/cofd/&/wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

The Fourth and Fifth attainments of your Legacy require gnosis 6/7 and 8/9(for convetional and novel acquirement), respectively.

Mysterium

I want ALL the magic

I don't think demon dark era can happen. I'm not saying its not a cool idea just that demon only recently came back from hell.

>Which of the Mage Orders would you join?
Tremere revised to use the Mystery Cult Initiation rules with a set of Attainments for each House.

...

the orders are so boring, you really have to move away from them if you want something fun/interesting
if that means user is going to call you a snowflake, i'm sure people can live with it

Am I the only one who doesn't know what to do when it comes to making a Mage's nimbus?

what's your character's background?

Again, Devil's Due covers this. You play as either weak Earthbound or individuals summoned by demonologists.

Oh I'm not playing anymore, the game only went on for a couple things before the ST had to drop the game.
But it just seemed like everyone was either "spooky mist" or "weird feelings".

Basically, think up a cool effect that fits the character and their magic.
Then make the tilt based on what that effect would logically do.

EG, Lucy's scalp lightning probably gives her bonuses to Intimidation and Intelligence
A character whose nimbus is a windstorm might give penalties to firearms, with a bonus to stealth
A Nimbus of brilliant fire might give a penalty to stamina
Ye olde classic Mastigos/Thyrsus Nimbus of arousal might give penalties to wits or presence, but bonuses to manipulation

thats sort of what it's all about
but you can add "cool shit" and "fun feelings"
you just base it on your character
you can look at some of the example ons in the books

Vecu’s nimbus casts long shadows like wings. Her hands
and feet have a bloody cast, and green swirls suggest vines
growing along her body.

Thaïs’ nimbus appears as a light with no apparent source that
catches the light in her eyes and sparkles around the tips of her hair,
but which disturbs rather than reassures, making her look frightening
and sad rather than divine.

Ray’s nimbus creates the illusion of a fiery angelic crowd,
all around, cheering as if they were at some kind of Supernal
Cup Final.

Rebecca’s nimbus manifests itself in the air around her, as a
kind of haze in the air and a smell of ozone, not unlike the fresh,
cooling feeling to be got from standing near a waterfall.

Ben’s nimbus causes nearby inanimate objects, particularly
those designed as tools, to appear to develop personalities.
Suddenly it seems, just for a moment, as if they were moving
of their own volition, as if they were watching Ben and some-
times even talking to him.

HM.
I guess I just didn't really think things through when I made my character and just went with something odd (and felt out of place compared to everyone else's nimbus).

Next time I will be more prepared.

I forgot to mention what my mage's nimbus was, maybe you could tell me if I went someplace wrong with it.

Essentially they "made" frogs.
Like it depended where they were, sometimes it was just as simple as making frog statues and figurines more noticeable, like being drawn to tasteless frog knick-knacks on a shelf. Or it made frog "shapes"; the splatters on a modern-art painting looking like tadpoles, cobblestones resembling little frogs all curled up.
Junk like that.

Everyone isn't going to have the same style with it, it's no big deal unless you have one of the specialized cabals.

Any Legacies which grant Death as their additional Ruling?

stone scribes, logophages, threadcutters, wraiths of epochs

Just another reminder that the Tremere are best Vampires and best Mages.

Silver Ladder or Adamantine Arrow

where you went wrong was making a mage who is devaluing rare pepes thats what

Maybe I'm being retarded, but 1e Legacies don't appear to give access to a new Ruling arcanum

your retarded

Some Legacies have attainments that utilize a primary
Arcanum other than the parent Path’s Ruling Arcana.
Mages who follow such Legacies are not limited by the
normal restrictions for learning Common or Inferior Arcana
for that Arcanum only. The Legacy’s primary Arcanum can
be learned as if it were a Ruling Arcanum for the character.
He can learn it at the same experience-point cost as a Ruling
Arcanum — new dots x5 — and learn it up to the fifth dot
without needing a teacher from a different Path.

Why?
Also, don't most people in the Tremere Houses not actually know they're part of the Tremere? It's not really an Order.

