/STG/ Star Trek General

The Iconians Are Behind This! Edition

Previous thread A thread for discussing the Star Trek franchise and its various tabletop iterations.

Possible topics include the rpgs by FASA, Last Unicorn Games and Decipher, the Starfleet Battles Universe and WizKid's Star Trek: Attack Wing miniatures and game, and Star Trek in general.

Game Resources

FASA's RPG
>mediafire.com/folder/9mt7sng56l8gg/Star_Trek_RPG_(FASA)
mediafire.com/folder/cwn8tbt2qm5t4/FASATREK_Adventures

Last Unicorn Game's RPG
>mediafire.com/folder/9eiysv2192ods/Star_Trek_RPG_(LUG)
-Official and Fanmade Resources
>coldnorth.com/memoryicon/

Decipher's RPG
>mediafire.com/folder/c6tb7p6dp0pye/Star_Trek_RPG_(Decipher)
-Fan Supplements
>strpg.patrickgoodman.org

Far Trek
>mediafire.com/folder/lrhbz9l0qay0j/Far_Trek

Lasers & Feelings
>onesevendesign.com/laserfeelings/

Lore Resources

Memory Alpha - Canon wiki
>en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Portal:Main

Ex Astris Scientia - Fan analyses of ships, tech and continuity issues
>ex-astris-scientia.org

Daystrom Institute Technical Library - Database of ships and technology
>ditl.org

Star Trek LCARS Blueprints Database - Ship schematics, deck plans and recognition manuals
>cygnus-x1.net/links/lcars/blueprints-main2.php

Star Trek Maps - Based on the Star Trek Star Charts, updated and corrected
>startrekmap.com/index.html

Star Trek Cartography - Information and maps
>stdimension.org/int/

/stg/ Errata

The Adventures of the Ark Royal Crew (an /stg/ setting)
>1d4chan.org/wiki/Ark_Royal

The history of Klingon Civil Rights/Star Trek artwork (more /stg/ headcanon)
>klingonhistory.weebly.com/

Other urls found in this thread:

youtube.com/watch?v=_IMBUa7w9K4
deviantart.com/art/OSB-Advent-Suits-130139430
imdb.com/name/nm0551234/?ref_=ttfc_fc_cl_t4
twitter.com/SFWRedditVideos

So, I know, I know. NuTrek doesn't measure up. At all.

But of the people who DID see Beyond, did anybody seriously not like Jaylah or IIIIII CAN'T STAND IT...

Generations does have all the makings of a good story, but I can't forgive them for killing Kirk on a literal bridge, and I can't forgive them for making Picard a dunce, or for making Data a stupid fuckwit with the emotion chip.

The best solution, was to go back in time before Soren betrayed Geordi and Data. Picard could have ordered more security... and if necessary, used Kirk as his ace in the hole.

>going back in time to stop the Borg from destroying the El Aurian homeworld, and Picard and Kirk meeting that way

I'd watch it. But yeah, it would invalidate First Contact. But, I'm also in the minority in that I don't like any of the TNG movies. I wish I did.

It happens. The Combs is fantastic.

I've occasionally thought about how to fix Generations... problem is surface alterations like that or say, putting the klingons in a proper cruiser so they have a real fight, having Kirk ram the stardrive section into them so the saucer can escape, all that just doesn't fix the underlying problems of the story.

The themes are good, the characters decent enough, the execution... Well it's not surprising it turned out this way given how long it took to put together. Too much was lost in script edits, re-writes and revisions over and over, so the filmed results couldn't even be fixed in editing (and in some cases harmed by it, removing scenes that would have explained more).

It could be polished, which might take it up from mediocre to passable, but Generations is too flawed a film to 'fix' without a complete do-over.

Well considering they were told to write the story as they were writing the last season, and go straight into preproduction after filming of TNG had wrapped, I'm not surprised.

Moreover, they'd never helmed a feature film before, so that didn't help.

I wish that time, talent, and passion could have come together to give us all a great TNG film. Instead, well, the Enterprise-D is destroyed by a 20 year decommissioned bird of prey in the hands of a rogue klingon house, and then the saucer section is crashed by someone who should never have been allowed at the helm, an action which undermines said someone's character even further than TNG already had.

