Wold guardians hit hard (and auto knock down stuff) but they're limited by being only fury 3, not having reach, being able to sprint 4 inches and not having access to a lot of living warbeast buffs.
They're still good mind you, and with 1" reach they'll be better. It's just you can trivially get a stalker to Mat 8 Pow 20 + whatever charge bonuses you can fit, not to mention ghetorix can get Mat 11 Pow 21 before you even feat with eKromac.
Wolds have their place though and I love putting them down on the table
Noah Johnson
what armies do you play (not just own but actually play)
>Wold guardians hit hard POW17 with two initials and no easy access to damage buffs isn't really "hard" for a heavy. Outside of Bradigus the Wolds are circle's least-damaging beast type by a large margin.
Cooper Roberts
>Skornites come and shit up the CoC Q&A thread
Aiden Moore
>faction with the most nerfs asks why faction that was unchanged or buffed was unchanged or buffed
Adrian Perez
So what insiders is everyone looking forward to?
Mine are (in order): 1. PoM 2. Mercs 3. Khador
If the guy in the troll forums was correct Mercs should be next up which is cool, but Khador's a ways away and Menoth isn't even on the list.
Noah Lee
>faction with the most nerfs
nobody mentioned legion
Kayden Gray
1. Khador 2. Khador 3. Khador 4. Mercs
Jordan Campbell
Excuse me, it hits hard in context. Baldur stone skinning it and then teleporting it, that'll hit decent. Being at the end of the Bradigus chain will do it too.
Benjamin Gutierrez
Minions for days.
Ian Barnes
well Just started another new army since a store is having a "going out of MK2" sale
Picked up: Cryx plastic Battlegroup Bane Knights full unit Bane Thralls(Warriors) plastic box Darragh Wrathe
All for 123 cad after tax
Guess I should play my friends with them a bit before MK3 hits so I can feel the nerf better
Connor Morgan
Both the Skorne and Legion communities have been very bad about doing that.
Tyler Flores
Cryx and Legion got the most nerfs.
They probably knew they deserved it, though.
David Nelson
any chance that's in the lower mainland?
Ian Rodriguez
Well, you can do that with a Warpwolf Stalker too. Will 5 Pow19s wreck a heavy? Maybe, depends on the heavy. But 5 Pow20s and a POW18 sure as shit will, and the POW20s have an extra 1.5" of threat range thanks to Reach.
Baldur actually doesn't like Wolds outside of Megalith all that much, his kit does way more for the wolves.
Josiah Kelly
markham ontario
Jordan Reyes
damn, congrats on the deal you made off pretty good
Christian Gutierrez
Goddamn. That's a hell of a haul.
Colton Ward
>CoC has nearly 0 changes
Easton Flores
it was between Cryx and circle
Circles had a battlegroup for 30, tharn bloodweavers for 9.99, trackers for 19.99, min wolf riders 19.99
decision went to cryx because I'd actually eventually bring myself to paint cryx up
Levi Perez
Summary of cyriss changes:
"Induction is uncapped, go apeshit. Also your cards now have Mk3 costs."
Nicholas Thompson
the whole conversation was about what wolds do in comparison, not who's better. Previously I had even pointed out how trivial it is to get a stalker or ghetorix up to Delete-Heavy tier alpha strike
Elijah Adams
>oh and aurora gives everyone flying, lucants feat makes you repair more total and Lucant gives his jacks dispel instead of purification
Mic drop
Connor Moore
-Mercs -Mercs -Mercs -Kayaz... Khador
Brandon Cruz
Kayazy are Mercs now. All the old Allies are Mercenaries with Partisan [Faction] rule.
Jace Long
>All the old Allies are Mercenaries with Partisan [Faction] rule.
Source?
Charles Scott
>mfw just bought Madeline for Terminus before hearing about the changes
fug :D
Asher Watson
Kayazi and Precursor Knights in the same army, cats and dogs living together, utter chaos
Matthew Allen
They mentioned that weeks ago when Eiryss 2 was shown and the whole "no more contracts for Mercs" thing was revealed. If you "need' a forum post then go find it yourself. I'm sure the Merc forum has it somewhere.
