The king's only son has died unexpectedly...

Have more sons. Execute wives when they refuse to birth sons.

The youngest daughter is now his son. Anyone who questions this sudden transformation is executed.

Take younger daughter far away to distant relatives. Make her drink dragon blood every week and have her tutored in the arts of war and necromancy until she has grown into a 7 ft tall instrument of death. Conquer the Duke's lands with an army of living and dead soldiers marching side by side.

If drinking dragon blood makes you stronger and necromancy exists, why not do this to all members of the royal family by default? Why wait until someone dies? If we had turned out son into a 7 foot war machine, this wouldn't have happened in the first place.

Just claim that the youngest daughter was actually the son in disguise, specifically to avoid assassinations in situations like this.

Depends on a shitton of factors. If the Duke is so politically powerful, just changing the law and decreeing another successor when the Throne is rightfully his, is a surefire way to piss him off and maybe incite war.

What even ARE the laws of succession in this kingdom? Does it go Eldest > Youngest? Male > Female? Both? If so, the Throne is the Dukes and any amount of political maneuvering is a good way go fuck up the country worse than a possibly warmongering Duke of Wherever would.

Do the Gods decree and back up the sovereign? Maybe talking to them would work out. If the god/s decrees that this girl is going to reign and gods are a very palpable thing in the setting, the Duke will probably not fuck with that.

If they aren't, he could still ask the head of the church to pitch in. The Pope's words usually carry some weight.

Other than that, I don't know, maybe talking to the Duke isn't a bad idea. Maybe he isn't a warmonger in the first place. Maybe you can change his mind. Or maybe you can get him to relinquish his claim to the throne.

Duke whatshisname can be upgraded to prince-consort whatshisname with the daughter as queen, and then their kid becomes king, or the king can adopt one of his grandchildren back into his own family name (While also giving Duke whoever some nice concessions so he can't complain) and then have a third party set up as regent until his grandson is old enough to rule, entirely skipping a generation.

It's probably too impractical to be common.

I'm pretty sure I've seen this exact same thread with just a slightly different premise several times before.

Literally dozens.

Kingdom is Gavelkind and is split into two pieces. A bloody civil war follows that ruins the kingdom. Weakened kingdom is then annexed as not!France blobs hard.

Something like this happened in Spain.

But France never annexed G*rmany ;_;

I fucking hate Gavelkind so much.

I hate it so much, I've created an entire region in "muh Original the Homebrew" that's fractured into a half-dozen petty kingdoms because the former ruler of the realm decided Gavelkind would be a better way to rule than Primogeniture, and now the petty kingdoms are too powerful to really see one prevail over all others.

Which is, of course, where the PCs come in and conquer the lands under their banner, and the PCs are more than likely natives of the setting's France...

Postpone your own death untill your grandson has been born. Make his regency be compromised of a ruling council instead of the duke exclusively. To avoid making the duke look bad give him a role on the council that is high in prestige but holds little practical control.

Underrated post

Kill the duke. You should have never let anyone beneath you get so powerful. Then either daughter can rule. Of course some cousin or nephew is going to raise a stink. So don't think this muddled succession thing is just going to smooth over.

Give the younger daughter the older daughter's birthright and then campaign the hell out of her. Have her make a few public appearances. Get her to attend some galas. Kiss a few babies. Execute a captured traitor. Whatever it takes to get the public, the church and nobility on her side. No one's gonna want to take the throne if everyone who matters will riot if anyone other than youngest daughter takes it.

Also, give Duke Fuckface a war to distract himself with while the whole rigamarole is going down.

This user has it.
Other than that get the older one caught in bed with someone else. Ruins her entire credibility and the family would probably disown her.

France took one good third of its current territory from the HRE in the first place.

>"Holy Roman Empire".

This is very difficult to say while keeping a straight face. I wonder who can, because indeed it is hard.

"Holy", you say, while grinning like Voltaire did. "Holy", it is its name. But then, thinking of "Holy", you think about all the Emperors who were excommunicated. You think about all those who tried to fuck with the pope. You think about the wars of religion and how many of them ended up as protestant heretics.

