D&D 3.5 PHB Classes banned Only classes from the following books are allowed: Tome of Battle, Expanded Psionics Handbook, Magic of Incarnum
In addition to ToB, XPH, and MoI, what additional (non-setting-specific) supplements would best complement for this sort of campaign? Lords of Madness, of course, for aberrations and some of the goodies in the back Races of Stone, for the extra psionic powers and feats and for the armor stuff Complete Warrior for martial stuff Maybe Manual of the Planes just for information on the astral plane (relevant for githyanki, and for the Astral Caravan power)
Tome of magic, to use that third that is actually good and leave the shitty two thirds to unsuspecting players. Nephandum, for the swag prestige classes. Savage Species for the weird half human half whale characters.
Brandon Diaz
Warlock is a perennial favorite
Brayden Bell
How about a different system that functions without gutting it at its very core?
Luis Scott
Inb4 4rryes come in lorries and try to start shi....
Nvm. Too late. Just use manual adjustments.
Nathan Cooper
This
Blake Clark
The system, while clunky, gets the job done. It's the classes at the core that are the problem. Upgrading fighters, paladins, and monks to their ToB replacements while replacing broken casters with the more balanced psionic manifesters makes the game work a lot more smoothly.
Not familiar with Nephandum. That's a Mongoose thing? Want to sell me on it?
Savage Species is out. Too broken, too anthro.
I like the ideas in Tome of Magic. I'd probably use the semi-official errata for the Shadowcaster (one of the writers posted his own houserules somewhere). Maybe just use the Truenamer as an NPC class, like I do with the Soulknife.
I've heard good stuff about Dreamscarred Press stuff, but it's Pathfinder, and I understand that there are enough little changes to the system that I would have to buy/read Paizo's shit. And I don't want to touch anything with Paizo's name on it.
Austin Cook
See, I actually like 4E. I've played OD&D, AD&D, BECMI, AD&D 2, 3.5, 4E, and 5E, and I do have a soft spot for 4E (as dejected as it may be.) But it's hard convincing other players to give it a chance. I like Tome of Battle because it's proto-4E while still working within 3.5. I wish 4E had a Magic of Incarnum conversion.
Matthew Adams
PHB II classes should be allowed too, those are all fun and middling in power level.
Lincoln Brooks
>What else? I wanna fuck that pumpkin.
Jaxon Wood
>Binder, the most fun class in the game, isn't allowed.
[Upset frog noises]
Robert Evans
I'd say Heroes of Horror, but ban the Archivist, or it's gonna hurt.
Kayden Sanchez
Skill tricks from.. complete adventurer, was it?
Xavier Jenkins
This to be honest family. Get some of that pact magic up ins, you will not regret it.
Henry Martin
I like the Binder, and the book does have neat things like that new special material, I just have concerns about the other two classes in the book. The Binder would work nicely in a campaign focused around the Astral Plane, what with all the dead gods floating around and all.
I understand that book has sanity rules?
That's the Warlock, Beguiler, and Knight, correct? How do Knights compare to Crusaders?
Oliver Morgan
>I like the Binder, and the book does have neat things like that new special material, I just have concerns about the other two classes in the book. Shadowcaster is a bit underpowered, but it's perfectly playable. I'd recommend it for a player who knows the system well and wants to try something novel. Truenaming, sadly, doesn't work by RAW. If you're willing to implement extensive houseruling, there's a fix on the GiantITP forums that's workable, if a bit weak. Otherwise, you can probably scoot by with a two changes: tweak all truespeech DCs down a bit, and note that the DCs all reset after a night's rest (this was probably intended to be the case anyway, they just forgot to actually note it in the book).
At any rate, neither will break your campaign, if that's what you're worried about.
Hudson Ross
Duskblade, Beguiler, Dragon shaman and Knight
>How do Knights compare to Crusaders?
Not well I'm afraid.
Knights are pretty lame and gimmicky, I basically forgot they existed desu
The other classes are cool though.
