MTG Magic The Gathering Ask A Judge - Tuesday Bluesday Edition

Your Void Shatter attempts to counter his spell and fails because he has a Sphinx of the Final Word. His clip Wings resolves and you sacrifice your Sphinx. Same for Overwhelming Denial.

Were it a Summary Dismissal, your spell would exile his.

But if I also control a Sphinx, how can his Sphinx counter my Void Shatter?

>how can his Sphinx counter my Void Shatter?
it didn't, your counterspell can't counter his uncounterable clip wings.

It doesn't counter it. "Counter" means "move from the stack to the graveyard". If you attempt to counter an uncounterable spell, your counterspell will resolve. But the "counter" part if it won't happen, so unless it has some additional effect then it just does nothing.

Nothing's countering your spell. Your spell is resolving and doing nothing. It's like casting Doom Blade on an indestructible creature.

Sphinx only stops your spells from getting countered by other spells an abilities. It doesn't stop your spells from being rendered pointless, or being countered by the rules of the game.

Slow day for MTG questions
Bump

Would be penalized for Slow Play? or for Stalling?

If i have Oracle of Mul Daya on the field and I play a spell that lets me draw multiple cards do i have to reveal each card?

yes

Not a question just wanted to saythanks for doing this gA, you've been doing it for years and it helps a lot of players out

No? Slow Play is for when you're taking more time than is reasonable to perform game actions, and Stalling is when you're doing it on purpose to weaponize the clock. "Taking pointless actions" or "playing to force a draw" are not illegal so long as you're not taking too long to do them.

Yes.

Happy to do it, but thank you for your appreciation.

And an "I'm home and dinner's done" bump.

What happens if i play a shockland with Blood Moon on the field? Does it still enter tapped, and do i get the chance to pay 2 to have it untapped?

It enters tapped no matter what, but you do have the option to pay 2 life. It'll still enter tapped though.

Bleh, mixed it up, sorry.

You can pay 2, and it will enter untapped if you do. It enters tapped if not.

>You can pay 2, and it will enter untapped if you do. It enters tapped if not.
Is that a recent ruling change? I could have swore the way you listed in was correct.

I may be mixing things up. Let me double check, I'm feeling a little fried.

Okay, I was mixing it up. I'm more used to Shocklands + Vesuva and the wires got crossed. With Vesuva, it always enters tapped, so you have the option to pay 2 if it's copying a shockland, but it still enters tapped even if you do.

With Blood Moon, lands (like all permanents) enter the battlefield untapped by default. A shockland's replacement effect has it enter tapped instead of the 'default' unless you pay 2, and that replacement effect exists immediately before it enters the battlefield. So, you either pay 2 for it to come in untapped, or it comes in tapped. Either way, it is a Mountain, but you have the option to pay 2 for it to enter as an untapped Mountain.

So I was having sort of a hard time finding an answer to this, even asking some pretty experienced in magic friends of mine, and got different answers each time.
Let's say I have the mana to cast emrakul, the promised end twice and also a man o' war. (29 mana, or less with cards in graveyard). I cast emrakul, then man o'war to return him to my hand, then cast emrakul again.

What exactly happens in regards to my opponent's next turn/extra turn(s?)

You DOUBLY control their next turn, and then after that they take 2 turns that you do not control, back to back.

Thanks. That answer makes a lot of sense, considering how multiple uses of mindslaver in a single turn do not stack (you doubly control the next turn, not multiple turns), but extra turn effects like time walk do stack up (into multiple extra turns).
You rock!

I managed to get two copies of paper tiger, rock lobster and scissors lizard, but when I used them to decide who went first at the LGS the owner said I couldn't use them or I'd be DQ'd

What gives?

Is the owner the judge? I've seen this exact thing done multiple times before and never seen anyone have anything remotely close to problem with it.

Owner was being a bit of an ass. The CR just says to use a 'mutually agreeable method', and the MTR says to use a 'random method'. The usual argument against the RPS cards is that you might have the sleeves marked and know which is what (though usually I see people lay out one of each face-down and each player chooses one).

You wouldn't be snap DQed because nothing you're doing is inherently DQable unless you're using marked sleeves, so don't fret too much. Just be prepared to switch to rolling for it or flipping a coin if your opponent or the judge has an issue with it.

Also, you might want to go talk to the owner of the LGS and ask why he said you'd be DQed. If he says the rules disallow it, bring up MTR 2.2, and/or CR 103.2.

If my opponent chooses to put his commander on the top of his Library then before his next draw step I force him to shuffle does the commander get shuffled with it?

