Warhammer 40k General - /40kg/

If you cannot decide and only have a handful, use Rifles. The range of the others is pretty limitating and being able to shoot into the enemies backfield has its adantages.
Both others kinda need a devilfish, too.

If your formatting isn't Battlescribe -tier shittery, post away.

Though we can basically sum up what your list should have in a few words:

Does he have flyers? Any anti-air will pop those birds and you should focus on them. Doomscythes are terrifying.

Lot of infantry means bring AP3, it's like you're fighting Marines that won't fucking die.

Try to avoid tanks because a Ark of Warriors is going to pop your shit no matter what you do.

Once when I played Green Tide (before it was removed) I played an Eldar player who ran his jetbikes into my Tide, forcing it to bunch up, then used Hit and Run to disengage in the following turn. I rolled a 1 for consolidate. He then dropped a full charge Eldrrtch Storm on my head the following turn. Lost 24 Boyz.

Mind you I managed to swamp him in the end so it was all good but damn that hurt.

>Not in close combat
>Use a special rule that specifies you to be in close combat
Nigga what

user I think you misunderstood him, pretty sure he is the Necrons.

Indeed.

Reverse it.

That's devilish. I wouldn't be even mad, that's Eldar as fuck.

every time i look at crisis suits, JSJ always comes up, everything ive seen so far states that JSJ required hit and run from retro thrusters, although it doesnt need fleet

i'm trying to understand why retros are required for JSJ

>Tau Commander has more wounds than a Warboss
>Generic Tau Commander has the same wounds as GHAZGHKULL

I'll go rifles since it's my first squad

Once I get up to a second squad and a devilfish maybe I'll try breachers

>Don't just SAY things. Look at the actual math.
Math is subjective...

I assume you are starting 500pt

I'm starting out aswell with (as of right now) this army , so it would be nice to see what you are thinking of to give myself some more ideas

Ghazghkull doesn't get instagibbed the moment something looks at him funny

Hit and Run has nothing to do with Thrust Move.
You get thrust move for being Jetpack infantry, you get to move in the assault phase instead of assaulting. No Initiative check, just 2d6 and move.

Hit and Run is that thing Eldar sometimes do to run away from close combat with an initiative check-

unless i am wrong jsj is something all jetpack units can do because of their rule that they can move 2d6'' in their assault phase

so you move, shoot, then move again in the assault phase
it has nothing to do with hit and run or fleet

Actually given that Ghazzy has no invulnerable save outside of calling a WAAAGH, exactly the same stuff insta-gibs him as does a Commander in Iridium armour (and when you next encounter Tau Commander not wearing Iridium armour be sure to tell me), except the Tau commander can at least access an inbuilt 4++ save.

Cool, i can strip 15 points off my army then

so why am i seeing tonnes of retro thruster reccomendations when i search for stuff about JSJ, is it from an old codex or are people just retarded?

Someone in the previous thread said about needing H+R if you have drones with your suits, why would drones change that?

Question. Are you kicking his ass with Orks?

If you're bringing Ghazzy, you're also bringing a formation or a detachment that let's you Waagh every turn.

Trying to make a world eaters list at a 1000 points, how does this look?

[HQ]
Kharn the betrayer

[elite]
Hellbrute
-Melta, powerfist

[troops]
Chaos space marines

Chaos space marines

Cultist
-flamer, heavy stubber

Khorne Berzerker
- 8 chainaxes, 1 power axe, icon of wrath, rhino

[support]
Havoc
- 2 autocannons, 2 heavy bolters

Maulerfiend
- tendrils

Drones are I 4 and Tau are legendary bad at melee.

You figure it out.

What colour should grav glow be, heck shoud they even have a glow?

H+R might just be useful in case you do get tangled up in melee, since the last thing a Tau unit wants is to remain locked.

ah, so you just take it because drones have far better initiative than the suits, cheers

The thing is that Ghazz has Eternal Warrior. The Tau Commander doesn't. And if we're talking about saves, Ghazz does have the means to get a 2++ all day erry day. You just have to built really specifically for it.

Unfortunately.

i want them to have fun but losing all the time isnt very fun.

