Warmachine/Hordes General

Yes

1st reaction: FUCK! Old Witch is no longer Khador?! : <

2nd reaction: Fuck yeah! Old Witch2, baby!

Damn it, the Old Witch is my favorite model in the entire game and now I have to switch factions to play her? I'm sad.

>>Damn it, the Old Witch is my favorite model in the entire game and now I have to switch factions to play her? I'm sad.
Old Witch 1 still exists in Khador, so you're not just sad, but also stupid

I never said she wasn't fuckboi, but I have waited for a new Witch ever since I started playing in mk2 and she finally comes and is off-faction.

Chances for partisan are close to 0 too, since she'd be a Warlock, rather than a Warcaster.

Erect

The real question is what made her from a work-in-the-shadow old magician that backs a nation to the super angsty the-world-will-pay villain? Inb4 Soles.

Well, the poem accompanying it addresses that. We just have to see what reason she is applying this "salve".

This is everything I wanted from Old Witch 2 model. She's gone full Baba Yaga.

>1st reaction: FUCK! Old Witch is no longer Khador?!
Holding out hope for Partisan [Khador].

I'm guessing the bargain she refers to has to be the deal Thamar made to get humans magic. Older lore talks about how the humans would have to pay for it some day.

Alternatively given her history maybe the deal Haley made with Haufang to protect Cygnar from the other dragons? The thing on top of the house looks like the container the Dragon Champion was held in.

You must go back. Reddit is waiting.

>Chances for partisan are close to 0 too, since she'd be a Warlock, rather than a Warcaster.
Not necessarily, she'd just need a rule specifying how her battlegroup gets put together. You're right that she probably can't take Khador jacks. Plus, I'm not even sure they 100% confirmed the new faction is Fury based, did they? There was still a possibility it would be something completely different (or a modification to the rules, like Cephalyx).

The fuck are you on about?

Holy hell, an actual, tangible model for this shitshow of a faction? It only took them like what, two years to get to this point?

If you kept up with the fluff then it's pretty obvious she's been forced into a more active roll by Wurmwood, who is brazenly trying to trigger the apocalypse with shit like manipulating Krueger to incite the dragons into action, and using Kromac to steal Rathrok and summon the Devourer through sheer carnage.

Manipulating Khador clearly doesnt work anymore, her aeons old rival isn't pulling its punches anymore so now neither will she.

it was too cringey for me to listen to all the way through, but it almost sounded like she said she was answering a threat with "crows of her own."

Since we know the faction they're making is based heavily in horror tropes, like bugs and crows, couldn't this just be Old Witch2(Khador Boogaloo) as a new caster being revealed as a direct competitor to the new faction? Perhaps she's acting as a protector of Khador against this new faction, and they're holding off on ACTUALLY releasing the new faction until SmogCon?

Don't know, don't care. This stupid faction has no business being devoted any time to, especially when considering that the game already has a whole bunch of horror shit going on (mainly Cryx for spooky, Everblightfor body horror, Skorne for torture porn and Gators for swamp shit, but others can also chip in) and doubly so since it'll end up being yet another dead faction like Cyriss or Cephalyx.

I know you are from reddit.

...And?

You're both Faggots.

Who wants to talk about how nobody runs Gator Posse and how blinding better Brigands are?

>Wah, people like different things than me

There's still plenty of design open in the territory of horror, that isn't either "ghosts and zombies" or "body horror".

There's also Cephalyx which does mental horror.

Whoa guys. This guy gets it. Better call up PP and let them know some random try hard fag is ripping on the yet to be seen faction and saying that the models will not sell.

Sure, but judging by the concept art we've seen so far it doesn't look particularly inspired.
Furthermore, many classic horror things don't work on an army scale, because it looses much of its impact when the other side has 6-ton monstrosities of corded muscle, autoguns and wizards.
Well, maybe I'm entirely wrong. That's possible, too.

They can design new factions after they fixed their shit. Seriously, the overall game balance, in-faction balance and hordes vs. warmachine balance is all kinds of fucked up and now they're throwing another, most likely powercreeped to fuck, faction into it? Yeah, sure, just add more moving pieces to the clusterfuck why don't you.

