/CofD/ &/wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

Man why the fuck has it taken so fucking Mummy so long to get it's second city book out that the rest of it's line is done, all of demon is done and the big 3 are out with one of them even having a supplement. Though that still brings up the hilliarity of Vampire having zero real supplements out yet for 2 e.

One is coming for Vampire though. After just... What? Three years?

How can they expect a system to live with 0 updates for so long?
If it wasn't for the tribal loyalty of the fans OPP would be dead and forgotten. If any other company treated their fans with this disdain, they would be shunned and forgotten, and rightfully so.

Maybe i'm better off asking in this thread. So, i am about to run the VtM game for the first time in my life and IRL at that and i need some clarification that is not readily available:
1. Vampires described as struggling for feeding grounds, where neonate should feed if they have no domain? What happens if they feed in someone else's domain? Do they automatically recieve some grounds, when they become neonates? Is there some common feeding grounds that are free for all? I'm talking about Camarilla, ofcourse.
2. How exactly do trades happen? What can newly fledged vampire offer to the lords of the city? Surely it's not (only) money, when they are readily available basically to every Cainite? If it's a favours they have to repay afterwards, what stops them from not doing so, from hiding or fleeing city?
3. How do vampires travel? Is there some trafficking network of ghouls and revenants ran by clans, that allow them to travel safely? Or are they basically bound to the city they were embraced in?
I'll post more questions, if they arise, and if you're willing to help the brother out here.

They where more focused on getting all the lines up as quick as possible so their brand had a strong foundation to stand on again, I guess.

Honestly I doubt it's disdain and more misguided goals or incompetence

Also:
4. The Tradition explicitely says that you should not slay your kin, but what if say young and daring vampires decide that they want to run a joint already held by some other vampire and they fail to come to understanding with the owner. Is he allowed to kill them? Should he ask someone first? Are they allowed to kill owner? And basically, what are the Rules of Engagement when comes to the other Kindred?

1. Stray dogs are perfectly fine unless you are of the fancy clan Ventrue. Also, they don't get shit unless they buy it during the chargen. Make them suffer form poverty if they spend all their background points on generation or some bullcrap.

2. The elders have far reach via allies and servants. Pissing off one is unadvisable. Even if said elder doesn't really give a fuck, he can't let it slide because that woudl make hum look like a pussy in the eyes of the other elders.

3. By being creative, duh. Less creative players should pick the right disciplines. Protean 3 is very usefull, vicissitude offers and interesting solution to physically small cainites...

Kin probably relates to, you know, your sire/grandsire/great grandsire and not at all to your childe.

>what if say young and daring vampires decide that they want to run a joint already held by some other vampire and they fail to come to understanding with the owner. Is he allowed to kill them?

Some higher up is going to inherit it and grant it to a ghoul vassal or something. They probably end up being punished if found guilty. Only independent vampires are a fair game, but they tend to be rare and ancient.

1) The common hunting grounds is called The Rack, and it usually incorporates the city's nightlife district. Outside of that, different areas are held by different vampires.

2) If I do X for you, you can establish an alibi and pretend you knew nothing. This is what the young do for the old - carry out old vendettas, run errands, risk their necks while elders stay cosy in their havens. Long lists of "prestation" - favours owed - are prattled off by Harpies in the local Elysium. Word spreads from town to town, especially through Nosferatu, so if someone doesn't keep their promises soon everyone knows.
3) Travel between cities is difficult and dangerous. VtM games typically have a higher rate of werewolves in wild spaces than the average WtA game. The cities should feel like a gilded cage.

4) This is where the letter of the law comes into it and not the spirit. It is permissible to punch someone into torpor, stake them and then keep them prisoner, as long as you are willing to put up with repercussions and an eternal enemy. The ability to kill is usually reserved by the Prince and their agents, leveraged as a boon perhaps, or invoked after the players do a sterling frame-up.

