Nobledark 40k XVII: What The Fuck Is Going On edition

Confederation of Light and Church of The Savior Emperor are post-Crusade/WotB, but have their roots in Katholian sects, and also continue the Katholian/Yechudite conflict from the Age of Strife.
I'm expanding the Shadow Wars to be a general term for any internal conflict of the Imperium that doesn't qualify as an open war, with the CSE/COL Imperial Cult War being the longest and largest of them. They also treated the Great Civil War as another front in the fight between xenophobic, Oscar worshipping, exclusionary, grimdark fanatics, and their great enemy, the inclusionary, Oscar and Isha worshipping, noblebright zealots. It just so happened that the Imperial Palace and Emperor Vandire was a part of that expanded front.
But anyways, we need to drag up old stuff and argue about it. Like which interpretation of the Sororitas works better, and is cooler, for example; or C'Tan vampires - brokenly horrifying, or horrifyingly broken? Do Astartes write fanfic? How many Guardsman make a standard economic index?
And who the fuck is the walrus? Who is it that says "goo goo catchoo"?
Are you the lemon?

I thought we had the Sororitas augmentations hammered out. All we need is the actual history behind them and we're good to go.

Like the idea of the Shadow Wars. It was mentioned somewhere else that the Navigators are still up to their old shit. I think it was mentioned waaaay back in thread 2 that some planets are still squabbling over old feuds beneath the Imperium's radar so as not to bring down the wrath of the Imperial Army.

So if Colchis is made up of a bunch of independent nation-states, who nonetheless swear fealty to a central, independent Space Pope, and have advanced enough technology to have spaceships but no Knight Titans, what do we call it?

Really not sure as I was not the one who came up with the design for nobledark Colchis and I hope I am following the original idea closely enough.

>Let's make the most powerful C'tan vampire have nuclear holocaust level powers!
Yea, I prefer the brokenly horrifying to the horrifyingly broken. Keep in mind, a pure shard is Warlord Titan tier powerful. Still being absolutely monsters to fight on an individual level, a vampire is a walking tank with a healing factor. You either throw tanks, explosives, or 20 good men at it to kill a vampire. People dealing with them should be think "Holy shit, I don't want to be turned to paste like that!" instead of "Looks like they'll have to exterminatus this world".
(pic related)

Same here. Maybe a very few, very old, very exceptional vampires get to nuclear holocaust power, but you should be able to count the number of those on one hand. Maybe one per strain of vampire, exemplar and greatest example- maybe even originator- of that type?

>Sisters
Orders Militant: When you want something better than Cadian Guardsmen but not as expansive as Space Marines.
Orders Securitas: Spying? They put the STASI to shame. Hunting down Fallen Marines? Better at it than regular Space Marines.

I kind of liked the suggestion that the C'tan vampires are basically NANOMACHINES SON levels of power. Total nightmare to fight on an individual level. Maybe a few very old, or very powerful vampires get to OH GOD power levels, but they are rare, like suggested.

It all kind of boils down to the fact that the Imperium can be described as a war on two fronts, which is even more pronounced here due to the civility/barbarity theme.

On the one hand, you have the war outside the walls of civilization. This is the world of Space Marines, Orks, Tyranids, Necrons, what have you. On the other hand, you have the war within civilization. The scale of large cities (especially hive cities) ironically means that you end up having pockets of barbarity in what, are supposed to be the most civilized places there are. Hive Worlds are considered just as good as Death Worlds for Space Marine recruitment in vanilla, after all. This is the world of Dark Heresy, of things like Chaos cults, genestealer broods, and C'tan vampires.

In the war within society, raw power is often traded for the ability balance power with being unnoticed. The biggest, baddest forces in the war outside society are things like Space Marines. Inside society the scariest things you can run into are C'tan vampires, Inquisitors, and Sisters of Battle.

When we were talking about the Astartes-Sister rivalry, I kind of imagined a good-natured shit-talking like this in a pub somewhere.

"No Sister can ever beat an Astartes in one-on-one combat."
"Since when do Sisters ever fight alone?"
"Pfft. Then you're saying one marine is worth three Sisters."
"No, I'm saying Astartes are expensive. Melta charges are cheap."

Wait a minute, isn't Securitas the overall group, and the Orders Militant are one of the subdivisions in them or something?

This is why I suggested changing the name of Ordo Securitas to Ordo Traitorous. All of the Sisters Orders work for the Inquisition but specifically Ordo Securitas which almost have the same name as Orders Securitias.