But then, the funniest is coming: "Roman". Yes, now, you cannot contain your laughter. "Roman", it is called despite the fact that this "Roman" body is standing on Germania, a land so harsh and poor that the Legions of Rome refused to set foot on it. A germanic and barbaric people, yes, but still calling themselves "Roman".

And now, here is the end of the fun: "Empire". Now you fell on the ground, laughing so hard that you cannot breathe. An "Empire", a body made of dozens of petty duchies and counties, all fighting for themselves, giving strange names to their position, full of Grand-Dukes or Archdukes. An "Empire" who will stay between Poland and France, while the great powers of Europe will create colonies all around the world.

>"Holy"
>"Roman"
>"Empire"

Oh no, my heir is ambitious and excited to rule a throne that is rightfully his as my only lawful son. Better do something insane, immoral, impractical or some combination of three to ensure the kingdom goes to a young undeveloped child I probably won't live to teach proper rule and has no supporters among the nobility, unlike the Duke who has lands aplenty to hand down to my royal grandsons, will keep my beautiful older daughter safe, and make a powerful military ally by marrying my other daughter to a mighty ruler.

No, wait that's retarded.

I go on a hunting trip with my son in law and enjoy the lack of assassinations

Yeah, the same "empire" that was annexed, disbanded and destroyed in two weeks by Napoleon.

much Holy
many Roman
very Empire

Someone else on Veeky Forums watches Reign?

This seems like a decent move, though the elder sister might spill the beans if she knows.

>All these people that gave plans that are basically "Ruin your eldest daughters life" when she's only in that situation due to you anyways..

Terrible..

That's why you should only marry your daughter in a matriarchal marriage with 2nd or 3rd heirs of duchies or kingdoms you can add to yours easily.

I can safely say that my plan wouldn't ruin her life unless she desperately wants her own son to not be the king.

Capped.

FUCK BITCHES

WE CIVIL WAR NOW

Eldest is the one already married to the Duke, though.

>Why do they call it the Holy Roman Empire? They're not holy, they're not Roman and they're not an empire!

Exactly.

The chances are inheritance will not pass through female lineage. A such, when the king actually does die, the successor is the nearest male relative. This happened for example in France, when the House of Capet ended without direct male heir, and the throne was in danger of slipping to the English through female line. The french decided that no, the succession will not work that way because we don't want no english ruling us, and House of Valois succeeded the throne.

Also, your king is not dead yet, OP. He has time to try and have another male heir. He needs to produce just one before he croaks, to secure the succession.

I should have added that the french decision kickstarted what would become known as the Hundred Year War. Google it, the whole thing and the events leading to it are a goldmine of ideas.

>The french decided
>What is Salian Law?
Brit plz

>Breaking your daughters hearts like that by telling them they're basically worthless.

Don't die. If the king is still youngish, then he can become a fitness nut, while raising the second daughter to be the best queen he can. This might mean that he won't die until he's ready and succession is secure. He should also consider getting another son if that would help.

The king may also seek support for his second daughter by going to the rest of the nobility and pointing out that if Duke McLarge Lands would be the king, then their power would be dwarfed by the Crown's. Their rights and privileges would exist at his pleasure, and not be respected. That might get a large enough coalition ready for your death.

There's also turning this over to some PCs for clever solutions that will probably make things worse. What could go wrong with:
>Hiring a bard to seduce and impregnate the Duchess, and then use that to ruin her reputation and legitimacy?
>Capturing a vampire so that they could force it to turn the king into an immortal?
>Sending the party to find some manner of immortality artifact?
>Escorting a master golem maker to create a perfect golem duplicate that he can be put into?
>Hiring them as deniable assets to assassinate the duke?

Salic law was something they dredged up later to prop up the Valois claim. Their primary concern was that the throne would pass to Edward III of England through Isabella. This was something they absolutely refused to accept.

No, just no.

Because people are more likely to take extreme, costly measures AFTER a terrible tragedy.

