Who wins...

Who wins, assuming they're in a neutral base and all start on opposite sides of a large arena outside each others' range.

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Clone troopers is my bet, although the Federation and imperial guardsmen have the advantage of understanding the purpose of cover

clone troopers, as shown in the clone wars show as well as battlefront 2, value traditional guerilla and trench warfare tactics.

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Well, there's multiple things to consider here.

Whoever the Red Shirts open fire on first is going to get decimated. Phasers are really deadly and will punch through the armor of anyone they hit. However, the Red Shirts don't have much defense in turn, so they'll get shot to pieces pretty quickly.

The Terran Marines are likely to draw fire, due to their imposing stature, so will likely go down once the medic is taken out.

Ultimately, it comes down to the clones vs. the IG. I give the Clones the advantage due to slightly better armor and a more mobile combat style, while the IG stay mostly stationary. However, close combat could be a game changer if the IG get stuck in after hitting with their flamers. A chainsword is going to intimidate anyone, Clones included (I'm assuming the Commisar has a chainsword, since it is their standard equipment loadout.)

Real question, are redshirts bullet attraction wears off when they aren't near any federation main character they need to make look good?
I mean, are they supposed to be competent lore-wise? Sorry, I'm shit when it comes to Star Trek.

the federation is supposed to have held off the klingons for years, so redshirts should be at least competent.

Or the klingons are idiots, which is frankly what a lot of on screen evidence indicates.


Either way, trek phasers can't even penetrate crates. I don't see them menacing body armor.

I want to just write off the Terran Marines as not even in this fight seeing how even in universe they're considered amazingly expendable. They do however have a rifle that is fully capable of bringing down lowly zerglings up to Protoss Carriers considering it's a (semi) man-portable railgun. So 5 marines + medic could do some serious damage at range provided they keep a distance. The armor is just too look badass and apply wicked decal art too....and also for hazardous environment protection. Not for actual bullets for some reason.

I give it to the terrain marines, who share a similar disregard for their lives as the other non-trekkie factions, but have powered armor, combat drugs, and guns with demonstrable anti-vehicle capability.

They also vaporize granite boulders, so your mileage may vary.

phasers have varying levels of deadliness, able to vaporise even massive boulders or just knock a person out.

Maximum setting phasers on wide dispersal are insanely deadly. I think they've just casually disintegrated buildings just to prove a point to people.

technically phasers could act like giant erasers if they actually put it in that setting doubly so for phaser rifles

Gonna go with Terran Marines as well. Assuming that everyone uses cover, sensible squad tactics and that every squad member on all sides has gone through combat operations.

They're ammo is gonna punch through all of the Cadian carapace armor and the non-armored redshirts are on a timer if they don't set up a proper ambush. Clone troopers come in second with Cadians coming in with a close third.

How good is the micro for the marines?

assume they're CPU controlled.

Red shirts have a long convo about the situation and pick off the stragglers afterwards.

How much cover is on the map?
Because of a smaller squad size (and most likely better armour save) the Terran marines can effectively hide behind objects to block off line of sight to them. It would be much easier to hide 5 marines + medic than trying to hide 10 guys.

>All sides move in
>All but marines take cover as marines are now stimmed up
>Redshits fire, Marines drop
>Guardsmen fire at Redshirts. They miss. Redshirts die anyway
>Surviving marines huddle around Medic who keeps them alive, taking out clones
>Not before heavy weapons clone shoots Guardsmen promethium tank.
>Guardsmen go up in a ball of flame
>Commissar is slightly angry his coat gets singed Charges heavy weapons clone and bisects the unfortunate.
>Clones and Marine gun down Commissar but not before he can put one between the eyes of the Medic as a final 'fuck you'.
>Surviving redshirts treknobabble their way to causing a feedback into surviving marine armor. They seize up, and bend backwards, killing the wearer as their spine bends in a direction not humanly possible.
>Redshirts fire on surviving clones. Clones fire on Redshirts.
>Both lose weapons
>Breaks out into a brawl as clones use Mandalorian martial arts and Redshirts ball their hands into a hammer and smack the clones again and again.
>Somehow one redshirt survives the scrum, declared victor
>Dies of heart attack

>Marines using stim right off the bat in a free for all scenario
Stopped reading there.

this is canon.

your loss

Red shirts have the best tech but I have never fucking seen starfleet be compitent at small unit tactics so they'd probably get ganked by the 501st who'd pick up their phasers and win. The 501st has the best training of the groups, the best tactics of the groups and have a full squad. The marines are the only thing really threatening here, unless red shirts become competent at ground engagements and learn how to fucking use cover, or just generally not be the worst fucking marine/security force.

