Spelljammer 5e ideas maybe?

Bows made from high tech smart materials and exotic body parts ike the ligiments of some creature or something that then use high tech/magitech holographic sights to improve aim and choose how the arrow works (exlosive, elemental, poisoned, etc)

Elven spaceships made out of trees and giant Fey space butterflies, whales, sharkes, etc

Familiars that can transform/shapeshift into armor and weapons

Wizards who have to be put into special rooms on the ship to use their magic as artillerty

maybe advanced elves? Like a WH40K eldar theme. It could be like they are the original elves who seeded elves on all the material worlds. Mix a combination of nature magic with some sci fi doodads, the magic could be fluffed as bio-tek if desired. Like big plant based ships shooting energy blasts.

Not very scary though.

Vampire Space Elves with an Aztec/Egyptian meets Cenobite aesthetic. Get a Chariots of the Gods kind of story going instead of the standard Imperial Elven Navy going around protecting elf kind from UnHumans.

Or maybe the Imperial Space Elves are still around but try and keep these ancient undead menaces a secret?

Anyway, blood magic and sacrifice culture. Spreading their blight and showing the living the endless sensation and absolution.

In my last 4th edition campaign, I was basically going to do an alien invasion story with aberration type monsters being the main villains. Their foot soldiers were going to be shardminds. I love the idea of semi-sentient drone-like crystal people

I know EXACTLY what system I'd post if OP hadn't mandated 5e.

1d4chan.org/wiki/Dungeons:_the_Dragoning_40,000_7th_Edition
But no one plays it anyway.

In ANY case...

>Abstract semi-sentient paradoxes of clashing rules of reality, hostile towards anything attempting to resolve them and capable of removing things from existence
>Demilich necromancers whose ships are giant artifices of bone and ligament, capable of transforming into oversized undead constructs for battle and reaving the living
>Thought Eaters whose astral vessels, powered by the shattered psyches they tear from us mere mortals, are able to induce mass hysteria and insanity without approaching the Physical Realms
>The Slime from Beyond the Stars
>Psychic ThatGuy neckbeards capable of mentally rewriting others to agree with their twisted lines of thought

Highly Militarized and Caste System following Giants with little understanding or exposure to culture.

View the idea of artistic expression as strange, but oddly fascinating.

You definitely need to have an Event Horizon type scenario.

Also, I went into Spelljammer thinking it was good based on people's comments. It's absolute horseshit. It's so shit.
You may as well just brew your own thing.

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I agree that a lot is dumb. I'm probably gona toss the cyrstal spheres, and use planets in space. Spelljammers are basically just airships that can go fast. Maybe they "warp" through the astral plane. I want to keep the cultures and species of spelljammer though even if I toss the crystal spheres.

Haha we actually have played DTD 40k 7th ed before. It's sorta fun but a bit too much sometimes. Also I don't like the exaltation mechanics. I've always thought it has potential though. I sadly admit that I used to cehck lawful nice's webpage regularly to see if he would ever update again. Its been years and no update.

Also there was some guy on the homebrew zetaboards who said he was going to mix The Haarlock's Legacy (Dark Heresy)
Chaos Factor (World of Darkness)
Die, Vecna, Die (AD&D 2nd Ed)

into one adventure for DTD. It never happened :(

These might be good for you.

suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/12430453/
suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/36902382/
suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/6312668/
suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/27938758/

I was gunna run a spell jammer game a while ago but I got massively stuck during the world building process.

one of the encounters I was planning on having was essentially that giant hermit crab thing from deluvian. I don't have the webm on hand but its essentially some giant hermit crab that's using a ship as a shell. Was gunna give it limited control of the ship as if it was operating the helm.

another already built encounter from the original spelljammer is a dwarf fortress. Massive keeps built in to asteroids. Have the players come across an empty one and try and figure out why its abandoned.

Wow user, two shitty NPCs! You've really sold me on the idea that this whole setting is beyond redemption.

I wouldn't worry about it. Plenty of people love spelljammer.

Him hating Spelljammer doesn't bother me, it's how shitty his argument is. Why go through the trouble to dredge up two obscure NPCs when there's plenty of easily mockable parts of the setting that are way more important and better known? I just... don't get it.

