/STG/ Star Trek General

Yeah, the secondary hull isn't half bad, but the nacellas are what kills it.

Wizkids confirm that ALL Enterprise-E repaint minis will come with the code for the tier-6 Command Assault Cruiser.
twitter.com/wizkidsgames/status/798281528233103360

Yeah, the command variant, meanwhile the Intel variant is on Z-store for 2500 zen for some reason.
Normally these tier 6 buggers go for 3K zen.

Makes it cheaper to get the set bonus at least.

Now if only i found those minis from somewhere around my parts.

Why not order online?

Plot Hooks and miscellaneous events/items.
Lets see if we can do something mildly creative:

Take a star trek related image, write some guff to go along with. Doesn't have to be a work of art. If you want, reply to someone else's image.

Example: Voyager fucks up again with yet another trip back to Earth, but at the wrong time.
Why was this guy important? He was erroneously deemed important by time-travelling assassins seeking to to remove Janeway from the timeline. Turns out he at one time was photographed near an actual relative.

There was also an user making a story about Kill La Kill in Star Trek, no?

So what are /STG/'s thoughts and feeling on the Iconians being behind everything ever in STO?

Was kinda cool.
Then we had the Iconian war that felt very detached from the game world at large.
I mean seriously, would it have killed them to add some randomly flying refugee fleets and Iconian sector space encounters?
Oh and the ending was pretty atrocious, either PC was all the time on the side of the Klink who didn't want to kill anyone for some reason, after all, it's not like Lord high admiral Playerus Characterus didn't see shitloads of carnage and suffering during the war and didn't have a motive to destroy the Iconians in the past.
Alternatively PC caught a fatal case of mouth breathing and didn't want to bother people while they were wowing revenge on us or escaping through star gate.

Annoyed but not massively so.

Was hoping for some mention of an Ancient Vulcan culture to explain why there are vulcanoids besides Romulans on various planets. Perhaps as a later precursor.

Also annoyed that they killed off the Preservers again. They pulled that shit in Star Trek: Hidden Evil back in 1999 and the moment they made another appearance I was counting down the missions till they got nuked from orbit. I'm sure it was meant to be a great tragedy and pull on the heart strings but for me it had very little impact.

Also annoyed that we couldn't actually do anything of any note and save the Iconians with the Annarax eraser. Yes predetermination grandfather paradox but who gives a shit at this point, I have a ship that can unwrite things without unwriting itself so I hold the sword of a horrific god.

Felt it could have been handle better.

STO's story has been fairly dreadful for a while. The only storyline that I properly enjoyed was the Romulan Republic. That had the benefit of giving you motivation and an actual sense of progress. Once time travel became the primary plot point I basically stopped caring.

I mostly liked it. Didn't like the whole "Iconians are the most ancient race evah" thing - yet another case of "non-sci-fi writers writing sci-fi have no sense of scale," just this time in time instead of space, and the whole Preservers thing in the first ep was garbage. After that it was bredy fun though. Introducing more hero-but-not-pc-tier characters that weren't in the shows was a nice move. I even kinda liked the ending, because it was pretty much the only way they could simultaneously solve the problem without making it a "plot gun/time travel fixes everything" game. Sure, time travel solved the problem, but it also caused the problem in the first place.

And then they made it a "time travel fixes everything" game.

>TFW if you wanted to play a Doctor Who game why didn't you just make a Doctor who game?
I hate when they do that in a setting when it doesn't even need it. There is nothing in Trek where you can't just technobabble your way out of shit. Time shit is just the laziest recourse of crappy writers/designers.

The 'no sense of scale' thing that still gets me is the Dyson Sphere. Literally, the most technologically amazing accomplishment in Star Trek by a TREMENDOUS amount, and it's just a vehicle for Scotty to make a cameo? Whatever.

Like. That thing is the single most important object in the entire galaxy. Fuck the Wormhole, Fuck the Borg. Fuck the Gateway to Tomorrow, a real dyson sphere is what everyone should be flipping their shit over.