I wish you had more options for Nimbus effects. Starting characters basically just get a +1/-1 to a skill.

>don't most people in the Tremere Houses not actually know they're part of the Tremere?
What the fuck are you talking about, they're offshoots of the main tremere legacy developed by eating other liches who adhere to the Tremere laws and customs. Of course they're also Tremere

Is it bad that the Attainments were going to be in the flavor of the Tremere as a whole while each had themes they shared with their respective Houses? The main reason behind making them a Nameless Order is that they kind of ARE one at the moment. Also it means any Path can join their ranks and they are not restricted to Moros, there is probably an upside to this.somewhere.

>Why?
because their goals,methods,reasons for being are all reactionary and the overall goal of each order is to keep the status quo

I don't like the tremere, but people who are going to stick to the orders are going to make boring as shit mages

So difficulty 9 and the success threshold is equal to their Stamina? That's awesome. My players are gonna be pissed.

I'd probably run the Tremere similarly to the Malkavians in Requiem. They don't exclude you from taking other Legacies but have some nasty drawbacks. Maybe specify that you can only take Reaper or House Legacies in addition to base Tremere.

Alternatively give them a bunch of optional attainment lines and let the character choose one particular set to go with.

I concede that I am indeed retarded.

>most of the Death Legacies are left-handed

Fucks sake

>>most of the Death Legacies are left-handed
oh no

Yes, but the entire point of those offshoots is that they're unaware that they're part of the Tremere. They're not "Tremere", they're "Nagaraja".
Also, man, I forgot that Houses have to devour twice as many souls.

The impression I'm getting from the single Legacy in 2e is that you're not completely restricted by Path (Marple is in a Moros legacy). I also don't see why the Tremere are a Nameless Order more than a Legacy. Just because a Legacy has a lot of structure doesn't really mean it's an Order.

But all of the Legacies are explicitly against the status quo, which is literally a creation of evil forces of oppression that want to control and manipulate humanity. Your understanding of the orders seems mistaken at best.

I should try to make a Death/Spirit Legacy. I don't know if I'd feel comfortable with that, though. We don't have many rules for it.

>Death can only be used to kill things and all necromancers are evil
This isn't D&D

>>Death can only be used to kill things and all necromancers are evil
no one said that
>This isn't D&D
no one said it was

learn to read

>But all of the Legacies are explicitly against the status quo, which is literally a creation of evil forces of oppression that want to control and manipulate humanity.
the legacies are just about changing your soul, most of them involve staying within the creation of oppression
>Your understanding of the orders seems mistaken at best.
Seems better than yours

Nagaraja=/=House Nagaraja. House Nagaraja inherited the name from the non-tremere legacy they devoured and are explicitly said to regard themselves as not just Tremere but the best damn Tremere there ever were

If I am a Guardian of the Veil, my rote skills are Investigation, Stealth, and Subterfuge.

If I take a rote that has suggested rote skills Intimidation, Occult, Weaponry may I use those skills as a yantra, or do they HAVE to be one of the three rote skills from my Order?

Also, when picking a rote, may I pick a skill that is not in the suggested skills (in the above example, replacing Occult with Stealth perhaps)?

The most self-hating one

I assume "oh no" was sarcastic.

Whoops, I meant "All of the Orders are explicitly against the status quo".

I'll admit I just looked that one up on the wiki and it gives no info. Still, I don't think that every Tremere in a House know they're Tremere. That's what I was getting at.

Guardian then

You can use any Rote, technically, though I believe that your ST should actually be deciding which spells you can find with which Rote skills. The Scriptorium having "Transform Self" doesn't necessarily have the Athletics version, but they do have the Science and Occult version.

>I assume "oh no" was sarcastic.
It was.
Because being left-handed doesn't really matter.

Not because your weird obsession with morality and D&D.

>Death 5 has a "one in, one out" spell where the Mage can die and Awaken someone else in exchange

me likey

And I've got Left Hand Path right here. You can't not know you're a Tremere without being wildly ignorant of the history of your house and contemporary Tremere politics. Hell the first step in being a Tremere is being an enfante, a generic tremere who hasn't progressed beyond the first attainment they all share, you only become a member of a house with the second attainment.

