Imperium Asunder

Aodhán art stuff.

Aodhán is a statuesque, almost unreal creature, his features arranged in a picture of classical beauty. He calls to mind statues of the era of Alexander the Great, with a well-defined jaw, a powerful brow, and flowing dark hair. Pre-Heresy, his eyes are a piercing, almost luminous shade of blue, some say influenced by the radioactive environment of his home planet, Nusku, and certainly reminiscent of the startling azure flowers that are harvested for their mind-altering purposes by its populace.

Tall, broad-shouldered, but somewhat leaner than many of his brothers, Aodhán holds himself with a manner of innate, regal authority, though there is something slightly virile and adventurous about him, not quite congruent with his angelic appearance. He often appears aloofly beneficent or amused, though, sometimes, a scornful manner can come over him, in which case his arrogance shines through and spoils his immaculate exterior somewhat.

One thing to note is that, like Fulgrim, he doesn't wear quite so much PAULDRONSSSS as many Primarchs. His armour is more in the vein of Sigvald the Magnificent's.

I'll document that once I get home. Could you add that to the wiki page?

Makes me think of pic related.

Now here's an idea, I don't onow how well this work, since I'm not done reading the Wiki, but what if we can fit Hua Yuan or altHua Yuan in.

For the uninitiated 1d4chan.org/wiki/Hua_Yuan#Hive_Society

Now I know whay you're thinking

>But user, you fag, you just want to squeeze in your special snowflake Donut Steel into our precious, hard worked upon universe!

Which is true. I'm proud of these guys. But consider their origins, a DAoT colony and mining expedition lost to the Far Eastern Fringe, then battered with Warp storms, Genestealers, Tau, and anything else out there.

Now since this is alt, what if the moon had never been reclaimed in 41m? What if they fell to Chaos or Genestealers much earlier and their is a stealer kingdom just waiting for the Tyranids arrival?

Of course this will have greater implications in 40k, but I'm assuming we'll get there in time

Interesting. These guys seem pretty cool, but I don't know how willing people are to add other Veeky Forums creations to IA. I for one am kind of hesitant. One thing worth noting is that the galactic east belongs to the loyalists, so it would lie within Imperial territory. With their name, most likely in Xun's Jade Kingdoms.
Important question: are these guys (primarily) yours, or are they a group project?

By all means. Huayuan is badass and I think an alt version would definitely fit.

Should probably do some primarchs stuff.
>Xun Tohilcoatl
If you wanted to sum up Xun in a word, it would be energy. He's very much got the Quetzalcoatl creation and destruction thing. He feels like an old storm God dredged up from forgotten myths.
In terms of useful description, he looks pretty East Asian, eyes dark or possibly like little windows to a warp storm.
He keeps his hair long and tied up, Han dynasty style. Usually he has his face painted in stylized Tepectitlan storm and Serpent motifs-- think Mesoamerican geometric motifs. I'm thinking he's got a Mesoamerican style nose ring depicting the ritual calendar of Tepectitlan.
He tends to wear elaborate headresses bedecked in quetzal feathers and jade and metal segments carved in Taotie patterns.

He's got fangs. Think Shang Dynasty/Aztec Sanguinius on a scary day. Less noble, more I'm a motherfucking dragon in human form.

After reading more, I'm convinced it wouldn't translate well to the IAu. A lot of institutions mentioned, like the Ecclesiarchy or the Sisters of Battle do not exist and there no longer is a central Imperium. This means that even if you try to translate it, it would be completely different from what it originally was.

>note on Xun
Reason I bring up Sanguinius is because he's got that æthereal majesty thing and Sanguinius is bedazzled as fuck without being Fulgrim.
Xun, like Sanguinius could be throw it all off in a moment.

>Gengrat Vannevar
Gengrat is a sinister figure, though not for any reason you can quite put your finger on.
In person, he's formal, reserved, self controlled.
He has a piercing gaze with wild eyes.
He has MIU plugs and mechadendrite dreads and a wreath/horn-like MIU cortex like a crown.

He may also wear a bane mask worked just to the form of a snarling beast.

>Graha'Nak
I'm picturing him as pale, large, dark eyes. Heavily tattooed with swirling patterns and sharpened teeth. The primarch version of Tyberos.
What do people think?

Oh, sure. I thought there was already a similar description in there, but if there isn't, I'll add one.

That's pretty gud.

They're a cool idea, but they need a major reworking. Keep in mind that things like the Adepta Sororitas do not exist really in IA (instead there are a bunch of Militant Orders run by the Sisters of Silence, who run the blackships, the celestial lighthouses, and protect/purge when necessary the Navigator Houses), nor does a universal Imperial Creed or the like. If you have any questions on what where how who is around, feel free to ask.

Anyway.

>GRAHA'NAK APPEARANCE

There hasn't been much consensus on how he looks so I'm throwing some stuff in.