Thanks for the elaborate and logical answers, mate.
Now if you or anyone else can judge my outline for the story i planned, that would be of great help too.
I plan to recruit fresh neonates in London to avert the incoming crisis, they will be sent to local authority (Harpy, Sheriff, i dunno) and asked to deal with the mortal named say Julio Massage, who got his hands on a large quantity of information that, if revealed, threatens Masquerade across the whole world and would surely bring the second rise of Inquisition and Dark Times. The problem is, said person is hiding in Venezuella embassy and is guarded by the Order of Leopold, and to boot set up several Dead Man's Switches that will make information available to the whole interwebs in case said mortal dies or dissapears. So the first thing they should do is to find people trusted with the location of encrypted archives, make them dissapear or delete said archives and get rid of anyone who might know about the contents. It all happens in a rush, because the Justicar should come into town in the near future and everyone involved in the breach of security will probably go belly up, and the persons responsible want to hide that from Justicar. Ofcourse it's a Prince and his agents, they don't want to be associated with the threat at all, neither do they want all their dirty secrets to get available to public, so they hire neonates of whom plan to get rid, after the job is done.
Sabbat involves somewhere along the lines, advising neonates to keep the info once they get it and pass it onto Sabbat. Sabbat doesn't plan to release the info, but they want to present Justicar with enough means to shake a current vertical of power, so they could use it in order to take headless city over.
Woah.. that's a lot of text. Do i make any sense?

>Would Time patterning or Time unmaking be appropriate for a spell that turns instant actions for the duration?
That question doesn't make sense, turns into what? Or turns off?

Wow if this actually happens, we might even someday see HL3.

>Travel between cities is difficult and dangerous. VtM games typically have a higher rate of werewolves in wild spaces than the average WtA game. The cities should feel like a gilded cage.
I was never into VtM and this is one of things I don't understand That difficulty travelling part, even in VtR but to lesser degree. I understand vampires don't like flying coffins, but what's a problem with getting in car and travelling this way? On highway you can easily do 75 miles a hour so even if you take your time, you can easily get from NY to SF in under a week hassle free.

Did DaveB mention what Mage supplements, if any, are scheduled after Signs of Sorcery, or when SoS will be released? In the Monday Meeting Notes, SoS has been languishing in "Development" forever, and no other Mage supplements are listed.

Afaik no dates are known, but next supplement afer SoS should be Tome of the Pentacle.
source: reddit.com/r/WhiteWolfRPG/comments/5e6p9n/what_books_other_than_core_are_part_of_mtaw_2nd_ed/dac65nt/?st=iw3i4rq3&sh=930f1184

>only 15 generations of vampires, and the 15th generation is a recent thing
Do vampires only sire when they're a few hundred years old or something?

Someone doesn't know about Palladium Games.

Vampire populations are strictly controlled. This is usually accomplished by requiring permission to sire from the local Prince or other ruling power figure. Younger, less powerful and higher generation vampires rarely have the political cache to obtain such permission. Also, the mortality rate of younger vampires is often high as they're embraced for little more than cannon fodder in sectarian conflicts.

Err.. and 15th gen () can't Embrace if i'm not mistaken.. if they try they left only with a dead body on their hands, and not a vampire.

I would imagine that usually throughout history powerful Vampires have controlled the rate of the creation of Vampire creation by killing those they didn't like, such as those created without permission.

If only because they want to postpone "the time of the thin blood" when they all die, for as long as possible.

SoS has been in Development because Awakening's errata and then Deviant have had priority over it. It'll still be out way closer to Mage than The Pack or Secrets of the Covenants were.

Next book is Tome of the Pentacle. One more approved after that, which remains unannounced.

Assuming you mean "into reflexive ones" as per previous thread... No. Well, you can do it if you like in your game, but be warned that it will snap the Storytelling system like a twig. Multiple Actions - just say no.

Thanks, Dave.

Now that the Mage errata is complete and the final book released, do you have a vague idea when SoS will be out? Christmas 2016 is obviously not realistic, but is Winter 2017 still a possibility?

Anything you can tell us about the cool people working on Deviant that won't break NDA?

>Next book is Tome of the Pentacle. One more approved after that, which remains unannounced

Any hints about the third Mage supplement or maybe some new Signs of Sorcery spoilers?

To be fair Dave, in Secrets of the Covenants case, that's not a high bar to clear at all.

>VtM

Can you give us more details on Deviant?

>animoo

pleb

So Changeling the lost 2e has moved into editing according to the Monday meeting blurb. Anyone have a clue how long the editing process goes for OPP. Or should I just assume it's like valve time

Any fluff reason why you couldn't have a spell that functions like 'Devouring the Slain' except for Spirit?

You wouldn't be able to use it on people of course. But chowing down on lesser spirits for mana/essence/willpower seems to be in theme for the arcana.

It all depends on who is editing the project.

>VtM games typically have a higher rate of werewolves in wild spaces than the average WtA game.

I always found that retarded.

Crossovers are fun.

So valve time then, got it.

And the quality of the draft they were given.

