What would Greyhawk magic-users think of this magus?

Fate is shit. KYS.

>high INT and CHA
>above-average STR, DEX, and CON that she can buff all day long
>average WIS

Very good magic user and a better martial than martials.

Her Gandr can literally cast Sleep.

>best girl who tried so hard against all the odds lost because a high school student took some martial arts lessons
IT'S NOT FAIR

She gains magical energy through semen.

Just like Odin!

>a better martial than martials.
That goes unsaid.

"That goes without saying", friend.

Thanks for having my back, senpai.

"She's gotta be a warlock in disguise. Find out her patron and execute her if it's an archfiend."

>high CHA

Come on user, you can be honest. She's not here right now.

...

>implying Rin isn't the most charismatic and charming

In vanilla stay night, she was easily worst girl.

In UBW and kaleid though (and zero, despite being a loli at the time and having all of one or two appearances) she is a lot better.

That said vanilla stay night anime is terrible anyways.

Rin is very good at bluffing and maintaining a facade, hence why everyone thinks she's the most elegant and magnificent girl in class despite being an ill-tempered and somewhat antisocial person in reality.

Depend on which version.

Fate Rin is useless.

UBW Rin is good.

HF Rin is absolute brute and op as fuck.

Then there is weird parallel versions where she gets to the throne of hero or counter guardian or whatev

I hate the Nasuverse.

>Fate
>Exposition: With Thighhighs
>UBW
>Tsundere: The Archetype
>HF
>Who?: Literally

She is only good in UBW and that's after trudging through half of her bullshit. Even after that she doesn't use her charisma for nearly anything. Ilya or Medea are far more charismatic than Rin.

>Fate Rin is useless.
>blows off Heracles' fucking face with one shot

>Rin is very good at bluffing and maintaining a facade

Surrounded by a bunch of filler NPCs whos only purpose is to populate the world. Any character that lives in a mansion in anime world usually always has this sort of advantage. That doesn't make them charismatic, it makes them just one requisite closer to a played our cliche.

Yes. Truly the best and brightest the Clocktower has to offer.

>Ilya
>sociopathic, but a little girl
>Medea
>only really gets her ara ara boya~ personality in F/HA; in the story, the only people she manages to convince to do anything in F/SN are a fake Servant she summons, a killer who has no motivations of his own, and a guy looking to literally kill himself, and the last one betrays her

>Surrounded by a bunch of filler NPCs
Shinji, Sakura, Taiga, Issei and Ayako?

>Young Aoko is literally Rin.
Nasu is a hack desu.

"That's your... familiar, you say?"

In potential level, when she goes to the Clock Tower.

In Fate she goes alone, and she mostly lives a life of dull mediocrity.

In UBW she goes with Shirou, and she will get better and better learning everything to protect her husbando.

In HF she becomes multidimensional space Jesus.

>Young Aoko is literally Rin
Don't compare a magician to a failure of a magus.

Who did Rin summon in the timeline that Archer comes from?

Shirou doesn't improve her potential, he just makes her waste time doting on him. Rin becomes an excellent magus after Fate and goes on to shut down the Great Grail with Lord El-Melloi II, just like after UBW.

The same guy.

Archer. The Throne of Heroes works outside of time.

Unknown, possibly Ajax.

Also Archer.

Time is some convoluted shit.

>Her Gandr can literally cast Sleep.
The only thing I've seen that thing do is act as a shitty gun.

I've always wonder where this gif comes from. Is it porn?

>Aias being any class but Shielder
Not rad.

Ajax was meant to be a route, but that was scrapped. Archer having Rho Aias is a real plot hole.

They would tell fatefags to fuck right off

>Ajax was meant to be a route
Bullshit.
There is no indication who Stray Servant was ever meant to be.

Shhh, no tears now, only dreams.

It's a curse, but her version can be juiced up so it acts like a cannon; however, she can still use it as a curse. If you recall, when she fights Shirou in the Fate route, her plan was to make him fall asleep and ill for the entire Holy Grail War, and that was also her plan the first time Shirou and Rin fought Kuzuki in UBW.

Most of her magic is fueled by her body's internal energies, or by energy she's stored in crystals for later use.

So they'd probably kick her out for being "too sci-fi" then go back to shooting each other with laser rifles and flying to other campaign settings on magic spaceships

Whoever it was supposed to be, Archer was supposed to receive Rho Aias from that Servant who was scrapped and never addressed.

Google it, famalam. Or not, because this particular one doesn't work. It's Strike the Blood, ecchi.

It's not really a "plot hole" though. Any more than him having Caladbolg or Durandal is, at least. It can easily just be something he catalogued sometime in his eternity.

Proto-Saber a qt

Who is best servant and why is it Tamamo!

Wow. I just realized that Medea would be all over Shirou as a master.