Forged into a peerless predator by the dark conditions and constant radioactivity of the Void God, Graha'nak is wiry and limber by Primarch standards, his skin a pale, ashen grey. He might be handsome if it weren't for how gaunt and sallow his sharp, avian features are, how his opaque black eyes shine like obsidian. He cares little for his appearance, making no attempt to hide his pointed teeth or control the wild tangles of his black hair, and he often falls into a slight slouch or hunch out of habit, having grown used to the oppressive environment and cramped corridors of the Void God during his youth.

Lines of glossy black chitin trace their way up his fingers, across his elbows, and along the length of his spine, bristling like serrated barbs in places, and his nails resemble the talons of some great beast of prey.

Maybe he should be our winged Primarch? Angel of terror sort of deal? Like opposite!Sanguinius?

Sounds like a more badass and clearer version of what I've been thinking.
I've also been imagining Graha'Nak as having ritual scars/tattoos, very Polynesian in style, though that's also throw Carcharodons talking.

I don't think wings make a lot of sense in context, given the whole narrow corridors and Xenomorph behavior, but if we want a winged primarch, it's probably him, Xun, Alexios?, or maybe Balthasar, if we want him to really look innocent.

Alexios would have scrawny chicken wings.

>Ravens of Morga
Most of the Storm Hammers legion is known for their even temper and honor, even in the fiercest of drop combats. The Ravens are a notable exception. Even before the horrors of the Heresy, the old 13th Chapter? Brotherhood? Was an known for its Saturnine disposition. Like similar formations across the legions, they specialized in macro-extinction protocols, their forces consisting of unusually high concentrations of Destroyer squads.
The Ravens, like the rest of their legion, typically deployed by massed drop pod assault amid intense orbital bombardment. However, due to the nature of their foes, the Ravens developed a distinct patterns of field fortification. The Ravens scoured their landing zone before digging in to face the horrors that awaited them.
Thus it was that during the heresy, the Ravens turned their mortars, cannon, and hammers from Xenos Abomination to the ranks of the traitor astartes.
After the heresy, they were given a fiefdom, etc etc.
First CM is probably someone like Thane Othel the Wroth, big even by Astartes standards, dark, with black dreadlocks and a massive hammer. He probably eschews the protection of a shield and has an arm mounted grenade launcher or something.
I'm thinking he's like the Nassir Amit of the Storm Hammers, who rose to prominence with his chapter on the hellscapes of Rangdan Xenocide.
The Ravens were again called upon for the War on Murder.
The first company of the chapter is known for their massed Terminator formations, in this case, wielding massive two-handed thunder-hammers. It's how a real man kills a carnifex.

I'm thinking that as the Heresy hits and the new realities are revealed, the legion expands their forte to include daemon slaying, supplementing their rad-grenades and phospex with true-silver flechettes and thrice-blessed promethium.

Still working on the color scheme, though.

>Note on Hammers
I imagine them making extensive use of terminators, kind of the Deathwing legion.

Related, 1d4chan has blocked my IP for whatever reason so I can't post there. Can you guys put my stuff up?

Here's some dudes for the Judgement Bringers that haven't made it up yet:
>(Panzer Kommandant) Romulus Kursk
Romulus Kursk had faithfully served the VII legion since the earliest days, rising to command of the Armored Division. This put him in a singularly difficult position when Enoch assumed command of the legion.
Where formerly Romulus had fought mobile campaigns and heavily employed mechanized infantry, Enoch increasingly made use of artillery pieces. What proper tanks remained were employed as assault guns.
Famously, when Enoch ordered that all remaining rhinos undergo conversion to whirlwinds or razorbacks, Kursk asked his primarch how his troops were supposed to cross the battlefield.
Ever taciturn Enoch is said to have replied "You still have legs."
None the less, Kursk served competently and loyally into the Heresy, first on Luna, then elsewhere, enduring the continual diminution of his command and the ever stranger requirements of the Warmaster.
In the end, it proved too much for Kursk and he rebelled, charging that Enoch was simply the puppet of the Warmaster. After a failed attempt on Enoch's life, Kursk and his company took to the void, fighting their former brothers with an intense hatred.
It is suspected that Kursk linked up with his former comrade Baqar Hadbaal of the XIIIth during the chaos of the Heresy and was eventually granted a domain in the Eastern Imperium, but this remains unconfirmed.

>Judgement Bringers

>Helmut Von Somme, Siege Master of the Judgement Bringers
Von Somme is perhaps iconic of the post-Enoch face of the Judgement Bringers. Drawn from some unremarkable rock, Von Somme displayed a talent for siege operations that won him the regard of the VII Legion Primarch. A dark and brooding figure, unlike his close associate Chelkam Marne of the Behemoth Guard, Von Somme was notorious for his bloody assaults. Despite the often appalling death toll of his campaigns, he was well respected by his men, in part because of his insistence that he lead from the front. He believed that no man should take risks he himself would not and by the end of the crusade had extensive cybernetic augmentation.
It was he that prepared the bombardment at the Tournament, though he was deployed on Luna at the time, where his talents were in need by the Warmaster.
Von Somme took over primary command of the Siege of Luna after the Paladins rotated out and Enoch was pursuing the fleeing loyalists across the Segmentum Solar.
Across the surface of Luna, Paladin trenches were reinforced and expanded. The blood of Loyal legions had been expended to blunt the Oathsworn's might, and Von Somme planned to bleed them dry. Faustus might be a Primarch, but big guns never tire.
Thus began a period of essentially static positions on the Lunar surface, with Von Somme attempting to reduce Faustus' fortresses to rubble. This grinding attrition took its toll on both legions and as time passed, Von Somme found his authority increasingly usurped by Asuran sorcerors. Though he and his men resented the witch-kin and their daemons, their loyalty to Enoch and the Warmaster was unshakable. When tempers flared, Von Somme reminded his men of their duty and the attrition campaign continued.
At the VIth Battle of Tycho Rim Von Somme was killed leading a charge against a fortified position.