Really these fights always piss me off because Trek has such bullshit capabilities but everyone in the universe is a bunch of fucking idiots. By every right each of these groups should win but there's always a toss up because phasers disintegrate everything and maximum spread basically makes it so you can't miss. Hell the IG has better tactics than the Federation most of the time. The IG. People who have groups that believe that standing in Napoleonic box formations is a good idea in the 41st millennium have better tactics. Don't get me wrong I love Trek, it's one of my go to shows to watch but holy shit are things stacked in their favor so much, but they aren't even smart enough to use it.

TL;DR 501st should win but Redshirts because of Trek tech have like a 50% chance or more of wining.

>Who wins

I'd say either the Clone Troopers or the Terran Marines.

Unless of course the Trekkies get to shoot first in every single encounter because then they'd just win: phasers are EXTREMELY fucking powerful. Phasers have multiple settings from the lowest being to stun, to the highest being able to melt rock, disintegrate living tissue, cut through metal like a welding torch, etc..
Trekkies though don't have armor and they come from a post-scarcity high-culture civilization; they realistically wouldn't have a stomach for gritty, personal, combat and you do get points for attitude. Terrans, Clone Troopers and Warhammer 'umies all have that drive to kill.


I'm discrediting the Warhammer soldiers because I'm under the impression that their equipment is neither advanced enough or quality enough and that they rely too much on numbers and orbital bombardment. I could be totally wrong though- They're the odd man out for me personally in terms of my awareness, so feel free to correct me if I'm completely wrong.

here's how I'd break it down. As anons have said, whomever the redshirts fired at would be decimated, but possibly not wiped out. their incredibly fragile leadership and lack of actual armor would have them wiped out in a ground battle.

the space marines are tactical and coordinated, but don't have very good direction due to their criminal status and getting drugged up. medics would help, but if and when the medic was killed, it'd be over.

guardsmen have the advantage of range, but do not have very high survivability. However, a commissar bolstering them would keep them focused and wipe out whomever they set their flashlights on. As well, having an advantage in melee may be a gamechanger due to their flamers and the commissar.

the clone troopers are, individually, elite forces. Nothing they have stands out, but their all around balance could decide the encounter in their favour.

But again, the early elimination via the redshirts could decide this battle.

IG soldiers are cannon fodder, but they're the best of the best of the normal human encampments, and much of their fighting is done on the ground, with trench warfare. squadrons are lucky to have artillery or improved weaponry, but the lasguns they have, while not powerful, have a long range giving them an edge over blasters or machine guns.

forgot pic

Their Lasguns aren't powerful in their setting.

Truth is, a Lasgun really deadly against an unarmored or lightly armored human. The Flashlight jokes come about due to the IG constantly fighting opponents that are so far beyond humans in durability.

In an IG vs Redshirt engagement the winner is whichever one shoots first, as each carries a weapon that can one shot the other. IG Carapace armor, while superior to the standard issue Flak armor, will not stop a phaser set to kill. The redshirts on the other hand are literally wearing shirts, no armor.

Not sure how Lasguns would fare against the clone trooper armor and I imagine they'd have some trouble with the Marines.

ill bet on redshirts....

but not overly confident.

I generally agree with you but I think you're underselling the 501st, and Marines to some level and overselling the Guard.

My Rankings:

501st Clone Troopers
Leadership 3-4
Tactics 3
Weapons 3
Armor 3
Survivability 3

IG Troopers
Leadership 5
Tactics 3
Weapons 2
Armor 2
Survivability 2

Terran Marine
Leadership 2
Tactics 3
Weapons 3
Armor 5
Survivability 2

Starfleet Redshirts
Leadership 2
Tactics 1
Weapons 5
Armor 0
Survivability 2

remember that space marine power armor isn't nearly as powerful as space marine power armor. In fact, I'd be surprised if it's even as good as SoB power armor, as it's made of neosteel instead of ceramite. I think lasguns would have some issues penetrating it, but not nearly as much as they would penetrating ceramite or wraithbone armor.

I think lasguns would be equivalent to the clone trooper blasters, albeit having a longer range. As well, their carapace armor, I think, would let them take a few shots from the clone trooper blasters or marine machine guns which, if you'll remember in canon, fire quickly, but without a huge amount of punch, similar to the lasgun.

Second thought Marines would probably have survivability 3 not 2.

