/cofd/&/wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

Do you think most people believe technology doesn't work?

The idea works perfectly. The idea is that research and sending out information is just to prime people's subconscious for new technology. That is why it took so long in the past, but doesn't take as long now. They had to gradually prime the masses to accept these things as possible before they became consensual.

Do you know what I like the most about Mage the Ascensions? Not playing it, LOL

There's still a lot of issues with it; common misconceptions caused by movies that straight up aren't how the world works, being one of the big ones(see: that guy who shot up a Planned Parenthood and left propane tanks around to shoot when the cops arrived because he thought they'd explode, the possibility of knocking someone out in one punch WITHOUT causing any sort of brain damage in the process, any number of things the Mythbusters have disproved.)

That's how magic works. It just means that when you use magic to blow up those propane tanks you can lessen paradox because people believe it's possible.

How is that an issue with it?

This. The rules of physics work according to the unconscious assumptions of all of mankind, collectively. So scientists and educated persons who 'know better' counter-balance the idiots of the masses.

However those misconceptions are still functional for avoiding paradox.

Oh. Well in that case I feel bad that I'm slacking off.

Well yeah, but once you can do Lethal with your bare hands, who'd do Bashing? I just want something weak, for characters that want to be Boxers or something.
I'd actually also like to see some that deal tilts.

The problem is that very simple concepts like germ theory can't work in a setting with Consensual Reality. If reality were consensual, our hearts would be where our thoughts came from and we'd be animated by fire and four humours. There's also the fact that several of the advances in technology that come from research are completely alien to most of the world. Most people don't know how a computer works well enough to have a consensus on how it works, and more people think gas cans explode when shot and banana peels cartoonishly suplex you than otherwise. Shitty /b/ trolling to get people to mix vinegar and bleach wouldn't work simply because most people don't know what that does, and just about every Darwin Award winner would be alive.

As points out, Mythbusters would never work in Ascension, unless they were magically changing reality as Technocracy agents.

Because if reality were consensual, you wouldn't need the spell to make it explode, they would already explode.

Not him, but it's that reality itself is supposed to be Consensual, not the effects of Magic.
If everyone thought that knocking people unconsious didn't cause brain damage (which I would be fairly safe in saying the vast majority of people do think), then it wouldn't.

However in Ascension, despite overwhelming public opinion as to certain viewpoints.
Reality still refuses to budge.

I think in a roleplaying game, "this straight up doesn't work" is the least compelling problem for a concept, especially when it's about as impossible and unreal as magic.

>counter-balance the idiots of the masses
The number of scientists or well educated people in the world is overwhelmed by the masses of the ignorant.

I mean really, the state of world politics today is evidence enough.
Any sane, educated man would vote Trump.

>Because if reality were consensual, you wouldn't need the spell to make it explode, they would already explode.
More people understand science than watch action blockbusters and think they're real.
You think the movie-watching American populace is a majority. It isn't.

Only 5% of the world's population lives in America.

America isn't the only poorly educated country in the world which is addicted to explosions.

1. Consensual reality is local. It is not worldwide, it only extends a set distance from the group who believes it. This is why globalism is so important to the Technocracy, and why magick is more powerful in third world countries and in the middle of nowhere. This is literally the reason the Gauntlet is so thin out near nature, and also the reason machines break down so easily in the desert. Oh, you thought it was the sand? No, its paradox because of the Taftani worldview holds sway in many out of the way places in the mid-east.

2. Our hearts used to be where our thoughts came from, and we used to be animated by the four humors. As the consensus changed, so to did everything else.
Obviously.

But those people who know better are dramatically outvoted, and wouldn't be able to learn such things in the first place. Unless you're telling me that John Snow, Louis Pasteur, and Robert Koch were all Technocracy changing the consensus. Which, if they were literal wizards, that means they were really bad at changing reality.

When the core conceit of your setting doesn't stand up to the basest logical scrutiny, that is a problem. It's not "Magic!" that's the problem, because magic is something we can accept and works within the setting. But when you try to explain it, then it becomes a problem because the explanation is full of holes.

>More people understand science than watch action blockbusters and think they're real.
No they don't. And it's not about the American movie-watching populace. It's about anyone with a television. Hell, I bet there are poor people in Africa without televisions that think that barrels of gas will explode, simply because they've got warnings on them that say "FIRE HAZARD". You've already got people in Liberia and the Congo and South Africa who think that raping a virgin will cure your AIDS.

It's the biggest.