In the wake of his death, several companies mutinied, tired of shedding their blood for esoteric goals that they had no stake in. In a cruel twist of fate, it was Enoch himself who arrived to put down these mutinies. Though his sons immediately surrendered to his will, the Warmaster ordered him, on the advice of Anshul, to massacre them anyways, so as to complete the ritual sacrifices required to summon forth the hosts of daemons.
Enoch informed the mutineers of their fate and carried out their judgement.
From that day forth, Enochs judgement was ever the Warmaster's.

Are the primarch relation matrices saved somewhere or do i need to go archive diving?

Go fish. Though some of them are out of date, particularly Gengrat.

>Gengrat and friends, the redux

>Bloodhounds
All the pompousity and ceremony takes all the fun out of the hunt. There's nothing civilized in running down xenos with packs of vorax, but that's the joy of it.

>Warhawks
Raydon, we have a navy for that. There's a lot of other things you could be doing that would be way more useful.

>Fists of Mars
Heeey Brother. That's a cool thing your making. Oh dear Omnissiah, what are you doing. Machine canon? Free your mind!! The spirit speaks to us all!! You walk the path of stagnation!!
The Fists are the Behemoth Guard's estranged cousins, enslaved to a nonsensical doctrine of death. There's some antipathy and jealousy of the Fist's favor, but mostly they want to free them.

>Silver Spears
Even more pompous than the Bloodhounds.

>Warp Raiders
They're fey fickle creatures. Not quite to be trusted, and yet, they know things.

I need to finish one for Sarco.

Seems fine. Admittedly only skimmed it. It might be worth identifying what would he different. The naming conventions alone fit nicely into the jade empire. But that doesn't mean they cant be in the imperium minor which is closest to the Tau.

Also the ties ins to the Ecclessarchy and sisters.might need a work around. But otherwise good stuff.

I have some saved. Not sure how dated they are. The only one i knows up to date is the hawk one.

Will post tonight when i knock off.

Who fills the role of emperors executioners in this canon.

It seems bloodhounds have the kill hungry attitude by otherwise arent suspicious or insular like the wolves. So who seems naturally predicated to watching for corruption within?

It actually is the Bloodhounds. They get sent after Rubinek and Oramar. They're less executioners than hunters though.

Much like Russ, Balthasar keeps up the great tradition of being the Emperor's executioner yet getting rekt in basically every duel with another Primarch.

Isn't Leman supposed to be reponsible for the destruction of the II and XI legions though?

They might get the job at the end of the day. But assuming each primarch had an intent behind them. Who was intended to do it. Bloodhounds seem like a fix rather than the ideal.

Rubinek maybe? His dogged tenacity could be useful for it.

Aodhan or Klaus? They're the killiest personally.

Maybe it was Anders, and Emps never counted on him being raised by loving parents into not a horrible psycho.

Shit maybe it was Alexios? He clearly didn't come out right.

Maybe he was meant to be the stronkest Primarch, but the rigors of the Warp turned him weak and frail in comparison to the others.

Klaus and aodhan seem more like inspirational characters than executioners or assassins.

Alexios seems to have to world builder gene. I guess anders maybe.

One of them is described on the wiki as the Emperors shadow. Maybe them?

That was Raydon. And an early title. Im not sure he would fit much to the themes of an executioner. Though he is pretty assassin-ey. Because while he is suspicious of almost everyone. He doesnt look kindly to the idea of infighting. Until the heresy that is. Then its balls to the walls murder town.

>Isn't Leman supposed to be reponsible for the destruction of the II and XI legions though?
I see the Iron Hearts and the Warp Raiders as those two purged legions' equivalents in our setting, the empty plinths in the hall on Terra. Except in our setting, the purges fail because muh primarchs.

Balthasar is the executioner. He's sent to purge the Iron Hearts for being hereteks and the Warp Raiders for xenos witchcraft. He's the son the Emperor depends on to keep the others in line.

The Bloodhounds, to me, are what the World Eaters would have been without the butcher's nails. They're warriors thoroughly devoid of moral compunctions of any kind. The Emperor says kill, and they kill.

What does Balthasar or the bloodhounds do to 'keep everyone in line' though.

> He's sent to purge the Iron Hearts for being hereteks and the Warp Raiders for xenos witchcraft

Yeah thats my point. He doesnt keep people in line. They respond to people outside of the lines.

