Would people honestly bitch about 40k going to a format like this?

Would people honestly bitch about 40k going to a format like this?

To explain what is happening here:
>AoS warscrolls have no points
>One book is released which has the points for everything in it, all in one tome. This is also the essential 'rulebook' for the game, and only about $25
>The book will be re-released yearly with updated points for all the units and formations based on feedback from players and tournaments, pic related is a preview of updated points for playtesting for the book that will be released later this year

So to clarify what I am implying for 40k, this is what would happen:
>40k still has all its codeces, but no points included
>the base rulebook has points for all the units and formations, and is a cheaper price
>the base rulebook gets re-released yearly, with points for everything adjusted based on feedback from tournaments allover the world, periodically GW puts out playtest points for feedback.

Would anyone honestly complain about this? This could prevent codex creep, as all points for everything gets updated ALL AT ONCE, instead of one codex at a time. Or would people still whine because it resembles AoS, even though it could be one of the few good aspects of AoS?

I think people would be terrified of that change because, as you said, it resembles AoS. The similarity in and of itself isn't the issue, but people are already nervous about losing the setting to 40k End Times/Age of the Emperor, and rehashing the release structure to closely ape AoS's will crank that anxiety up to eleven.

By itself, though, there's no issue with using AoS's publishing pattern; it really is pretty solid.

Pic unrelated but goddamn captcha

I'd resent having to shell out for a new rulebook every year, but it wouldn't be the end of the world. My bigger concern would be 40k adopting AoS's simpler rules - that's a complete dealbreaker that would push me over to another game, or at least remain playing earlier editions.

>Would anyone honestly complain about this?
Yep, since people wants to see 40k fixed, not totally turned into "roll 3+ to win".

It's ok for AoS for points to be optional,but i feel people would rather have points written in the rulebook or codices and then updated and freely available. 40k is not AoS and it would feel wrong to make people pay a yearly fee.(but really we would just all get the rules for free wouldn't we?)

Nice way to completely ignore the entirely of the post and completely revert to a knee-jerk reaction to the first sentence.

Shitposter says what?

>implying it's not already like that
Also i think the majority of people freaked out more than anything for the complete and totally uncalled for annihilation of the setting

I'd kill for a yearly updated points cost for all the armies.

Sadly, a lot of the AoS-hate comes form people who don't know anything about it. I still see people not wanting 40k to get AoS-ified because "they're going to remove the points".

So how does this work when they release new units after the yearly update?

As GW has been doing it now, they release a little image for free which has points on it, as we saw with the silver tower stuff, then it will get printed in the next book

they could even just release all the dataslates for free and you would still get anti-aos bitching

So you don't need to keep buying the new book?

The image with the points is just a placeholder until the new edition of rulebook. So they may be adjusted, and the image only shows the points of the new models, not the entire faction

So it'll be balanced at the start of each year until they release a new codex.

>remain playing earlier editions.

By yourself, I assume.

Because all the older editions, nearly all of which are better than 7th, are ded ded ded.

that's subjective of course, but regardless, it's a much better system than waiting until the codex gets updated again. i would take a yearly rebalancing over sporadic single codex updates

Yeah anything would be better than nothing, but I honestly don't trust them to do it well regardless at this stage.

>>implying it's not already like that
Yeah, current 40k ruleset is shit, but this rulset still could be fixed since it has large potential, which will be totally lost in AoS-like ruleset.

You guys talk as though the AoS rules are bad, which I find hilarious because they aren't. 40k could take a few lessons from aos' superior rules.

Oh well, just more uninformed bitching about something people don't understand.

>because they aren't.
But they are.
AoS rules pretending to be WarmaHordes-like system, but it overloaded by miniatures (since 2k+ only playbale formats) for such ruleset, with 40k game design quality (broken/unbalanced/untested etc)
Shit, they spend the whole book, just to add points system and fix most obvious holes in their 4pages meme-rules, like endless summon in one phase, without improving common quality of game.