I get what you are saying user from a tech achievement level it's way up there but from a story hook idea. It is kind of dead in the water since there is no way in hell the UFP could really reverse engineer that at their current level of tech. And to most normies it's just a big ball and not that great looks wise because it's hard to really show the scale of the thing.

Make it an alien derilect or space station or asteroid or something. Not an object that has more manufactured surface area than all planets known to the federation combined.

>Make it an alien derilect or space station or asteroid or something.
Trek has done all that already and then some. The Dyson sphere was just a nod to the space geeks that watch the show. It's like a wet dream to space engineers to have something like that realized but as a story plot it sucks. If the guys who made are still around then you are messing with a race with god-like tech. And if they don't want you around you won't be. And the level of advancement would be so high, trying to understand even during the TNG era. That it would like a dog trying to figure out a warp engine. And if they are gone it's the same deal except they are truly dealing with shit way above their heads with no help and are liable to kill or hurt themselves fucking with shit totally out of their league. In other words, shit like a Dyson sphere should only be dealt with in fiction in passing unless the setting is at that tech level.

>50251045
they launch people into hilarious death takes, so logically, yes

>i can't even fucking cross post
welp i've had enough for tonight

If you were dropped into the Trek setting what race would you want to be and what era? I like TOS characters better but I like the TNG tech better. I'd want to be a covert human augment serving on a Prometheus class vessel.

Pre-Dominion War DS9/TNG era.

if Telltale announced that they were going to make a game based off the star trek series, which series would you want it to be based on?

A) TOS
B) TNG
C) DS9

>Geordi will remember that

anytime during tng or post war ds9. a human would be just fine. i could probably work security and try to find myself an honorable qt 3.14 klingon waifu

Post-DS9 as an El-Aurian.

Fast all the major wars to actually damage anything important and get great longevity. Also ability to detect changes in time line.

Just a few weeks before the Dominion War, Human. I want to see if I can get the federation to develop a proper carrier.

Into the 2340's as a Cardassian. I'd try and convince the High Command to take Starfleet seriously and ramp up weapons development to counteract them.

I've seen the way Telltale "games" are played, and frankly I don't want them touching Trek.

Seconded. They've really dug themselves in too deep to their formula of story with occasional bits of interactivity that really add very little.

If I were going to have to suffer one, it'd be TNG. Everyone is still around for voice acting, there's plenty of scope for doing something to fill in the Enterprise E era, much like the old 25th anniversary/judgement rites games did for TOS.

Human, post-DS9, ex-starfleet engineer, running what's basically a high speed (warp 8+) taxi service of a small starship. Bit bigger than a runabout so some freight and passengers could be carried. I'd travel around the Federation, see places, moving people and valuable small cargo.

Image unrelated.

You'd stop liking it at least by the time someone puked inside your ship for the 5th time and when the cargo hold gets infested by something nasty.
Like fungus, alien lemmings, tribbles or worst of all, hippies.

I can always space the hippies. Unless someone is paying me to ship them. That might be violating some sort of law though, shipping hippies that is. I suspect the Federation got pretty hard on them following that series of incidents in 2269.

Moriarty was a wonderfully human character.

Kreetassan
Right around Terok Nor becoming DS9

I would be an outcast from my homeworld, having a long record of not adhearing to my species strict ettiquite and ceremony. This would turn out to be a boon as I was far easier to deal with than my more traditional counterparts, thus paving my way into Starfleet Acadamy. Upon graduation, I would serve the standard ship borne service time all new cadets must have. After 5 years, I would be reassigned to the shipyards for experimental ship construction. There, I would bust my ass resurrecting the constellation class and making it great again.

So I'm making my way through voyager, and I have to say, some of these episodes are the best trek I've seen.

Any thing involving the doctor is solid gold.

If Voyager was solidly bad it'd be less of a problem. But it'd keep having good episodes on occasion, particularly through season 4, and that's what makes it painful that it was just drudgery and mediocrity for so much of it.

Is there a watch guide?

Probably a load of them.