The way it was phrased made it seem like they were a means of prevention. Especially since they are sent twice so they dont even work as a deterrent

ok

To be fair, there's countless timelines in which things work as intended, but in those, there's no heresy. Our systems are naturally dysfunctional in some ways.

And now back to updating Gengrat.
>Storm Hammers
Sturdy, dependable, resolute. If only they didn't look at us like we were insane.

>Judgement Bringers
Enoch is a needy failure of a Primarch and his sons are no better. Romulus Kursk was the only one with any understanding of the good things in life, but Enoch stole his tanks. Typical Enoch.

>Void Lords
'Oh... what is this? I think... I think he hears the voices! Want to... go unleash tanks and robots on our enemies, little brother?'

>Oathsworn
Dependable allies, but too secretive on the genetech.

Continue dammit.

Sorry, working on an outline for a paper on Neo-Assyrian Imperial Ideology.

Right

>Paladins of Kor
A bunch of asses. People die in a war. You save lives by ending it quickly and making the thought of another too terrible to contemplate.
"Anders, sweet Anders. You march to the thud of mortars and the shriek of shells. You have. I know you have. I have seen you stride amid the slain, through barrages, dripping crimson. Do you mean to tell me you do not enjoy it, down in your deepest self? That down where hypocrisy has no lease, you do not listen to the music of the guns?
They speak to all of us, Anders and those who listen and learn are made wise. But more than that, dear brother, their thump and thunder echo our own hearts. You embrace everything but yourself, brother and in that embrace, you strangle your spirit."

>Second Sons
True comrades. Someday they'll learn to smile.

>Angels of Light
Alexios and his legion are cold, calculating, and cruel. Unfortunately they are bound by dogma and thus cannot hear the spirit. This said, there's a lot of respect, but little love.
The Behemoth Guard work well with the Angels, but chafe under their rigid demands.
Personally, Gengrat finds Alexios' dispassionate attitude puzzling. All work and no play make Alexios a dull boy.

>Sky Serpents
I know you hear the voices. I have seen the way you cast down your foes. Why do you resist? Listen to them and you and I could carve a bloody path across this galaxy. It will be beautiful.

The legions work well together, but bring out the darker side of the Sky Serpents.
Personally, Gengrat finds Xun's ability to mask his darker urges fascinating.

>Arms of Asura
Listen to the voices, Anshul. They're the heartbeat of creation, the screaming of the Damned and the songs of the neverborn. Tranquility is the thin ice over the roiling depths of passion. How is it that in your immersion in lore that you have never walked the paths into the underworld and seen what lies beyond and inside yourself?
There will be a moment of thunder, brother, when you will see what writhes in the depths, why serpents are always in the deeps, and the turmoil and seething depths will overflow.

I really need to rework that into something nice, but basically, Gengrat sees Anshul as looking everywhere but himself. When he does that and finds the chaos within, Gengrat expects he will be a lot of fun. Assuming we're still going with the idea that Anshul sees Tzneetch as the highest emanation of chaos, the two probably get along pretty well after the heresy. Anshul probably finds the Behemoth Guard obsession with machines a bit weird, as is their tendency to put daemons in machines.

Legion to legion, the Behemoth Guard probably sees them as a curiosity, but not much fun until those guys... the pyromaniacs that someone wrote up. I don't see it on the wiki.
Anyways, as they get into that, the Behemoth Guard warm up to them, seeing in their mysticism a reflection of their own technoccult beliefs.

>Eyes
Never talking, always listening. Worthy of respect, but never quite trustworthy.

>Iron Hearts
Who?
Oh shit, they're awesome. But why so serious?
>After meeting them
Dang. And they call me a freak? Fuck them!

>Scions
Chill out. You're almost as bad as Aodhán.

>Negators
Yes, Aodhán, it is better to rule in hell than serve in heaven. Yes, Aodhán, we do love our work. But Aodhán, why do you fight?
That's your chain.

Legion to legion, the Behemoth Guard cannot figure out what the Negators have against tanks. They do appreciate the Negator's flamboyant style and appreciation of the Behemoth Guard's works. A Negator may talk your ear off about what he killed yesterday, but he appreciates craftsmanship, and that's a rare virtue.

>Knights Exemplar
Honorable beyond reproach. Dependable allies. Klaus sets himself against a dark universe and we all respect that.
Too bad they cannot join the Warmaster.

So back to
>Thane Othel the Wroth and the Ravens of Morgas
In many ways, the stories of the Ravens of Morgas and their Thane, Othel the Wroth are inseparable.
Drawn from the Nordafrik hives on Terra itself, Othel established a reputation for himself on Desdemona Prime, where his company was instrumental in breaking the nexus of enemy resistance in the capital city, deploying the then new Terminator Armor via Teleportarium, one of the first known such strikes. There they slew the strange biomechanical overlords, with Othel supposedly strangling the Overlord after the power to his fist's disruption field failed.