>the overall game balance, in-faction balance and hordes vs. warmachine balance is all kinds of fucked up
Internal balance yes, External is almost fixed. Do you want them to halt all production and have their entire staff work on errata? That's neither very productive, nor very likely.

Yeah, yeah, I get it, I am a negative nancy, but I can't bring myself to get excited for a faction that sounds like a halloween gag that got out of hand.
Also, I have no idea if that stuff will sell; it most likely will. I just fear they will end up never getting any additional releases, just like CoC and Ceph.

as a CoC player I'm genuinely hoping another faction gets the same treatment. I got into the faction because there wasn't a widely visible thing saying it was limited, and if another faction gets the same treatment now that the game's a lot bigger the backlash/demand might make them start supporting the limited factions more.

So Chiron's spray has to be a misprint, right?

It says sp10 pow 15 Annihilating Gaze

Annihilating Gaze is the special rule that extollers have that add the str of the target to the damage if it's living. But the fluff does specify that the ranged attack cases enemy warbeasts to tear themselves apart.

If it actually hast the annihilating gaze rule it would be dice +10 on a mammoth.

Maybe Annihilating Gaze is just the name of the weapon, not the special ability.

No, Hordes just has all of the best guns now.

I don't know why, but between Loki, Azrael, and now Chiron (and, really, the Pureblood, Woldwyrd, Ravagore, and probably others I'm forgetting, too), Hordes just has better high-quality guns.

Don't forget the Cannoneer

Running a demo for a local convention. I've got some painted battle boxes, but also looking to build some simple 25 point lists using the battle boxes. How does this look?
Khador Army - 25 / 25 points

(Kozlov 1) Lord Kozlov, Viscount of Scarsgrad [+28]
- Decimator [16]
- Juggernaut [12]
Man-O-War Shocktroopers (max) [16]
- Man-o-War Shocktrooper Officer [4]
Man-O-War Kovnik [5]

Protectorate Army - 25 / 25 points

(Malekus 1) Malekus, the Burning Truth [+30]
- Castigator [12]
- Revenger [10]
- Repenter [8]
- Reckoner [16]
Deliverer Sunburst Crew [5]
Choir of Menoth (min) [4]

I run Gator Posse. I like em, they're cute. Especially the "nyah nyah dance" shaman leader guy. The tilting effect that jackass has on some opponents is worth its weight in gold (you just have to do a little "nyah nyah" thing with it every time you kill something of theirs, it works wonders).

Cephalyx do Mental Horror AND Body Horror. That's worth a 2x score bonus, right there, buddy.

>Well, maybe I'm entirely wrong. That's possible, too.
Always is, always will be. Welcome to the human condition, enjoy your stay.

>Chiron – Skorne Heavy Warbeast (resin)

Chiron is one of the greatest basilisks ever broken to the skorne lash, and his subjugation attests to Beast Master Xekaar’s perfection of the art of physical conditioning through pain. The beast’s physical might is matched only by the power of his destructive gaze. Entire ranks of foes wither to dust as Chiron sweeps his cold eyes across them, and enemy warbeasts tear apart their own flesh in agony at his barest glance.

TRADE POINTS: As Beast Master Xekaar’s personal warbeast, Chiron makes a perfect purchase for players who have also picked up the Skorne Battlegroup Box (PIP 74095) as he gains boosted attack rolls on his SP 10, POW 15 Annihilating Gaze ranged attack. In addition his Leadership [Basilisks] ability means that this hulking basilisk works great in tandem with other Basilisk Drakes (PIP 74005)

>Dominar Morghoul (Morghoul3)

After a lifetime spent bloodying his hands on behalf of others, Morghoul has emerged from the world of shadows to command a house like no other—the paingivers. In battle, Dominar Morghoul is attended by two paingiver escorts who aid him in crippling his foes so that his blade may find purchase, and he empowers his army with mortitheurgical might so that they may shift like the sands of the desert to swiftly fell their foes.

TRADE POINTS: The lethal master assassin of the Skorne Empire has returned, ready to lead his warriors to quick and bloody victory. With a feat that grants Acrobatics, Overtake, and Parry Dominar Morghoul pairs best with fast moving melee troops like Praetorian Swordmen with the Praetorian Swordsmen Officer and Standard Bearer (PIP 74078 and PIP 74031), Praetorian Keltarii (PIP 74078), and Praetorian Ferox (PIP 74025).