There's more unfortunately, but on the whole it's not particularly good. Perhaps the nostalgia are firmed fixed in place.

Babby's first sci-fi-fantasy mash-up. Dragonstar is where it's at.

>I'm itching to use the laser gun rules from the DMG
Fun fact. Many undead are vulnerable or non-resistant to radiant damage and therefore laser guns.

How about a crystal sphere of technically advanced demons?

That could be scary, especially if they are kept gory like doom demons instead of oddly nice looking like many D&D demons.

5e does need sci-fi/other genre components.

Do lasers deal radiant damage?

That's what kills me. There is no sci-fi/fantasy setting for D&D proper. Hell, even Fuck Finder has a sci-fi setting.

Yeah, and sci-fi has been such a part of D&D from its very beginnings.

at least they called out expedition to barrier peaks in the DMG. Also the player's handbook mentions some worlds of the material plane have advanced technology, so who knows, maybe we will see some.

Excellent. Apparently the sprinkling of clues/call outs in their supplements means we'll be seeing more of it in the future. This is good news.

According to 5e, yes. It's started me thinking that radiant damage is actually caused by intense UV radiation, and that paladins are walking nuclear reactors. Praise the sun.

Our god Pelor, the Burning Hate, is a benevolent god.

>Every star exploding is Pelor busting a nut
>Better hope you're not in the way of the Gamma ray burst

They don't call it a divine blast for nothing.

anti-matter rifles deal necrotic damage FYI, which is an interesting twist. Negative energy is literally negative.

Not sure if any of you guys have looked at tome of beasts, but it has some cool sci fi monsters.

That makes a lot of sense tbqh. Negative energy is meant to represent negation/oblivion/obliteration.

This is entirely to my interests. I was planning on running a similar game with a mash up of Spelljammer, Kill Six Billion Demons, and a bit of 40k.

My only issue was the existing races were too constraining

How closely are you going to stick to the Spelljammer cosmology? Are you keeping with the crystal spheres or doing away with them for just space in general?

> The creepier they are the better. I'm going for some sci fi horror here.

I'd probably just replace fantasy undead with some scifi mumbo-jumbo to facilitate the life (through robotics and biotic enhancement we've taken these previously undead beings and given them incomplete consciousness, etc).

Probably getting rid of them. Spelljammers will just be magic ships that fly through space if I get rid of them.

I personally really like the crystal spheres. For my own campaign I essentially made the phlosgiston the Warp.

Did I get drunk and make this thread last night? I just convinced my group to let me run 5e spelljammer with a horror edge to it.

I've been doing some quick reading on the setting, and I've got some questions you guys might be able to help me out with:

1. Clerics. Gods stay within their own crystal sphere, so they can't grant spells if the cleric leaves...which sucks for a spacefaring game. Anyone have any good workarounds for it? I've seen just allowing the holy symbol to act as a conduit for the god, a 2nd level spell that establishes a connection with the god for 1 week, being able to draw spells from a similar god (if you're a cleric with the war domain, any war god will grant you spells) or having to gather at least 100 worshipers so your God can influence that sphere. Ideas?

2. Spellhelms. I found stats I can use for lifehelms, forges, etc., but nothing for an actual spellhelm. I know it uses spells per day, but is it just 1 spell for 1 hour of movement? Any difference between using an 8th level spell and a 1st? How fast do these things move anyway?

For Clerics I would just ignore how their power is kept to a crystal sphere. It's just a dumb detail from 2e.

For Helms, movement didn't actually use spells per day, just using the Helm let a spellcaster control the ship, but they lost their spells for the day, no matter how long they used it. Another dumb detail.

But if the helm uses all your spells, what happens if you've cast some or all of your spells for that day? Like, if I'm a 12th level wizard, and I've cast all my 6th, 5th, and 4th level spells, there's no difference?

None, it just essentially just drains you of your magic power. You can use it for 12 hours straight before you become exhausted and can't use it, it drains all your remaining spell slots for the day, and you need to have 8 hours rest before being able to use it again.