>trek phasers can't even penetrate crates
Are you thinking of tricorders

don't forget though, that the 501st doesn't have an APC trooper to command them, so they're effectively moving as a squad, but without a leader to command them, they're making their own decisions.

that said, 501st troopers are incredibly elite on their own. I stand by their 2 in leadership.

The power armor would be comparable to Astartes or Soroitos armor. Not as good but comparable.
Blasters would have more punch than a lasgun but worse range. in 40k terms something like 18 inch range S4 AP6 or AP- Assualt 2. I think the Gauss Rifle as OP said is comprable to a Bolter. I don't remember them having low penetration or punch qualities according to cannon, but I'll admit it's been a while.

I guess the important thing to ask at this point is what is average? Is it three, is it two? Because right now I'm working off of three as average for a trained military.

I think 3 would be average, but without an actual commander, a unit, no matter how well trained, will do what it feels is best.

remember that terran marines are the dominion/terran people's basic footsoldier in galactic warfare, comparable to the IG. Their armor might be equivalent to sororitas armor, but definitely not the level of astartes.

We talking seasoned clones or shinies?

redshirts are out because they're redshirts.

Marines probably have the best gear. But they're outnumbered. Their medics are pretty neat, though.

Clones have shit for armour.

The commissar is probably a bit redundant unless they get into melee.

501 are usually elite troops.

501st are all the best of the best of the original jango clones.


>Clones have shit for armour.
kek, no they don't.

>The commissar is probably a bit redundant unless they get into melee.
commissars are next level commanders who will keep the guardsmen unified and under control and keep their morale high.

>I think 3 would be average, but without an actual commander, a unit, no matter how well trained, will do what it feels is best.
True, but these aren't normal troopers. This is like saying 10 veteran Rangers have below average leadership abilities, and that's just wrong. The major problem with this comparison is that it's a bunch of mooks fighting it out with one squad of elite troops. They will be better trained, and have better knowledge and control of the battlefield. In the Clone War series we see small squads quickly identify leaders and promote them to command positions. This would be no different.

>remember that terran marines are the dominion/terran people's basic footsoldier in galactic warfare, comparable to the IG. Their armor might be equivalent to sororitas armor, but definitely not the level of astartes.
Your right I should have only compared it to the equivalent of sororitas armor, which is still damn impressive. It's still a 3+ save and I believe toughness four.

fair enough, maybe clones would have 3 across the board then.

>Your right
*You're right
My mistake sorry.

Gotta go with the clone troopers on this one. Unlike the others, they're born and bred for war and are probably the best trained and best equipped out of the 4 options. The DC-15 is already a heavy blaster, so the special weapon they're carrying is going to be pretty devastating. A Z-6 is going to chew through anyone's armor, and a quad-blaster will do the same, as well as destroy light cover.

Carapace armor, not Flak.

Terran armour has never been shown to be super effective though.

501st legion are the best trained of these guys; I'd firmly bet on them. Redshirts are a wild card as even though there's virtually 0% chance of them coming on top, as stated before whatever is on the receiving end of their phasers is going to die before they do.

I'd say threes in everything but tactics which would have a four, these are the best of the best elite troops after all. Frankly that might up their survivability as well, 501st are pretty hardcore. They are the favored force in my opinion. Now if it were just regular clones and not the 501st that's a whole different story. I'd say that your original ranking system is actually a perfect representation of your standard clone squad. Average across the board in everything, but a dip in leadership because no Sgt. or Lt. with them.

The more I think about it the more I agree with you. It has a bunch of augmentations that help the wearer but physical protection is somewhat lacking.

All these SW and 40Kids wankery. Star Trek wins due to thickest PLOT ARMOUR. You can have all of the Red Shirts killed and the mission will still be successful somehow due to some mindfuckery, seduction or technobabble. No contest.

Under normal circumstances I'd agree with you, but I'd expect the other factions would tend to target them first since they look scary. I don't know the exact effectiveness of SW/40K weapons against their armor, but phasers can be scary when the Federation wants someone gone.

Then the clones and IG would turn on the redshirts because they just rekt an entire team, and the redshirts would die really quickly due to rapid-fire weapons vs clothing being a really one-sided engagement.

Then it comes down to clones vs IG, and I'd probably give it to the clones since I think their weapons and armor are probably a little better (iirc lasguns are supposed to be laser .50 weapons, whereas blasters cut through that armored door in the beginning of ANH). They're probably also slightly better combatants since they're all clones of an extremely effective individual and theoretically bring some of his exceptional strength, reflexes, etc to the party.