That reminds me: I had a concept for a Star Fleet Intelligence Officer who's cover was that he was an ex-Starfleet engineer turned freelance contractor/merchant operating in the Federation/Cardassian border territories.
So, human pre-Dominion war. Personality wise, he'd be warm, friendly, empathetic, a great listener, the sort of guy who you always want to have a Raktajino with when he comes by. He had to work a very long time to become that person and takes a professional pride in his ability to get people to talk without realizing they're being probed for info.

His ship would be a converted and upgraded small freighter hosing the equivalent of a very well equipped machine shop, a small personal holosuite, the holosuite's dedicated computer is employed in running analysis on data from the 'really quite normal, see?' ship's sensors, and the remaining space for cargo.

See places, meet people, move small valuable cargo. While trying to deal with Ferengi traders who don't like competition. Cardassian customs who like bribes. Fereration customs who don't like people who resign from Starfleet to cut shady deals on both sides of a disputed border and various people who really think they could make far better use of that ship.

I like the idea of a spy who's job is what a lot of spying is (as far as I can tell) actually about. Just blending into a background and gathering lots and lots of boring minutiae that when you sift em fine enough reveal patterns of activity.

I also like the idea of a spy who spends most of his time maintaining his cover, and most of his problems stem from maintaining an anonymous cover than a shadowy figure in a menacing black outfit that might as well have "SPY" written across the back in neon.

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too many with not enough consensus. Watch it all. You need to experience the good with the bad.

I like this character idea. Our characters should meet up, bond over similar backgrounds, indulge in beverages and bitch about whatever two-bit VIP needed high speed delivery of a crate of 'cupcakes' from Vulcan to DS9 in less than 2 weeks.

...I did actually check what warp factor would need to be cruised at to make that trip possible it, it's doable in a bit under at about Warp 8.6+

>TFW Fed spy in carddie space
I would really watch out for all the other spies running around that place. It would be funny if you had like a card game every so often with other traders in the areas. And the kicker is all the other players are spies too but with very plain covers with all of you guys trying to out spy the other. Oh Garek drops by sometimes too just to keep taps on all the spookies.

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I like that idea. Everyone knows more or less who everyone else is. But any direct action by any party means everyone else gets grabbed, so a kind of truce prevails.

I had a couple of scenarios for him. One is where a rival Ferengi trader runs some numbers and decides his business is a front. Which is true. And that it's a front for the Orions. Which is false, but disproving it would be very inconvenient. The Ferengi wants to leverage this to disrupt Orion trade on behalf of a rival syndicate. Putting the spy in a situation where he has to figure out who the Ferengi is working for, gather enough plausible info on the Orions to buy him time, make contact with the Orions and convince them what's going on, all without either getting himself killed, or doing anything so overt as to blow his cover. (Certain material shortages on worlds near the Cardassian border could be indicative of a construction effort, and he needs to investigate it).

By the end of it, a lot of people would be dead, he'd be in good standing with the Orions. The Cardassian project would turn out to be a series of irrigation canals to irrigate a subcontinent for Kanar production.

The other would involve a Maquis group turned mercenaries kidnapping him at the behest of a corrupt local official over a trade deal. Rather than just killing him they dragoon him into service upgrading some of their equipment. He manages to win the trust of their local engineer, talking idealistically about what they're doing, and why they joined up. The engineer would test his sincerity a couple of times, by apparently dropping their guard. Once he had convinced them and the engineer had covered for him, buying him some extra time he'd beat them to death with a pipe and escape. Feeding info to a Cardie opposite number on where and how to wipe out the rest of the group in exchange for info on who hired them and why.

This is not a guy who will have an entirely positive view of himself and what he does.

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>This is not a guy who will have an entirely positive view of himself and what he does.
I think that's the thing with most spies what they as a cover is unremarkable but what they need to do for their real jobs can be nasty. I think Garek showed this somewhat during DS9, he had done a lot of crap in his pass. Some that weighted on him more than others. I like that there are deep cover spooks all over the place in Trek during the TNG era. I mean anyone who's anyone has a strong spy organization in their government. It kind of puts James Bonds to shame how much covert stuff happens in Trek during that time period.