>Whoops, I meant "All of the Orders are explicitly against the status quo".
yeah which is why you're wrong
Guardians: Protect magic that hasn't been hurt since the Fall
Mysterium: Hide magic doing the Seers work for them
Ladder: Get more people to awaken, keeping the numbers of awakened the same since 1000BC
Arrow: Help every other Order
Free Council: Democracy and murika
it's the status quo

Yo, is there a 1e book that gives stats for Ochema?

I don't see any reason why the smart money isn't with the Throne. I can wrap my head around serving them more than wandering autist Archmagi.

>h
yeah seers of the throne

I think that a single Ochema is on par with an Arc of their Exarchs Arcana, but I could be wrong.

Because the Exarchs don't give a shit about you except how you are useful to their purposes and you stand a real good chance of getting murdered by other seers

the oracles don't give a shit either and you're likely to get killed by other pentacle mates too (lucy sulphate you bitch)

The last part is the ONLY reason why they haven't "won" yet.

>nd you stand a real good chance of getting murdered by other seers

Let me guess, you're not nearly as worried about other "right handed" mages shanking you for no reason.

How does the Pentacle kool-aid taste?

...Where?

Let me explain the problem that is having:
The only Legacies that use Death as their Primary Arcana are all morally repugnant and often literally monsters.

It's not because of some obsession with morality. It's not wanting to play a soul eating monster.

Alright. I was just making sure that the question that was getting answered was actually the question that I asked, which is "I thought that most Tremere Houses didn't realize they were actually Tremere Houses and thought they were their own Legacies".
The answer is apparently no.

But...
Magic has been hurt. Paradox is dangerous and more of it is bad.
The Mysterium hides Magic to protect it, not to keep the Supernal away from the Fallen, but because they're afraid those Sleepers will destroy everything with their grubby hands.
The Ladder does not want to keep the numbers of awakened the same, they want to Awaken the entire world.
The Arrow belief is literally that if you accept the status quo you aren't magical enough
The Free Council believe change and adaptation are better than not and embrace the myriad changing culture of Sleeper society.

No one wants the status quo, other than the Seers.

Because you'd be a puppet. You'd get a ton of money and bitches in exchange for being a shitty person and betraying everything you hold sacred and also being at risk of "you have failed me for the last time".

That's bullshit and wrong. "The Pentacle has some shitty people" is not an argument for why you should join up with the people who's core belief is literally that you should murder your superiors to advance.

Oracles aren't going to tell my cabal mates to kill me though and promotion by murdering my boss isn't the preferred method

>The only Legacies that use Death as their Primary Arcana are all morally repugnant and often literally monsters.
what do you find morally repugnant about the stone scribes?

>who's core belief is literally that you should murder your superiors to advance

Maybe when you grow up you'll stop enjoying all that bullshit your hierarch is feeding you kid.

Cabals may be families, but pylons are friends.

To be clear, I said most, not all.

Legacies: The Ancient, in Tamers of the Cave. It's called Atonement.

>Magic has been hurt. Paradox is dangerous and more of it is bad.
Paradox is not magic being hurt, its the world being hurt because of mages.
Read the fucking book.
>The Mysterium hides Magic to protect it, not to keep the Supernal away from the Fallen, but because they're afraid those Sleepers will destroy everything with their grubby hands.
And they're doing the Seers work for them
>The Ladder does not want to keep the numbers of awakened the same, they want to Awaken the entire world.
But they can't. The numbers have stayed the same for thousands of years.
>The Arrow belief is literally that if you accept the status quo you aren't magical enough
They're even more stupid, because they fight for the status quo.
>The Free Council believe change and adaptation are better than not and embrace the myriad changing culture of Sleeper society.
Wow so they embrace the status quo, it's almost like you're arguing for no reason other than to advertise yourself as an idiot.

>To be clear, I said most, not all.
You literally did not. I can understand not reading the book, it's big, but maybe you should start small and read your own posts first.
>The only Legacies that use Death as their Primary Arcana are all morally repugnant and often literally monsters.