I think I would make the map a grid and let you move X squares per spell lvl burned per day.

It seems unfair if a lvl 20 caster can't fly faster than a lvl 5 one.

Also I'm pro dropping the cleric restriction. It nerfs them, plus tiamat is in like 5 settings so it makes no sense.

Idea:
Spellhelms require attunement. They give a ship an SR equal to the highest level spell slot the caster can cast. SR then acts as a reference point for speed (I'm not sure how fast these ships are supposed to move, but a 4 should be faster than a 2), and a bonus to maneuvering.

How would one allow long distance communication in Spelljammer?

That is a good compromise. Allows stronger casters to fly faster without lots of bookkeeping

It depends if you have crystal spheres. In original spelljammer (somebody please correct me if I am wrong), the crystal spheres blocked teleportation spells and magic in general.

If you got rid of crystal spheres, you could arguably communicate across planets unless you added some implicit maximum range to spells.

Rules as written, you could really use planeshift to get to any planet (in two castings) even if there are crystal spheres. Plane shift to another plane, then planeshift back but specify the planet you are going to.

>It depends if you have crystal spheres.
I do have them, but my phlosgiston is more like the Warp than regular, so maybe shit like Message could work?

I kind of want Star Wars-esque long distance communication, with a small illusion on a circular disk sort of thing.

in original spelljammer it was the spheres themselves that blocked the spells I think. You can just ignore that though and let spells like Message work.

The Arcane could have created or found some device that allows communication through the spheres. Though, if you're running the phlogition like the Warp, it would likely distort the message in some way (which could be fun to play with...intercepting messages from 500 years ago that were just bouncing around, the message is spoken backwards, the image is a demon but it speaks and acts like the original sender, etc)

It's either this or casters can act like Astropaths?

So, monsters so far plus some more

Yuan-ti / Reptilians. They are infiltrating governments, guilds, and maybe even the crew of your ship! Part of some interplanetary conspiracy to take over the material plane. Maybe this is a fringe group of advanced Yuan-ti, which is even infiltrating other groups of Yuan-ti on each world.
Good for a conspiracy theory or they live feel.

Mindflayers:
Great classic sci fi d&d villians. Heck, the mindflayers were even introduced in expedition to barrier peaks with laser guns and grenades inside of a crashed space ship. My only gripe is that mindflayers are overused.

Lawful Good Robots:
ORGANIC LIFE IS EVIL MUST BE PURGED. I remember the epic level handbook in 3e had an adventure seed where sci fi robots attack. This could be like that. They have come from the future/deep space/alternate material plane to destroy the wickedness that is organic life.

Mi-Go:
These guys are in Tome of Beasts (3rd party), and based on cthulhu mythos . Plant based aliens that steal brains, harvest life forms, wield advanced technology, and fly through space. A great fit honestly, although brain stealing is overdone.

Neogi:
Classic spelljammer villains. I never found them that scary though.

Tsochari: From 3e lords of madness. Body snatches that steal spells from a distant world in the material plane. They burrow into your body and replace your nervous system.

Intellect devourers. Could be refluffed as advanced aliens that steal brains and infiltrate societies. Like the mindflayers, they were actually introduced as sci fi monsters in 1e.

Giants: I really like the idea of Giants from space wielding advanced weaponry.

I was thinking of allowing dragons to fly through space. Perhaps the ancient Giant civilization also traveled through space, which is why so many different material worlds speak of an ancient war between dragons and Giants. The battle was one that raged across a million worlds.

Vegypygmies:
Also introduced as sci fi monsters from a crashed space ship in 1e. Volo's guide in 5e has kept this origin, claiming they were arrived from a meteor or in a "peculiar metal dungeon full of strange life" (This is a reference to barrier peaks) These can be used as a zombie apocalypse style monster, since they spread a deadly fungus that turns creatures into vegepygmies.