1. Again, the Consensus is localized.
2. Most technological innovations were caused by Technocrats or Technocrat associates yes. First the theory is spread around and debated, then its adopted by the consensus, then technology based on it becomes possible.

>You've already got people in Liberia and the Congo and South Africa who think that raping a virgin will cure your AIDS.
And they're balanced out by the rest of the world who knows it's shit.

And as stupid as you may be, you still went through the American education system and know it's shit, despite all the movies you watch.

Is it weird that one of the reasons I'm looking forward to Sekhem Sorcerers and the Mage/Mummy crossover is so I can try and create a blood sorcery created by those descended from some followers of Imhotep who got turned into vampires?

Not according to Consensual Reality!

Except that if you go somewhere that people believe the action movies, the gas tanks still won't explode. Hell, if reality were locally consensual, things wouldn't break down in the desert because the people driving them don't think they will.

Likewise, if reality is consensual, no one could ever research and experiment to find new things. The very scientific principle wouldn't work, because replication is key, and no one would be able to replicate the experiments of the one mad scientist that changed reality.

Except there are more uneducated people in the world. There always will be. The largest and most populated countries are generally not industrialized. Chinese dirt farmers outweigh all the educated elite.

Saying that "only Americans are dumb" is so fucking asinine. It's childish bullshit that doesn't actually refute the complaints about the setting's logic.

>Except there are more uneducated people in the world. There always will be. The largest and most populated countries are generally not industrialized. Chinese dirt farmers outweigh all the educated elite.
Doesn't matter. The ignorant are disparate, they do not share the same belief as to how things work, they simply don't know.

>Saying that "only Americans are dumb" is so fucking asinine. It's childish bullshit that doesn't actually refute the complaints about the setting's logic.
Your entire argument was based on everyone believing the rules of action movies more than real world rules. Chinese dirt farmers do not learn from action movies.

Using action movies was one singular example of how consensual reality fails. It's also an example of a belief that the ignorant share.

So, do they explode or not

Of course they do. Anything in WoD that can explode will.

Mage the Ascension (because beggars can't be choosers and the GM is a friend) question: how do I combined spheres?

Cyanoacrylate is best.

That actually spellcheck suggests to Technocracy

Mix them in a bowl and then wipe out your avatar and spray quintessence all over that shit

hey I made a crow familiar for an upcoming neolithic mage game look at this fucker:
Towards the Night, crow familiar
Rank 1
Power: 1
Finesse: 3
Resistance: 2
Ban: Towards the Night must perform a minor service, such as a single night of observation or a single usage of its omen sight ability, for anyone that offers it a bird's skull. It cannot be compelled to place itself in physical danger.
Bane: Firelight
Essence: 10
Numina:
Omen Trance
Speed
Innocuous
Corpus: 4
Willpower: 5
Initiative: 5
Defense: 3
Speed: 14
Size: 2
Language: First Tongue, Vinca
Influences: Fear •
Manifestations:
Twilight Form
Image

"DO YOU READ SUTTER CANE?"

What are your favorite individual books (not gamelines) from the WoD and CofD?

I'd say Shadow Player's Guide from Wraith is my all-time favorite, with Dark Ages: Devil's Due, Midnight Roads, Mage Noir, and Danse Macabre all close behind.

So I like Werewolf's themes of maintaining the balance between the human world and the spirit world—but, frankly, I don't want to play a game about Werewolves. How well do you think the spirit mumbo-jumbo could be adapted to a mortal/Hunter style game?

I'm not actually familiar with any of the mechanics of Werewolf, so I don't know if this is a stupid idea or not.

Summoners.

Give Werewolf (2e) a read anyway.
But honestly, sure, you could do it with Hunter if you just give them a way to actually interact with Spirits.

>Give Werewolf (2e) a read anyway.
I'd like to; I mainly ask because I don't want to end up reading it just to find that I can't actually put any of it to practical use. I know I could totally sell my players on a spirit-hunting chronicle, but I doubt I'll be able to convince them to play as a bunch of werewolves.

On a related note: is there a Werewolf 2e download link floating around somewhere?

Pretty sure it's in the pastebin. Also, I know I had the same problem. But honestly being a werewolf is pretty awesome.

Werewolf 2e has tons of stuff for you to steal. You may also want to check Spirit Slayers, for Hunter.

What's your secret re: spirits, anyway? They're the one part of the setting that's never interested me.

first off: werewolf is sick as hell and you should accept it as a game about the descendants of a murdered god bound by an ancient debt.