There are no trek writers involved here, so their gay plot armor is not in effect.

>I don't know the exact effectiveness of SW/40K weapons against their armor
Marines get blown apart by a short volley of hydralisk spines. Their armor is not that great. It's more an exoskeleton than an armored suit. Lisk spines are probably equal to some 'nid weapon like the Spine Rifle or Fleashboarer which are standard issue small arms of the Tyranids.

Hydralisk spines shoot apart tanks, mechs, and shielded space elf walkers too. And in case you forgot, tyranids can pry open 40k muhreenz, too.

These aren't normal animals and shouldn't be thought of as such. They're AFVs that look like mantis cockroach snakes.

Not saying they aren't horrible death insects, I'm just giving a reasonable comparison from one universe to another.

I think most people are vastly overestimating the combat potential of a sc marine. In SC2 a marine has 45 hp and deals 6 damage base, a zergling 35 hp and 5 damage base. Assuming the scythe-like talons of a zergling and a hormagaunt's scything talons are more or less the same, save at WS 3 instead of 4, that would mean it takes 9 attacks on average to kill a marine and 8 average to kill a guardsman.

Compare this to the damage marine and guardsman deal to their respective insectoid foes, a guardsman need 6 lasgun shots to down a gaunt, and a marine 6 to down a zergling.

The guardsmen are basically just 2x the terrans plus 2 flamers and a commissar who has twice the normal health and twice three times the melee ability with just a pistol and regular sword. The guardsmen also have fragmentation grenades.

Storm troopers in empire at war have 40 health per 9 men and deal 1 damage per hit. Assuming similar armor, this is about 4.44 shots per kill, so S 4 AP - or 8 damage per attack.

I think it's safe to assume marine armor, clone laminate, and carapace armor are all of equal protective quality. The result are 3 squads of very similar composition and then the federation cucks who are running around with handheld nukes, wearing nothing but diapers. I would say combat training, fire discipline, and combat experience would remove the trekkies from the equation, then it comes down to who brings the most utility and the most tactical flexibility.

>all of them vs 1 book accurate mobe infantryman

They have a medic though. Burn those stim packs and go to town.

Hell if you want to get creative, have the medic blind the commissar for giggles.

Terrans have healing (3 per second, or somewhere between the damage of one guardsman and 1 clone), next to no training, no hand-to-hand capabilities, and relatively short range weaponry. They throw out 30 damage a "round," or 5/6 of one guardsman/clone. They also have a total of 285 health including 60 for the medic.

The clones have one support weapon of what is probably impressive power, a superb training regimen, limited hand-to-hand capability, and relatively short range weaponry. They can toss out excess of 80 dpr or enough to take out 1.77 guardsmen. They have a total of 450 health.

The guard have two heavy weapons in the form of flamers, support weapons in the form of fragmentation grenades, average training, perfect discipline (so long as the commissar lives), a dedicated close-combat specialist, and comparatively long range weaponry. They deal 60 dpr at long range, 126 dpr with the commissar's pistol range, and 114 + 2(flamer) dpr at close range. Or 1.3/2.6/lots guardsmen. They have a total of 540 health.

Seems to me the guard come out on top in just about every situation. Too far away, they can poke and you can't hit them, too close and you get rapid-fired and flamed. They even have the backup of charging into melee where they can throw assault grenades and get their chopping machine into the thick of things. They can also suffer the most casualties and have a replacement for their heavy weapon. They even get a sergeant as a secondary melee combatant.

Who's microing the marines? As long as they stutter step correctly I imagine they'll beat everyone.

Terran Marines with ease. Lore-wise their guns are accurate and lethal out to like 10 kilometers, so they kill anyone else as soon as they get over the horizon. The range difference is huge, and they have the firepower to kill everyone else.

Redshirts hit the hardest, but they will never get in range.

They all get nuked, that's a stupid one to bring in.

where did I say the guardsmen have grenade launchers?

ever?

they are a standard squad of 10 with carapace armor, 2 flamers and a commissar

>The guardsmen also have fragmentation grenades.
>where did I say the guardsmen have grenade launchers?
>What is reading comprehension?
Guardsmen come standard with fragmentation grenades, as in those things you pull a pin out of and lob at people.

Its a bit disingenuous to not only mix game mechanics and fluff but to pick and mix game mechanics across lines to make yours seem better.