I was in that boat initially, but I'm cautiously optimistic at this point. Admittedly the bad emo poetry isn't helping. It will all come down to the models, and whether they're cheesy or cool. Everything else is secondary, including the rules. ("What!? Rules secondary?? Burn the Heretic!")

I wouldn't count on it. If they learned a "lesson" from that, it's going to be to tell people up-front that the faction is limited in nature. Which is fine, I think, as long as they're up-front about it.

That does seem pretty ridiculous on first reading. I guess we'll see. There's probably something there we're missing.

>Venator Dakar

Looks like Skorne is following the Circle trend of "I've got details on my details!"

Purifier, finally. Word is it's a 3 model kit for $24.99. Still no trace of the Revelator.

Except without the insane character warbeasts as Drakes are unplayable in Mk3 so a character one certainly won't be. The fact that the bond is so strong but with such a weak caster is a huge kick in the teeth when you look at Loki.

Busty Skorne babes. Nice.

>Furthermore, many classic horror things don't work on an army scale
That's actually quite a good complaint. I hadn't considered it, but a spooky faction fighting against Cryx or something would be kinda silly.

>Drakes are unplayable in Mk3
That's a bit of a stretch. They're not warping the meta or anything, but they're hardly "unplayable".

Out of curiosity, what would you consider a fair price for a boostable magic spray at RAT 5 / POW 14? Obviously 8 is way too much in your opinion, so what would it be?

Justify 42 points.

I'd take 2 PGMTs over a Drake.

Anyone notice how Skorne got kind of cool?

Looks cool, I guess?

>Justify 42 points.
Has a boat for a hat.

17" threat with Doomy2?

...

dat feat.. Ferrox possible threat goes from 17 to 19 now with overtake and morg3 (not taking account any movement buff morg3 might have spell wise)

PLEASE DON'T NERF FERROX!

Having a pimp and his two Kitana clones does not make a faction cool, user.

kitana/meleena .. WITNESSED

Anyone notice that the hair bands on his "escorts" are similar to the ones on this image?

hrmm i'm feeling a makeda conversion coming along soon

>jusitfy

I has a boat

>Having a pimp and his two Kitana clones does not make a faction cool, user.
You sure about that? Because he looks cool as hell.

It's a valid consideration, but that doesn't rule out the drake. The Xerxis2 spam list alone probably rules out the possibility of making the Drake cheaper.

If you're going to give him that little armor, why bother armoring him at all?

Maybe he rolls up into a morph ball.

Dude, the user you replied to was talking about how over detailed the Dakar model was.

Been out for a long ass time, Mk1 was my jam, Mk2 I played like 6 games. But the scene is coming back in my local area so I'm jumping back in with mercs, buying up a Cephylex "everything" as well as what I need for an ashlynn army (sans another unit of eliminators and some nomads)

Any tips to get the most out of the cephylex army?

So fucking hard right now.

He was talking about Circle releases too. Circles releases blow Skorne's releases out of the water.

>Circle
Una2
Storm Raptor
Loki

>Skorne
Zaadesh2
Desert Hydra
Chiron

Circle got a completely broken caster, a colossal that actually sees competitive play, and Mk2 Molik Karn. Skorne got Zaadesh2, a useless colossal, and a character version of an unplayed light with a strong bond for a weak caster.

Was he? I'm not arguing your point or anything, I just don't see how the post you replied to was talking the rules in any way.

He mentioned Circle so IDGAF.

Man, Trollbloods don't really have many character beasts do they
>Mulg
>Rok
>Dozer & Smigg
Where are all the character troll beasts?

Who is using storm raptors

>How dare you be enjoy about anything!

Pretty sure the winner of LVO had Una1 with a Storm Raptor in his non-Una2 list. I know that someone who placed highly did.

Ok. So couple of questions. And I need legit answers, not trolls or fanboys. Be realistic.
First, should I invest into Warmachine? As in, is this game actually going to last with a large amount of players?
Second, I want to play Khador. What should I get to start out? I want to include a colossal, but I don't really have to keep going for more jacks since I am aware they suffer in Khador.
And finally, what are hard counters to Khador? Or in other words, what should I look out for?