As promised in previous threads, more screenshots of the TOS themed ships.

Take of the thread anons, for now I seek the sweet oblivion of sleep.

The way I see it, ultimately, the issue is that TNG's characterization and development just wasn't suited to a film, not the same way TOS had been. It's not as if I dislike the TNG crew, but they're far less like the sort of companions the original crew was and, thus, unlikely to be the good basis for a movie when they don't have the normal conventions of the series to fall back on.

The DS9 team, though...if they'd given THEM movies, that shit would have been gold, I think.

Is this from Star Trek Online?

Agreed. There's also the fact that non-action sci-fi movies don't generally do well. So, Star Trek action movies are what gets made.

This isn't to say action is bad - Star Trek II is both one of the smartest and actiony of the Trek movies, as is Star Trek VI.

The issue is that the TNG cast is ill-suited to that sort of thing. They were always the ones trying to find a better way, and none of the case was as tightly connected as Kirk, Spock, and Bones.

>DS9 movies

I can only hope they would have been good. But, I kind of think it's better that it ended and while maybe the ending wasn't everything we wanted, at least the series didn't go out with a whimper.

Most certainly.

Sleep for reals now.

Anything new with the USS Ark Royal and Dave Innatubes?

Just what's on the 1d4chan page, I think.

I meant to do some work on the page and I promised in an earlier thread to do so.

Then work started to get busy. It is still busy.

I have not forgotten. As soon as I have some time I will do so.

So is almost every image in these threads, go lurkmoar

what do you guys think of the original pitch of "In the Pale Moonlight"

in it jake would have discovered sisko and garak's devilish tactics in bringing the romulans into the war against the dominion and driven a wedge between them

I think having a character there just for sake of pointing out that what hey were doing was morally bankrupt would have lessened the experience. Sisko knows well that what he's doing is fucked up. He essentially spends the entire episode rationalising so that he can live with himself. We don't need it spelled out because what really makes the performance excellent is the fact that Sisko is so uncomfortable with it. He can't bring himself to say that it's explicitly wrong until the very end, when he has convinced himself that the ends justify the means.

Nor do we need someone to instigate conflict between Garak and Sisko, because it's inevitable. Sisko gets used by Garak. He doesn't see the real game until Garak has already finished it. He was just a pawn, like the Senator, like the blue fish-fuck guy. And that's the point that breaks him, as an officer, as a man. I think that any attempt to have Jake as the voice of morality would have been ham-fisted. Something along the lines of him saying "I'm dissapointed in you, dad".


Also
>Jake
>playing a significant role in a storyline
Pretty much the only thing i hate more than the "allemoraine" people is a Jake-centric storyline. That boy is just insufferable.

So what was the worst executed races from concepts that were ok on paper but horrible when done. We already went over the Pakled race. What are the other races that /stg/ think were done awfully?
To be honest, Jake was such a little pussy of a character in DS9, it's sad that Nog as a character grew so much by the end of the show while Jake didn't.

Nog - His dad was a waiter that became the septic tank repair dude of the station and was even discouraged from going to school. Went on to join the academy, passed with good grades, became a war hero and become a Starfleet captain.

Jake - Father was a Starfleet captain, ship designer and religious icon. Encouraged to go to school, given every break, wasted every opportunity, pussied out of every fight and did nothing with his life.

I don't care if he's barely more than 4 foot tall. If shit gets real I would rather have the big eared midget by my side because he is fucking badass.

the "Alamarain" people
>on paper
A race that is obsessed with games and have developed impressive, frightening technology for the sole purpose of having a good time.
>on screen
youtube.com/watch?v=_IMBUa7w9K4

This one will be a little bit more controversial but...