So, according to the schematics in the previous thread, these ST:M ships, at least the early ones, gain gravity from thrust (they're built like towers rather than seafaring vessels). But they also use impulse engines and warp engines, which necessitates inertial dampening. So the crew only get the benefit of thrust gravity for very brief periods. So what's the point?

This is the image I'm referring to, by the way.

Maybe the dampeners can be set to dampen a certain amount of inertia?
So while the ship is moving it allows enough inertia to affect the ship and crew so that folks can have gravity, while dampening any further force that would turn the crew into walking pancakes.

>You will never be part of a squadron exploring deep space.
Why live...

Inertial dampeners are part of the artificial gravity system, or the other way around. That floorplan isn't for thrust-based gravity (which would require constant, low accelerations, which would be impractical to say the least), but floorspace efficiency with that hull design.

I think pancakes would slide more than walk. At best they could move around like a snail.

Then why does the Connie's engineering hull not use the same design methodology.

And I hate to be pedantic, but anti grav isn't controlled by the impulse system.

You seem to be thinking that these old ships could sustain warp for long periods of time and spent most of their time in warp when they probably spent most of it at sub-light for surveying, patrolling, ect. Thus granting more time for thrust gravity to do it's job.
What is it's job? The human body is not designed for zero-g, things start going very very wrong if you spend too much time in it. Muscles atrophy, bones weaken, heart problems begin manifesting, ect. Even small amounts time spent in gravity will lengthen the crew endurance for a long voyage.

One should probably assume that these early space explorers were will fully versed in zero-g living as with enough thrust-gravity living to keep them sane, healthy, and capable of doing their jobs.

Been skimming the museum, can't really find anything referring to the deck layout being for the sake of gravity, if there is a reference someone will have to point it at me.

>You seem to be thinking that these old ships could sustain warp for long periods of time and spent most of their time in warp

Not him but going by the warp speeds alone, yeah they do. Going even 5 light years at an early war cruiser's cruising speed of warp 2.3-6 takes over 100 days, 150 at the cruising speed of a Bison transport. So 4-5 months just to take a system to system hop. Getting to the early antimatter/reactor ships like the Conqueror with it's cruise speed of warp 3.1 cuts that trip to just over 60 days.

The SFM stuff was designed with not needing the speed of plot so no Earth to Qo'noS trip in a few days kinda bullshit. should have taken the better part of 9+ months without stopping at warp 5... yes I enjoy playing with the warp speed calculator.

>That one episode of TOS where Enterprise saves a group of hippies from exploding with their shitty shuttle while they are running away from the feds
>Hippies infest Enterprises lounge area and sing songs there until captain cracks and agrees to take them to their little paradise planet they heard of from a guy who saw it while doing shrooms
>They actually find the planet
>Hippies grab a shuttle and land before anyone has had enough time to scan the planet
>It ends up being a star trek version of Catachan
>Kirk and crew manage to save more than half of the hippies before they manage to kill themselves by either dancing barefoot on grass that produces acid or eat cyanide berries from nearby bushes

Should have given it a few more days. Let the rest of the insufferable shirts kill themselves. God they were annoying.

>Then why does the Connie's engineering hull not use the same design methodology.
Because the vast majority of the ship's volume is in the saucer, and maybe it'd be a pain for some reason to change it. Also, the shuttlebay is pointing in the same direction as the saucer's decks, and that is a significant portion of the secondary hull's volume. And, there could be rooms that specifically benefit from having long decks with lots of floorspace, like the warp core.
>And I hate to be pedantic, but anti grav isn't controlled by the impulse system.
I said inertial dampeners, not impulse. Seeing as how the inertial dampeners and artificial gravity have the same effect (using space magic to create local accelerations in one direction or another), it would make sense that they would be linked.

I don't think that artificial gravity is linked to the inertial dampening system. Gravity (on TOS era ships anyway) is produced by gravity generating plates under the deck. They can be independently turned on or off, or have their settings changed (we see this in In A Mirror Darkly).

It's entirely possible that the ST: M ships don't have the gravity plating, so the most sensible way to generate gravity is to do it under acceleration. I'm not sure how this would work under warp, since the warp drive doesn't actually accelerate anything. It moves space around the ship and negates at least some of the ship's mass.