>Disingenuous
>A thought experiment in a thought experiment thread about fictional universes
I chose game mechanics because lore can be arbitrary and inconsistent, maybe it doesn't reflect the truth of the fiction, but I don't think any other source can claim to either.
also
>to make yours seem better
>implying im not a federation fag and just butt-mad i know my guys would't stand a chance

Terran Marines. Might not be the best trained but the only reason the Zerg/Protoss get as close as they do it tunneling or portals.

Canonically they have an INSANE range thanks to their bog standard gun being a railgun that can penetrate pretty much anything they fire at and the shit they survive being hit by can kill tanks and intergalactic space cruisers anyway.

Clones get overated as fuck because while they are the best of the best of the best in Star Wars......

It's still Star Wars. They are still as retarded as the rest of the guys willing to use blasters over solid weapons and their armour is next to useless.

Cadians also cover the same territory as them but have more training. Cadians are trained from birth to fight abominations from beyond the stars that can create plagues and summon storms as well as guys who are essentially walking tanks.

The Red Shirts canonically are meant to be extremely good at what they do in ship to ship boarding actions and they have been doing what they do against Romulans (10x human speed and strength) and Klingons (1-2x) while maintaining an advantage. Plus they have the best weapon out of any on this list as long as they get in range since they can literally remove matter from existence and any red shirt with half a brain could just turn his phaser into a bomb and disintegrate the rest.

Especially if he's a post DS9 Red Shirt ala the MMO and has the shit they equip such as portable shields.

Stim is an upgrade, just like the listed heavy weapons, specialists, or equipment. Unless OP wants to alter the question, the marines don't bring them to this fight.

A blind commissar still has sight range of 1 which means he can still command and execute his squad and fight fine in melee, so blinding him does nothing other than removing the threat of one las pistol. Scary.

>removing one .50 cal tier weapon

The clones and Red Shirts wouldn't be able to survive the lasguns on any level. Clone Armour isn't remotely as capable as carapace or even flak in terms of protection. It never got featured showing a guy who took a direct hit surviving a blaster shot despite Leia surviving one while wearing a cloak.

She'd be fucked if a lasgun hit her. Let alone a phaser or terran railgun.

Lore is unclear as to whether or not romulans maintain vulcan--like strength. Their biology has changed enough that klingon blood was a better match for ribosome transfusion (dont quote me on the details of that). Vulcan strength is also generally associated with evolving and growing up on high-gravity vulcan. Further, their are no instances outside of the 2009 movie showing romulans having anything but human strength.

Also most redshirts don't operate ships near either neutral zone or any sort of combat area, even then boarding actions were rare and generally agreed to be unfavorable situations for federation forces.

A-are you drunk, user?
Cuz I have no idea what you are trying to say. I was saying the most a terran medic could accomplish with a blind would be limit a commissar's shooting, which would be less effective than limiting a plain old guardsman's. Hell if starcraft rules still apply, his teammates' sight would let him shoot anyway.

Don't know what the whole leia thing is about.

Redshits never show any of these informed abilities, ever. If we go by what we see, the redshirts will be dead in the opening salvos as they stand around pulling their puds with their phasers set to 'tickle gently.'

>only reason the Zerg/Protoss get as close as they do it tunneling or portals.
Lore-wise, the Protoss are really fucking overpowered and the only reason they can't win is because they're few in number and full of arrogance, and the Zerg are the Zerg.

The Terrans are kinda fucked on both fronts, if not for the Zerg having to fight the Protoss and vice-versa. Well than, and their weapons are pretty capable, even if they can't take a hit nowhere near as well as the Protoss. But that's to be expected since Lore Protoss are same level of bullshit as Lore Space Marines, maybe even more.

The Protoss are staggeringly militarily incompetent. Incredibly stupid. Unbelievably so. Even with their limited numbers, they could've won the war otherwise.

Well, it is their first war in a long time. They had to resort to digging up thousand year old war machines to stay afloat.

I mean, they're bad. The Brits fought stone age ooga boogas who understood war better.

Phasers a shit. And redshirts are worse shots than stormies

Let's add these guys to the fray

i feel like 501st should have a lot more survivability.

Cus Vader's Fist.

If you ask me, i'd bet my money on the guys trained from birth to fighting eldritch horrors, walking tanks and genetically engineered warmongers.

I'm more interested in the question if any of those four could beat a single regular space marine from really any chapter.

>I'm more interested in the question if any of those four could beat a single regular space marine from really any chapter.
Terran Marines and Red Shirts definitely can kill a Space Marine with their weapons, the question is whether they can get the drop on him.