Adrian Baker
I completely forgot that Nephandum is an Italian only setting manual, sorry. To break it down though: >Nephandum is in some ways a "cancer plane", a corrupt plane of existence that feeds on other planes. Being more specific, is a "lower" plane, things can come out of it but nothing can come it. > The Nephandum is ruled by five "Lords of Terror", who incarnate aspects of corruption and evil. Those are NOT characters you can fight, ever. They send emissaries though. > This is my favorite setting ever and has the best flavored Prestige Classes.
Quick summary of them: Burattinaio (Puppetteer): create puppets, fight with those puppets, perform with those puppets, cast spells of doom from your puppets. Cacciatore Di Streghe (Witch Hunter): go all Spanish Inquisition on someone's ass. Discepolo Scarlatto (Scarlet Disciple): become the embodiment of body horror using your blood, be a better caster because of it. Folgore Divina (Divine Lightning): the bane of undead, at supersonic speed. Furia Selvaggia (Wild Fury): be a furry barbarian, but fierce and glorious instead of... Furry, Impuro (Unclean): a Druid of illness, acid and swamps, because that's nature too. Infestato (Infested): imprison a ghost in your body, be a paragon for necromancer. Maestro dell'Assurdo (Master of the Absurd): THE paragon illusionist - also, my favorite PrC ever. Mietitore Oscuro (Dark Reaper): the grim reaper in Fighter flavor. Mimetista (Mimetic): be the killer plotted plant in the corner. Ottenebrato (Obscured): a fighter who uses shadows to his advantage (Warning: Shadow Hentacles might ensue) Segugio Implacabile (Relentless Hound): track people to the ends of the multiverse and fucking shoot them. Hard.
If there's anything that interests you particularly I can write its description completely.
Elijah Bell
>The system, while clunky, gets the job done.
Eeeh, arguable. If you have to ignore a huge chunk of the system just to stop it from breaking the second play starts, I wouldn't call it "getting the job done."
Didn't know that! This makes me all fuzzy on the inside.
Read it if you can and, trust me on this, buy it. I think this setting (Along with one from the same authors, Empyrea) is what makes me still love D&D 3.5 after all these years.
Andrew Jenkins
Yeah, when I saw you quoting it I thought "Is he talking about THAT Nephandum? Isn't it italian-only?". Happy to see it's being translated, it's a fun handbook in pretty much almost everything, from setting to monsters to classes.
Colton Sullivan
I'm looking at the Dragon Shaman class right now. Some people online are calling it a boring upper tier-4 class. The auras kinda resemble stances from Tome of Battle. It's kind of tempting to make a homebrew ACF that gives draconic auras instead of stances.
Owen Richardson
Classes aren't part of the system, they're content FOR the system
Some classes being broken doesn't fundamentally ruin a system any more than a broken, badly made adventure module, you just recognize that they're shit and stop using them.
The fact that the classes that are broken are the ones that come bundled with the actual rules obviously complicates things, but it's still an easy enough fix.
Cameron Sullivan
Well, it is making bedroom eyes at you.
I'm reading some glowing reviews. I'll check it out.
Bentley Morales
Mind if I test the waters on some homebrew content, Veeky Forums?
>Martial Vestiges I think it would be cool to stat up new vestiges corresponding to each of the martial disciplines. These vestiges could be spirits of the ancient martial arts masters that founded the dominant fighting schools.
>New Class: Dancer Dancers are a charisma-based initiator class. Their recovery mechanic is based on the Scout's skirmish mechanic from Complete Adventurer; if the Dancer has moved at least 10 feet away where she was at the start of her turn, she may recover all expended maneuvers with a swift action. Dancers share a lot of the same disciplines as the Swordsage, but they have a few unique ones of their very own. This includes a discipline linked to the bluff skill an based around feinting, and a discipline linked to the sleight-of-hand skill based on iajutsu builds.
>Rider Inspired by 6 Juggernaut Star Scours the Universe, this meldshaping features a mount chakra it can bind soulmelds to in order to summon a mount that it can also share soulmelds with. Also features smite opposition and functions as a replacement for the Soulborn class.
Grayson Reed
>Their recovery mechanic is based on the Scout's skirmish mechanic from Complete Adventurer; if the Dancer has moved at least 10 feet away where she was at the start of her turn, she may recover all expended maneuvers with a swift action.