History is the primary interpretation argument. I'll have to trawl for my v2 pastebin.
Basically. Securitas is what the Inquisition and the Arbites call for backup, so they need both spying, analysis, and combat skills. They are SWAT, FBI specialists, and Intel analysts combined.
" I won't fight a Sister, they cheat."
"So what you're saying is that you don't have enough brains to fight smart."
The Inquisition has the Ordo Securitas, who are the primary investigators for special crimes, threats, and multi-sector issues. They are the NSA and CIA to the Arbites FBI.
The Sororitas Orders Securitas are the backup to the Inquisition. Their Orders Militant are a specialist force of the Imperial Army, like the Astartes.
Its confusing, like the Imperium as a whole.

Ordo Traitorous works pretty well, especially since it helps define their role as to not officialy overstep the Arbites too much.

>Help! Help! This corrupt offical is embezzling money!

>So? Let the Arbites deal with it.

>The official is funding [separatist, Chaos, or renegade military forces]!

>Dominica, get the flamers...

Ordo Traitorus? Jesus Christ, I thought we were trying to simplify and standardize everything, not confuse things farther by introducing another name/organization.

It's already established the Ordo Securitas is the 3rd major Ordo of the Inquisition along with the Malleus and Xenos. It's function is pretty much the canon Ordo Hereticus+Sicarius since they police the internal affairs and systems of the Imperium.

The Sisters of Battle are the Chamber Militant of the Ordo Securitas. I guess it's also time for the once per thread reminder that we're sticking somewhat close to and reinterpreting canon, there are other AUs for wholesale rewrites.

Now, make it even more complicated. The nobles embezzlement could be impacting a necessary industry, or be reducing the tithe presented. The Arbites might not have "enough" evidence to get a warrant, or a judge is being paid off to not convict. Or the Inquisitor wanted to investigate said noble and helped lend additional weight to the official investigation.
The Inquisition is not bound by the same regulations as the Arbites, and has a tighter focus than "every breach of local and Imperial law". Organized crime is Arbites jurisdiction. The wandering pirate port of Rum And Pour is Inquisition jurisdiction. A squabble between two local churches is Arbites. A multi-world war between two faiths is Inquisition (Cohort Religio, specifically).
Breaches of Regulatory Law is Arbites. Breaches of the Big Five (the Declartio Fidelitas) is Inquisition.
The Inquisition can request aid from any branch of the Imperial Government. Any branch can demand that the Inquisition look into anything.

"Astartes always fight smart. You can teach a servitor to slap a det-pack on something."
"You know what I find funny?"
"What?"
"The Administratum says the reason women can't receive gene-seed implants is because the gene-seed is keyed to male chromosomes. The Sisters say the Emperor had to give you guys the better augmentations so that his Angels of Death wouldn't lose to a girl"

Second. I don't even remember the name Ordo Traitorus ever coming up.

I thought the Sisters were the Securitas. Or at the very least their militant arm.

Orders Securitas are the militant arm of the Inquisition, with each order being assigned an area of space. They Inquisit in between visits from Inquisitors.
Orders Militant are Astartes-lite, since the total number of potential sisters are about 2-4 orders of magnitude higher than the number of potential Astartes. They fill in the gaps for when the Army needs a heavy assault unit, but there are no marines available.
The other Orders perform humanitarian and specialist tasks for the rest of the Imperium - like all bureaucracies, the Sororitas has expanded over time, rather than farm a task out to another organ of government.

"Don't get me started on losing to a Sister. I lose half my pay to one every month, even with the bonus she gave me."
"What happened?"
"We had an argument over who the Emperor favored. Then she filed a request for my stored genes and had us a kid. Damn regs ruled in her favor. But little Ulrich is one hell of a scout in the Iron Hammers now, and the other kids are cute."
"But how does she get half your pay?"
"I got an even bigger bonus for marrying her. Make two and half times what I did before this."

It's fucking beautiful.

HAs it been added to the 1d4chan yet?

Also it begs the question of what their regiments are like and the state of the world in the Dark Millennium.

Also would they see themselves as closer to the eldar ideal than the craftworlders or no different?

I believe it was mentioned way back in whatever thread that came up with it that Craftworlds like Alaitoc point to Colchis as proof that mankind isn't completely hopeless and can eventually be civilized. Something about Colchians getting along better with your average Eldar than most humans do as well.

I'm going to suggest that they are seen as everything wrong with modern society by Dorhi and the human supremacist groups.