Yep! The only time he can shunt his Commander to the Command Zone is if it's moving between zones. In your question, it's not moving between zones, just changing position in the zone where it already is, so he can't do much about it.

What happens if an opponent controls a Tainted Remedy and I control a Transcendence, and then I get bolted or some ought?

gA, what tournament rules (if any) have been broken if Player A says "pass turn, I have effects on your upkeep", and Player B immediately untaps and then draws for turn? What's the fix, if there is one?

Tournament rules? Technically none. That's not a Tournament Error, that's a Game Play Error. Pretty much a GRV, since it doesn't fit neatly into anything else. An argument could be made for Hidden Card Error, saying that he's drawing when nothing is telling him to.

If we apply the GRV fix, we just put a card at random from his hand on top of his library as a 'rewind' and go back to the upkeep where the opponent has stuff to do. If we apply the HCE fix, then we reveal the hand to the opponent, they pick a card and we shuffle that card into the random portion of the library, and continue on.

How would you know which of those to slot it into? What would you look for to go one way or the other?

Judgement call, really. It comes down to whether the responding FJ decides "The problem is you didn't give him priority and jumped right ahead to your draw step" (GRV) or "you drew a card during your upkeep, which you cannot do" (HCE).

Personally I prefer the GRV route, but I wouldn't argue against an HCE.

What kinds of things might clue you in that Player B had intentionally rushed past their upkeep? Asking as always to try to become a better judge myself.

I can't give you hard answers here. Pretty much anything involving the word "investigation" has an inherent "you had to be there" component to it that's hard to just discuss via text. A lot of it comes with experience, and better teachers than I might be able to explain more clearly; I know some judges have done interactive Investigation Scenarios to help train newer judges.

Personally I just go off of body language, consistency of story, and consistency of skill. If someone who has been playing very tightly and technically all day suddenly starts making sloppy plays that happen to potentially benefit them, I ready up the Baleful Stare. Sometimes it's just something about the way they're acting that rubs you the wrong way, and makes you want to poke into it a bit and see what you can find.

But yeah, a TON of it isn't really something you can convey in text. The body language, potential changes in speech patterns, minor changes in their story, nervousness, etc.

So last week I was playing this kid and he played a Structural Distortion targeting my Wild-Field Scarecrow. In response I payed its cost and sacrificed it. He insisted I still took 2 damage from his spell and I didn't feel like arguing so I just took it.

I shouldn't have taken any damage when Structural Distortion resolved, correct?

Thanks anyways! It does help a little.

Another question:
Player A controls two Ornithopters, one Signal Pest, a Ravager, a Vault Skirge, and a Mox Opal. Player B controls a Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet and a random flier (I forget, doesn't really matter anyways). Player A attacks with the Ornithopters, Skirge, and Pest. Player B blocks Skirge with the flier. Player A then sacs Skirge to Ravager, sacs Opal to Ravager, and then sacs the Ravager to itself in an attempt to put counters on an Ornithopter. At this point, Player B remember that he controls Kalitas, and points to it. They agree (without me there) to rewind the Ravager eating itself. Player A passes after combat, Player B draws for turn, and then for some reason they call me over. What do you do at this point?

I had them rewind back to the point where the Skirge was sac'd (so Player B gets their zombie) and progress again from there since as far as I could tell it repaired what should have happened pretty reasonably without substantial strategic changes. Note that this happened at Regular - I basically explained what my two options were (either rewind or let it go) and while I didn't give them a choice, I paid attention to reactions/body language to try to suss out which would make a better experience for the players. They both seemed happier about a rewind, so that's what I went with.

Correct. Structural Distortion has exactly one target: target artifact or land. If that target becomes illegal before the spell resolves (for example, because it stopped existing on the battlefield like your Scarecrow did), then the entire spell will be countered on resolution by the rules of the game ("Fizzle", in slang terms). The game rules eat the spell and none of its effects happen.

Compare to Searing Blaze- that still has a legal target if the target creature gets sacced (the target player), so it will still resolve and do all it can.

And now sleep. If the thread's still running when I wake up I'll tend to it; if not, I'll make a new one as soon as I get to the office.

Pic related comes from an ancient modern general thread.
The deck's premise was:
>So today I learned how to flip a coin to always get the answer I want.
>I'm gonna post a deck list and you guys tell me how to refine it.
>I want to disguise it as best I can so it seems like a deck that is a little janky, but that if I get lucky I win with.