His desire to be a hero of justice and trying to take hits for her left and right... given the emotional state Caster was in after being summoned from her shitty fucking marriage in ancient greece, she would probably fall for him at least as much as she fell for the serial killer.

Assuming, that is, Shirou fucking lives long enough. Take Saber out of the equation, and he doesn't have Avalon keeping him alive anymore. So he probably gets himself killed pretty goddamn dead unless Caster has some way to save him from his own heroic streak.

If that's the way it was in the visual novel then sure, never played it, only ever saw the anime.

Which is why I asked.

Anarcho-Terrorist Rin > Clocktower Rin

prove me wrong.

>Caladbolg or Durandal
Wasn't it that he got them seeing Gilgamesh's versions from Gate of Babylon?

He could presumably copy Archer's Rho Aias, like he did with Kansho and Bakuya.

...

She becomes one of the lewdest servants potentially

at least before Fate GO fucked up the powerlevel/lewd rankings

I super hate this.

Considering everyone here seems to understand the Nasuverse, is there a doc I can read to understand the mechanics of the universe? I was thinking of making an RPG about it, mostly because I really don't think the one Heavens-Feel made was that good, the only problem I have is that I have no idea how to compile the fluff for RP purposes and also I'd like to structure the game around the in-universe mechanics.

She becomes Bayonetta? Shouldn't have let her out of her trunk.

This is not my Tohsaka.

I don't think there's one big compilation anywhere. Nasu explains the magic system from scratch in pretty much every one of his works, though.

>understanding Nasuverse mechanics

>What would Greyhawk magic-users think of this magus?
Fuck you and your anime.

That she PLEASES OLD MEN FOR MONEY

it's okay, she's still the same old greedy Rin

She even starts a business outsourcing heroic spirits as hireable labor to the everyman!

Okay dude, if you want help with this make an IRC channel. I'll help you as much as I can, but it's pretty darn whack.

Disgusting.

>Soujuurou is literally Shirou

>Anything can happen for any reason.
Fundamentally it's not so difficult to comprehend.

>Became a Servant because she's that deep in debt

Does the Nasuverse just run on its own internal memes nowadays?

The best way to represent Nasu's magic system for an RP is the same way that Nasu himself does it in his works:

Write down a decently complicated, but in no way comprehensive, magic system for how magecraft works on a fundamental level, with some examples for how to use it on normal characters.

But include, in the rules, that whenever you start a new campaign you set aside a sheet of paper or a small notebook titled 'rules of magic'.

Anything not covered by the rules in the game is open to be made up later. You just have to try and be consistent with the new rules after they get made, and you can't outright contradict the core rules or the new rules once they have been established as fact.

That said, very rare exceptions to the rules do exist somewhere.

The in universe explanation is the same as in the novel: magic is so enormously complex that even an expert magus only knows MOST of the rules of magic, only the most legendary of sorcerers know EVERYTHING about magic. And even if you know all of it yourself, it takes too long to be practical for you to try and explain it to someone else. Rin doesn't have time to explain everything she knows about magic to Shirou even if she wanted to, so she only tells him what he needs to know at any given moment as it becomes relevant. The rest can wait.

You just need to come up with some way to prevent players from using this purely to give themselves artificial power boosts. Maybe a give-and-take system, where the players can't magic up a new rule of magic until the GM makes up a rule of magic, with creative power bouncing back and forth across the table, and you can only make a new rule once a session so shit doesn't get piled on absurdly fast.

Ya I guess I need to get around to reading those VN was trying to avoid pirating because my computer is shit but fuck it.

I've read some of the wiki on the Nasuverse mechanics and they actually make a lot of sense in a very weird asian way which really only makes sense to me because I've been studying asian religions for a few years now. It's all interconnected and feeds into one another

I don't know how to make an IRC channel but I'm working a couple of other projects at the moment (An RPG set in Hell, and another that is essentially Conan got smashed against Greek mythology)

If you'd like to help slay that beast I'd be more than happy to work with someone else. Got any contact info?

I mean the magic system does make sense to me in a very taoist sort of manner in the info I could glean from the wiki.

The only rule of the Nasuverse is "everyone breaks the rules in some way". Combat consists of both sides constantly pulling out completely bullshit new abilities, which make them seem undefeatable until someone else either pulls out even greater hax, or coincidentally has an aspect to one of their powers that makes it the rock to their scissors.

That HF RPG only lets you get the exact abilities that another character had already, which is completely missing the point.

You mean she pleases blonde ojous for pleasure, surely.

The magic system has a foundation of logic and spell circuits and magecraft and conceptual objects. Most of the magic that gets layered on top of this foundation is consistent with the levels below it, but Nasu does have a tendency to just make up new shit halfway into a story and pretend that was always the case, especially when it comes to specific interacts of magic as opposed to just general magical theory.

He doesn't do it super often, but he does it enough to be noticeable.