1. Keep in mind a lot of the original purpose of Spelljammer was to create a unified setting (along with Planescape). As far as I can tell that rule was thrown in to explain why some of the gods are different in different settings. A lot of gods exist in more than one sphere (no you don't get an explanation for how that works shut up), so technically it's not something that ever has to come into play if you don't want it to. I love Spelljammer but frankly it's one of those settings where you're better off picking and choosing the bits you like than obsessively adhering to every little detail. Your workarounds seem pretty solid if you want to go that route, though.
2. I'm with - it's a dumb rule you're better off ignoring.
>(I'm not sure how fast these ships are supposed to move, but a 4 should be faster than a 2)
In atmosphere it's supposed to be 500 yards per round per point of SR, although that wasn't a 1:1 ratio of spell level to SR like you're proposing. In wildspace it's 100 million miles per day regardless of SR. Maneuverability is unrelated to the caster. The whole thing is begging for an overhaul, though.
>In original spelljammer (somebody please correct me if I am wrong), the crystal spheres blocked teleportation spells and magic in general.
I thought that was only the Astromundi Cluster?

> In wildspace it's 100 million miles per day regardless of SR
At first I was like "Holy shit that is fast!", but then I looked up the math. That would be like 58790 days (161 years) to go 1 light year. I guess spelljammer space is a bit smaller? Doesn't matter though, the scale is arbitrary.

> I thought that was only the Astromundi Cluster?

You may be right. Does that mean you can cast teleport and go from eberron to mystara? I'm fine with that honestly. Teleport is level 7 so very few people will actually be able to cast it, and you would still want ships for large scale transportation. It wouldn't really change the setting. The only wrinkle is the teleportation circle spell. With that even level 9 casters could travel across the universe, although the portal is only open for a short time, isn't that big, and can only be used to go to places you already know the sigil for.

>Doesn't matter though, the scale is arbitrary.
Exactly this. The granularity of how much distance can be traveled is usually only important in ship to ship combat where you're in tactical movement. General travel is arbitrary.

Necrotic energy is what they renamed negative energy back in 4e, and as far as I know, it's stuck in 5e. That or they screwed up and slipped a necrotic in when they meant a negative - don't have my books to hand right at this moment.

> My only issue was the existing races were too constraining

Volo's guide added a lot of races. Plus D&D wiki has a bunch of the spelljammer races:

dandwiki.com/wiki/Giff_(5e_Race)

Giff could acutally be pretty scary. They have darkvision, so you could have a lights out session where feral Giff are running around biting people's heads off every time the lights go out.

Do you need to enter a crystal sphere to pass through it and get your bearings?

not sure what you mean by this?

Fyi, if you give giants laser guns, they will deal triple damage since giants are huge. 9D8 laser rifles.

Just seeing if you need to actually cross through a crystal sphere to pass through it. I found my answer and it was no, some spells allow you to pass through a crystal sphere without traversing the sphere itself. Without those spells you would have to.

normally you have to go through holes in the crystal spheres right?

Some notes for adapting Spelljammer.

1. Cleric Spells. Gods stick to the places they are worshipped. Not every god is in every sphere, some gods of travel may get around, other times a cleric may need to cast a spell that grants them far access to their prayers or perhaps helps them locate a diety or divine source whose power is close. Clerics of esoteric concepts might be able to side step that.

2. Jamming. In the Original SPelljammer, when a caster sat in a helm it sucked up all their spells to give the ship motion. Now, you should set it up that burning spells gives a temporary boost to either maneuverability or speed in combat or out of combat. Make base speed reliant on both the quality of their sails, the helm, and the character level if the character in the helm has cantrips.

I'm definetly gona ditch the cleric restriction.

It makes no sense because lots of dieties like Tiamat are in multiple spheres, so it kinda puts a hole in the concept of sphere centric worship.

Also it unfairly nerfs clerics. In general, I don't think a core mechanic of a setting should be designed to punish one class.

Spelljammer was a neat idea but will always and completely fail because it required you to be intimately familiar with RPG stuff, so its an incomprehensible wall to non-hardcore gamers

Fair enough, now an important question to you about how you'll be doing the Flow. The space between crystal spheres amid the scintillating colors of the Phlogiston.

okay, here goes.

For your game, in the Flow, Fire bad?

I agree, but it isn't hard to just replace a lot of the mechanics with a rules light version and then just treat space as a map.