If someone caught on and called for a judge, how would you handle it?

im not a judge but you could get a third party to do flips for the player if their winrate is shifty

The TO said that since RPS is strategy and not random, it's improperly determining a winner and referred me to the IPG.

dunno how gA would handle it, but if I was, I'd want to see the flips or the coin and determine if there's foul play there.

This may be confirmation bias, but I've found that often times (though hardly every time) if the coin is heads-up when you flip it, it'll land on tails and vice versa. If he's just doing that or something, there's not much I can do as judge.

If I suspected the person was unfairly flipping the coin, I'd investigate. If my investigation led me to believe they were knowingly cheating, I would DQ them.

"A player uses or offers to use a method that is not part of the current game (including actions not legal in the current game) to determine the outcome of a game or match."

Improperly Determining a Winner is only a penalty if you're using a non-Magic method to determine the winner of a game or match of Magic. It has fuck-all to do with determining who goes first. Maybe just don't break out the RPS at his shop, but they shouldn't be a problem elsewhere.

Sorry, totally missed this last night.

So, the Bolt hits you for 3, which triggers Transcendance. As that trigger resolves, it'll try to make you gain 6 life, but Tainted Remedy will replace that with "lose 6 life". So you'll go down another 6 life, which triggers Transcendance again to gain you 12 life, which turns into "lose 12 life", which triggers it to gain you 24 life, etc.

Unless one of you elects to destroy one of the two enchantments, the game ends in a draw because your enchantment will just keep triggering itself and the game can't move on.

If I play Hazezon Tamar and leave him on the field until my next turn when the tokens appear from his ability and then use Descent of the dragons on him and the tokens do his tokens survive him leaving? Do things leave in a particuliar order, or is it all at the same time or what?

Descent will destroy everything at the same time and put dragons into play. Once it's finishes resolving there will be a Hazezon trigger that makes you exile his tokens which you will have zero of assuming you hit all of them with Descent.

Unless the spell or ability says to destroy them in a certain order, you destroy them all at once. Even if you were destroying them one at a time, Hazezon's trigger can't go on the stack in the middle of a spell resolving. By the time that trigger even goes on the stack, your Descent has fully resolved and turned your Sand Warriors into Dragons.

Isn't losing the game a state based action? Why don't you lose the game after your life drops below zero?

...

Is that a chumhandle?

Yes and no. I picked the name 5 years ago when a friend had introduced me to Homestuck and I pondered what my chumhandle would be. I haven't actually read Homestuck in a whiiiiiile.

Apparently it's finished.

So if Helix Pinnacle triggers and it changes controllers before the ability resolves, what happens exactly?

If you block a 6 power creature with Tree of Perdition and it's toughness goes down to 7 until the end of the turn, if you activate it's ability will your opponents life total go down to 7?

Damage =/= losing Toughness

The player it triggered for wins the game, because he still controls the trigger.

Could you link to the Comprehensive Rules in the OP from now on?
>media.wizards.com/2016/docs/MagicCompRules_04082016.txt

If Tree of Perdition has 13 toughness and takes 6 damage, it's toughness is still 13.
Unless it got damaged by a wither or infect dork. Those would change it's toughness.

>119.6. Damage marked on a creature remains until the cleanup step, even if that permanent stops being a creature. If the total damage marked on a creature is greater than or equal to its toughness, that creature has been dealt lethal damage and is destroyed as a state-based action (see rule 704). All damage marked on a permanent is removed when it regenerates (see rule 701.12, "Regenerate") and during the cleanup step (see rule 514.2).

thanks guys, I figured that was the case but I wanted to be sure

The controller of the trigger is the player who controlled the Pinnacle when it triggered. The trigger will begin to resolve, check if the Helix Pinnacle that it came from has 100 counters (it does, probably) and then you'll win the game.

Damage does not reduce toughness.

I suppose I could. That or Yawgatog, since it's hyperlinked.

>Yawgatog, since it's hyperlinked.
Didn't know about this. Godamn that's a lot of purple.
Seems to load just about as quickly, which is nice.

I get the impression the links were script generated though.
More than a few glossary references seem unintentional.

This site's great. I feel like I'm looking at Black Box Packs from Duel Masters.

why is this card hilarious?

post more joke cards.

...

Possibly. I also use blogs.magicjudges.org/rules since it has the CR, MTR, JAR, and IPG all in one place.

Because Dandan had a fish in the art but people used to joke that the creature was the boat.

What am I looking at, here?