>Paradox is not magic being hurt, its the world being hurt because of mages.
Timori go home

>Because you'd be a puppet. You'd get a ton of money and bitches in exchange for being a shitty person and betraying everything you hold sacred and also being at risk of "you have failed me for the last time".

Sounds like any other job worth having. If you can't swim with the sharks, you don't have a place in the ocean.

Oh GAAAAAAATE!

>You literally did not.

>most of the Death Legacies are left-handed

Actually yes, I literally did you fucking spacker

youtube.com/watch?v=cbq8wr4RddQ
REM makes me think of Mage.

youtube.com/watch?v=-0AkMPAQ-h0

But you're wrong.
Like, every single thing you said is wrong.

That wasn't him, that was me. I don't actually know the Stone Scribes. Either way, stop quibbling. It's bad that Death is an Arcana that keeps getting treated as "oh, no, it's not evil or anything" and then used mostly for evil.

>Implying you're the shark

Updated a Mage Legacy to 2e, should the old attainments be 1, 2 & 3 or 1, 3 & 5?

>It's bad that Death is an Arcana that keeps getting treated as "oh, no, it's not evil or anything" and then used mostly for evil.
It isn't.

The Stone Scribes are basically biographers of the dead. The Tamers of the Cave are hermits who study ephemera.

Yes. In that one Legacy. But look at this list:
whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Legacy_(MTAw)
Most everything with Death is Left-Handed. As an aside, according to this, Stone Scribes have Fate as the main Arcana, so Death is secondary.

Also, what are Shadowbinders? That sounds like a Legacy I wanted to create.

>Also, what are Shadowbinders?

No specifics, it's ust an end of a paragraph. The first attainment suggests it lets you absorb ghost's anchors into your soul, turning them into familiars. Higher up you get greater powers based on this, but each greater thing attached to your soul cuts down your Wisdom

Mostly because it's necessary for Reaping. There are some interesting other ones (Bokor and Master of Destruction are in a grey area admittedly, though Stygian Herald Singers in the Silence are fairly moral), though Reapers take up a lot of the focus for Death legacies. Alternatively just create your own.

Attainments 2, 3, and 4, if you're going by dot-level.

Oh. My Legacy idea was a Death/Spirit one about manipulating ephemera.

My problem is that... well, what you said. Most Death Legacies are Reapers.
I plan on creating my own, especially if we get better Legacy creation rules.

Does Promethean have a signature other realm, like the Underworld, Shadow or Supernal?

i want a vampire gf

I want to drink your blood until your dead

hot

i know i am bitch you dont need to keep saying it

It does not. Not every game has or needs one. The signature other realm for Mage is also the Astral. You don't really "go" to the Supernal. It's less a realm and more a substance.

...

Honestly the astral is so neat that if you took out the supernal and replaced it with a more in-depth treatment of the astral itd probably be a better game.

How so?

There's a number of different angles we could go with but let's go with that the basic experience of mages is not and never will be platonic ideals but instead a passage through an initiation into gnosis that's heavily colored by sleeper cultural ideas such as a Plutonian underworld, Abrahmanic revelation, germano-celtic ideas of a fairy circle, hindu theology and so on. That magic is the physical actualization of the collective unconscious works better with mage's setting than the platonic stuff, and is in some ways better supported by the fluff. On the more prosaic level lets go with that you aren't going to be going or dealing with the supernal much but it uses up more wordcount than places like the underworld or the astral or the shadow which do come up in gameplay.

Creeeeeeeeeeeeeed!

>you will never have a qt Assamite gf

Why even live?

That doesn't surprise me in the least.

I'd join the Silver Ladder.

Silver Ladder or Mysterium.

>tfw been wanting to start my players off having to deal with a Scelestus, but thought the one from 1e core was the only statted Scelesti Legacy
>tfw get around to looking at Left-Hand Path and realize there's several other Scelesti Legacies
>tfw the Legion is more or less what I wanted

Has DaveB stopped posting on /wodg/?

I haven't seen anything from him in ages, unless he stopped using his tripcode.