Making that how the game works too saves you from trying to autistically compile and reconcile all of the magical shit he has every written, which is the 13th labor of Hercules right there.

Nasuverse's rules only exist so you can be impressed when someone ignores them.
The guy who ignores the rules in the more unfair way is usually the guy who always wins, especially if in theory his opponent should be more powerful then he is.

This is all because of an interesting decision Nasu decided for Fate, which is that power levels should always matter less then concepts trumping concepts.

EG: The Shield That Never Fails beating the Spear That Never Misses, or The Sword That Shows Harsh Truth being blocked by The Scabbard of Unobtainable Utopia

Also I think we can all agree, Iskandar is best servant. Just throwing that out there.

Also, Earth hates you.
And so does the moon.
And all other planets.
Some of them are actually chilling on Earth now tho.
Oh and Earth has this whole spilt personality thing going.

It's REALLY easy to write a Nasuverse fight.
Go into how impossibly powerful something is for a good while before and during the fight (use the phrase "on a completely different level" liberally), and then have the actual fight be extremely close or totally one-sided in favor of one party because as it turns out the invincible undefeatable person is actually totally detestable in these very specific circumstances where he suddenly finds himself in.

Repeat as necessary for every fight.

Of course he's the best servant. He's the only person that isn't made for pure waifu material and actually has a personality that I can't describe in two words.

Yep. Shirou was a shit class mage who would lose in a straight fight against almost any servant, but because of how their respective powers and combat styles worked he was the perfect counter to Gilgamesh's Gate of Babylon.

Gil could effortlessly destroy an army, but he didn't respect Shirou enough as an enemy to use that power until it was far too late, because by all rights Shirou should be a chump. And Shirou could match Gate of Babylon weapon for weapon and then some. Once he got close enough to actually fight Gil in melee, Gil was doomed whether he knew it or not.

For some reason the earth hates people because they are killing it but all humans have a collective consciousness that is collectively dedicated to keeping the earth alive, which is controlled by the earth.

>Got any contact info?
Jump into this.
client00.chat.mibbit.com/?channel=%23TypeyMoon&server=irc.Rizon.net

The world doesn't "hate" humans, it just thinks killing humans sounds really fun. It sees humans as interesting.

The moon doesn't hate humans either, it just thinks of them as food. (Except in EXTRA, where the moon totally hates humans, but pretends it doesn't because it's not "supposed" to have opinions.)

To be fair, we are given to understand that the only reason most of those fights are close is because the characters we are following are specifically choosing battlefields and tactics that limit the advantages that can be brought against them and force the enemy to fight under less than ideal conditions. If they met on a level playing field, we are sold on the idea that it would be a curbstomp defeat.

So I guess, in game terms, powerlevels exist but preptime and tactics and be used to shift the balance more easily than powerlevels can ignore good strategy.

That is, come to think of it, literally Kiritsugu's entire combat doctrine for killing mages left and right over the years: don't fight them how they want to fight, burn down their house with them inside and then hit them with a car when they run outside.

>Hating on Gilgamesh
>Hating on Caster Zero

You take that back.
The funny thing is, Gilgamesh has a perfect counter to UBW. He could literally destroy the demiplane they were standing in at any time, he was just too fucking proud to do so.

Funny enough, in the magical girl spinoff, Gilgamesh as a child is actually arguably a bigger threat then his adult self, simply because he's more willing to actually use his powers on people.

At one point he's trapped underground with the cast, so he summons his airship and flies straight up through several hundred feet of rock. Hard to imagine adult Gil being that pragmatic.

I've once heard a fight in any Nasuverse thing generally described as being rather like a chess match rather then a fight; instead of a back and forth trading of a maneuvers and attempts at getting around each one's defense with a lot of random variables, each fight is actually largely internal strategy stuff (with some largely ineffectual back and dory hitting that is mostly for show when it comes to determining the outcome), then one of the fighters maneuvers the other into a position where it's special movie or ability effectively makes victory assured no matter what the other person does (putting them "in check").

Then the other party either figures it out and retreats to fight another day in more favorable terrain or is too stupid to know when it is beat and gets killed.

>Veeky Forums - Anime and Manga

I'm sorry but all I can imagine now is Rider dumping a giant plastic bag of pawns on the board, lining them up while his opponent gives him a dirty look and Rider just looks at him and says

"What? This is a completely legitimate tactic!"

Gilgamesh is boring as hell in Zero.

As someone who posts frequently in /a/ Type Moon threads, this is far and away the best Type Moon thread I have posted in for years. No shitposting, no waifuwars, a serious discussion of powerlevels without the wank, I wish there were more threads like this on /a/

It's against the rules, but so is everything everyone else does too.
Except for Tohsaka, but that's why she's just a love interest instead of the main character.

It's asking how a set of people in a Veeky Forums setting would react, so it's Veeky Forums related.

>Veeky Forums - Every Other Board Except Better

Medusa or Iskander?