If you're designing a muscle suit that can be used as a self contained environment how would use design the feet...

If you're designing a muscle suit that can be used as a self contained environment how would use design the feet? As strange of a question as it may seem what would be the advantage/disadvantage of the "foot' glove design in general military application?

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I would use a normal goddamn shoe because I'm not a disgusting barbarian.

On a more agreeable note, I'd probably go in for the Japanese separated-toe design. There's no reason you'd need each individual toe separated - human feet don't "grip" with them. Have the big toe separate and the rest together.

There isn't a good way to do it. In fact, it's a very serious engineering problem with no clear answer.

>human feet don't "grip" with them
That's only true for westerners with stubby toes, and who wear sports shoes everywhere.
Years of martial arts training have taught me that you actually DO grip with your toes.
Even when you're wearing boots, because your feet aren't clamped down tight inside them.

The wearer's feet would be contained in a regular shoe-shaped bit, but the 'feet' of the suit would have splayed toes for more grip, more akin to a gecko than a human, and you can have anchoring spikes in the toes.

I'm not a podiatrist, but I'm guessing there's a good reason we kept our toes separated when we evolved to stand upright, even though toes are really vulnerable this way.

Well its because they evolved from hands. The actual FUNCTION of all your toes minus your big toe is to essentially act as one "slab", that provides traction and counterbalance. The big toe moves separately because it's stronger and has more flexibility for balance.

Clearly, you are also not a podiatrist.

Yeah that good reason is 'there is no reason for that to happen without fairly intense selection pressure for club feet'

Evolution only cares about 'good enough'.

Quads of truth. We don't need to breathe through the same tube we swallow through, but for evolution, it's "good enough".

Self contained environment suit? I'd want the bits that are in contact with the most surfaces to have the strongest protection and most damage resistance. "Foot gloves" are soft, thin, and full of complicated extra wear points that are just begging for a puncture. Give me a steel toe over reinforced soles.

Muscle suit for every toe would be largely useless and possibly even detramental, as current toeshoes kinda fuck up the feet because they space toes awkwardly with the additional bulk.

The big toe, which has the most muscle, could be musclesuited to some effectiveness, but the middle three are all slaved onto the same set of muscles. The pinky toe however does have its own dedicated structure, since it plays the major role of our outer balance support.

So, musclesuit for the big toe, and a specialized tight shared sock for the rest with the sciencefibers enforcing the middle toes as a whole and extra enforcing along the top and outside of the pinky.

Sports shoes designs really did ruin a lot of things. And to think they were designed the way they were because the creator truly, honestly believed that having his heel be raised a couple inches higher would give him a head start

>Years of martial arts training have taught me that you actually DO grip with your toes.
what martial art uses toes to grip with?

Sports shoes ruined some things but having a raised heel isn't one of its crimes. Flat foot walking and running is no bueno, even the fucking medieval shoemakers knew this and integrated raised heels into boots.

I thought that was for vocalization so we share a tube for greater airflow and range

Karatoe, Toe-fu, Toejitsu etc

Any martial art that requires you to stand.

But that's not gripping in the same way hands grip. The minor toes all grip together to provide balance. it's not like you're GRABBING things with your feet.

When did op mention anything about grabbing?
He said grip, I said grip, you said grip.

You grip. End of story

Fair point, I admit to derp on that.

Shoejitsu

I open doors with my bare feet if I have my hands full at home. Bit awkward at first, but when you know to twist your body with your leg, it's not difficult. But I also have semi long toes. My second toe is longer than my big toe

The importance in positioning of the toes comes up more or less when kicking as you don't want to damage your toes as you're kicking someone

Well, practically all martial arts use leverage from the ground in order to deliver their power. The old adage to that is "a warrior's strength flows from the Earth." I know ninjutsu uses the toes a lot more but that's more so they can have an easier time running around on unstable surfaces rather than fighting, because most of ninjutsu is the art of how not to fight.

Technically speaking, evolution only cares about "Doesn't matter, had sex".

For real?

what you're forgetting is evolution isn't working towards an end result. it's just muddling the limb towards something more suited to biped locomotion stuff like shoes willl reduce the selective pressure, as we're coming up with solutions faster than evolution can keep up.

that was an unexpected bonus of a lousy ferature,so it stuck.

Wrong. if the result of the sex isn't going to result in offspring that have the resources and protection to repeat the procedure, then it's no good.

Or you know, you could just have 100s of kids per reproductive cycle and zerg rush. whatever works.

I mean - he's right. Non-helpful random mutations get selected against by the individuals not surviving to mating age. If a "negative" mutation isn't negative enough to prevent reproduction, it wont disappear until it start impacting survival rates to mating age.

Sorry, I should have elaborated.

Let's say for example, two males are squaring off over the opportunity to mate with a female, but it's been a bad season (for whatever reason. climate, disease, etc.) that's resulted in reduced resources, and a lower chance of survival for any offspring, and fighting for the mating rights could result in a serious injury.

It's better to capitulate in those circumstances and not mate, but not risk injury, and just try again when the odds are more in favour of the offspring survival.

I know it's a specific scenario, but this is part of evolutionary game theory, Specifically, hawk-dove models.

So in those circumstances, 'didn't matter' had sex doesn't hold true.

and some maths, if you're interested.

not my work, just googled something more detailed because I don't wanna write an essay here.

Didn't those things cause serious foot problems?

bugger, forgot the link

college.holycross.edu/faculty/kprestwi/behavior/ESS/HvD_intro.html

Oddly this is what I love about Veeky Forums. A thread about foot glove vs. boot design for muscles suits turns into a discussion on evolution.

only if you walk on weird surfaces.

they're actually better for your feet.

...unless you're like me and have fallen arches or similar issues...

Anything other than capoeira, because you've got to grip the goddamn floor somehow.

That too. Toes are delicate.
So are fingers, as I learned last week.