Royal families are notoriously inbred. You gotta do what you gotta do

Okay, you tell your daughters lies that won't hold up in the real world, all for "love". They will surely thank you for it after either circumstances reject their claim, or the kingdom falls around their ears.

>All kings are Habsburgs

Doesn't change the notoriety.

>Only son died unexpectedly
>Eldest daughter is married to a known warmongerer
>The killer used a lead pipe
>The son died in the Study

It could only be one person...

It really depends on the rules of the kingdom. Are we assuming it functions like a typical medieval European dynasty (which is kind of an oxymoron) or are fantasy rules allowed?

Let the younger daughter take control immediately upon your death, if she's still too young; however, find one or more good advisors to serve as the de facto rulers until she reaches adulthood.

*even if

Oh, and make up some BS in your will about how you want the Duke to prove himself as his own man by tending his existing influence instead of just being handed a kingdom because you respect him so much.

Foster the son of a loyal ally.

Have another son. That's the only surety that the Duke wouldn't get the throne. If the queen is dead and he won't remarry for whatever reason the he could search the monasteries for a young man that looks similar to him and claim that he was a spare that was sent away for just such an occasion.

Sit down to discuss the situation with the Duke and give hints that you are considering leaving the throne to your eldest daughter.

Give him tasks to do and subtly sabotage his efforts via wrong information, incompetent workers and some such. Just one disaster after another.

When he inevitably screws up, reprimand and exile him for being an incompetent doofus. You should appear to overreact righteously.

>A known warmonger
He isn't known warmonger, you just believe he would be for some unexplained reason. Just tell your daughter peace is great and grand and it's her job to preserve it for the peoples sake. Its not like a king can just wage war willy nilly without a Casus Belli and the support of his nobles.

Also in the meantime invent a table top strategy wargame for your son in law and the nobles to test themselves upon. Nothing takes away a mans gusto for war like getting smacked down by young count chucklefucks army of badly painted artillery pieces.

Miss Scarlet!

Just because the eldest princess is married doesn't make her husband king. See Queen Victoria; her husband wasn't King Albert, but Prince Albert. The same rule could apply here.

...

He might be Prince Consort but that's still a quite a lot of power if he knows how to he influential.

But he'll be completely out of the line of succession and will never actually rule the country, so it works out.
If his son (The next king) turns out to also be a warmonger, then tough shit, but you can't plan that far ahead anyway.

The answer is pretty simple. Have the king take a tour around the entire country, laying any girl he can get his hands on whether consensual or otherwise. And hope he plants a son or 600 to succeed him. This also allows for a crazy life-changing event as the entire empire falls due to civil wars about who is entitled to the throne.

What does this have to do with traditional games?

Everything.

Why do you always need it spelled out for you?

No, for real. How does this in any way relate to traditional gaming? Is this some type of shit you people ITT do in PnP or something? Play noblemen and try to decide who to marry family members to in a completely unexplained setting?

The Duke is the enemy, not the eldest princess. Just politically isolate him and trick him into draining his coffers, while building up a clique of advisers and supporters around his wife, the eldest princess. And quietly prepare the law so that when the King dies, the eldest princess will become Queen and the Duke will be her Royal Consort, not the King.

>the king believes the duke would be be a warmonger.
>is willing to do risky shenanigans to screw him out of the throne
>marries his daughter to the guy anyway

Then why did he marry his eldest daughter to him in the first place? Did he think that his son was fucking invincible?

It's obviously trying to find a hypothetical narrative device to help beef up the setting for the players to ruin later.

>grinning like Voltaire

Interesting phrase. What's the context?

Unless you're a Christian nation or specifically forbid women ruling, the Duke wouldn't inherit the kingdom, the elder daughter would become "Queen Regent Whoever" and him "Duke Wherever, King (or Prince) Consort" having no more direct power than he did before, aside from a close relationship with the Queen Regent.

So depending on the setting, it could be a non-issue, and for most fantasy settings it probably is (being more liberal in general than strict historical settings, and even in certain places and times in history as well).