But if you really wanted to play it without the wolves you could build a decent enough minor template out of some of the abilities werewolves have, most importantly:
1. Inherent ability to speak First Tongue and perceive spirits in Twilight.
2. Ability to look across the Gauntlet
3. Ability to step into the Shadow through a Locus
4. Fetish-crafting.
5. Ability to store and use Essence.

Those would give you a basically playable Mortal+ spirit...person...

Everyone says it, but it's true.
You just can't beat Summoners.

So is Dark Ages: Werewolf any less dumb than regular Apocalypse? I love all the other DA lines.

Spirits are fucking awesome. They're animistic totems of concepts in a Darwinian jungle world.

Horror Recognition Guide from Hunter is bar none my favorite book of fiction from CofD.
>Gnosopharm
>Cat Lady
>Ten Photos
>The Market
unfffff

Fluff 'em as Shamans. Done.

>first off: werewolf is sick as hell
I want to love it, user. If it clicks, I will definitely try and convince my group to play it, but I expect it's going to be a tough sell.

Thanks for the suggestions, though! I will definitely keep this stuff in mind.

>What's your secret re: spirits, anyway?
I think I just watched too much weird anime when I was younger: Bakemonogatari, Mushishi, Mononoke, or any of Hayao Miyazaki's darker stuff. I definitely found myself channeling the tone of these things when I ran Geist, even if it's totally different from the game's intended Day-of-the-Dead vibe.

I love the idea of normal folks trying to understand, bargain with, fight, and put down these creatures that are at once alien and inextricably tied to the thoughts / emotions of humanity. Or something like that.

Spirits have a lot of creative room, but aren't so open-ended as to cause the Mage problem. Makes them great as NPCs, Antagonists, and other set-pieces.

Werewolves are by far the single coolest splat in the entire WoD, old and new.

But the Forsaken are losers. Pure all the way. Ninna Farakh represent.

why would you pick the worst Pure tribe? It's Fire-Touched or bust you anarcho-primitivist chumps

By the way I have put alot of thought about what the Sin-Eater verson of "Going Loud". Im calling it "Unsealing the Quietus"

Its a fact that Geist is constantly pushing back deathly energies from the Sin-Eater's Death.
its also known that sin-eaters gain power for deathly energies.

So what if the Sin-Eater allows the deathly energies from his own death in?
Logically that should be a lot of power.

oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/american_english/quietus

You mean best Pure tribe, you masochistic jesus camp motherfucker.

>Not even the Pure fans like the Ivory Claws

I like the ivory claw. as antagonist

i like Silver Wolf a whole lot but the Ivory Claws themselves are not as immediately engaging. They're "evil werewolf country club" while the other two are "REBIRTH THROUGH FIRE AND BLOOD" and "BRUTALITY IS THE PATH TO FREEDOM" .
I say this despite the fact that the main Pure presence in setting of the werewolf campaign i'm running right now are a gigantic, 200-year-old horde of Ivory Claws that have been controlling the region for as long as they've been there.

I do find the whole "libraries of lineage charts" and "purity of blood" stuff interesting for creating enemies that are wholly unreasonable, which is important for antagonists.

I like all the Pure tribes, but I'd rather play a Predator King. My character concepts always lean toward the primal, with a focus on intense physicality, instinctive behaviors, and bestial force in all endeavors.

>Sin-Eater verson of "Going Loud"
Jesus fuck, not every splat needs to be a copy of each other.

>I wanna add something completely unnecessary to the themes of my favorite splat just to give them a power boost so I can wank over my fan 2e update even harder

I'm a fan of the Ivory Claws, though I dunno if I'd call myself a Pure fan
I mostly just like the idea of using them for the kind of shit Pentex would be used for in WtA; scientific facilities filled with Uratha that have been tested on in horrible ways, some of whom barely resemble Uratha anymore, others stuck in bio-mechanical machines that abuse the properties being a Werewolf gives their bodies

Ivory Claws are, in my mind, basically "Whywolves" taken to the worst possible extreme
I blame Chris, entirely, because of that one Ivory Claw facility write-up he did a while back

I don't really think it's necessary. I mean, I do want some sort of aura, but I think has a point. It can fit Changeling, and Promethean will also probably have it, but Geist doesn't really need it. Although I could see certain ways that it might work out, I don't really see the point to it.

>>I wanna add something completely unnecessary to the themes of my favorite splat just to give them a power boost so I can wank over my fan 2e update even harder
That's not me, that's someone suggesting it to me.

Also, Whywolves? I think Ivory Claw are great because they're some of the worst aspects of the Garou Nation as villains.