We still have a small group of people playing WHFB instead of AoS, and about half of our 40k group has said they'd rather keep playing 7th than move to an AoS-ified edition of 40k.

And if that falls through, like I said, there are other games. Warmachine looks promising.

It would improve the game immeasurably. It's unplayable at the moment.
That said, AoS is horrid too, and don't act like adding points actually made it in any way balanced.
It would be much better for the players to buy one book which has everything, rather than having to shell out for new codexes all the time if you want to stay updated.

So you're saying General's Handbook fixed AoS's endless summoning problem but 40K Tzeentch still has endless summoning? Sounds like it's a better game then.

It's still bad, because it's AoS. Don't you see? Anything closely resembling AoS is automatically bad, regardless of whether or not it was good.

>pretending to be WarmaHordes-like system
opinion fucking dropped. as user said, you are just yet another uninformed passionate bitcher with no knowledge other than what other internet idiots feed you. enjoy your ignorance

>Sounds like it's a better game then.
Nope, it's still primitive 3+ on the middle of table garbage. TO make this system better requires total redone of ruleset.
>:i-i-if you dislkes it you are just bitcher who didn't played it!
Nice arguments shiteater.

Yet you keep posting and keep showing your ignorance of the game.

Keep shitposting, it's all you seem to be capable of doing.

>everyone who dislikes General Handbook are just shitposters
Another brilliant post.

And more uninformed shitposting. Keep it up, you're really not helping your case, here.

>And more uninformed shitposting.
Nice projections you have here.
>.Keep it up, you're really not helping your case, here.
>says the man who keep shitposting instead of arguments

not him but you really are kindof an idiot. my issue with aos is the setting, minis, and art, but ill be a liar if i said it was a shitty game. its actually pretty solid. ive had the chance to try it out several times. i dont mind playing casually especially for people who want to practice their lists and such, and dont mind me proxying my 40k orks for orriks or whatever, but the game definitely works in its own regard. i had heard plenty of memes about how shitty it is, and i dont get those, especially the "rolling 3+ to win" meme, or the "pile in the middle shitfest" one. the whole thread brings up a good point ive seen argued before, that 40k could use some of the treatment fantasy got, but like other i fear for the setting. but this thread is about the yearly points book, which i think is a great idea

I was just at the LVO, playing the AoS GT. The 40k GT and the AoS GT shared the same room. In between games, I would peruse through the tables to see what was played and talk with some of the 40k and AoS players, because I do play both games.

One point I was just resting my legs and on my phone when I heard 2 of the 40k players pass by in conversation. This was their conversation:
"So there are no points or anything?"
"Nope. You just bring whatever you want!"
"That's dumb."

And I thought the GHB bringing points was common knowledge by now. Truth is unfortunately most of the memes about the game stem from it's rocky start, which it really did have one, and people refuse to look into it any further. Which is their prerogative, I guess.

>not him but you really are kindof an idiot.
Because..?
>but ill be a liar if i said it was a shitty game. its actually pretty solid. ive had the chance to try it out several times. i dont mind playing casually especially for people who want to practice their lists and such, and dont mind me proxying my 40k orks for orriks or whatever, but the game definitely works in its own regard. i had heard plenty of memes about how shitty it is, and i dont get those, especially the "rolling 3+ to win" meme, or the "pile in the middle shitfest" one. the whole thread brings up a good point ive seen argued before, that 40k could use some of the treatment fantasy got, but like other i fear for the setting. but this thread is about the yearly points book, which i think is a great idea
So where is your arguments, except "rules designed for 8 yo are pretty solid" and "I don't get this criticism"&

i find myself educating people about the game a lot. its gained quite a footing in my area from both new and veteran players though so it doesnt happen that often.

>i find myself educating people about the game a lot.
So Veeky Forums finally found real redshirt?