Considering maneuvers don't take up your full round (usually) this is essentially a swift action recovery. The Dancer could recover maybe as a move action that provokes AoOs (but with option for acrobatics to not provoke AoOs)
Not a bad idea for the class, otherwise.
Ethan Rogers
The problem with that though is that it keeps them standing in one spot. The point here is to keep them moving.
Well, one tweak would be to limit the number of maneuvers they can recover in this way. How about this: 'The dancer can, as a swift action, recover up to one expended maneuver for every 10' she moved this turn away from where she was at the start of her turn.' This way, you are encouraged to not only keep moving but optimize your speed in order to recover as many of your maneuvers as possible. It's balanced by opportunity attacks, terrain features, and other effects that might prevent you from moving around (and thus prevent you from recovering your maneuvers.)
Julian Green
Why bother? Why go to all the effort of banning a fair chunk of the core rules, then requiring, on top of the three core rulebooks, at least three other supplements just to get a decent game? Just play anything else
Joseph Brooks
>The problem with that though is that it keeps them standing in one spot
How's about something like this.
The Dancer can choose to move 15 feet as a move action. this movement provokes Attacks of Opportunity and can pass through occupied squares. At the end of this movement the Dancer recovers expended maneuvers. She must end this movement 15 feet away from her starting point. Passing a DC 15 Tumble check negates AoO caused by this movement, increase this DC by 5 for each enemy that would be provoked.
Possibly a bit convoluted, but makes recovering into a bit of a trick by allowing
Anthony Edwards
>Why go to all the effort of banning a fair chunk of the core rules Because classes aren't rules. They're content FOR the rules. Core Class is just a marketing concept. >g, on top of the three core rulebooks, at least three other supplements just to get a decent game? Because in the year of our lord 2016 you can grab a copy of ANY fucking 3.5 book for free with a quick google search. > Just play anything else Because 3.5 with Psionics and Tome of Battle is fun
Oliver Thompson
>Why bother?
Because 3.5 is a fun system buried underneath a heap of sub-par content.
Remove the bad content. Keep the fun system.
>then requiring, on top of the three core rulebooks, at least three other supplements just to get a decent game?
Nigger 3.5 books are an ass to get a hold of anyway, anyone playing it at this point and not using downloaded PDFs is a fucking loon.
Ethan Martin
That's possibly less convoluted than my idea. I like it.
For disciplines, I'm thinking the Dancer shares Desert Wind, Shadow Hand, and Setting Sun with the Swordsage, then has two of her own as mentioned. And maybe access to a 'Indigo Veil' discipline or something that uses essentia for Incarnum synergy.
Class skills then include Tumble, Hide, Sense Motive, Sleight of Hand, and Bluff along with the usual others.
Maybe... 4 maneuvers and 2 stances known at first level? The extra stance helps to differentiate them a bit.
Good Reflex (goes without saying) maybe together with good Fortitude (ballerinas have endurance!) and same BAB as a Swordsage.
And... maybe they add their Charisma bonus to AC. Maybe Weapon Finesse as a bonus feat at level 1?
Eli Turner
I'm surprised WotC haven't released a definitive complete 3e rulebook that combines the best of all official material into a single book.
It wouldn't be difficult and would print money.
Samuel Cook
I would definitely love to have a 'best of all feats' book. How hard would it be for them to just peruse all the optimization guides, pick out the most highly recommended feats from every class handbook, and just compile all of those in one place while omitting the stupid feats that nobody ever takes?
Robert Cruz
>Lords of Madness >the one with the Darkstalker feat >the feat that makes stealth characters fucking unstoppable with no prerequisites
Mason Garcia
Would you rather have that or Dodge?
Anyway, Darkstalker does nothing but force creatures with special senses to make Listen or Spot checks to find you. I've used it on NPC's to punish casters. The feat does nothing against mundane guys that have nothing going for them but ranks in Spot and Listen.
Cameron Bennett
>>Rider >Inspired by 6 Juggernaut Star Scours the Universe Don't you mean 7?