Plus remember this isn't even the cutting room floor step. I discovered this during Exalted's development cycle. Once it moves into layout the person laying it out will ask them to start Cutting down the text to they always right MORE than what's needed. The stuff that gets get can always be put into other books if it is worth saving like Kiths, Contracts, ect.

Yes your are on the bright side of the tunnel but this is going to be murky time table wise.

This step is mostly checking for spelling errors, making sure formatting conventions for things like Italics and bold are followed and the grammar is functional.

Oh god imagine what the draft of M20 would have been. 500+ pages of buccatto complaining about muh capitalism.

About why capitalism is good? Or how it isn't bad.

It's Brucato, so he's probably got a dim view on it like anything that's not either neopagan sentimentality or hardcore techno-fetishism.

You already have that.
It's called Channel Essence, and it can be used on unwilling Spirits.

Capitalism is bad.
Find someone with a black and red star avatar and ask them why.

Yeah, not saying Capitalism is the greatest thing ever, but it works very well. While there is benefit to turning over some infrastructure to the government societies work best when governments fear the people not people the government. That is unique to capitalism. The moment you cross into socialism or communism the government controls more and more and people become addicted to the hand outs and fear them being discontinued.

>people become addicted to the hand outs
Literally a point refuted a thousand times.

There are so many problems with your post that I'm not going to get into in a WoD thread. Just find an Anarcho-Syndicalist, Libertarian Socialist, or Communist on Youtube and they'll explain it.

I'm trying to get a hang on Forsaken 2e but the continuous use of werewolf speak is getting tedious.

You get used to it after a while. The jargon is always the hardest part of any RPG.

So I'm trying to devise a mantle for a changeling court. The prime elements of the court are that we collect "taxes" i.e. protection money, we protect trade in the area, and we dish out justice on behalf of the Freehold as the Freehold's law enforcement.

We are called the Constabulary Court.
...So umm...any advice on how to build this thing?

I'm thinking at 1 dot
+1 Investigate because constables do that, so do Sherifs.
At 3 dots maybe 9 again to intimidation checks to Interrogate.
It's that 5th dot that is hanging me up. I'm not sure what to do with that one. Or if I am doing this wrong.

Learn to love it. The Uratha speak like that. The lingo's part of getting in the mood.

Yeah. That was my first big problem with Mummy. At least Werewolf has translations.

Vampire was designed by and for americans and that's easy to spot. Between New York and San Francisco there's a lot of wilderness and that's home of the garou. It's just dangerous and most vampires prefer not to risk their lifes. It's not like it doesn't ever happen, the lore is full of travelling vampires, you even have european medieval vampires living in the americas.

This would be a non-issue in almost any european country, where there's plenty of wild nature but cities are closer to each other.

For most of vampiric history, human populations were so small that too big amounts of vampires would've collapsed vampiric society. This means population control is required (even more than in masquerade). And of course the most powerful (read old) vampires are more likely to be the ones allowed to embrace if they desire to.

It's to demonstrate the anxiety all basement dwellers feel when they have to travel out amongst the normies

So, I have this idea regarding a few Devotions, could you please explain why they are bad ideas:

Immortal Shape of the Wraith
(Protean •••••, Celerity •••)
For a moment, the vampire is no more substantial than mist, causing attacks to pass through her harmlessly.
Cost: 3 Vitae
Dice Pool: None
Action: Reflexive
This Devotion allows a Vampire to become completely immune to one attack, as instead of hitting a solid body, it strikes through a body as substantial as mist. No matter what type of damage is delivered, it deals none, unless the source is from a Bane, in which case it deals normal damage.
This Devotion also allows a Vampire to slip out of a Grapple, as there is no longer any body to hold onto.
This Devotion costs 4 Experiences to learn.

Basically, a cheaper, one-attack-only Juggernaut's Gait, with the small benefit that she can't be knocked down, grappled, or driven over an edge by being rammed with a car.

Cont...