The game is growing allover. The ITC obviously picked it up and before the LVO there were many independent AoS tournaments ran across the nation so people could get their ITC rankings up in time for the LVO. A lot of veteran known 40k ITC players made the switch to AoS because they were getting sick of the bullshit over on the 40k side of things. Bullshit like facing the same damn lists over and over again with little to no originality among the players because to deviate from netlists pretty much meant losses from those who didn't.

In the AoS GT I lost some games and won some games, but never once did I feel like I was in a position where there was nothing I could do to win while playing what would be considered not a competitive list, and same for my opponent. Game's werent decided wins until at least turn 4 or 5. Whereas in 40k I frequently get in games where I know the loss is coming by turn 2 at least. It's just not as fun.

AoS has a lot more tactical depth than people give it credit for, because those 4 pages of rules can be deceiving. I was still learning shit about how to be a better play even through my 6th game.

>5-30 miniatures
>Both cost 60 points

How does this work AoS players?

60 points for five
360 points for thirty

> Things the GHB fixed
Gave points
FOC structure
Infinite summoning

> Things the GHB did not fix
Shooting into combat
Shooting from combat
Fixed dice targets
Tactics in magic (power/dispel allocation)
Variety in magic
Psychology
Points being fair
Every unit having 3 unique rules
Every hand weapon and shield being different
Equipment being a free, objective upgrade
End-of-turn roll swinging games
Tactics are solely stacking +1 buffs onto deathblobs and then mashing together

> Things that AoS players were praising as novel before GHB was released
No points
No FOC structure

>Shooting into combat
>Shooting from combat
I'll give you these.
>Fixed dice targets
Not an issue and therefor does not need 'fixing'
>Tactics in magic (power/dispel allocation)
The GHB actually did fix this, through one of the rules of 1.
>Variety in magic
This is not something the GHB was supposed to fix. That is being fixed though with the newer battletomes. Pretty much any battletome from Sylvaneth and on is bringing in schools of magic and the like.
>Psychology
What?
>Points being fair
Fair is subjective. I would argue fair is also relative. It's definitely more fair than 40k or what WHFB was.
>Every unit having 3 unique rules
This is a problem how? Definitely not for us players. Did not need to be fixed, and if it did, it would not be a GHB issue.
>Every hand weapon and shield being different
Again, not a problem, and therefore does not need to be fixed. If it did, it wouldn't be on the GHB.
>Equipment being a free, objective upgrade
Not an issue. For most, and I do mean most, different equipment and weapons changes the role, and so it could be considered zero-sum whether or not a unit equipped swords and shields over spears. There are some exceptions, but those are few and far between.
>End-of-turn roll swinging games
This still remains to be controversial, so I can understand it being here, somewhat. However among veteran AoS players, we understand that it's part of the game, and part of the strategy. The poor player will curse random initiative, but the experienced player will know how to deal with it or have plans to counter an opponent's double turn.

cont.

>Tactics are solely stacking +1 buffs onto deathblobs and then mashing together
And here is where I am calling bullshit. I don't get this, but it seems to be a popular meme, unwarranted at that. The GHB definitely did help to fix the pile in the middle issue (which really was only apparent when playing without a battleplan) with the battleplans being very objective based. I have seen a lot more movement and multiple different combats on the table since the GHB. So I would actually chalk this up to 'things the GHB fixed'

A bunch of these honestly feel like you are merely stretching to make one side appear bigger than the other to eschew perception of the issue. So I will fix it for you:

> Things the GHB fixed
Gave points
FOC structure
Infinite Summoning
Tactics are solely stacking +1 buffs onto deathblobs and then mashing together

> Things the GHB did not fix
Shooting into combat
Shooting out of combat
Points being fair (relative issue, but yearly updates coming to refine them)
End-of-turn roll swinging games (subjective to opinion and experience of course)

its explained in the book. a unit of 5 costs 60 pts, and 60pts per 5 on top of that, up to a maximum of 30 models. units are purchased in batches.

Could also add:
Lack of flanking tactics or benefits
Vulnerability of characters to shooting

I think the point is that even after the GHB, AoS is a shitty game to emulate.