This established a reputation for skill in the termination of extremis level threats, which in turn lead to further specialization. Destroyer cohorts were collected under Othel's banner, and by the time of Rangda, they bore the sigil of the black raven of Morgas, a death goddess of old legend.
Thus it was, still fresh from the hellscapes of the Rangdan Xenocide, that Othel met his primarch.

(I'm thinking they get along pretty well, and Othel is decently respected in the legion, one of the higher ranking captains, with his blunt aggression at odds with the honorable veneer of the legion. Most observers attribute this to the nature of the Raven's foes, but it goes a bit deeper than that.
Some cool stuff happens at Murder, heresy stuff, and then post heresy, Othel tells Alexios where he can shove his codex.)

On the subject of love for legions, what do people think of:

>Nofr'atos the Traveller
Like so many of his brothers, Nofr'atos stands in shadows dark as his plate. What is known for certain is that Nofr'atos was a captain in the favor of his lord, Graha'Nak. Stranded in the Sol Sector during the heresy, Nofr'atos lead the capture of the Second Sons world killer, Terminus Est.
With this ship at the head of his small armada, Nofr'atos embarked on a self appointed mission of justice, razing the world that had betrayed their oaths to the Emperor. In particular, his Castigation of 3.27.3 stands as an example of the chaos of the Heresy. (It's something like Mor's assault on Bodt.)
To this day, the Terminus Est is said to appear suddenly from the depths of the warp to pass judgement with strange and ancient bioweapons. Rumor suggests that an Oathsworn detachment protected during their censure by Nofr'atos provide these, but the survivors of the Terminus Est's revelations are seldom in a state to provide much detail, though legends of a figure in dark cataphractii plate, with a cape of human skin and a massive, bone handled scythe, descending amid shells that render life down to sludge to dispense personal judgement and the enlightenment of terror abound.

The capture of the Terminus Est is itself part of a series of naval actions across the Segmentum Solar, the campaigns of the so called Lost-- legionary battle groups dispatched on Oathsworn censure tasks or xenos compliance actions that found themselves suddenly alone in a galaxy gone mad.

>Deathwing Legion
Bulk terminator legion was already done in the Knights Exemplar.

>Othel tells Alexios where he can shove his codex.
Not necessary, as was clarified last thread the codex isn't as much a military book as a religious one.

Question.
Whats with the prevalence of rad and bio weapons in this setting? do all the authors just have a hard on for it? I get that there is a legion that has that as 'there thing' but this seems to be that and then some.

Might be good to get back on the beast or to discuss some crusade era campaigns.

We should also put up the concensus on the Storm Hammers legion culture.
Wanna do up a Behemoth Guard and Asura one?

There's also a Raiders, Serpents, Asura one.
Behemoth Guard and Serpents
Fists and Behemoth
Scions, Spears, and Negators
Serpents and Angels
Graha'Nak and basically anyone

Ullanor, who is there, again?

>the codex isn't as much a military book as a religious one.
What? No, that was a misapprehension raydanon had. Alexios' Codex Astartes is not a religious text, it's a Codex Astartes, a text on warfare using spess mureenz.

Phew. Back at last.

>census on the Storm Hammers legion culture.
I see them as proto-vikings. A culture that values decisive action more than pure aggressiveness. Has a code of honour in that it respects those strong.

>They are proud and willful but they are true-hearted, generous in thought and deed, bold but not cruel, wise but unlearned, writing no books but singing many songs.

A military textbook that doesn't actually provide doctrinal guidance.

Is it just me or has this thread not done much today? Seems largely like its at where I left it.

I don't think we need a winged primarch, I mean, if he is winged thats cool and all, but we shouldn't just add one because we feel we need to.

>that doesn't actually provide doctrinal guidance.
literally where did you get that idea?

Ah, whoops. I think we need to clear up what the Storm Hammers do, since I've been picturing drop pods and terminator teleportation. Then again, there's room for terminators in a few places.

>Rad weapons
I think it's a hard on thing. They're one of the cool things about the 30k setting and since every legion has destroyer cadres, they show up. Personally, I think the way destroyer cadres are treated tells us a lot about legions-- are they punishments, honors, the dumping grounds for the weirdos, etc.
It's one of the factors, like the use of tanks and assault squads.
As a result, I think most of these legions have some sort of kill it all and call it a day group. With the Ravens of Morgas, it's specifically about slaying big monsters and the way I imagine them doing that is with nasty rad and chem weapons and massive tempest hammers.

Sarco's Ash Walkers, on the other hand are a heresy Era group dealing with the logic of dreadnoughts and embrace all these weapons along with the flamer, since the flesh is weak.

Sky Serpents Jaguar Warriors use specifically rad-grenades and missiles as a means of crowd control, but it's also because I imagine those as potent tools for dealing with really nasty shit, similar to the Ravens.

Nofr'atos is just the loyal version of Typhus and I figured that a Void Lord was the best fit.

I think the other part of it is that the Oathsworn are a major legion and advise other legions in matters of bioweapons, so they're generally more available.

This said, there's a few examples of big deal Destroyer formations in the OU-- Nemesis Chapter and Dreadwing come to mind most immediately.