>Also, Whywolves?
The Adventure Time version of Werewolves
youtube.com/watch?v=V1X2tTzDufE
I basically just mean "scientist werewolves" though

Tell me more, I dont hear enough GMC stories

>I want to play a rapist cannibal
>It's just what I lean towards

Not that guy, but I was running a Demon game until a couple of weeks ago
It started out with the players all waking up in a room made to look like a doctor's office, inside a Facility, and then escorted to wherever the G-M wanted their missions to begin by a handler(mortals for all but 1, who had a stigmatic handler), and then they all Fell through various methods.
the Messenger's Fall happened when he asked his Handler to wait a minute, so he could watch what he'd done and take pride in it
the Analyst's Fall happened when she corrected the Destroyer Angel sent to flub an investigation and get her father thrown in jail, which led to him being taken off the case and her father walking free
the Guardian's Fall happened when she decided to hijack the bank account of the man whose account she was sent to prevent a hack on
the Destroyer's Fall happened when, after assassinating a man, he received a new Mission to kill himself, and he chose not to(he's the one who got the Stigmatic handler)
They spent about 3 sessions with only the Analyst and Messenger knowing each other(the Guardian joined on second 2, the Destroyer on session 3, the Messenger left before session 4), and then took another 2 sessions to actually meet each other face-to-face, since I didn't want it to be forced

They spent all 5 of those sessions looking into the Facility they woke up in, which was a big Occult Matrix that as taking in criminals and ne'er-do-wells, wiping their minds clean, and then keeping them healthy and strong until the God-Machine needed one of them to fill in a new Angel's appearance
The Facility was beneath the HQ of a big neuroscience company, who'd been sending out free MRI machines to hospitals who needed them, and said MRI machines were sending data back to their main office
The brain scans were being used to piece together suitable personalities for the Angels being summoned in the Facility, before sending them out
TL;DR Dollhouse: The Occult Matrix

Literally every splat except mage as one.

Also, after that fifth session, the Analyst dropped out, and I recruited a mutual friend of mine and the Destroyer's
He made a Psychopomp, who's Mission was to plant a bio-mechanical heart into every 4th car he worked on at his job as a Mechanic; one day, the guy whose car was lucky #4 came back just before he finished doing the repairs on the car, but before he could install the heart in it, and drove off the moment the Psychopomp turned away(he left the money he owed on a table nearby, iirc)
Psychopomp tracked the dude down and broke into his house in the middle of the night, then popped the hood of his car and started to install the heart inside
But then the guy who owned the car opened the garage door with a bat in hand and turned on the light, and asked what the fuck as going on; we basically decided he had two options: 1) Kill the guy, which would lead to a Fall because it was clear the point of the hearts being installed was for them to be driven around the city, and with him dead, the car wouldn't move. 2) Stop installing the heart, which would lead to a Fall because he decided of his own will to not follow his Mission, as well as his arrest for breaking and entering, and possibly the guy and some others becoming Stigmatics
(there's also the third option of continuing to install it, but that would have lead to the Psychopomp getting whacked in the head with the bat, and probably his death)
He decided to attack the guy, and try to kill him.

It started out going not-so-well, with him taking half his health in a single hit of lethal damage, but only doing a couple of bashing to the guy, so he pulled out a wrench, and dramatically failed a swing with it, which lead to it sticking to a magnet on the shelf next to him. He reacted by saying fuck it and doing a Partial Transformation to manifest his Blade Arm(cont)

The guy fell to his knees and started crying, begging him not to kill him(I mostly did this because the player mentioned to me that he has a bad habit of being way too empathetic in games)
We considered letting him live, which would make him become a Stigmatic, and actually probably would have been a pretty interesting element to the story imo
He killed him, though, and then finished installing the heart and fucked off to a church to confess that he killed someone

The next session consisted of the meeting that had been set up at the end of the previous session not going as planned; the Guardian didn't show, though the Psychopomp was (conveniently) nearby, because his bike broke down, and there was a piece of Infrastructure right next to them
After they talked for a while, the Psychopomp walked over to introduce himself, since they all pinged each other with Aetheric Resonance, when suddenly a flashbang got fired out of a grenade launcher, and an EMP went off
And then an Angel materialized out of the flashbang, and attacked them.

The Destroyer and Psychopomp ran for the Psychopomp's bike, since he managed to fix it, but the Angel chased after them and made made sure it wouldn't start, so the Psychopomp ran off while the Destroyer got smacked and proceeded to Go Loud in order to survive and kill the Angel with his Rivet Arm
The session ended with the 2 of them ducking into the Psychopomp's Bolthole, and the game ended there for various reasons

Only Demon and Changeling have one.
Every splat but Changeling and Demon has an Aura.
I am giving Sin-eaters a Haunting Aura of some sort, though.