Drop the Icon from the Zerkers, it's mostly wasted on them since they have Furious Charge base.

I'd also ditch the Chainaxes for more Zerkers, AP4 isn't going to help you unless you know you're against Orks or Guard and then the Zerkers are going to kick their ass anyway.

The rest looks alright, the cultists won't be doing much with their weapons, but it might deter people from charging them when they're sitting on a point. Maybe change the stubber for another flamer for that overwatch.

a couple of questions.

1. How many CSM in the squad?

2. What are they equipped with?

3. Why the chain axes on the berzerker squad?

4. Why the mix of autocannons and heavy bolters?

5. What do you plan to do with cultists?

6. What is your helbrute going to do?

There's exactly one that lets you do that and the only way to take Ghazzy in it is to take him in a specific formation that clocks in at 614 base, with another formation that is minimum 524 points. That's all that spent on the bare minimum; no wargear, no additional models in units, and virtually nothing in there is actually useful.

Yeah you can build for it, and you end up with a force that is practically useless. Ghazzy might do some damage if he makes contact, but he's the only part of that list that does damage. You have no points left over in 1850 for Tankbustas, MANZ, Mek Gunz or Battlewagons.

Honestly had forgotten he has Eternal Warrior, you have a point there. Regardless, Tau Commander shouldn't have more wounds than a goddamn Warboss.

So you are beating his ass with Orks. Next question. Is he new/new-ish to the game?

More wounds or not, my commander has a habit of getting his shit kicked in by instant death out of fucking nowhere. Not fun when your source of markerlights is just taken off the table immediately

Actually, you can fit in some painful things at 1850 with the Orkurion. At the very least in the list I am running I have a squad of 8 MANz and a warboss in mega armor in waaaagh band, the ghaz council and at least 1 squad of ten man lootas. I believe reecius had a list that managed to squeeze in the battlewagon formation but I don't remember how he did it.

Also, Chapter Masters are sitting on 4 wounds. A daemon prince is also sitting on 4 wounds. I wouldn't put much stock in what 4 wounds represents in the game.

I think what's upsetting the poor man is that generic tau commander #389071 that every tau player fields is as durable to small arms fire as one of THE greatest orks to have ever lived.

So this is the list I will be bringing against my friends IG list that usually brings ~100 infantry, 4 of any configuration of Wyvern and Basilsk, 2 Vendetta and some tanks.

As I said in it is a 3000pt list

I haven't built my Necron collection with really winning games in mind and as such don't have the Canoptek Stuff (though a stalker would do a lot of work here).

Below is my list and after that a brief summary.

>Reclamation Legion:
Anrakyr the Traveller - 160
Gauss Immortals - 170
7 Sword and Shield Lychguard - 210
Monolith - 200
3 TL Gauss Tomb Blades with Nebuloscope - 60
2 x 10 Warriors in a Ghost Ark - 235
20 Warriors on Foot - 240

>Royal Court
Overlord w/ Veil of Darkness, Warscythe, Phase Shifter - 150
Illuminor Szeras - 110
Orikan the Diviner - 120
Vargard Obyron - 120

>Anhilation Nexus:
Doomsday Ark + 2 Gauss Cannon Anhiliation Barges - 410

>Deathbringer Flight:
2 Doom Scythes - 320

>Star God:
Shard of the Nightbringer - 240

3000/3000

Right off the bat I think I want to replace the Nightbringer with some Deathmarks (who have sick models and could do more work I think) or perhaps the Praetorian formation so I can bring a Stalker.
I would deploy with Illuminor and The Traveller in the unit of immortals that they both buffed up.
Orikan will naturally go with Obyron and the Overlord in the Lychguard Unit so they have two deep strikes.
The Doomsday Ark will sit in the farthest corner that grants LOS, ideally on a ledge.

Apparently he played a fair bit of 3rd edition but hasnt played since

True, but 'small arms fire' in this game is representative of miniature rocket launchers and laser guns

Are Canoptek Wraiths good?