Now that you've got me thinking about this and I warn you I am sleep deprived and mildly inebriated, I don't think bio, chem, and rad weapons are universally employed with the same frequency.

>Bloodhounds
>Negators
Probably enjoy hitting things too much

Spears keep it restricted to specialists.

>Paladins
>Knights
Probably too dirty for them

Wasn't being serious, just poking fun at the idea that doctrine is meant to be the common frame of reference for the military, but most if not all factions who follow it modify it.

We're talking about multiple independent militaries though. The Codex Astartes' is Alexios' combat doctrine. Alexios is pretty damn good at combat doctrine, so the tome is studied by strategists even if they don't follow it with the zealous idolatry that the Angels do.

Personally rad/bio weapons just have very little appeal to me. So its hard for me to understand why others are attracted to it.

But as you say, almost everyone has at least some destroyers. The other side of that coin is that, in 40k timelines they no longer exist for a reason.

>Storm Hammers
IIRC they are more of an armoured assault group. Drop pods, Land Raiders, Razor Backs etc. But ofcourse they use terminators as well. Like destroyers everyone has some, its more the amount that makes

>multiple independent militaries though.
Yeah, doctrine covers that. IRL NATO for example uses common doctrine people are trained on before deployments (especially if it differs from normal SOPs) In the OU though, its obviously simpler because gorrillaman supposedly perfects the study of warfare to the point where if you hit a snag you just look it up in the tome and it provides a conceptual answer.

To be clear, the comment was (perhaps a bad) joke, the terminology doesnt precisely carry over from real life to 40k.

Have you read the art of war, it sounds more like an art of war proxy than it does military doctrine in the conventional sense.

Who else...

Warhawks, Raiders, Eyes, Iron Hearts have no special attachment to any of it, I'd think.

Behemoth Guard, Judgement Bringers use the nasty stuff the same way that the Iron Warriors do.

Second Sons are just all over it.

Oathsworn use bioweapons and make them for others.

I assume the Fists use rad weapons because the flesh is weak.

Angels of Light and Serpents use the weapon to get the job done, though I imagine the Serpents are a bit more flamer happy.

So I'm thinking that really bioweapons are limited to the Second Sons and Oathsworn. Chemical weapons have a bit of a wider spread, but are mostly a Second Sons thing, while light radiation is decently widespread, but the Second Sons are the only ones dropping nukes like fat rhymes.
Phosphex is similarly limited, I think.

There's exceptions, of course, I think every legion needs a beast hunter bunch, who would naturally tend to use poisons and toxins, but now that I think about it, I suppose I see restricted rad weapon use as part of the normal legion equipment, particularly since the Mechanicum has rad weapons out the ass. They're the baseline scifi horror weapon, with stuff like Phosphex and things we need to imagine being the realm of really fucked up shit that the Second Sons use.

>rad weapons
I'm more interested in the rad weapons. I think it's because of their debuff effect and I like the idea of astartes striding through toxic clouds to do battle with xenos horrors. I think it's the idea that if you need to field these weapons with catastrophic collateral damage, then the threat must be enormous.
I like the idea of these absolutely massive battles against foes that make a Nid hive fleet look like a slight bug problem and the idea that the battlefield is made into a hell beyond human tolerance really sells it.
It's like that moment on the tabletop when you blast a carnifex with a rad-missile and then proceed to slay it in hand to hand. You have to weaken them to even have a chance.
Similarly, the idea that the scale of the conflict is such that you have to poison the world itself to thin the enemy ranks suggests to me warfare on an ungraspably Apocalyptic scale. It sends it back into the realm of myth.

More prosaically, I like WWI, which is part of the allure of the Judgement Bringers, hence Helmuth Von Somme

>astartes striding through toxic clouds to do battle with xenos horrors
Okay I think I see the appeal. That is awesome imagery.

>the idea that the scale of the conflict is such that you have to poison the world itself to thin the enemy ranks
This not so much, this to me is why Astartes are a thing to begin with. Like the enemy is so insanely dangerous regular humans just can't beat it. So you send in the Astartes.

(yawn) hey I'm back. A wedding happened. Not mine. Anything cool happen?

Not.much the thread has been pretty dead today.

Some discussion of legion cultures was occuring but everyone seemed to disappear.

Alexios and Raydonanon were having another go at each other. For like the 1000th time.

Apart from that nothing new.

No primarch, but how the Black Suns warband views outsiders:
>Bloodhounds
Close to the truth, yet blinded by the hunt. Soon they will know what must happen.
>Warhawks
Potential wasted, for the abyss sees no difference between man and Marine.
>Fists of Mars
Fist of steel, mind of metal. They lack perspective, even as they master the laws of reality.
>Silver Spears
Specialists, gazers of the past, a threat. Yet only for one who wages the kind of war they know.
>Warp Raiders
Brethren. Competitors. Danger to the cause. Knowledgeable of the other reality, but ignorant of our secrets... For now.
>Storm Hammers
Simple, efficient, frail in their humanity. Let go. Embrace the madness and join us.
>Void Lords
Yes... Embrace the insanity. Soon you will be ready.
>Oathsworn
Their knowledge could benefit us, but stuck in the memories of past glory.