>See, this is the cultural suicide of both the Eldar and human of this world. What my sights lay upon is the abominable fusion of both and the advancement of none. This is the destruction of Eldar culture and their human partners follow suit, there is the strength of none while holding the weakness of both.
- unknown Norhai writer

Having read through Nightmare to Come/Age of Dusk and attempted to get into Imperium Asunder and Hektor Heresy...yes, this is barely a new lick of paint by comparison.

Are we trying to rewrite the securitas AGAIN?

Their earliest fluff was:
>the Ordo Securitas was set up as Imperial IA
>since it had regulatory power over all other Adepta and Officios, it got the Decree Passive slapped on them
>Inquisitors quickly find the loophole and use it

This then got retconned to:
>Securitas formed
>Dominica specifically wanted the former Brides of the Emperor to be folded into the Ordo as penitence for their role under Vandire
>Over time, the Sisters as an organisation eventually spread out and grew to the point that they were in service with Inquisitors of all Ordos.
>Since the Space Marines are not independent of the Imperial Army this time, they can't just randomly be called on for detached duty with an Inquisitor's retinue.
>Instead, the Sisters serve that role of "Inquisitor needs some big muscle and bigger guns", with another advantage over SMs being that they can still blend in with civilian populations (at a stretch).

That's the last I remember of the Sororitas/Securitas discussion, although it was something like half a dozen threads ago.
>I have no idea where the Orders Securitas came from, and as far as I know they don't exist.
>Contrary to , the Sisters do NOT serve as frontline troops except in special cases (less "we need Operators Operating Operationally but can't get a hold of any marines", more "this Inquisitor wanted to go and punch some demons, so his retinue did as well").
>not "m-muh sexism" but just simply because of their being attached to the Inquisition instead of the Army.
>If anything, this adds to the SoB/SM rivalry, with the former convinced the Administratum won't let them fight "real" battles.

tl;dr: has it completely right, although I imagined the Securitas being a smaller Ordo that specifically polices the Imperium's own internal workings - having them as Nobledark!Hereticus works perfectly fine too, though.

>See that fool? That one right there? That is the actual suicide of both eldar and humanity. I look upon them and I would be turned to pity were it not for the disgust at their stagnation and wretchedness. They prattle ona bout purity whilst their society crusts over in bones of wraith and dies starved of lover or sunlight. They prattle on about purity, romanticizing a time that never was when they liven in some unseen Eden all the while carefully omitting their decadence and depravities. Let them turn inwards and look no more upon the outside world. We will pick their corpses clean, we will out last them, our beautiful hybrid society ever young, ever vigorous. If they can't change they will rot.
- Her Ecumenical Excellence Mother Dwynwen XXIII of Colchis.

Actually, yeah, the conservative Eldar stance is pretty untenable when you remember that pure, old empire style Eldar culture still exists, and its in the Eye of Terror, ruled by Slaanesh and Malys.

All I want is to change the name of Ordo Securitas to Ordo Traitorous, that's it. Especially for newfags Ordo Securitas and Orders Securitas is very confusing. It also sounds more fitting, an order that just hunts traitors instead of being space police.

>pastebin.com/rsCB8189
Orders Militant and Orders Securitas is where I'm getting my names from. I think this was written by Sany Guardsman(?)

I think I vaguely remember having read that from a while ago - afaik, they had the Sororitas written as partially being dedicated to the Inquisition but also having wider roles (like the vanilla SoBs). From what I can tell, Orders Securitas just meant the sisters in the service of that Ordo

(Using the Victorian definition) I don't think conservative Imperial Eldar would want to recreate the Eldar Empire because you know, Slanneshe. They would want to keep the status-quo of being what is basically client states of Terra just like the human worlds. The nationalist on the other hand would want to see independent Eldar states but still wouldn't try to recreate an Eldar empire, maybe something like the HRE actively trying to not be too strong. Reactionary Eldar are the type to massacre a orbital station and say "We'll recreate the Eldar Empire ,but this time, do it right!" being a bunch of edgy Grimdark bastards. Thankful of all the warring factions in this AU, the Imperial separatists are the weakest, for they represent what this galaxy could have become if everybody held the idiot ball.

>"Years of Lead" between human separatist and Eldar separatist

Also Eldar Crosiers are the closest to non-degenerate Eldar Empire aesthetically.

Are there Lamenters in the Noble Darkness?

I don't think anybody mentioned them yet. I wonder if they are just really unlucky or Tzeentch loves fucking them around.

They're referenced indirectly in the Sangy fluff, and it's likely they would have been formed as a chapter during the breaking of the legions. I imagine the main difference is that their heroic sacrifices are actually meaningful now instead of being hilariously pointless.