Jeremiah Sanders
Oh god, I forgot how bad battlegroups were to clean, poor Denny has so much excess plastic
Nicholas Kelly
Kayazi, Precursors, Idrians, & Cephalyx are all one big happy family. I am curious to see if any of them work for other factions now.
I could see Idrians working for others if they aren't "devout" Idrians and Precursors could feasably work for Khador.
Evan Sanders
Idrians would already work for Magnus in that one theme list nobody used
They did say cephalyx would still be their own thing but we'll see to what extent
Joshua Davis
They've said Cephalyx are still picky and don't play nice with others, so you're unlikely to see them outside of actual Cephalyx lists.
Ethan Taylor
I know someone who has inside info, you don't even know how far Cryx has been nerfed.
Elijah Richardson
did he used to work at nintendo? cuz I know that guy too
Benjamin Lewis
His info on Bane changes was accurate before the insider was released, and he already told me the rules for the new birds (they have more than just reposition), so I have no reason to doubt anything he says.
Austin Brooks
Looks like Eiryss1 will be the go to Eiryss in Mk3.
Chase Adams
And no more targeting restrictions on the PA and TEP
Dylan Garcia
>tfw I have the No Quarters but am too scared to write down my credit card number in a mail that could get into the wrong hands during postage
Daniel Gonzalez
What's she do now?
Justin Reed
Any word on if they can be made by neurosurgeons?
Nolan Baker
Sorry, I promised not to pass the info on.
Thomas Wilson
Mammoth's gun got nerfed a bit.
It's AoE 3 now instead of 4. And it got d3+1 shots per turn. Which is decent, but I was hoping for non-random shots on a gargantuan. Its range went up to 12 at least, which is where I wanted it. But dropping the AoE kinda kills the point of the gun, it's rat 3 so it's never direct hitting any model.
Adrian Bell
Fuck off then.
Luke Bailey
eHexeris has Field Marshall: Channeler
Hail Satan
Jose Perry
Archangel is 1d3+1 as well.
Might be the standard for most ranged big dudes other than Blightbringer.
Jose James
I guess I can say that Necro-Surgeons can't make new birds, it's technically not a spoiler I think.
Lincoln Long
The d3+1 doesn't bother me. If it was straight d3 I'd be pissed.
Moving from aoe4 to aoe3 on a gun that can only direct hit models that are knocked down or are other gargossals is stupid. The whole point of that gun was shitting out 3 aoe4s to try to blast damage stuff while it was on the way in to a brawl.
Hudson Hernandez
I'm curious how that'll go for the colossals like victor guess we will see.
Noah Diaz
Hexxy1 sounds really promising as well. Here's hoping his feat is better.
I really don't know what to think about that change. He isn't required to spend fury to fire anymore but he has a AOE3 and a min of 2/max of 4 shots.
All I can think is, maybe they buffed him somewhere else? If his Rat was higher or the dmg on his gun, it could be nice. It's just weird considering, if he had stayed the exact same but got a small rng buff, he probably would have been fine. Maybe give him a few more dmg boxes.
I kind of figured, when they redid them, they would end up redoing the Mammoth as sort of the "long range" gargantuan and the Hydra as the melee beater. Now I don;t know if either will be all that great unless there is some amazing change coming.
Cmon universal Bulldoze. If all Gargs got BUlldoze the Hydras stock would go up by a bit.
Joseph Hill
They did say that the gargs are both getting more boxes.
Adam Peterson
How do Hordes players deal with so many options on the table? How do you just say enough is enough and not over run your fury?
Sorry I forgot you all have ways to clean off all the fury each turn
Joseph Robinson
ask us again in 2 months
Jason Hill
Reminder that cataphracts are the only heavy infantry spoiled so far to not pick up some kind of rules, only a nerf
Manowar and Cyriss: Repairable and still 8 boxes Warders: Shield guard, brutal charge, always-on wall of steel instead of waiting to get hit to get the armor bonus Champs: Threat increase, 14/16 is a better statline than 12/18 if facing non-boosted shots, gained steady to be one of the few things that still have mk2 tough Blighted ogruns: Gained tough Cataphracts: Lost a point of def
Ayden Evans
Well, I play Legion and Circle, and have Skorne and Protectorate armies mid-assembly, sooo....