> Soon they will know what must happen.
which is?
>for the abyss sees no difference between man and Marine.
huh?
>Embrace the madness
So the Black Suns know and recognise they are insane? Isn't that sort of.. .sane?
>Soon you will be ready.
For?
>memories of past glory.
tragedy maybe, when were the Oathsworn ever glorious.

>Paladins of Kor
We cannot cooperate before you understand that death is but a door. The possibilities are endless.
>Second Sons
Blind to the cycle, worshippers of its creators. It is time to end the cycle of Chaos, brothers. Not to repeat it.
>Angels of Light
Drunken by speed, blinded by past.
>Sky Serpents
You are ready. Stop resisting, brothers.

>Probably enjoy hitting things too much

Yeah to an extent. Negators do use a lot of specialized ammo and such, and they're not really averse to shooting, but they consider rad weapons unsporting.

Things like Vengeance and Hellfire rounds are more their speed.

>which is?
Unleashing the horror behind Tyrant Star upon reality
>Huh?
They consider having astartes pilot ships wasting the value of their strength and skill at arms (even as fighters and ships take more skill than sword)
>So the Black Suns know and recognize they are insane? Isn't that sort of... Sane?
They are contradictory like the object of their worship: Black sun shining blindingly bright white light, yet illuminates not.
>For?
Joining the Black Suns' quest tobl bringing about the end to reality as we know it, a darkness even daemons fear.
>Tragedy maybe, when were the oathsworn ever glorious
Unless I'm sorely mistaken, they still defend Emperor's vision, which the Black Suns consider a dead dream that could have never been.

>use a lot of specialized ammo and such
>Vengeance and Hellfire rounds are more their speed.

Should probably note that Vengeance rounds are created by the Hawks, and probably wouldn't be available to traitor forces. Whats the traitor version, banestrike?

Yeah, Banestrike rounds are literally the same thing mechanically.

That said, Negators equip themselves via a mixture of piracy and Commorrite industry, so they probably have a mixture of all sorts of patterns floating around. Warbands that regularly steal Storm Kingdoms stuff would be more likely to be using Vengeance rounds, while warbands that spend more of their time picking on Dark Imperium Forge Worlds for whatever reason will probably have Banestrike stuff.

They may have developed some quirky pattern using Commorrite plasma or dark matter tech, but many warbands spend most of their time out in space kicking people's stuff over, so that kind of thing might not be seen as often.

The enemy. They steal our knowledge, and want the Herald's worlds.
>Iron Hearts
Their technological understanding could become a threat, should they gain hold of what we have found.
>Undying Scions
Mighty warriors, yet unfit for the universe that will be.
>Negators
Possible allies, even if their association with the Eldar makes them a potential threat
>Knights Exemplar
Potential exists, but for now they are only a distant threat.

The first segment was supposed to be
>Eyes of the Warmaster
The enemy. They steal our knowledge, and want the Herald's worlds.

Did you ever decide on which one of 49595693 you like? The Black Suns might not be a legion, but I'll add them to the list anyway.

Right now, we have description for Balthasar, Raydon, Oramar, Graha'nak, Alexios, Xun, Aodhán and Klaus. So does anyone have a primarch to add, or should I start asking for them specifically?

I meant this post .

>A black circle haloed with sickly white ring
>A chalice, colouration of which is currently undecided
>A blood red symbol, reminiscent of a bird's clawmarks or a trident, three lines pointing downwards and one up
>Markings that only become visible when light hits them at just the right angle, or when it is dark
>A mix of two or more of the above
From these, the chalice and the "clawmarks" would be my personal favorites. Maybe it should a silver chalice with the crimson clawmark on it.

Cool, added it.

Fuck it, let's get some Rubinek up in this shit.

For much of his time in the Emperor's service, Rubinek's brothers knew the Primarch only as a hulking, half-hunched figure, towering in stature despite his stooped posture and clad in a thickly-layered shell of bronze armour, his solemn helm (think 7 here) crusted with lines of verdigris and streaked with oxidization.

It was only after the discovery of his heretek ways that Rubinek revealed his true nature. His baled head is wracked with scars, and criss-crossed by lines of insidious silver, the technology of the Iron Heart insinuating itself throughout his physiology. His deep, heavy brow is set in a perpetual frown, and his wide jaw rarely strays far from a grimace. The strange energies of the archeotect implant in the place of his heart smoulder in his eyes turning them into gleaming, fiery coals, burning with an ever-present resentment for the universe and its misdeeds against him.

His thick, broad arms are sinewed with lengths of metal and his breast concaves inward grotesquely, the Iron Heart bare for all to see at the center of the horrific injury, its metallic arteries shuddering as they pump life-giving energies through Rubinek's mutant body.

>(think 7 here)

Uh, here, that is.

I'm retarded.

If I were the Emperor, I'd have gotten rid of him too.

Aaaawwwww hell yeah.

I'm imagining the Silver flows and pulses with a strange red glow beneath his skin.