Yeah, that was me.I tried for a reinterpretation that would fit roughly to vanilla.
I kept the Decree Passive, and loopholed that with "the Inquisition must request aid from another organization if they need more firepower", and then added Sororitas Standing Order 3: any sister must honor any request for inquisitorial aid". Since if the Sisters were part of the Inquisition, they too would be subject to the Decree Passive.
Oscar don't play with loopholes, and used a loophole of his own to show it: the Imperium has The Big Five laws, with their attendant sub laws and explanations (such as the section dealing with the tithe). Those are the only laws it has. Everything else is just a Regulatory Ruling.

That's a good point.

In Vanilla the rules lawyers got their akshully face on and nobody could do or were willing to do anything about it because they were following the letter of the law.

This time round Oscar can tell them to stop playing silly buggers and make amendments as needed. Or encourage amendments to be made if he feels like being gentle.

I don't think their sacrifices and suffering were pointless in Vanilla so much as ineffectual. They die for a higher cause and the universe just keeps on chugging forwards.

This time they would be on an equal legal footing with all chapters as their doesn't seem to be a super veneration of the First Foundings. They can call out the bullshit and it will have weight. If there is a law/"strongly encouraged" guideline from Oscar about age of consent in the augmentation process then there is almost certainly something preventing mass abductions as a means of recruitment. So people over the age of 16 - 18 have to willingly let themselves be strapped to the operating slab and be rebuilt into a living Juggernaut.

If the Lamenters, who would be seen by the plebeian masses as big damn heroes, start digging up shady practices of other legions then they might find the recruitment lines drying up like thin spit on a hot stove.

And those disillusioned masses run straight to the open arms of the Lamenters. Becoming a Super Soldier is a hard choice, if they were going to do it they were going to do it and now they can still do it with a clear heart. Lamenter ranks a full to overflowing, their praises sung across the galaxy.

They are very much like anti-Minotaurs. They are the ones who pick you back up and lend you some spare gear rather than teamkilling for delicious loot.

There are so many regulations. Technically speaking, the Imperium doesn't rule worlds, it's simply an interstellar federation that provides a common basis for defense and trade. In reality, it rules worlds - no trade can happen off world without the manufacturing, shipping, and distribution following the appropriate regulations. Every world is free to make its own laws - provided they don't clash with regulations. Thankfully, 99% of all regulations are easy to follow and prove that this Imperium has common sense.
But in return, a planet gets a lot. Every bit of imperial infrastructure is available on request, pending availability. Schools, tech support, military aid, even a common trade currency. To a planet that will struggle to survive in a larger galaxy, all of this is invaluable. Even prosperous, multi-stellar, nations find it helpful, since it can free up some of their resources.

...

Yeah, basically. I pulled that interpretation from Traveller.
If I weren't on a tablet and watching my nieces, I would be helpful and trawl for notes to add to the pages. So instead I'm sitting here hoping for fluff I can try and extrapolate on, or clarify.

>A Hegemonic Empire maintains control by making other people want to be part of it, typically by Rule of Cool and being the lesser of two evils. Therefore, it justifies all of its potential infringements in civil liberties or human rights as Necessary Evil.

- exempt from TV Tropes

A few points regarding the Lamenters.

The thing is, their sacrifices in canon really are that pointless, it's pretty much a succession of shaggy dog stories one after another. Whereas the Ultramarines stop Hive Fleet Behemoth with the sacrifice of their 1st Company or the Astral Knights blow up the World Engine, the Lamenters take heavy losses freeing millions of slaves from Orks only to find they have no ships to get them off planet. Or when they did the right thing and helped their best bros against the overreach of the Inquisition, only to find out their buddies were corrupted by Chaos. Oops. They're essentially a black comedy showing the pointlessness of being a good person in a grimdark universe.

Which brings us to the Lamenters in our AU. The way you've described them, there's not a whole lot to separate them from the Blood Angels and they lose their flavor. They're not the Super Popular Cool Kids, they're the Lamenters. To me, most Blood Angel successors represent an aspect of Sanguinius, and to me, the Lamenters represent Sanguinius' recognition of his own powerlessness and maybe a bit of his self-doubt, that for all his talents and power his ability to affect the universe is ultimately very limited. That's what they lament, their own powerlessness.