The Bajorans.
>on paper
A once prosperous, unified, space faring species, reduced to refugees, terrorists and slaves. Their homeworld raped and pillaged, their gods debased, their history forgotten, their people abused in any and every way the Cardassians could think of. Even now, after their liberation, they are a broken and scattered people. How can they ever be what they once were? How can they move past the most horrific moment in their history? Can they ever be unified like they were? Bajor is now one of the most important worlds in the quadrant. All of this should move things to a breaking point where the Bajorans will either come together and heal or turn on themselves and devolve into chaos.
>on screen
REMEMBER THE 15 GORILLION! GIVE REPARATIONS TO MY FARM OR ELSE!

The Kazon
>on paper
A nomadic, confrontational people. The Kazon lay claim to a vast area of space. Dozens of species fear them as raiders. But they spend most of their time fighting each other for spurious reasons.
>on screen
Shit, discount Klingons

i didnt get a "bootleg klingon" feel from the kazon at all

they just seemed like generic angry space tribals

and i agree i fucking hate the bajorans s1 of ds9 was the most fucking boring shit ever thanks to them

To be perfectly honest, humans really are incredibly shallowly developed in this show. It kind of makes me ill every time they avoid talking about personal belief. It almost seems like a society wide taboo or something. Like if you say you believe in something beyond what you can see or touch, then every other human will look at you if you're crazy. It is really very annoying. Having faith in something is not a weakness, it's a strength. I think Jake was possibly unintended example of this. He didn't really believe in anything so was kind of an aimless character. He had no overwhelming drive in anything even his writing since he had lived such a sheltered life even if he had a lot of tragic events in it. He just seemed as character not to be able to process it really. I don't think Jake ever really confronted the trauma and lost, he just held it in.

The humans in that show are more evolved than you, hence believing in magic is frowned on.

Then why aren't we educating the less evolved creatures like the Bajorans who still cling to their cave man superstitions?

Which is even more retarded than you make it sound considering that magic is proven to exist and extensively documented in the Star Trek universe.

>Then why aren't we educating the less evolved creatures like the Bajorans who still cling to their cave man superstitions?
Because since the Prophets are real, the Fed are afraid to piss them off and to actually be wrong about their gods not existing. Because the Bajoran gods could slap your shit hard if you're a prick which Star Fleet does tend to be a times.
OH BTW Q IS GOD! ALL FED ATHEISTS BTFO! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!
That was a great episode, too bad Picard is too thick to get the point.
>The humans in that show are more evolved than you, hence believing in magic is frowned on.
Then Q shows up and literally does magic tricks in front of you.

Look, if Kirk was able to beat a bunch of demi-gods and klingons were able to kill a god with their disruptors, what sorta chances do you think a bunch of worm hole inhabiting beings have against people who can either invert tachyon energy flow and reverse the polarity of tetryon molecules to destroy the wormhole or a bunch of warriors who would and could punch gods out of existence?

Because no god in classical mythology has ever died.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!
Well, even demigods can be idiots but if they true god like beings that didn't need equip, to control little kids, or a rage god that needed to troll people to get his power. If those situations don't apply then I DON'T CARE IF YOU'RE KIRK YOU ARE FUCKED! Q or anyone around even half his power level would rekt everybody's shit in Trek without trying.

>Because no god in classical mythology has ever died.

What is Balder.
What is Dionysis.
What is Quetzalcoatl.
What is Jesus.
What is Osiris.

That was kind of my point.

Yes, but a lot of those bastards that do die come back from the dead, too. Which is not something even the bastards in Trek can do all the time with a few exceptions, of course. How would you even put up a fight to something like a Q? If a TNG or TOS race just had all their tech turned off what could they do?

Depends which race and what bullshit magic they have.

I downloaded this from a sci-fi art thread, and it made me wonder who or what is Boucher? I couldn't find it in the wiki and Google keeps giving me someone else's page. Can you help me out?

Am I the only on e that really likes how the Kelvin constitution class looks with the reman prototype shield?

Looks pretty badass. If you could put an enormous glowing green skull and crossbones on the saucer section it would be perfect.

A character created by the artist:
deviantart.com/art/OSB-Advent-Suits-130139430

No offense but that makes it look like your ship switched out it's engines for two 'planet killers'. I don't know if that was the look you were going for but that's what I think anyway. Imho it looks a little weird but I was never a fan of JJtrek.