If you want to give Graha'nak any sort of strange mutation, a monsterous tail would be more fitting.
Actually, why doesn't he at least have a whip? That seems like a good weapon for him.

Don't bully the Rubinek.

Yessss.

Who else needs a description? I know Kashaln is basically Ravana as a Space Marine. I always see Engerand as Thor as played by Sean Bean.

Enoch's an angry bald dude with manlet issues.

A tail probably would be more fitting.

When I statted him I gave him a wrist mounted harpoon thing so he can snatch people out of squads and reel them off into the dark. I imagine Void Lords Terminators use a similar device, both for picking out choice targets and for boarding actions.

Imagine it. Void Lords ship shoots Terminators at an enemy vessel, they hook on, reel themselves in, and tear their way inside. Or they move across the hull, tearing open choice sections, grabbing victims and dragging them out into the void, before moving on.

Awww fuck yes.

Wrist mounted harpoons for once you're on board to move in low g rapidly or to impale foes.
But damn, terminators zipping around on grappling hooks?

Though if Graha'Nak has a tail and chitin, wouldn't he be pushing the bounds of toleration?

There's still quite a few we need proper descriptions for.
>Marcus Sinistrum
>Kashaln
>Engerand
>Enoch
>Faustus
>Anders Kor
>Saul Sheridan
>Gengrat
>Anshul
>REDACTED (I've taken to calling him Redac, dunno)
>Sarco

Yeah, the Void Lords are crazy cool and the wrist mounted grappling hooks are awesome.
It's just that grappling hooks don't make for very good melee weapon. Judging from his stats, he has a chainfist/lightning claw combo, but a whip could be an excelent mid-range option.

I'm not really in favor of giving him a tail, I'd prefer to give him a whip, like I said above. I primarily meant to say that a pair of wings don't really make sense and that a tail would be better than that.

Wew that's quite a few Primarchs.

Anyway, I like the idea of a whip, but whenever I've been writing stats I've tried to keep the Primarchs' weapons of choice as distinct as possible. Oramar is already Mr. Whippington.

I'll get to writing Engerand and Anshul.

Hm. Isn't Oramar's whip of Eldar origin? That would make it fast and light.
Graha'nak's whip could maybe be more like a flail, much heavier and more brutal.

I think I've decided for good that Saul will be black.

But I'm still not sure. To me he's kind of a faceless entity. Someone whose face is always in shadow, or seen from behind, or obscured by his general's cap.

I like the idea of him being a black guy, brings some variety into the mix.

Try to think of any sort of feature he might have in your mind, from his eyes to his (facial) hair.
Then maybe someone who can properly write these descriptions (so not me) can take a swing at him?

>Harpoons and melee
Well, depending on how crazy we want this, the harpoon heads could be mag-locking or have drill bits. It it a magnetic deal, then it would be simple bought to have a nasty melee blade and drills that can bore through bulkheads will fuck you up.
If we want Graha'Nak to walk that train line between awesome and bad anime character we could have him fight with his harpoon blades, perhaps something like "the talons" which would be some sort of nightmarish lightning claws that could be launched with chain fist blades in the palms.

The other option and what I was imagining for the terminators in general was a gauntlet mounted hook where the chain blade on a chain fist would be. If this is the case, then the fist will likely have industrial drill bits or a cutting torch over the fingers. I'll doodle some various "boarding claws" and see what results we get.

Alright, good luck, sounds fantastic.

VANTH, is there some way to see all of the Primarch stats? This is kind of why I wantedto set up a Google Drive or something similar, to share files such as those.

I was thinking Graha'nak does most of his ripping and tearing with his turboclaw thing, with the harpoon mostly a ranged weapon, but he could easily use the blade to parry and get quick jabs in during duels.

I was actually imagining these Terminator squads would have these as their primary shooty weapons, and then chainfists or power claws for slicing their way into stuff. On the tabletop they'd have a mechanic where the harpoons have the Haywire function, to represent them administering a sudden EM pulse on impact, to shut down vehicles before reeling them in. If one harpoon for every Hull Point a vehicle has hits, they can drag it 2D6+4 (mehreen str) toward them. Imagine it from the crew's perspective - you suddenly hear the sound of tearing metal, and the lights all go out in your vehicle. While you're scrabbling to get things working again, your stomach lurches suddenly, and you realize that your tank is being physically dragged toward something...

I donno to be honest. I didn't do all of them. I have Engerand, Oramar, and Enoch in the works at the moment. If you want I can post all the ones I've made so far.

I'd prefer if he were to use the harpoon as his primary melee weapon, instead of the claws. The claws are awesome, and he should definitely have them, but the Void Lords already have to put effort into differentiating themselves from the Night Lords, and their Primarch also using the claw does not help towards doing that.

I'd love it if you could post them. I'll try to get all of those together as well.

Wait, Curze has lightning claws? I thought he had... Predator-Batman sorta wrist blades.

Starting statdump. A few of these have errors that I'll be changing. Some just need to be trimmed down a bit.

...

Did someone make stats for Sarco at one point? I'd do it myself but I don't play 30k and I don't really know the 40k rules that well either.