Circle's my main army but at the moment I'm more excited about Protectorate. Doesn't hurt that the Revelator is a fucking beast.And comes with its own theme song.
Who the fuck knows, though, I've been saving my pennies since Mk3 was announced and will splurge after I've got all the cards.
Carter White
>No-limit Induction is "nearly 0".
Tbh, I'm wondering what we're missing, as the other factions seem to be generally toned down, but CoC just got turned up to 11, or so it seems with the Insider.
Liam Reyes
>Been wanting something akin to a Steelhead Sharpshooter for years. >New edition announced >Cygnar Arcane Tempest Sniper solo Why do you not want my money, PP?
Jordan Anderson
What you're missing is that CoC was their lowest sales volume faction.
James Cox
>The d3+1 doesn't bother me. If it was straight d3 I'd be pissed.
This. I was hoping for straight up ROF 3, but d3+1 isn't different enough to bitch. Going down to AOE 3 is weird, though. Maybe Skorne is getting some sort of knockdown tech and the Mammoth now exists to drop boosted POW 15s into knocked down heavies.
Jose Powell
I always thought it was somebody's pet faction.
Angel Lewis
I mean, that's basically Kell Bailoch.
Ryder Miller
I'm assuming that's the case, considering our pow 18 rat 1 catapult.
Juan Nelson
I'm pretty sure there's better things you can be doing with knockdown tech than using a Mammoth. If my hits are guaranteed, I'd be fielding a herd of Gladiators right about now.
Oliver Bennett
didn't the creator get booted out or something?
Caleb Cox
Retribution had the same thing for MK2 you retards. They designed them with the new rule set mostly fixed in place so when the switch comes they're ready for it.
Jacob Martinez
Eh, it's not all that. Induction creates some weird positional issues unless you're just doing a gunline.
You've also got to consider that Warjack hate is going to be more common because people will actually be bringing warjacks now, so people will have a reason to put it in their lists.
Lucant losing Purification is also pretty big, CoC can't trivially ignore upkeeps anymore. And the Enigma Foundries also got hit hard with the general change to recursion mechanics.
Nathan Green
Well, given the new info, if pXerxis keeps Def Ward (pMak lost it, and with a lot of target-other defensive abilities going away and the Agonizer being a mini-pThag, at the moment I'm doubtful he'll have it), I'm thinking of doing something like:
pXerxis Mammoth Sentry x2 Catapult x2 Agonizer Swordsmen x1 or 2 + Support
Sentry takes Def Ward and stands in front of the Agonizer at ARM 25, doesn't die (and the second one takes over if he does), and drops headbutts and slams on stuff it can't kill. Mammoth + Catapults kill shit. Swordsmen jam and stack Fury and Xerxy's feat to kill everything, and sacrifice everything but the Mammoth to kill everything that can threaten the Mammoth asap.
Of course,
a) I'm expecting pXerxis to lose Def Ward b) I'm expecting the Sentry to lose a point of ARM c) Even stacking "add one die" with "+3 melee damage rolls", swordsmen still suck.
But it's a fun dream.
Ryan Reyes
pXerx kept it. He lost inhospitable ground and fury, but kept d-ward.
Elijah Thomas
>Lucant purification
Did you miss that he gives all his jacks dispel? That includes ranged weapons.
Recursion sucks worse for others because I'm not exactly depending on the melee attacks from my reciprocators to fuck anything up and they'll still benefit from shield wall
Samuel Torres
>Did you miss that he gives all his jacks dispel? That includes ranged weapons.
It's specifically melee weapons only.
Nolan Collins
Defender's Ward feels like it's going to be a really big deal in Mk3 considering how they're clearly nerfing armour against blast templates. The Krea no longer has it, even the fucking Razor Wurm lost the ability to shield from blast.
Hudson Taylor
Eh still, you're setting up your synergy chains anyway.
Carson Harris
I play against enough Circle and Legion I won't miss Inhospitable Ground. What did he get to replace them, and did he keep his feat?
Any word on the Sentry?
Julian Edwards
What? We're talking about Father Lucant. He is not the caster with Synergy, that's Syntherion.