So while another chapter might celebrate a successful crusade or the defeat of a Waaagh, the Lamenters would say, "we could have done more." That sort of self-deprecation and melancholy means they're probably not a lot of fun to hang out with, and probably not super popular with the Imperium at large. Highly respected, yes, deeply appreciated, yes, but there are more charismatic chapters out there that are more likely to win the love of the common man.

That's how I see the Lamenters working in this nobledark AU so we can retain a bit of their character.

>the pointlessness of being a good person in a grimdark universe
On a broader scale, the problem with trying to fit in the Lamenters here is the fact that they are pretty much THE textbook example of nobledark in Vanilla 40k - and replicating them verbose in a setting full of their themes would be boring as shit.

That being said, I do like your idea of Nobledark Lamenters basically being BAs during Sanguinala, except 24/7

That's good. It also explains why they are so low on numbers whilst not being shafted by the authorities.

They answer every distress call but they don't have super Ultramar huge resources to draw upon and they can't keep up with the attrition anymore.

Also in this AU the last apothecary of the Celestial Lions really was shot by on ork with a sniper rifle.

As a side note, I think the First Founding chapters would still have a level of respect and veneration above their peers in this AU. I think we discussed this briefly in an old, old thread, but given that the breaking of the legions was a voluntary act this time and not an enforced decree, there is no formal or legal reason why a legion can't exist. Thus the Chapter Master of a First Founding chapter has the option to call for a reformation of the legion, recalling all the successor chapters to fight under the banner of the old legion in times of crisis. It's a hugely monumental event and probably hasn't happened more than 2 or 3 times in each First Founding chapter's history, and only happens in extreme crises like Black Crusades.

This would mean that the CM of the First Founding chapter has an additional level of authority, making him a first among equals with his successor peers. Add on the fact that the most well respected captain probably took over the original chapter when the legion was broken up, and you have some solid reasons for why the First Founding chapters retain a certain level of elevation above the rest.

Just because a call to reformation is called does not mean that it is answered. If the cause is just then a wayward chapter might lend such aid as it sees fit, but as equals, not under foreign command.

Mortificators are Ultramarine 2nd founding for example. First of their Chapter Masters a former captain of the Ultramarines.

They are all death cultists who treat the Coded as helpful suggestions at best, I can't see them giving too much of a shit about what Papa Smut says.

pic related also correctly described where Strigoi see themselves in that system.

Well, just so we're clear, the Codex IS just a bunch of helpful suggestions this time, Guilliman didn't ram it down anyone's throat. There's a lot of good ideas in it, so chapters tend to pick and choose what fits them.

You're right, there's no obligation to answer the call, but then you'd be That Guy who turned his back on his bros, especially since the call only comes during times of extreme crisis. Like, it doesn't come during crises where the idea is "shit, we could lose a whole sector," the call comes when it's a situation of "OH FUCK THIS COULD THREATEN THE WHOLE IMPERIUM." So I would imagine most chapters wouldn't be too comfortable being That Guy.

So it turns out the discussion we had last thread about how much the modern Imperium remembers the nations of Old Earth actually turned into a really good codex entry when you put it all together.

The only thing I kind of feel bad about is it cannibalizes the in-universe quotes from the last thread, which provided a pretty good look at the Imperium on their own.

The entry is kind of primarch heavy, but more focused on how Unification era Earth is viewed in M41. Part of this is because we don’t really have a lot of other Old Earth figures that would have written a lot on their home. Malcador was already mentioned. Kharn and Abbadon were too focused on military endeavors to do so. Typhus was an offworlder. Ahriman probably would have, especially given that he would have noticed he was one of the people in the highest position of power to speak for Achaemenidia, which was a nice place but had no primarchs. Bjorn. Huh. Maybe.

Should I put something other than mono-molecular structures in the quote? I know the Imperium didn’t discover the mono-molecular knife STC until M41 or something, though mono-molecular materials is a future technology something the Imperium would be super-excited about, even if they couldn’t apply it anywhere yet, and the Eldar would be like “Yeah, so?” given their extensive use of that technology.

pastebin.com/YvHCNCep

That is beautifully written and the mono-molecular addition and the eldar reaction fit perfectly.

A thousand years after WotB old nations would have been all but forgotten. That's just the way of things.

I remember the Soviet Union, but I can already see the memory fading in the eyes of younger men and that is right and well.

Yeah, it'd be a little weird for the Eldar not to share their technology with the Imperium. I think we agreed the general tech level of the Imperium is a bit higher than canon Great Crusade since knowledge wasn't lost and some small advancements were made, it's just that the high end goodies are rare due to cost and limited ability to produce it.