>Lack of flanking tactics or benefits
These are definitely still there, just not as obvious. There are benefits to flanking enemy units, they just don't provide a static buff like in whfb. I would flank an enemy unit rather than charge it head-on to manipulate its movement, which is big in AoS. Also I've used it to manipulate wound allocation, and pulling units off of objectives, or clear paths for charging and shooting. It is often used to split attacks in combat, making a big buffed unit perform under strength as it is forced to divide its strength. These are just some of the things that charging and combat can do outside of just beating your opponent in combat.
>Vulnerability of characters to shooting
I actually do understand this one. Hellcannons are the biggest offenders to this. I do wish there was some sort of look-out-sir rule or something.

>I think the point is that even after the GHB, AoS is a shitty game to emulate.
Even if it's thing like free dataslates, rules, and points adjusted yearly all at once? And that is also your opinion. My opinion is 40k could use some AoSification of its rules. It is long overdue.

>My opinion is 40k could use some AoSification of its rules.
t. 8 years old children

Not the same guy, but 40K could use some of the rules in AoS.
Specifically the whole "release all point costs in the main rulebook at the same fucking time".
That rule.

>Specifically the whole "release all point costs in the main rulebook at the same fucking time".
kys

Why? afraid of having balanced point cost?
Scared that your riptide is going up in price or that you can't field as many scatterbikes as you normally would?
Please explain to me what is wrong with what I said in more than 3 letters without making yourself look like a total retard

>Would people honestly bitch about 40k going to a format like this?
HO HO, don't you pretend you don't know they would! Give out miniatures for free, and fucking grognards will bitch that price gave meaning to miniature collecting.

>Scared that your riptide is going up in price or that you can't field as many scatterbikes as you normally would?
>implying I cannot do something like this in AoS
>Please explain to me what is wrong with what I said in more than 3 letters without making yourself look like a total retard
I've already explained my opinion here

I'll try and summarize your post since it was that long and deep:
>AoS is shit and I don't want any AoS rules because 40K is shit but less shit
I actually think I used more characters than you.

So let me get this straight, you'd ditch the only acceptable thing in AoS because you're scared that doing so would Sigmarize 40K and ruin the utter mess of a ruleset 40K currently is.

Now, since you didn't prove a fucking thing, let me ask you: why o why releasing the point cost of each model at the same time would ruin the game?
Or are you above answering a question like this?

>>AoS is shit and I don't want any AoS rules because 40K is shit but less shit
Yes and I explained why 40k "less shit"
>and ruin the utter mess of a ruleset 40K currently is.
>says 8 yers old kid

>Fair is subjective.
Non in case it could be calculated with some simple statistical math.

>Yeah, current 40k ruleset is shit, but this rulset still could be fixed since it has large potential, which will be totally lost in AoS-like ruleset.

>Yes and I explained why 40k "less shit"
I totally see that now, sorry, I was so blind, but you opened my eyes

Care to do the calculations then?

I hope it does go closer to AoS, drop some of the more gimmicky and convoluted shit like the to hit and wound charts that seemingly only exist to give the impression that you're not looking to roll the same one or two numbers every time.

For AoS GW has started putting points in the battletomes, the new Tzeentch one at least has them.

I don´t care as much about the rules as I care about the lore and the world.

I am at least to some degree open to changes regarding the ruleset. I don´t want to play a completely different game though.

With that said ....my biggest fear is them killing off the setting.

I don´t mind them advancing the fluff, or going full great crusade 2.0

>I don´t mind them advancing the fluff, or going full great crusade 2.0
Which appears to be what they're doing. The status quo will be shaken somewhat, like with some primarchs coming back and the eldar getting a renewed sense of hope, but GW has confirmed this is not going to be end times. I don't see why it's so hard to believe we can get a new set of rules without an end times.

Because autists dont like change.

Kraggi point upgrade is the most useless update ever...100 pt for guy who is buffing anvl and ONLY anvil. he should be 40 pt or 50 but no 100.