So the marines are just base equipment, so a squad of 5

The autocannons should do some work before the heavey bolters are used

Chain axes because it's fluffy

Cultist are only to capture points

Hopefully the hellbrute will give the opposition something else to shoot at and it'll be able to hold down points

Awesome thanks
It's just the first run I came up with, I'll have to muck around with it a bit more

Huh. Then he should know what's the deal with Tau. See, I had an idea. I find that with new players is that you can really skew their perceptions of the game by playing a top heavy assault army - KDK, Orks, that sorta thing - and just bum rush them. Once their locked in combat, there's very little they can do and they think that things like Tau and Necrons and Eldar aren't strong because they aren't winning assaults. But your friend isn't exactly new. He knows the score, more or less. I don't think Tau has changed much in the intervening years, so that part I don't get. Oh well.

Question Time

If you had to start another army right now, what faction would you choose and why?

If you recently started another faction or your first faction, why did you pick it?

If you have to choose between Nebuloscope and Shield Vanes, I'd go for the Shield Vanes. Not like a 3 model squad is going to be hunting a lot, you're going to be taking points.

That's a lot of special characters, you really sure you don't just want to get more Lord and Overlord for Anakyr? He can't possess named ones after all. You may want to consider a Nightscythe for that Deathstar too, the Monolith is fine, but the Nightscythe is going to get you where you need melee more reliably while you can save your Monolith for repositioning your shooty infantry.

If you bring a shard, bring a Conclave of the Burning one. End of discussion.

Deathmarks are alright at sniping key targets or countering deepstrike, if your IG opponent has neither, I wouldn't bring them. Snipers are generally fairly weak.

>orks
>str 3
>literally as weak as firewarriors

My first 500 point list is probably gonna be:

Ethereal
10x Firewarriors w/ Shas'ui, 2x drones, turret
10x kroot w/ sniper rounds
3x crisis suit w/ TL fusion blaster, cyclic ion blaster, and two drones

Any word on if or when FW will give us updated stats for their flyers. Or should I just plan to not use the extra rules with my FW flyers.

Imperial guard. Lot of players at my local gw play assault heavy armies; being able to hold the line and deny their charge sounds like a fucking amazing idea

In the formation, they're one of the best units the army can bring. 3++ with 5+ RP (4+ while in the decurion) while close to the Spider is really hard to crack, especially if you keep them in melee so your enemy doesn't get to shoot them.

Outside the formation, they're still OK, but you usually have better options for the points.

>I don't think Tau has changed much in the intervening years, so that part I don't get. Oh well.

Tau have changed pretty vastly since 3rd ed. Pathfinders are way more accessible, so markerlights are more common, and markerlights are more powerful.

Tau also have access to the big suits like Riptides and Stormsurges that they didn't have access to back then, and which, along with other additions, drastically increases the amount of AP2 Tau can deliver on the field.

If I was starting another army now I'd do a mechanicus force. Allways been a fan of it.

Recently started a knight themed khorne marines army.

>So the marines are just base equipment, so a squad of 5
They won't do much of anything. You're better off removing them in favor of other options.

>The autocannons should do some work before the heavey bolters are used
Don't mix and match guns. when your autocannons are shooting, your heavy bolters aren't and when your heavy bolters are shooting, they are s5 ap4 vs s7 ap4. Stick to one or the other (preferably autocannons).

>Chain axes because it's fluffy
Can't argue with that. Keep it up.

>Cultist are only to capture points
No complaints here.

>Hopefully the hellbrute will give the opposition something else to shoot at and it'll be able to hold down points
The loadout screams dark vengeance model. If so, at the very least put a heavy flamer on the thing. Other wise see about getting another power fist and heavy flamer and throw him in the face of your opponent. As it is, the helbrute can and will be ignored.

My two cents. Hope this helps

Just started Tau

I've been in love with them since Dawn of War 1, but they were so outdated when I started playing the tabletop in 5th edition that I meandered

Only just now finally getting to return to them after all these years

Yeah I am pretty much throwing my entire collection on the table to get to 3000. I have a metal lord I could use to proxy a cryptek so a second one would be all I need.

The Deathstar has two Deepstrikes right now and with no way to manipulate Reserves waiting for them to get on the table can be rough.

My goal is to have a decent 2000, 2500 and 3000 list that I can bring to most games and have a good war with.