Voltaire had a bone to pick against the catholic church, religious fanaticism, "holiness" and "miracles", and superstition, even if it came from the bible. Especially if it came from the bible.

So based that he mocked the church, rigged a lottery, and won both.

>Kill the duke for plotting conspiracy
>Kill your daughter for not killing the duke and supporting treachery
>Fuck women until a son
>Standardize the armies equipment, make advances in military technology, grow the military in general if need to conscript
>Co-opt the church and social leaders to support your divine rule and current policies
>Proceed to influence the ignorant poor in support of your ideas of military conquest
>Engender hate against your neighbors and convince the people they are the source of the nations problems
>Take your son mold him to believe in manifest destiny.
>Support him with teachings of history, strategy, logistics, and faith
>Set your son up with a willing populace who wants to support the nations conquests and hates its neighbors blindly

Let him go forth and have fun. Who cares if this bitch burns to the ground.

Also fuck the younger sister what have women done for mankinds history?

I knew that, I was just wondering where that particular phrase came from. I get what you were going for though.

Bastard children probably aren't recognized as legitimate heirs, if it's anything like most real royalties.

Was going to suggest this.

Switching to ultimogeniture (youngest inherits first) would piss the duke and the eldest daughter off royally (pun intended), but it would make the younger daughter the heir.

Now, my usual strategy when this happens is to marry my daughter off matrilineally (any children born are of the mothers dynasty, not the fathers) to some nobody without land or titles. Then I give that scrub a bunch of titles and land.

The marriage has to be done first though, trying to do a matrilineal marriage to someone who already has power never works.

Because that is the advice from the minister that you shouldn't trust. I mean, there's a lot of hot tempers right now, so the king might trust him, but that's just setting up the next generation's worth of adventurers to clean the mess up.

>Interesting phrase. What's the context?
Randomly pick any given portrait of Voltaire. Chances are he has a smug, insufferable grin on his face. He might have the most punchable face in all of human history.

That, and "smug Voltaire" has more or less become a meme on the grand strategy threads of Veeky Forums.

I have no idea how practical this is but it sounds like a fun story.

Promise the other one to Duke of Somewhere's son when he comes of age as a future long-term investment as a check to the Duke of Wherever.
In addition, make close allies with the Count of That Place and have him support the Duke of Someplace to shore things up for when the king dies and the Duke of Wherever inevitably makes a claim for the throne.

Seems almost entirely pointless, no player is going to give a fuck about this, as you say. If OP is GM then it won't matter any either, because if he's so deficient in imagination or ability to research historical situations of the sort then he'll have to make a new thread for every little shit that pops up along the way from here on out.

Yes. Also,
Mai waifu even though her character makes me want to punch her in the face 3/4's of the time

It's a Veeky Forums meme

Why not just murder the Duke?

This is a quote from Voltaire
>This agglomeration which was called and which still calls itself the Holy Roman Empire was neither holy, nor Roman, nor an empire

It is an empire in the sense that it had a monarch who rules over lesser monarchs.

Bloody frogs. And now they presume to make law for England!

I think the general idea was to avoid warmongering?

This just in, the Duke was killed by a wild boar while hunting with the King! Thankfully our beloved sovereign is safe and unharmed!

There is an old Anime and Manga called Princess Knight.
In a nutshell, the crowned Prince is actually a Princess who is keeping this a secret so she can inherit the throne rather then the evil Duke.
The entire this is resolved in the end when the Duke's son finally gets the throne, suddenly remembers that 'oh yeah, now that I'm king I can change laws and shit' and forces a change to the law allowing the original Princess to inherit as Queen insted before stepping aside to allow her to take the throne.

Tl;dr, change the law so the youngest can take the throne.
You're the fucking King.
You can do that.

>he thinks people actually discuss traditional games on Veeky Forums

>kingdom falls around their ears
for what. being a woman?

That's not a smirk. That's the face one makes when confronted with something so stupid that you want to kill everything.

In CKII matrilinear marriage is only important because having hair with different surname is losing condition.

I don't think it's so critical in real life.