Ha, I can switch the blue nacelle coloring for orange and really complete the look.

>Tier 7 ships get introduced
>All of them come with nacellas that are actually small sized planet killers
>Each ship comes with a special ability "Dual pure antiproton beam barrage"

Thanks. I know it's a fursona (what's the equivalent with scalies?), but I would still like to see more actual alien looking creatures in Star Trek. Too bad we didn't get another animated series.

Can you combine the Reman Shields with the Breen Engines?

>TFW you become the EDF from season 2 of Space Battleship Yamato.

Wasn't that ship called Andromeda?
Or was it just one of those "we change a name for no reason in English dub" sorta things?

You mean so it would have the frost warp trail effect?

Maybe they changed it. I can see the American censorship authority (whatever the fuck they're called) getting pissy with the ship being called the Yamato. Much for the same reason they wouldn't greenlight a project about a space battleship Bismark or Graf Spee.

precisely.

>Jake - Father was a Starfleet captain, ship designer and religious icon. Encouraged to go to school, given every break, wasted every opportunity, pussied out of every fight and did nothing with his life.

The more I think about it, the more I realise I like Jake as a character, if not as a person. Because as a person Jake is kinda an asshole. But in a very typical young person way. I'm glad he's there. He was the first prominent, reoccurring human kid in star trek to NOT want to join star fleet. And it was a good choice, because he was clearly unsuited for it. I like that he turned out to be a coward, and that he admitted as much. I like that he made bad decisions because of his lack of experience and forethought, like staying behind when DS9 was abandoned.

He was fallible, not hugely skilled like every main character ever, not lacking in smarts but certainly lacking in wisdom. He grew over time, and not just vertically, going from being the captain's kid into being his own man.

And that's a great character to add some grounding to the ensemble.

hm, I guess Ill need to get that engine and find out.

So I'm guessing Jake was more of the typical kid who grows up in the UFP. Like the 99.9% of the citizens of the UFP who don't want to join Star Fleet. And why should he, he's well off and naïve. There is so much else to do in the settling besides Star Fleet but they really never got into that. How the heck are you supposed to make a living as a Fed citizen? What do you do to fill the hours of the day if you don't have to work? What's the point then?

There's likely a real world reason for this. It's less controversial that the Federation is full of wishy washy non-believers than it is to have believers, some of whom may be extremists.

If you write a religious character well, they're can be a complex and nuanced person - if you write them badly, they're an offensive stereotype that perpetuates the worst kinds of misinformation about a particular group.

There's also a strong influence from Gene, an admitted atheist who had some rather bizarre political, ideological, ethical, and personal beliefs.

I personally am an atheist, but I too think it's unrealistic to think every human in the Federation would be too. TV execs don't like getting lambasted in the media about being racist, sexist, homophobic, or some other flavor of supposed hate. It tends to lose them money, so if the Fed humans being atheist doesn't bother anyone, there's no reason to change it.

Injuns get to have culture and religion and stuff. Just one for all Indians, but it's something.

It's kind of funny you say that when the show was based on being just that 'controversial' and not being a benign sci-fi show. It was supposed to push the envelop with statements of human nature and their biases. That you can't have like one human say they believe in something greater than themselves that's not tangible without being looked at as crazy. Is the height of cowardice in a supposed enlightened settling. So you step on a few toes that at least means someone is paying attention. I hate that the only time that this was done was native American episode that was Wesley centric that I could have done without.

Better than how Wesley turned out, who, dropped out of Starfleet and then emoed around the ship pissing off everyone until he found out he was space Jesus and literally walked off the set.

Either that or he got tricked by a creepy alien and assraped in the back of his space van until Nemesis.

I think we all know which happened.

Even creepy aliens have assraep standards

I agree that Trek was originally about pusing the envelope, but there was also the problem of Gene using it as a platform for his ideas, some of which were thankfully abandoned.

Trek changed over the years, though. Look how safe they played VOY and ENT.

The execs were afraid of losing viewers (and thus money), and they managed to lose them because Trek wasn't doing anything interesting.

>wesley

Another of Gene's creations which should have been aborted.