Thanks for the advice.

>If you recently started another faction or your first faction, why did you pick it?

Tau, I really like the idea of setting up firing lines of maximum dakka (strike teams with an ethereal telling them to fire more and multiple cadres tell them to fire even more), trying to slaughter anything that will definitely win if they get close enough by simply throwing as many shots downrange as inhumanely possible

Also i like the helmets and had a soft spot for the shitty ps2 game

Right, they've only gone from strength to strength but the core tenets of the army - JSJ, markerlights and then kill, don't get into CC - remains the same. Maybe he's just not seeing all the toys and what they can do for him. I dunno, man.

all of them have TL fusion blasters? seems massively overkill unless you are expecting to fight cheese alot

also remember that kroot firing sniper rounds dont benefit from the ethereal "shoot them again" buff, as sniper rounds arnt pulse

AM, because BALLS OF STEEL

>The loadout screams dark vengeance model
You ain't wrong, bought the chaos part of my bud but I could fashion a flamer out of Bitz I have

Alright cool I'll trade out the heavy bolters then, what could I swap out the marines for?

If I HAD to? Shit I don't know. I already have Necrons and CSM and Daemons, I've tried Shooty Choppy and Psychic so I don't know if any other army has anything to offer.

Propably some Loyalist Chapter, maybe Flesh Tearers, could call them World Eaters in my head and pretend I'm just playing my CSM.

Either more cultists or a bigger squad of Marines with Melta and a Rhino.

Alright cool thanks

If its the DV hellbrute just say the mouth on his palm can breath fire and thats his flamer.

Going to a friendly 1500pts tourney at my LGS. Thinking on bringing my necrons. Restictions are : no death from the sky, no more than one allied detachment, no more than one Super Heavy, no Super Heavy that cost more than 400pts.

What do you think of this list ?

Decurion

++Reclamation Legion++
Overlord - Warscythe, Phase Shifter 125

10 Warriors 130
Ghost Ark 105

15 Warriors 195

10 Immortals - Gauss 170
Night Scythe 130

10 Immortals - Gauss 170
Night Scythe 130

3 Tomb Blades – Particle Beamer 60

++Canoptek Harvest++
Canoptek Spider – Twin Linked Particle Beamer 60

3 Canoptek Scarabs 60

4 Canoptek Wraiths 160

Somebody explain Detachments for a retard like me my head hurts from reading all this shit.

Basically I just need one Primary Detachment that has 1 HQ + 2 troops and then each formation is a detachment and I can go crazy with it?

TL FB are the same price as TL plasma/missiles, and I'm going to magnetize the models, so it's whatever.

Mostly, I want to get a valid CAD, without needing to buy a second start collecting box (the value on those Firewarriors and crisis suits is just too good), which means Kroot.

For 750 points I'm probably gonna go either 2x hammerheads, or pathfinders and piranhas.

Not again, it literally shat up either the last general or the one before it.

Formations are Detachments so you can use an army of just them.

Man, CSM are allready weak as they are but your list...

You have no real AT, no AA and you are running assault squads in fucking rhino. Not to mention the marines on foot.

Here's what you can do ;

>Replace the marines by two minimal squad of naked cultists
>Drop the Havocs
>Drop the Rhino
>Drop the chain axes
>Drop the Hellbrute
>Pay a Land Raider for your Zerkers.
>Get another Maulerfiend

Still weak sauce but at least you should rape any army that doesn't spam AT like crasy.

See
and follow the thread

>Reclamation Legion with Canoptek Harvest
Maximum friendliness right there.

Well, it still is a tourney after all.

>Buy a Land Raider
Fuck that noise.
Your Havocs should have all Autocannons. Autocannons are vastly better than Heavy Bolters.

That Helbrute will never do anything helpful. Best to just drop him or give him better gun.

Combine the CSM squads, give them some meltas and the Zerker's Rhino.

Cultists should be kept naked. No upgrades ever. Their only real job is to fulfill the Troop requirement of a CAD. Maybe they'll hold an objective at some point.

Chain-axes are garbage. Fluffy, but garbage. Drop them. Give the squad a Dreadclaw Drop Pod.