It may be possible to "accelerate" using impulse engines while warp is active, and generate gravity that way, but they're not going to get to their destination faster.

But the time spent traveling would pass much more pleasantly, without the bone loss or muscle atrophy.

However, this doesn't interact well with ENT in other areas. We see that the NX class already has gravity plating, and we also see that it's common on vulcan starships and human civilian vessels. ST: M was created before ENT ever aired, and ENT mostly didn't give a crap about being consistent with the rest of Trek, let alone fan ideas.

I really wish this was more complete, its really well done as it is.
st-minutiae.com/articles/romulanwar/index.html

I wouldn't mind them having gravity plating, it's been speculated here before that the gravity plating is a spin-off tech of warp drive since they both involve distorting space in a way, though in Star Trek Gravitons are a particle I believe which may or may not mess with that idea.

Also starships at warp are still being pushed by their impulse engines, since the warp drive is simply warping space around the ship.

It'd be interesting to explore that from the Federation side. How do you do a job that requires everything, body, mind, and soul; and that the average citizen would consider criminal if they knew you were doing it. On the Cardassian side the Obsidian Order was at least respected and feared.

That's the other thing I've hoped for, a Section 31 series or series of stories where they're not a shadow government or secret puppet masters, but are genuinely trying to protect the Federation as best they can. Because the psychology of that, how do you organize a group so that it can remain on task for centuries and become neither uselessly corrupt or dangerously inward facing fascinates me. I think DS9 was kind of torn between making them 'evil fascist shadow government' and 'the Federation's hidden sword and shield'.

So does the UFP have civil spaceships that are like ocean liners and if so what do thy look like?

They do yes. Starfleet ships help out with official business (diplomats, colonisation efforts etc.) and they can provide general transport seemingly at their own discretion. But on a few occasions we hear about civilian transports, mostly in TNG and DS9.

I think the only way to keep Section 31 from becoming the complete antithesis of the Federation is to have them periodically disband. As if they were an extension of the regular intelligence agencies that was only deemed needed on rare occasions rather than left as a permanently operating branch.

They definitely do as there's clear movement of civilians going on around the Federation, I don't think I've ever seen any tv/movie-canon examples, though the starfleet museum has a whole bunch of designs up, and Star Fleet Battles (and the Star Fleet Command games) have a whole bunch of civilian cargo/passenger ship designs going on since they feature as targets in convoy attack/defence missions.

I think it'd be good though to collect what designs there are for TOS-onwards that are floating around, as well as other civilian ships. Would be good to have examples. I'm not sure if the RPGs contain any examples.

1. Idealistic fanatic realists: Fanatically believe in the Federation ideals, but realize that there are threats and other things that mean the Federation can't survive just sticking to its ideals, and sometimes (but only sometimes) people have to do evil crap for that ideal. They know what they're doing is evil, they know they can't participate in their ideal Federation, but they are willing to do it for their ideal to exist for others. They don't take over because they don't want to: their ideal of the Federation doesn't include them being involved.
2. Very low numbers: basically this can't be a big enough organization to actually take over or anything, or even to do much besides the highest-priority stuff. They wouldn't do much recruiting, since they have very strict standards (see part 1). They are probably also augmented a la Bashir, to be able to do their job without a big organization (which would leave a paper trail).
3. Semi-independent agents: if any of them get bigger ideas, the rest will take them out. Also allows plausible deniability.

Does anybody have the greentext differentiating the various Trek series through the mechanism of rape? The one with the bit where Kirk responds to Scotty saying "I canna break the laws of physics" with "Why do you LIE like that, Scotty?"

I need it for reasons.

I don't have the one someone made with Sisko, sorry.

I like these. In the spirit of 3, rather than making them semi-independent you could also have an internal rule that places a strict limit on the authority you could have after being part of section 31. So if you've worked for Section 31 and then decide you want to be an Admiral or sit on the Federation council, you're going to get a polite warning, then die in a mysterious accident if you persist. The idea is that they know they attract power hungry people and anyone who thinks being a spy is something you aspire to as part of a career rather than something like being called to be an ascetic is toxic to the long term health of the place. So it's made clear that Section 31 is where careers end, violently if need be. This helps them make sure they select for (1) above.