Also, if you want to include/expand on the little blurb I wrote for Sanguinius' writing, it is here

They try to be even less evil than the lesser evil. But 10,000 years of warfare, and the need to maintain a stable and chaos free empire, will make you the lesser evil. Thus, one of the themes of our Imperium is the best we wish to be vs the best we can do.

Agree with . Also it makes the Lamenters look like Tattletale Marines (who are tattling for their own gain) more than anything else, as opposed to the selflessness which is their big shtick.

Also, how many chapters would be resorting to mass abductions for recruitment? If the Imperium suspects your chapter is doing something shady, they send you to the back of the line for new gear as a warning to make them shape up. If they can outright confirm it they send the Sisters and perhaps another chapter or two knocking on your door.

Outright raiding other worlds like Huron Blackheart and the Imperium brings the locomotive.

It does sound like this is the general trend. The chapters who kept the Legion name seem to have generally got the best men and planet the Legion had, with the exceptions of visionaries who had their own ideas on how to run a chapter (e.g., Typhus, possibly the Crimson Fists if they're like in canon).

Given how none of the primarchs (except maybe Curze, Morty, and Perty) would be okay with mass abduction, you would also get the descendant chapters ganging up on any offending sibling.

Of course as says you probably get chapters who disown their parent legions, and ignore their sibling chapters as well.

It would certainly explain why they're called the Lamenters. They started out thinking maybe Sanguinius wouldn't have died if only they could have done more. They see every man, woman, and child that die because they weren't fast enough as their fault. They see everything, no matter how hard they try, as just not good enough.

Counterbalancing that is a greater amount of damage to infrastructure caused by the Age of Strife and the WotB.
Also, high end goodies can be produced in massive numbers - but its still not enough to be common across the Imperium. Personal defence shield projectors is an example: a dedicated factory can produce 1 per 150 manhour of work, taking a 5 man team for product assembly, 6 people to machine the parts, 2 people to form the stock used for the parts, and 2 people for quality control over the entire process.
This is if the factory has been running non stop with no loss of knowledge, and its a veteran team doing the build. Now imagine just how juicy of a target this factory, its blueprint repository, and its workers, are to chaos and separatists.
Infrastructure is what gives you the ability to fight and win wars. This is what Chaos targets, for destruction and raids. Chaos can get around their infrastructure issues by summoning daemons and binding them into an appropriate receptacle, raiding for just about anything else, and brute force manufacturing what they really need to make in house.

I think it was mentioned that the Eldar don't share as much of their tech as one would think because of REEEE-ing AdMech. There was mention of hybrid wraithbone experimentation FAR AWAY from Mars in M41, because the AdMech are getting desperate enough to bend their old rules and the Imperium needs literally everything it can find to fight the tyranids, Necrons, Chaos, and Orks.

Will add Sangy. Had thought about him since Objectively Best Primarch got turned into chicken tenders before it became cool to write about Old Earth.

Was not trying to be exhaustive about the primarch's books (since that included other things like the Tome of Fire and Typhon's book). More on how the people of Old Earth tried to preserve the memories of their culture in some way as represented by the efforts of the primarchs...and they failed.

>ork with a sniper rifle
Which is not necessarily the same as an ork sniper.

(samefag)
Fun fact, the whole "Magnus wrote about how ridiculous Ursh was, and no one believed him, but it was true" is actually part of vanilla canon. It didn't involve Magnus of course, but the vanilla Imperium had something similar in the canonical Chronicles of Ursh, which described how bat-shit insane Ursh was including the summoning of daemons and warp-sorcery. The Imperium dismissed it under the Imperial Truth despite every word being true. If they had paid more attention to it the Horus Heresy probably wouldn't have caught everyone off guard.

Reform Mechanicus. Only 1.25% of the total tech priests, but still a large force of advancement. Sorta. The eldar dont like sharing wraithbone, the tau think humans can't get battle suits right, the Jokero are crazy, and the hyper orthodox AdMech will do literally anything to remove xenos tech from the universe. Like funding terrorist groups to blow up bonesingers and battlesuit mechanics.

I'm confused. And here I thought that the Sororitas and Securitas were the same thing, the former starting out as a derogatory name for the latter that stuck. Securitas being their "official" name in High Gothic like "Astartes" is for Space Marines.

Also wouldn't it be Proditorus if we are keeping the High Gothic-is-Latin thing?