Body of Whispers
(Auspex •••••, Protean •••)
Normally, a vampire projecting her mind elsewhere, leaves her body dangerously vulnerable. With this Devotion, that is somewhat alleviated by bringing it with her where she goes.
Cost: 3 Vitae
Roll: Intelligence + Occult + Auspex
Action: Instant
Dramatic Failure: The Vampire becomes trapped in a half-ephemeral state, parts of her body shifting in and out of Twilight. She suffers the Stunned Tilt for a number of turns equal to 15 minus her Stamina. During this time both material and Twilight creatures may freely interact with her.
Failure: Her body stays rigidly solid.
Success: For a scene, the vampire's body shifts into Twilight, becoming immaterial. During this time the vampire can walk through physical obstacles, and even sink into the ground if she wishes, otherwise she moves just as normal. While in this state, she can not interact with the physical world in any way, though her Disciplines work just the same as normal.
When this Devotion ends, the kindred simply slips back into the world where she happens to be at the moment. If she is inside an object, she will safely appear outside it.
She may end this Devotion at any time she wishes.
Exceptional Success: Her body submits further to the rule of the mind, her Speed is multiplied by her Auspex dots, and she is no longer limited to obeying gravity.
This Devotion costs 4 Experiences to learn.

I wanted an infiltration power. Applying the Twilight Projection to Beast's Skin felt like the most logical step. It is more limited however, one can't stay in this shape forever, and one is much slower. Even with the Exceptional effect the Vampire lacks a lot of the mobility of this shape.
The secondary benefit of this power is that one can chase away pesky spies using the normal Twilight Projection, provided one can catch them.

Besides these, I also had an idea for two Celerity-based Devotions.
One that simply increased your speed and initiative by your Celerity dots for a scene. (Celerity + Resilience), and one pure Celerity devotion that allows the user to speed up extended actions, based on part of the Acceleration spell in Mage.
Though I haven't decided exact dot rankings for those yet.

I hate the word "normies" and I don't know why

Anne Rice's new book is out.
It's about Vampires and Atlantis.
The cover color accent is Awakening blue.
Hrrrrrrrrrm....

So I'm writing up some content for a Hunter game I'm gonna be running tomorrow and I want some music to help keep my juices flowing and potentially to play during the game.

The opener is going to be with two of the players being wannabe "ghostbusters", one of them being a homeless squatter, and the last one being a cop called in to investigate the trespassing. I'm thinking the house they're in could have ghouls locked in the basement or something that the two ghost hunters accidentally let out (they're gonna have an npc friend that I will have get nabbed by the ghouls to keep them from just leaving the house.)

Anyone got any good music to get me into that kind of low-leveled Hunter mindset?

As long as she leaves out wizards I'm fine with it.

That said, White Wolf might pounce on her, and try to bleed money out of her. They are going to be in competition regarding vampire tv series soon.

>White Wolf pounce on Anne Rice for similarities

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

I didn't say they were reasonable. But you know how companies are.

Considering one of the things listed in the 'inspirations' section of Masquerade and the largest bits of it can be tracked to Rice, they wouldn't dare.

If implies you are not and will never be normal. And that produces a feeling of anxiety of being rejected and divorced from people. when the fact of the matter is those feeling are completely normal. and everyone feels that from time to time

They can't be that stupid. They've cited Anne Rice as inspiration for Masquerade. If they tried to go after her she'd be able to destroy them.

Can you really look at Dracula and say that he can't possibly be that stupid?

I rest my fucking case.

>fashion dictates action

What? Since when was White Wolf getting a new Vampire TV show. I mean Kindred was entertaining and all but...seriously...since when?

Fine, Can you really look at how Dracula has spoken and acted, and say that he can't be that stupid?

They have lofty goals for a VtM TV series on Netflix by 2020.

user you're not even trying

There is literally an actual court document of ww trying to sue sony over underworld.

HISTORY over anecdotes user seriously

Well best I can do is Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underworld_(2003_film)#Legal_controversy

I dont have access to Lexus Nexus at the moment.

So. Is it a stupid idea to invent a Requiem Bloodline who can buy Strix powers?

How much do you like to keep living? That is a bloodline who is likely to have everyone eyeing them in suspicion.

Oh please. I bet it is quite possible to keep this additional curse a secret...

Yes... This will be great.

-Bane:: detachment is penalized by Blood Potency.
-Embracing is no longer a breaking point

Stylize them as Evil Nuns and Priests. Evil religious analogies.

"Hail Mary full of spite, let me dine on blood tonight. "

Vampire has delays because its developer had to take over running a decent chunk of the company, a problem they've noticed, rectified with a new hire, and the new book should be out in two weeks.

>-Bane:: detachment is penalized by Blood Potency.

Nah. That means that everyone above BP 5 is a guaranteed draug, since they can't succeed on detachment.

The strix wants to punish vampires and force them into horrible monsters. Making a deal with the devil should fuck you dearly

I wasn't thinking about a bloodline who dealt with the Strix to have their powers, I was more thinking an old-ass one, from ages back, before the clans were truly formed, from when there were less difference between strix and vampires.