>I think the only way to keep Section 31 from becoming the complete antithesis of the Federation is to have them periodically disband. As if they were an extension of the regular intelligence agencies that was only deemed needed on rare occasions rather than left as a permanently operating branch.
Interestingly, the fact that Ross worked with them (and going by novel canon, so did Trip Tucker), albeit very reluctantly, implies unofficial tolerance, at least during situations like the Dominion War (or the Romulan War). When Section 31 crops up in Kirk's time, they're fucking around with cloaking devices and trying to false flag a war between the Klingons and Romulans, and Kirk creates the "Kirk Cabal" with some other officers to keep Section 31's excesses to a minimum, though they seem to have failed at preventing the events of Undiscovered Country, since Cartwright is a conspirator with 31.

>Sorry GENE thanks for the idea but your way of going about it, is full of shit.
See that's the big kicker in Trek about the UFP, it's not a true utopia. It's a projected false utopia that most citizens of it buy into. Since as long as the weather is nice and the food and items flow without interruption, people will mostly ignore everything else. I mean have could you really have utopia if you were surrounded by Space Mongols, Nazis, and Romans. I would say the average UFP citizen is the most disillusion person in Trek thinking that the UFP is close to perfect when most people in the know. Know for a fact that the ideal utopia is just a thin layer over all the crap that really goes on behind the scenes.

>Was hoping for some mention of an Ancient Vulcan culture to explain why there are vulcanoids besides Romulans on various planets. Perhaps as a later precursor.

Maybe there's something about desert planets that makes the Vulcanoid genetic pattern appear spontaneously and independently from other Vulcanoids. Almost all humanoids are based off of the same species, remember?

Herbert.

>Herbert.
>TFW I have a cousin named Herbert.
WTF was that supposed to mean anyway.
And seriously, with all the robots in TOS, where the heck are all the cyber waifus during the TNG era? I would think there would be enough dateless geeks in the future to make their creation of them a necessity.

just finished ds9 and the ending just kinda fell on its face at the end

>just finished ds9 and the ending just kinda fell on its face at the end
I think that's because they wanted to a big avatars of gods end battle and had no idea how they really wanted to do it. The ending feels out of place for a Trek show since spirituality is kind of looked down on by the Star Fleet guys and you had Sisko do the big god battle thing which TNG era Trek really tried to steer away from. Because 'we are too enlightened for that BS' humans which I find full of shit myself. I think they want a mystical B5 like vibe to the ending and totally failed at it because of really bad set up.

It does okay at tieing up the war. But Sisko'S resolution was dogshit.

That's because The Sisko is powerful. The Sisko asks, and they come of their own volition.

Guys, i got pictures, pictures of new science ships for Feds, Roms and Klinks!

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And that will be it then.

I still prefer my nebbies looking like nebbies, but this ain't bad

I like this one. It's very sleek but robust.

Not as much a fan of this. Can't put my finder on it but it just looks off

Agreed, for some reason Cryptic just cant get their Klingon ships right.
Most of the Romulan ones look good and Feddie ones are a bit of a coin toss with some looking good and others looking shite.

It's also a shame they don't make any more sub-faction ships like they had back in the days.
Feddies having some Vulcan, Andorian and Caitian ships available for them and Klingons getting access to Gorn, Orion and Nausicaan ships.
Really wish they would make more of those at some point.

Thank you. I'm trying to convince a couple of newbies to watch TOS (they've seen TNG and VOY), and I needed something which captures the spirit of the show in a format short enough that their gnat-like attention spans can grasp it.

Daily reminder that the Maquis did nothing wrong.

They all died. At the very least, that qualifies.

It seems like they went through a lot of effort for not a lot a benefit.

I'm really not a fan of the cryptic designs for Starfleet. Some of them are great but the majority lack aesthetic balance. Which is weird, seeing as they seem to have nailed the Romulans so perfectly.