Oddly enough that was a Ron Moore story, I guess he later transferred the idea of a young human not wanting to be in starfleet over to Jake Sisko, where it made far, far more sense than with a character we'd seen learning to be an officer since season 2 of TNG.

I think you get it from the last or second-last mission in the Breen arc.

>I agree that Trek was originally about pusing the envelope
This meme needs to end. It was a western in the guise of a sci-fi show. It was meant for Gene to feel like a writer, and make him a rich man. It didn't generally pull its punches when the story called for something that might be controversial, but it wasn't about being controversial either.

>The Kazon - shit, discount Klingons
No, not even close - the looked and acted like space gypsies.

Are you two stupid or something? Just because the technology at someone's disposal is so advanced that it looks like magic that doesn't means that it's powered by magic.

On its initial conception, certainly, it was just a Western in sci-fi clothes. But it became more than that, occasionally by accident, sometimes on purpose. And it wasn't really Gene who pushed the envelope, aside from using it as a soapbox for his strange notions. Gene allowed that myth to propagate because it made him look good, but it doesn't change the fact that Trek did in fact push the envelope of what was acceptable on TV by the audience and the networks themselves.

In case you've forgotten, it was the networks who didn't like the idea of a woman in the chain of command, and that's why there's no female first officer after "The Cage". Still doesn't change the fact that there was one initially.

We think of it as no big deal now, but a black woman on the bridge of a starship (and holding an officers rank, no less!) was unheard of when Trek initially aired. Yes, we look back now and sneer at how she was a glorified telephone operator, but she would have been cast as a maid or cleaning lady in any other show of the time.

More than that, I'll happily be proven wrong if you can point me to a late 60s TV show or movie where a black man is presented as a scientist in the top of his field (that isn't The Twilight Zone).

The "Ultimate Computer" introduced us to Dr. Daystrom, a man and computer scientist who had revolutionized the Federation's computer technology. The Daystrom Institute, that gets mentioned in other Trek series is named after the character.

And who played Dr. Daystrum? William Marshall.

>imdb.com/name/nm0551234/?ref_=ttfc_fc_cl_t4

And then there's Q and that dude in the sparkling nightie in the Kirk Fights a Gorn episode and the Organians there are others but those were the ones that jumped to mind first.

Calm down. We don't win players to Veeky Forums by being assholes.

We be assholes in game and make it Veeky Forums storytime.

Look Q is literally powered by how awesome he is, when the fucker can bent reality with a thought. IT MIGHT AS WELL BE MAGIC! Since it seems to uncountable by anything less than another Q. Guys like that don't need tech they are pure power in themselves. They just will for stuff to happen and it will happen.

Also, meanwhile, in-game he is literally sitting IN his chair.

>In case you've forgotten, it was the networks who didn't like the idea of a woman in the chain of command, and that's why there's no female first officer after "The Cage".
Also a myth, perpetuated by Roddenberry. They didn't want Gene's no-talent mistress as a lead, so they made sure that she couldn't be one. It was fine that she had a bit part (and she later grew as an actress), but being a lead was too much.

Probably hiding so his dumbass kid can't find him

>glorified telephone operator
>implying that we don't still have dedicated communications people even with modern tech

I do still like his story, though. "They told me to lose the woman and the Satanic looking fellow, so I married Majel and kept Spock since I didn't think Leonard would let me do it the other way."

And yet, there's no female officers wearing pants after the second pilot (not that I'm complaining too much, mind). It's just something one notices.

I'm implying nothing. Various people have made the (rather obtuse) claim that Uhura's job was unimportant, or that she was just "Kirk's secretary", rather than in charge of the ship's vital communications link to allies, friends, the chain of command, and help of any kind.

I'm not saying SHE wasn't, I'm saying that it is technically a legitimate job.

They didn't give the character Uhura much to do, and she doesn't get more than a few interactions with the crew, and not a lot of time in away missions either.

I don't know if that was a necessary evil of the format (TOS was never meant to be aired in sequence, the network basically just wanted to chop it up it and air it whenever and in whatever order), or just that they didn't know what to do with Uhura (or any of the minor characters).