In 2002 WotC had an anime/manga/etc. made to compete with Yugioh.
But it was mechanically pretty different from Magic, so they made a second TCG.
It was called Duel Masters. English translations got axed in 2006.
Pretty interesting game, still going strong in Japan. Lots of weird shit.
>tabakrules.tumblr.com/post/100530619404/duel-masters-triple-faced-cards#permalink

That card is "Parlock ~Crossword~" from the Duel Masters equivalent of an Un-set.
The crossword has multiple correct solutions, and it's ability is dependent on your answer.
Those sets are tournament legal in Duel Masters though, so if you want to build a "2016 Calender" tribal deck you totally can.

Except that's only partially right. It started in 1999, and was not owned or made by WotC at all. The TCG started in Japan, owned by Takara Tomy, and WotC just published the English version because they owned the rights to the name "Duel Masters".

Can you figure it out?

Easy.

Mind Control on one of the Flagbearers. Cast Chain Lightning on the one you stole, then pay RR to copy it. The copy is created directly on the stack, not cast, so you can dome your opponent and bypass their Flagbearer entirely.

wow, that was quick.

On the equally valid other hand

Pacifism has flowers in it's picture. Aren't they nice?

To be fair, I've seen the "Create a copy directly on the stack to bypass Flagbearer" thing in Magic Puzzles before.

I'm expecting a puzzle with a changeling one day, where them being Flagbearers will be the solution.

Make one yourself. While you're at it, make one where it's relevant that they're Sand.

I have questions and need critique on my deck. Should I add another kozilek? How terrible is this? Should I splash white for declaration and unmaking? What else?
It runs okay, but I want to improve it. I want it to be competent at the start then flop a big ol' eldrazi dick on everything. I need critique/suggestions

I have no opinions on the matter because I am laughably bad at Magic.

4x Thought-Knot
4x Reality Smasher

Favorite Legacy deck to judge? Least favorite Legacy deck to judge? Favorite Legacy deck to run?
For that matter, what do you play besides EDH? tappedout.net/users/galvanicAutogenitor/deck-folders/

I don't really have a favorite one to judge, because I judge very little Legacy. Miracles and Horsemen can be a pain though due to time problems, ESPECIALLY with less-competent pilots. I don't play Legacy, unfortunately- nobody in town to play with, so it's not worth buying into. I pretty much only play EDH, and occasionally Limited.

New player here, not too educated on phase rulings and the like. Say I have both a Putrefax and a Meren of Clan Nel Toth survive to the beginning of the end phase with 5+ experience counters. Meren and Putrefax both trigger and I can choose what goes first so I choose to have Putrefax sac itself and Meren to bring it back to the battlefield. Will Putrefax still sacrifice again immediately after?

Alternatively, if I had 4 exp counters instead of 5 could I have Putrefax brought back since its death triggers Meren's exp counter gain?

Meren's trigger needs a target the second it goes on the stack, at which point your Putrefax is still alive. You won't be able to get back the Putrefax.

Let's say you have two, though (maybe your current one is a clone, I don't know). As soon as you move to the End Step, everything that triggers "at the beginning of your end step", triggers. If you put another Putrefax or something like that onto the battlefield after those triggers fire, it's "too late" for these new guys to trigger.

If the Putrefax from a turn before is in the grave is pulled out by Meren will it stay on the battlefield during that end step? I'm trying to abuse Putrefax as an alternate EDH wincon.

Yes, it will- sorry if I didn't make that clear! Once all the 'beginning of upkeep' triggers have fired, we're past the point where any more WOULD. If you put a second Putrefax onto the battlefield once you actually have priority in the End Step, it's too late in the step for it to trigger.

Of course, it's just gonna die during your opponent's end step, so that's not terribly helpful.

Ah. Then I'll just have to put it back in my hand. Thanks for the help.

Well, if you just have the one Putrefax, you won't be able to target it at all with Meren's trigger if it's on the board when you move to the end step.

If you have one in the graveyard and you have any less than 5 counters, you get it back to your hand.

If you have one in the graveyard and you have 5 or more counters, it'll come back to the board and die during your opponent's end step. You don't get the option of putting it into your hand if it has CMC less than or equal to the number of experience counters you have, it just goes to the board.

BEDTIME BITCHES.

See you kids in the AM.

You never answered

With one more mana (any color) Firebolt > Flashback Firebolt > Keldon Marauders would work, yeah? Not familiar with flagbearer mechanics. Do they apply to triggered abilties?

No, flagbearer doesn't work for triggered abilities.

Solution posted here:

how does this intereact with odric 2.0?