Its pseudo Latin.
Okay, so the Adepta Sororitas are an organization separate from the Inquisition, but with a standing order (as in, a rule they all follow) to support the Inquisition. They both have an internal division with the same name: Ordo Securitas for the Inquisition, and the Orders Securitas for the Sororitas. The Orders Securitas are dedicated to support of the Ordo Securitas, while the other Orders of the Sororitas perform other tasks to support the Imperium, like disaster relief and maintaining the Memorial Worlds (the replacement for Shrine Worlds, since the Imperium does not have an official religion).
The Ordo Securitas is the Internal Affairs and Special Investigation branch of the Inquisition. It focuses on governmental corruption and breaches of the Big Five laws. The Inquisition needs a dedicated support organization that is legally separate because it does have the Decree Passive, which restricts a single Inquisitor to just ten alcolytes and an Escort Grade vessel (a frigate or destroyer), or a cargo transport. Anything else had to be requested from another organization for a specific purpose and duration. These requests for aid often disrupted a lot of necessary things, like war efforts or food shipments.
The original Sororitas were made of:
Surviving and defecting members of the Brides of The Emperor (Vandire's personal bodyguards/special operatives/concubines)
The Sisters of Silence (later on)
And a civilian disaster relief organization that was all female due to its religious background of Isha worship (the Sisters Solamens, later the Orders Solamens).

>Proditorus
If High Gothic really was Latin, then Ordo Hereticus should be Haereticus. The closest thing to High Gothic is Germanized Latin which makes a lot of sense. Pretty much half of the developed world speak either the a Romance language or the Germanic tongues. One of the first languages to leave Terra would be the Latinized, Germanics, and Chinese.
(pic related)

I thought the implication was that Low Gothic and High Gothic are languages that no one today would understand (they could be a derivative of Mandarin Chinese, Hindi, Spanish, and English for all we know), but they are translated as English and Latin for the readers convenience, because when readers (read:Brits) think of a "high" language and a "vulgar" language, Latin and English are the first two that come to mind.

Oh, I see. The issue is we somehow ended up with an Inquisitorial branch called the Securitas, and an Adeptas Branch called the Securitas.

Also, aren't the Sisters of Silence dead?

>Doian Liberation Front attacks a cargo hover transports with Mechanicus emblems on it.
>The only guards are inexperience PDF troopers with old stubbers.
>Separatist uses pre-planned kill zones to ambush the PDF.
>After winning the ambush, the DLF plant explosives on the transports.
>Before the bombs could denote, the separatist near the transports are killed by Tech-Priests bursting out.
>DLF panics then set off the bombs early while mowing down everybody close to the convoy.
>DLF runs away when they thought everything was dead.
>Unknown to the DLF, the convey was taking researchers off-world to a research station.
>The DLF was informed by a shady servitor that Eldar weapons were going to built to put down a human rebellion.
>They were told that materials to build such weapons was being moved off-world under a Machanicus emblems.
>It was actually Tech-Priest secretly being transferred to research Eldar weaponry.
>Shadow Wars: Techno boogaloo

Information obtained by Securitas Sisters after enhanced interrogation methods on DLF members, along with leaks from informants.

Donia not Doia.

My basic goal is to give the Imperium a nerf in the form of lots of internal conflict.
Also, because it provides adventure. I come at 40k from an RPG perspective, not a wargame one.
We needed a replacement for the Hereticus, since, you know, no Imperial religion.

Come to think of it, we made the Orkz stronger, Tyranids attack sooner, unholy Dark Crone Eldar union, and corruption stronger. While having Humans, Eldar, and Tau under the Imperium to counter Chaos. Sisters are smarter to counter corruption and decent industry to counter Tyranids. Necrons are a wild card that might be able to reproduce again. Almost everybody don't hold the idiot ball except for the GrimDark separatist, who are being controlled by Chaos, vampires, or an Imperial organization in the numerous Shadow Wars. Only a few legions worth of Marines become Fallen but receive more buffs from the gods.

My introduction to 40k was looking at Imperial Guard models, so that's why I do go into detail about Guardsmen.

I'm guessing the combat ones are dead but the ones working on the Black Ships are still alive.

My first actual introduction to 40k was a SoB model. Until then, I thought it was stupid. Especially when my friend in high school told me that GW didn't want anybody using actual military tactics when he was reading the IG codex.
Seriously, I tried to read the IG codex (back in... 2010, I think?), and all I got out of it was "we stopped studying military history after WW1, but brought in the tanks that broke trench warfare, and you're fighting armies that ignore trenches".
Part of why I thought 40k was stupid.
Then I found Dark Heresy, and many sins were forgiven. Except the grimderp.