But I wouldn't personally call her useless. I'm more irritated at the contemporary critics who give zero actual thought to what Uhura's job would entail.

There was one good Jake episode in the series, the one where Sisko gets hit by the warp lightning and kept getting pulled through time. Though to be fair it was a different actor playing Jake in most of that episode.

I think its possible that the writers did want to do more with the Jake character. But the kid actor they got just didn't have the acting abilities to do them. So the character stayed kind of stale though out the series.

Well I was hoping that the frost trail came from the nacelles, but it looks interesting how it is.

What the fuck am I reading and why isn't this a thing yet?

That does look very well

>TFW Trek is now New new BSG with a more Nomads, the Nonconformists guys from the Infinity game vibe.
That could work but the UFP would be totally against it since it makes a mockery of what they think is enlighten behavior. They would be like those 'Gathers' in that one TNG episode.

UFP enlightened behaviour demands that people watch impassively whilst others die.

Also in the Dominion War the UFP had more to worry about than guarding junk yards.

...

Oh god please don't remind me that that episode existed

www freewebs com / paragon19 / startrek htm
What does /stg/ think of paper craft? Does anyone know if these are any good and what kind of paper you should use? These look pretty nice actually.

Bumping with a ship I enjoy far more than I should, honestly. I love the Pilot Escorts.

I think they look great. I wouldn't mind putting one (or more) together.

As for the proper paper, I haven't the faintest clue, but I wonder if some more reading of the site could clear that up.

tfw no fleet of miniature star ships

What the UFP don't know don't hurt them. One signal jammer and by the time the tech goon comes to fix it and it was a month ago that the scrap warped out.

And they wouldn't be like the Gatherers scavenging carrion from the weak and the dying.

They have a fleet. It's time to make the Dominion start dying and then they will have all the fresh meat they could want.

If the Jem'Hadar might have though the Klingons were harsh to deal with they never realized what humans were like with the standards removed.

what the fuck do you think this is, a board about gaming with tabletop miniatu-

They look like a defiant and a Jem'Hadar Attack Ship had a baby with foetal alcohol syndrome. Seriously, I'd almost rather fly in the fucking Deep Space Shoes

...

Is that the Eaglemoss collection? Are there any models that are particularly delicate that I need to be aware of?

Any of them that have really small bits. The Nausicaan raider and the Malon garbage ship come to mind. The Bajoran solar sailor looks like it will fall apart just from being looked at, but it's been a trooper so far, and it'd be pretty easy to glue back together, I think.
All the starfleet ships have the typical break points that any model would have (>tfw no sif), but a bit of super glue will fix it right up, probably stronger than before.
My major complaint about the series is that they have some QC issues, especially for the earlier models. Like, my Stargazer's and Nebula's paint jobs are messed up, and I don't know if they did the detail part of the D'kora's ventral section at all. I think these are individual defects, though, since I haven't heard any general complaints about those particular models. The die-cast parts are great, and have amazing detail; but the plastic parts (which for most ships is most of it, since they only use metal for the big continuous sections) are really half-assed in comparison.

Not that guy but my brother has the collection. according to him, the nacelles can break in transit but theyre easy enough to repair with glue. Specifically I know the D7 and nebbie needed repairing. The Galor also had a damaged bridge section.

Thanks! So far my collection is just up to BoP/NX-01 (they're shipping them out of order because of availability issues), and so far I've been impressed, but the BoP stand was difficult to get to stay on because it kept wanting to spring off so I was worried that would be more typical than the better fitting ships.

Reminder that partying kills the Q. Please do not party near the Q. Thank you.

>Q hanged himself from one of those beams of light

Well crap. That means we'll have to find another godlike being to cowtow to.

...

I don't know, it just doesn't look like much of anyhting to me. Like they just rummaged around in the bargain bin of leftover ship assets and slapped em together.

On the subject of ships of debatable attractiveness, I present to you the Scryer Class Intel Science Vessel. Is she, dare I say, the ugliest fucking ship?

Question: Is the picture of that ship upside down because if not that is first time I've seen a ship with it's deflector disc on top.