I'm not a huge fan of the Tendrils, but I usually use my Maulerfiends as anti-tank.

>he fell for the 160pts drop pod meme

Might as well not run zerkers at all.

Just play KDK instead if you want to run with a Khorne theme. Better fluff, better gear, better everything.

what the fuck is a decurian

It's 100 Points, and it practically guarantees that you'll get to charge turn 2. It's sure as shit better than a Land Raider.

If it has to be right now then IF successor double Demi company cause no one at my shop regularly plays marines and IF successors would fit the color scheme I have planned though I'd prefer to wait for the combined admech codex though

'Zerkers are BAD. may as well just run CCW/pistol khnore marked marines. yiu can fit so many more in. if you want fluff, then have them in units of 8.

give the havoks autocannons all the way

air is going to cause you a massive headache

Tell him to stop taking fire warriors and start taking suits, especially riptides. Assuming you enjoy having your asshole ripped open.

What are some units that you wish you could justify running but are just so bad?

>lictors will never be good

Hay

We always play with serious amounts of terrain, about 5-8 full 2-3 storey houses and debris and forests. What ways do i have as csm to avoid the initiative penalty when the whole field is just one large difficult terrain? It doesnt matter which units i use except stuff with grenades, the rules all point to initiative 1 for my kytan, daemon princes, spawn, whatever.
Why the fuck doesnt a 2 story monster thats faster than a fucking bullet get to hit first ever in a forest?!

Waacfag away!

There's something I've never understood about 40k fluff.

They have all this characters who are incredibly powerful, unmatchable warriors or tacticians, and then they kill them all off. Sure, okay. But then they replace them... with new, different, unmatchable warriors.

Why?

What's the point of killing off Horus just to have Abaddon be basically the same character? Why kill off Rowboat to have some lesser but also still incomparable chapter master replace him?

The only way it makes sense to me is if they were trying to write to the genre of "the past was more powerful", but then forgot to actually make the present weaker.

>mfw a buddy is ordering 10 chinaman lictors to run those two Lictor formations with deathleaper
>mfw my other buddy thinks it's cheese
theyre both hardcore waacshit tourney losers...

Always
MAGNETIZE
Freaking
EVERYTHING

Guys should I just wait off till the next edition comes out before starting with 40k?

I wanted to go with orks before knowing anything but after lurking for some time and doing research I'm not sure what do.

I don really wanna get stomped by 70% of the other players and the other armys aren't really that attractive to me.

They read about naydens lictor shame list and think they can do the same. tip: they cant.

>Guys should I just wait off till the next edition comes out before starting with 40k?
>Orks
Yes

Vespids.

I recently started to run vespids in all my fast attack slots. It hurts my markerlights, so my heavy supports are all skyrays, which hurts my overall firepower...

I don't want to use formations, but this new setup seems to force you into them unless you want your army to be absolute shit. I have 2 full squads of fire warriors, and ethereal and Cadre fireblade to boost them, a full squad of sniper kroot, 3 skyrays, 3 full squads of vespids, 2 squads of crisis suits, a team of stealth suits, and that is literally what my army can hold.

It fucks up MEQs, but it folds to the usual IG AV14 walls everyone brings here, where they park their tanks in a fine line, backed up against the edge of the table, blocking their back and sides for all but the 1 or 2 at end end, and then blast me off the table, because even if I could hurt them with fusion guns up close, there is no way to punch through 12 of the fuckers before the suits are dead.

start small. next edition is a year away or 3 years, it might just be an edition 7.5 with the faq added. current rumors are full on retarded bogus from "some guy with a store".

Also orks will always be low power. Buy the "start collecting!" and just do it! its fun as fuck and orks are da best!

Yes, wait.

40k is shit, spend the time between now and next edition learning a language or instrument instead.

Let us bittervets wallow until it dies or changes.

Warp Talons.

The models are awesome, the idea behind is great, but they are just so freaking bad I just can't buy them.

I play with extremely casual lists, and even then i just can't.

Ork flyers. The models are fantastic, but what are they for?

What is the population of the Tau? How many Firewarriors exist?