>Skorne got Zaadesh2
>Circle got a completely broken caster

And now Zaadesh2 is arguably better than post-nerf Una2. You did good Circle!

>Desert Hydra
>a useless colossal
>Storm Raptor
>actually sees competitive play

How could anyone come to the conclusion that the Desert Hydra is useless? Likewise how can anyone claim that the Storm Raptor sees competitive play other than Tom Guan and Jeff Everitt trolling people at the LVO?

>a character version of an unplayed light

Why is this relevant at all? Molik Karn was a character version of an unplayed light and he carried the faction for an entire edition.

Then there's you just being retarded and not just comparing stuff cross faction, but comparing unreleased models crossed faction.

To be fair, mon of the Hordes factions had more than 3 till this new wave of releases. Trolls got a 42 point dude wearing a ship instead of what I can only guess to have been Rok's fire or slag equivalent.

Trollbloods don't have many heavies period. 4 non character heavies and 3 character heavies is a fraction of what every faction has.

>inb4 trolls are the light warbeast faction shitposters
>inb4 butthurt trollplayers with 'where's m-muh non character heavy with light peepee?'

I can see why PP struggles to come up with something creative with troll heavies, but it's a pretty large hole in the faction that needed to be filled like 4 years ago. The easy way out is to just make another plastic troll kit with the Earthborn as one of the options, and then two new ones.

I suppose it's a lot easier to make a character warjack than character beast
Still...

The answer to question one is: Depends on your local scene. Seriously, if you don't know how it looks there, we can't tell you if it's worth it. Unless you got a few friends you can play with.
Khador is really good this edition and a few casters handle jacks really well, so you're not limited to one colossal.
Since each caster brings a different toolkit, it's hard to pin down one glaring weakness, but I'd say control gives them a hard time, a bit more than other factions at least

Thanks! (Ignore the trip, I'm covering bait threads at the moment)
So overall, lets say I'm building a Khador army with one colossus and a few other heavy jacks, and the rest being infantry. What would you recommend towards that?

Cephalyx has been kind of a non-topic this edition. They're probably ok and you'll get some wins because your opponents have no idea what you're doing.

Do note that your second mercenary list can have all merc units now, the different contracts are gone

So you want another player to suffer because your faction is fucked for options? Perhaps do your due diligence before buying 100's dollars worth of models.

Try it. The biggest concern imo, is that the lights might just rip apart the Man-O-Wars and the two heavies need to fight down on attrition for the remainder of the game.

Bah, screw the Khador colossuses and grab a gun carriage battle engine and another warjack.

Yeah thats just opinion, but the gun carriage is bitchin, the colossals are just big fattys with shoulder guns. Ooooo. Wasn't that Behemoth's thing? Isn't Behemoth still better than either colossal?

As a core though, I'd pick a caster, then grab a few jacks. The battlebox helps here, and the caster with it is pretty cool.

For example, I am also a newish khador player with a limited collection. I have a warcaster (sorscha1), 2 jacks (destroyer and juggernaut), and some infantry (widowmakers, MoWshocktroopers). I want another jack (kodiak) and infantry (rifle corp). I also want a gun carriage cause that thing is just cool.

You can switch pretty much any of those things (in parenthesis) for anything else of similar class of model.
Take marauder instead of kodiak, decimator instead of destroyer. Pick up models you like the look of, or love the rules/themes of.

Um... user... the Hydra was an instant competitive adoption for Skorne. They love the miscast thing.

What the hell, it's just a Judicator with big Vanquisher cannons on it. It can't be hard to sculpt or produce, it's no Hydra. With the Hurricane coming out in April, it'll be the last colossal unreleased, hell we don't even have a render yet. It's closing in on what, four years?

Ah, only two years. Feels like four though

I thought everyone said the Storm Raptor sucks ass.

wat

And with that, Gangsta-Morghoul and his fly-ass bitches take their place among the assortment of literally god-damned weirdos that constitute the Skorne leadership cadre.

New player here... is that a new colossal?

It's also sad because right after they talk about how they don't have to do parallel releases anymore, they give most of the battlebox casters, that have they're book out, characters.

Trolls new Gargantuan, the Sea King. Announced in their Command book.