A Clone Trooper probably could also find a Star Wars weapons that can punch through a Space Marine.

>501st legion
>Literally one of the good groups of troopers
>Has members that take down dozens of droids like its nothing

My bet is on them.

In tabletop all of them will beat single marine. But in lore or whatever maybe terrans could beat 1 marine.

I know almost nothing of Star Craft lore, care to explain?

(The Protoss incompitance, I mean. Not the Ooga boogas.)

A good commissar will also know exactly how to kill a guardsmen for insubordination right before he would die anyway to maximize moral with minimal loss.

I apologise, ive only watched the 3d animated series

Jesus Christ this thread is RETARDED.

The EU was RETCONNED. None of it was canon, although none of it was even really canon because it for the most part, directly contradicted the movies. We know from the Clone Wars 3D Show that Clones are RETARDED and can't hit the broadside of a fucking barn. They fire at battle droids who are only ten meters away and miss most of their shots.

I'd say the Star Trek security team would win, but like the Clones they suffer from complete and utter retardation.

This is a fight between the Imperial Guardsmen and Terran Marines, with it being rather hard to call on account of the guardsmen having more dudes but having weapons that render Terran armor pretty useless.

*and having weapons that render terran armor useless

However, the power armor the terran marines use give them highly advanced sensors that will render most sneaking impossible, so they're gonna know where everybody else is during the firefight, which gives them one hell of an advantage. Plus they have assisted aiming.

The Clones and Security Team will open fire at each other, and fail to hit anything for an hour.

>having weapons that render Terran armor pretty useless.
I'm actually not sure a flashlight can make short work of a Marine suit, they regularly tank heavier stuff both in game and in lore, and they're pretty well sealed against the environment, so a flamer is also not instant death.

It'd probably get through eventually, though.

>and any red shirt with half a brain could just turn his phaser into a bomb and disintegrate the rest.
This would make for an interesting tactic. Have 3 redshirts set their weapons to over load and throw them in the general direction of each enemy unit. They still have 7 usable weapons, and have potentially done horrific damage to the other teams (or if you believe some of the older shows destroyed the entire complex).
Granted that would mean the redshirts had tactics and that is far from a given.

You mean those advanced sensors which completely block their vision of anything that is farther away than 20 meters and fail to detect anything underground or invisible?

Have you played Starcraft? Flamers wreck their shit hard.

>If you ask me, i'd bet my money on the guys trained from birth to fighting eldritch horrors, walking tanks and genetically engineered warmongers.

...You mean all of them except for the red shirts?

Yes I have actually, quite a lot, and I've read a bunch of the lore. They last through flamers enough to let off a bunch of shots, nowhere near instakill, and I doubt a man portable IG flamer is anywhere near what an upgraded Hellion or a Firebat can bring to bear.

Also be careful about bringing the games as an argument, because Starcraft units never, ever miss a shot.

And the Terran Marines, who are mainly conscripted prisoners.
And from what i know, Droids aren't quite on the same level as Chaos Demons/Space Marines, Orks and psykers gone mad.

>never, ever miss a shot.
Actually, lemme correct myself, they do miss sometimes in the original game, under a very rate set of circumstances.

Terran Power armor is incredibly thin and focused on kinetic energy absorbtion IIRC, not thermal, which is completely different. Lasguns meanwhile on high settings can vaporize an entire man's head, and can be fired at full auto and, as a laser, are both instant and do not miss. Not to mention that if these are cadians, they have a 90% accuracy rating in firefights, under stress. Terrans do NOT want to test if their armor stands up to lasguns. Better to make use of their firepower and suppress the guardsmen.

>psykers gone mad
Sounds an awful lot like jedi and sith.

>You can't miss with a laser
no

I don't believe that those Flamers would be so different that they make a real difference. After all, let's just consider what both factions are fighting and using them against.

I also just noticed that i missread your post. You're right, it's not quite instakill.

Are you really comparing a Tzeentchian Psyker to a Jedi?

>Terran Power armor is incredibly thin and focused on kinetic energy absorbtion IIRC
It's thin by Starcraft standards, but they can still stand up to a couple hits of almost anything that universe can throw at them (including lasers, which the Terrans have plenty of in their arsenal)

Also, there's quite a lot of metal to vaporize before the laser can hit anything vital, and as the amount of vaporized metal in the air increases, lasers lose their effectiveness quickly.

All that aside, Marines also quite handily outrange Guardsmen, both in weapons range and vision range.