Also Synergy is capped at +3, in case you missed that.
Adrian Davis
Krea used to give +2 arm vs shooting, now it gives blast immunity.
He got tactical supremacy and rift to replace them. No word on his feat.
Josiah Long
Oh shit you're right. The Krea just went from auto-include to auto-include.
Evan Long
Oops wrong warlock. Well here you go then.
Tyrant Xerxis
Lost Fury and Inhospitable Ground Gained Tactical Supremacy and Rift Gained Stir the Blood battle plan (affects FF model/unit, +2 STR for first attack this turn) Ref
Jason Phillips
Xerxis is the poster child for the new Marketh.
Spell Slave had to have been designed with Rift in mind.
Xerx is a fury 5 caster. Why would he want a cost 3 offensive spell?
Because marketh can cast it for him, and marketh uses his MA of 7 to roll to hit instead of Fury 5. And then marketh can upkeep D-Ward or Tactical Supremacy for him to save Xerxis a fury point.
Nicholas Brown
But he's not a Steelhead, and Steelheads deserve more love.
Isaiah Taylor
Thanks. Pretty cool. Shame on the Fury, though, as the last thing Skorne needs is another reason to not take swordsmen.
Now just need to see Tibs and the Sentry's card.
Connor Baker
Steelheads are just generic "what do we call these mercenaries that don't have a real theme" mercenaries.
Nicholas Gutierrez
I feel like making it be the first melee attack each turn is literally spitting in the face of swordsmen.
Considering that swordsmen also got a point increase I'm probably going to rip their arms off and make them keltarii.
Benjamin Hill
...
Henry Johnson
>I feel like making it be the first melee attack each turn is literally spitting in the face of swordsmen.
Here, have a (You).
I'd really like them to be useful. Maybe they've got something cool coming up, but even with eMak's Elite Cadre for THEM SPECIFICALLY I don't think there's a reason to take them over Nihilators or Keltarii.
Not that Keltarii are particularly good, they're just better at being swordsmen than swordsmen. Maybe the kelts will go up to PS 12.
Daniel Jenkins
Since when was Magnus the Traitor bad?
Brody Rodriguez
Since forever. He rolls over and dies to upkeep removal and basically doesn't have a feat. His spell list is good but let down by his FOC6, he can't put out his upkeeps and run his battlegroup on the same turn. At best he was just a less-good-than-Bart Galleon list.
Ironically, Mk3 might make him bonkers good just off the general changes, bonus points if non-Colossal merc jacks get buffed.
Zachary Davis
I thought champs were 12/17
Bentley Reed
They were 12/16 in mk2, before krielstone, and had defensive line for +2 arm. Defensive line is now +2 def, making them 14/16.
Isaiah Brooks
Is zerkova really that bad?
Hunter Rogers
CoC was written when they probably had an idea of what changes they wanted to make in the next edition and ended up somewhat forwards compatible.
Ian Mitchell
She's like a cygnar caster without an arc node or a squire, basically. And her feat is at about the power level of one of haley's spells. Her debuff spell is like if crippling grasp was only a third as good and had to be hard cast at range 11. I guess it's nice that she has banishing ward?
Chase Watson
All this delicious butt hurt honestly i just hope that MK3 even with the nerfs actually becomes an interesting game unlike MK2 otherwise i'm going to short sale all my menoth and be done with it
Leo Moore
I actually bought Zerkova the other day because she was dirt cheap and there's no way they could make her worse.
They need to give her field marshal channeler and some spells that are actually threatening.
Imagine playing Denny without any arc nodes, without stealth, with no meaningful offensive spells, her spells don't reduce arm or str or anything anymore except for def and prevents running and charging and is elemental typed, and her feat is basically Temporal Barrier once per game that also denies ranged attacks, but doesn't reduce def.
Logan Gray
Silly user, the faction doesn't look OP when you don't give it access to every warcasters' spell list at the same time.
Camden Harris
So, wait. Corollary can hold 3 focus and can induct 3 focus. But it still has the power transfer action, which only works for 5" and requires line of sight and facing?
So, why ever use its * action?
Grayson Morgan
user, think for two seconds. You have to spend focus to trigger induction. What is the Corollary going to spend 3 focus on?