I'm not sure. I may toss phlogistin and spheres entirely. In 3e space was just space, I may use that design for space. In this case space will a collection of stars and planets.

I'll still keep the illithids, nauteloids, neogi, elven armadas, giff, space dragons, etc.

I love the creatures of spelljammer, but I don't really care for how they do space.

I may keep phlogistin in parts of space. Maybe there are supernatural currents of it that connect worlds, kinda like mass effect relays. Who put these flows there will be a mystery, but I don't like the idea that space is entirely filled with flammable stuff.

Well, they'll make for cool nebula or unique atmosphere in mining heavy asteroid belts.

Moving on, are you thinking post or pre Second Unhuman War? Gonna use the Vodoni empire? IE Roman Wolfmen from Beyond the Stars?

Ill be straight with ya, I don't know much about the two Unhuman wars. My players may read this thread, so w/o giving too much away the setting will involve a powerful nation from one of the popular D&D settings invading another popular D&D setting. The scary horror baddies (w/e they end up being), will also be a third faction and a looming threat.

I don't know much about the Vodoni. Can you give me some highlights? I'd be happy to toss em in.

Vodoni Empire, a group of conquered planets by a caste system heavy Werewolf like race. Kind of Roman Empire-y.

Heavily use of Eugenics and forced alignment were curse on their foot soldiers. I think an Alpha Wolf Emperor, so if you beat him you beat him. That's what I remember, let me google something and send you some lore.

You can make them scifi with genetic manipulation for the wolf stuff. And seem inhuman and creepy because their forward conquering face are oddly intelligent and regimented beasts.

I could be entirely off base and remembering things wrong. Hold on.

huh, actually the first adventure they appear in is easily findable online.

>deathranger.com/SJA4 - Under the Dark Fist.pdf

Awesome! Thanks. do they actually have any relation to lycanthropes, or is the similarity incidental?

>Awesome! Thanks. do they actually have any relation to lycanthropes, or is the similarity incidental?

Well, can't find the Spelljamming creature compendium, but this rpg.net let's read thread talks a bit about it. Most of the Vodoni are humans. The eugenic masters are warrior wizards who turn others in the empire into the wolf like enforcer shock troops.

The enforcers are always wolf like, and in a full moon have a powerful rage.

>forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?627244-Let-s-Read-AD-amp-D-2e-Spelljammer-Aliens-Unleashed/page23

There are naturally occuring holes, and some spells allow you to traverse the crystal sphere barrier to get inside it.

I'm doing something similar to OP, but i'm keeping the Crystal Spheres, the space between is a twisting realm like the Warp and Limbo, but has currents from sphere to sphere like the Phlogiston. In this realm, without the protection of magic or enough willpower, you'll eventually discorporate. The comatose bodies of the gods are taking an incredibly long time to do so, but the body or spirit of a mortal will not last a few days unprotected. That's without being threatened by the things that make that realm home.

Do the other planes still exist, or is space/warp also your astral plane equivalent?

Space/warp is the astral plane equivalent. I imagine there are places within it where there are tendencies towards one element or form than other. If other realms like the material exist, they are likely within a crystal sphere where the elements have been separated and aligned into more accommodating forms. By creating your own dimension you essentially create a small crystal sphere, unless it's a pocket dimension in which it's folded into existing material.

ah, so this is fairly like the DTD cosmology.
What are you planning to use for your horror bad guys?

>DTD cosmology
The what?

>horror bad guys.
Well the gods are "dead" and their adversaries work their ruin, and the things beyond are reaching in. Demons are found in the astral, devils in the material. Devils have become prominent, being creatures of vice they gravitate towards the criminal element, something in which they excel in.

My campaign though isn't going to be much of a horror, more inspired by the sword and sorcery kind of genre. The story is going to be a more personal one than an epic one.

> The what?

Dungeons the Dragoning. Its a funsion of planescape, spelljammer, warhammer40k, exalted, and world of darkness.

Its pretty campy and doesn't take itself too seriously. Anyway, in that setting the astral sea is the space between the crystal spheres, and the warp is a parallel universe filled with demons you can enter to travel quickly.

