

>arcanists
>super vulnerable

One problem you shouldn't have with Ret is the ability to screen small based solos who hide behind your jacks anyway. dedicating almost any attack to taking out a 1 (2 now)point solo is going to be a trade in your favor anyway.

Arcanists are cheap as fuck

Helios isn't vulnerable

Power up doesn't stop unless you're disrupted or dead

Indeed, I think Ill go with the Sentinels, backed up by a unit of Riflemen.
Ad to this Discordia for some more jack love and a couple of Arcanists which now fills the role of being "totally fucking awesome!", some good assassin solos and I'm golden with a 75p list with what I already got.

If you're building a very heavy jack list then you need those support to keep the focus rolling. I can sacrifice some of my shit to drop your armies effectiveness massively.

If you're answer to Menoth is "I'll kill your choir, it's just so easy" then I don't know what to tell you. Losing arcanists isn't really that big of a deal when I get two focus per non-Helios jack before allocation anyway.

If power-up is within 5" I'm golden, as my main opponent plays Jarl (Fuck you magic bullet!). Also play with Rhan as my main, so no problem surviving blasts and the like, especially now with free focus and Discordia! Hell yea, my Riflemen will be crammed up on that mother fucker!


Will be interesting to see what they get in mk3, this is a until I have always wanted, but played to small games to fit them in anywhere. Now Ill be advancing to 75, I might just get them. All depending on how good the Hyperion gets to kill infantry (Hopefully he can insta-gib medium based models now, because I fucking hated that in mk2 rules).

Power up is a default rule now. Helios is likely losing it as all jacks automatically generate a focus a turn or whatever

Why would Helios lose it? He's a support colossal, having broadcast power + power up makes ret into a genuine Jack list

Helios has broadcast power which is only superficially like power up. Also the fact that Helios isn't even going to exist in Mk2 gives credence to the idea that his Mk3 incarnation won't be all that different.

Discordia + Stormfall will eat infantry all day every day. I was wanting a phoenix and run both under Kaelyssa for assassination runs but she doesn't need the arc node now. Maybe play Garryth instead and just spray the shit out of infantry then get into fisticuffs with jacks while I sneaky breeky to assassinate.

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The whining on the main forum is brilliant.

>wahhh wahhh Ret actually have good spell hate now like they were designed to
>wahh wahh these guys might actually kill my warnoun
>wahhh wah the faction that hates warjacks is really good at killing warjacks

Beautiful.

Nothing has even really changed though. The thing everyone wanted nerfed is being nerfed.

Yeah. With Ret, everyone wanted the MHSF nerfed. And they got toned down reasonably.

With Skorne, everyone wanted Molik nerfed. And instead everthing else got nerfed. Seems weird to me.

To be fair, Karn got nerfed with pretty much everyone but Makeda3 from what we've seen.

I'm honestly curious on how you defend against Garryth's assassination, to be honest. You can't escape from it, you can't screen against it, you can't camp against it, so what do you do?

LIke, it feels like you need to be an ARM19+ warcaster to even have a chance.

He has the bond with all the Makedas. Amd Mak2 was the only one using him as a jojo or missle anyway. So it hardly changes anything.

Stay out of range, same as any other decent assassination caster. Keep your ass away from them.

Sure, but the Beatback nerf limits his potential with those two.

Only Makeda3 gives him movement on every attack, which is great, because she can still do her super feat, which was always impressive to watch.

I mean, to a degree, sure, but the way his feat works, he might just be able to use his army to shoot you to death as well, As you can't transfer or spend to stop the damage under it, Garryth no longer needs to do the deed himself.

Rhyas was just as deadly, if not moreso, and yet, she's never been a particularly competitive warlock.

Just keep away from him.