>get invited to monday night VtM larp by friends, a game where you hang out in-character at a 40-person event of various clans from around the state and drink heavily
>everyone has a great time, lots of events unfolding, lots of political backstabbing for position/power/mischief, which my friends had told me is like 90% of the point and purpose of playing at these events
>now all my female friends are ooc furious at each other and not talking anymore because of their characters
I suddenly don't fucking understand anything

Yeah, that might work. I'd do it as a corrupted Julii remnant, if it was me? Not a Faustian arrangement, but an added curse on the survivors after they didn't honor their deal with the Strix in Rome. Victims of the Strix, but other Kindred don't trust them or know that.

Yeah, either that or some Mekhet bloodline connected to the primal dark, or something.

>Our vampires are different from yours/ elder masterrace vampires

Thats tried and tired trope. It doesn't bring anything to the game that isn't already there. Vampires are already Ancient old evils.

Now the idea of using the Strix as Djinn has a lot more potential and divorces itself from a perhistorical (and very antediluvian feeling) requirement.

There is nothing in the Strix powerbase that specifically needs a strix to emulate. You can use a custom discipline / devotions.

but hey your game. not my monkey not my problem

What are you talking about?

I'm talking about a throwback bloodline to ages past. Not necessarily super-old vampires. They would have access to the Dread Powers of the Strix, and that's not really that powerful. I mean, not compared to the powers of the Kerberoi or Khaibit.

vampires are already an extension/continuation/result of strix.
Making a bloodline off of them is simply redundant.

If you want to make a throw back bloodline. Look at old mythology. Think of bloodlines as photographs / flashpoints of vampire society. And how one vampire had taken something from mortals and persevered it into the modern nights.

Bloodlines based on myths and folklore are rich in flavor. Like the Wannabe Daeva Mecket were a reflect on the goth wannabe vamps of the 90s. And then there is the Siberian Nos whos bane is all about the frozen corpse on the mountain trail. The Kerberoi and Khaibit were based on Greak and Egpytian myths respectively. And it made sense. Because vamps would use those traps. maybe influencing or were influences by those mortal beliefs

>vampires are already an extension/continuation/result of strix.
>Making a bloodline off of them is simply redundant.

No. It's not. It is continuing to build on that theme.

I have a Bloodline of really ancient Egyptian vampires who believe Sekhmet was the first vampire. They only Embrace women (and even then very rarely), and there's only a small handful of them who are all pretty old.

Please Tell me their nickname is The Lioness

I thought she became a Christian and put aside all that Devil work?

The majority of things listed in the Underworld lawsuit aren't really even the creative insight of White Wolf to begin with. I also wouldn't really be surprised if they tried going after Vampire Diaries or Teen Wolf. There was that one talk he gave where Dracula said they'd be cracking down on "people a little too inspired" by WoD, and my first thoughts were Dresden Files. I basically expected a rehash of the Underworld lawsuit, except that on anyone possible. It's one of the earliest reasons I disliked Dracula.

What's the point of being able to buy Dread Powers like a Strix?

Ok, first off you're going to need to warn the players to investigate before they attack. This is like a heist movie. If you want to do the prop they do from films with the pinboard (blueprints, photos, names etc.) they'll really groove to it.

Allow Contacts and Influence rolls, a lot of shady backalley meetings and "business dinners", make the fact there are backup servers the FIRST thing they find out, but the locations one of the LAST. A ticking clock is fine, but don't make it too short or you won't be able to cover the travel times to and from the servers. During this period the players get approached by a shadowy "Deep Throat" style character that throws them a bone - some useful lead or clue. If they cosy up to Deep Throat, lead them on a bit before they get asked "tell me, what do you really think about the Camarilla?" - seduce them, draw them over to the Sabbat without mentioning their name.

The Justicar arrival is the deadline. Every game start with "X nights until the Justicar arrives..."

Last thought, if these neonates were handpicked and embraced for the job, they'd probably have anti-terror, intelligence or police backgrounds, wouldn't they?

>what's a problem with getting in car and travelling this way?

If the cities are close to each other? Nothing at all. Problems start when you have to make a stop-off for the day. Better hope you have Meld Earth, what else you got? Sleep in the boot like Detective Knight and hope nobody jacks your car? Stay in a motel? What happens if the local Lupines smell you out while you sleep, sucker?