>The guy fell to his knees and started crying, begging him not to kill him(I mostly did this because the player mentioned to me that he has a bad habit of being way too empathetic in games)
>He killed him, though,
Forgot to mention, in true me-running-games fashion, I hit the play button on this song right after I finished typing the guy's last words
youtube.com/watch?v=i_j1JOzW8mM

I hardly consider Frenzy or Death Rage on-par with Embracing the Wyrd or Going Loud
For one, Changelings and Demons can trigger theirs willingly, while Vampires only do it when provoked, and Werewolves only do it when they encounter a Trigger or take on Gauru too long/outside of combat

And Beast doesn't have one

I wouldn't consider Frenzy or Death Rage like Embracing the Wyrd or Going Loud at all. Hell, I wouldn't compare flaring your nimbus to Going Loud either.

That said, in my homebrew Sin-eaters DO have something similar to Frenzy. It's called Fervor, and is the Geist taking over. It happens when you don't indulge their Passion for too long, and they aren't so much trying to fuck you over as they are trying to get their fix. You can also let your Geist take the wheel willingly, which means you're playing them, with the Sin-eater riding shotgun.

Dave said that Mages are gonna have like 6 different versions of that power

There's a good deal more to them than that, yo.

Garou is the wolfy equivalent, I feel. Temporary awesome buff of awesome, with a risk/downside.

Hell frenzy gives a bonus of blood potency to 5 of the 9 attributes.

And I feel the closest thing a Mage has its Reach. That's the Risk/Reward thing to me.

Please no more going loud, its boring and stupid. It looks great on demons, but on changelings its mindless fuckery of fuck.

I'm not sure I understand this setting. How do games flow?
Is the setting just like our normal world, but supernatural?

Pretty much. Also a darker place in general.

Its normal world setting, supernatural exist but hiding\humans cant see it. Like supernatural series but less gay. Or Lovecraft mythos but no huge tentacle monsters.

It's like our world, but shitter in many ways to justify much of the "hey, the world's shit, let's just be shit ourselves" stuff that many Supernaturals personally contend with.

In terms of game-flow, it's just like any other game.
You have a setting, a plot, and character who fit within it.

Imagine a show like Grimm, or Supernatural, or True Blood, or Vampire Diaries, or Bitten, or Constantine, or.. you get the idea.

They're always our world, but with a second world beneath the surface - a darker world full of terrors and monsters, things that live alongside humanity and prey on it. Few people are aware, but their impact on things can be significant.

That's how the WoD is. For most people, for most of their lives, it's just like anyone's life here in our world. And in our world, sometimes a girl goes missing in the woods. Sometimes a man wakes up one day and says he's seen the light and vanishes from his family. Sometimes you find a body and don't understand what killed it, or bump into a creepy doomsday cult with queer beliefs and rituals, whatever.

In the WoD, sometimes those things have supernatural explanations.

>Like supernatural series but less gay

Maybe yours isn't

>Or Lovecraft mythos but no huge tentacle monsters

Maybe yours don't

Dude no others splats "going load" compares to a demon going load.

Their power stat raises to 10 get every embed available to their "X" splat, has every exploit in game, and has unending aether. So a changeling getting to choose to boost a total amount of stats equal to their power stat is not so power in comparison.

>start a dark ages mortals game
>each single PC is forced into the first mission by a different guy
>we have to fuck eachother over

I hope something happens soon or it's gonna be a hell of a ride

>dark ages mortals
>fuck each other
Accursed sodomites

I hear sex in the Dark Ages was diertier, because everybody was covered in dirt and shit

Anyone played Adventure! ?

Is it any good? The d20 one.

If DaveB sees this, there are two attempts at converting the Bene Ashmedai in the forums and both vary wildly. Any chance we see it converted anytime soon?

He has four other Legacies to convert first and that's after he does errata and goes through the FAQ thread. The man's busy.

Starting Mage soon. Will 10 d10s serve my purposes?

Are there no more safe place to determine size? Whay if I own an entire island

Are there any Scelestus Dynasties in Mage? That is Proximus Dynasties that undergo an Abyssal Awakening as opposed to a normal on.

What Arcana combinations would best fit trying to replicate different musical Genres?

What's the stongest Hunter creed and why?

I mean flavor, not actual implication.