Ah ok, then yeah it's pretty similar except the astral sea and the warp are combined.

are you keeping any of the core D&D worlds, or making your own?

Im going to be using the mechanics of other realms but maybe not necessarily the realms themselves.

For example, I've got an evil sentient tyrant star they basically inflicts the Abyssal Corruption mechanic on all those who behold it.

I really haven't decided yet if im going to be using the realms themselves. Things like the Nine Hells are going to be in a material realm, because Devils are there. Demons are more like Warp demons, and im not sure if there are physical locations in the warp or if it's just a churning realm of madness.

I'd actually like your opinion of this problem if you don't mind?

Well, in DTD both realms that were traditional material worlds (like Oerth or Torril), as well as other dimensions (like hell), were all in crystal spheres.

So you could have a crystal sphere that is like a normal material world, another that is like hell, another that is a paradise, another ruled by artificial constructs.

The demons were from the warp, but they were a bit different than DND demons. They were more like far realm creatures in a lot of ways, since 40k demons definetly have that "drive you insane with a glance" lovecraftian vibe that dnd demons tend to lack.

They had a core demon crystal sphere, but I didn't like that because i thought it defeated the purpose of having demons being from the madness of the warp. That was their thing, giving them a sphere kinda seemed redundant.

What you could do if you want demons to also have crystal spheres is treat it like an infection. If too many people use evil magic or summon demons in a sphere, it can "crack", and the horror of the warp will flood in and devour the sphere, transforming it into a demon world.

Perhaps every evil spell or even act makes a little chink in the sphere. Summoning a demon makes a bigger one, as it literally bores its way through, leaving a small leak of warp behind it.

That's pretty cool. I do like the imagery of a cracking crystal shell and the warp rushing in and corrupting it. It also makes sense because the crystal shells protect the worlds within them from the warp outside. Such worlds can be the realms of demon princes. I'm not entirely certain on the how or why crystal spheres crack, corruption can certainly be a method of it. Something like the Tyrant Star can also be a consequence of it.

Essentially my demons are a mix of D&D demons and Warp demons, use their stats largely but rarely make them a distinct entity. more like things emerging from chaos.

Devils have a unique relationship to demons in this campaign. By taking a demon, and sealing it into a form and give it a face, and you get a devil. Law imposed on chaos. It's why devils exist in the material realms, demons exist in the astral. Devils don't want to be demons, they like being material too much.

The same goes for my celestials, who are weaker in power but still exist. The old testament sort of strange things exist in the astral, whereas the more humanoid forms exist in the material.

The other dimensions could also be in crystal spheres, though im having difficult consolidating the realms of the gods and crystal spheres. The shells keep the bulk of influence out. It's why gods and fiends/celestials can't manifest without a medium. Gods have Avatars, but they don't literally step within the spheres. Does it make sense for their own realms to be made of that same material and rules? Or do their realms exist in forms unlike crystal spheres?

>Does anybody have suggestions for good sci-fi monsters besides mindflayers
Aboleths. They don't even need ships, they can just swim along happily through the void like packs of space whales. I guess any slaves they capture need ships, but perhaps aboleth slaves don't leave their spheres.

Reads like a Dwarf Fortress random history.

Negative energy is older than that. Haven't you ever heard of the negative energy plane?

>Anyone have any good workarounds for it?
Won't fit all character concepts, but if you just want a cleric's mechanics and kind of justify it, why not make the ship a god somehow? Say, bind a god's soul to it or whatnot. Depends on how you plan to handle divinity.

You could also just do away with that complication, either making space gods, or letting gods project power beyond their sphere indirectly (as in, through clerics and other agents) only, making clerics that much more valuable to gods.

Out of your workarounds, the holy symbol is the best one.

>Devils have a unique relationship to demons in this campaign.
>it's the exact same as Kill Six Billion Demons
I mean, it's a good idea, but don't claim if for your own if all you've done is used names better.

That is a direct inspiration for this game, I make no claims these ideas are original or mine. This game is comprised of mostly things stolen liberally from things I like and feel appropriate to the game tone.