But that's why the Sororitas is my baby.
I'm also a compulsive world builder, so religion, sociology, governmental structures, ands various background details are my thing.

Back in 2008, my friend described to me Space Marines which I thought sounded stupid and ridiculous. Then I saw his Guardsmen models that looked very nice. Eventually, I somehow ended up in a Black Crusade campaign, where we stole super secret Imperial ships and their blueprints while helping a Black Crusade by launching diversionary attacks from the Maelstrom. Loving Chaos at the time, I heard of the Sisters thinking "Amazonian Gothic nuns, so?" then I saw the models thinking "Holy flamers!" and that's how I converted.

I've never played any 40k. I could never afford any models or codexes, and I couldn't find anynbody that I wanted to play DH with (or any 40k RPG). Mostly because they gave me the vibe of "you're a reasonable person. The Inquisition kills you for being reasonable. Refusing to engage in excessive senseless violence is a sign of chaos worship.".
You can see my attachment to this project.

So are there Zoats in this setting?

The whole thing with the internal divisions is probably why editfag 'n' co wanted to simplify it - keeping the structure roughly as it was in vanilla, except the Orders Militant just serve as the Inquisition's shooty muscle.

This is what the Sisters are roughly like in Vanilla. I added Securitas because in vanilla the Sisters have nothing Inquisition related, while here they do - the Orders Militant were specifically for the front lines in vanilla. And being a soldier and being a cop/spy are rather different specialties.
We could rename the Orders Securitas to Orders Inquisitorial or something like that if the term closeness is too confusing.
To be fair, I added two types of Orders (Securitas and Solamens), and removed the Dialogus, whose schtick now belongs to the Rhetor Imperia.

Page 10 bamp

The Krole fluff has then pulling a Thermopylae so the Black Ships can escape.

The Necrons definitely got a buff as well. Silent King has nearly everyone unified under his banner except a few crazies or wild cards that don't fit his policies, and he has all the super-tech the Necrons had been building years ago. Including four or five extra World Engines.

Having too much internal conflict, especially separatism, doesn't make a whole lot of sense on two levels though. First is in-universe, inclusion in the Imperium is largely voluntary, unlike canon where the Imperium has a manifest destiny hardon and wants to rule the galaxy. So if a world is agitating enough to leave, Oscar would just cut them loose and say "I told you so" when they get curb stomped by the next Waaagh because the Imperial Army is no longer around to protect them.

There could certainly be maneuvering and scheming within the structures of the Imperium, but that would be largely bloodless, and small groups of separatists are certainly present, but their impact would be limited. Essentially, separatist sentiment shouldn't reach a planetary government level or else the Imperium will just leave them to their devices and indulge in some schadenfreude when the next crisis rolls around.

Second is thematic. Obviously people are flawed and will disagree and scheme, some times violently, but again at the basis of this AU is the theme that people are good and work together to face down the true evil in the galaxy, and having too much internal conflict undermines that.

The way I see it, the Imperium buffs are largely countered by how much scarier the xenos are in this setting, as the full hive fleet is here, the Orks are more organized, and Necrons are mostly unified instead of being a bunch of warring dynasties.

It was mentioned in earlier threads that there is still some low level tension going on, planets trying to settle old pre-Imperial grudges behind the Imperium's back. Separatist movements who think things aren't as bad as they are and want to break away (often covertly backed by Chaos).

People may be inherently good, but they're also inherently flawed.

It's probably like what people often say about vanilla 40k. There are lots of planets in the Imperium with no covert tension, you just hear about the ones that do because that's where it happens.

All this talk of internal conflict made me write this yesterday night.

Flames Rising
>pastebin.com/z2zDF9CS
Securitas Sisters play with fire.

It was mentioned last thread that Oscar and Isha adopt and must have over the centuries adopted what must be thousands at least.

Criteria for adoption into the Royal Family would probably involve psychic development in infancy. Typically it only starts at puberty, a psychic child is horrifying and needs to be raised by another psyker. Preferably a stronger one.

Add to this that all eldar children are very low psychics and Macha is desperate to have a child of her own.

The great tragedy of it is that they can't be given rejuvenants for nothing but family connections without it being massively favouritism. The royal couple will outlive all of their children, some a hundred times over.

Not so much huge rebellions but minor skirmishes on worlds or in space. The separatist within the Imperium are more stupid than Orks because they think their worlds can survive outside of the Imperium. They are the weakest threat to the Imperium because they are a bunch of pawns used by third parties in their Shadow Wars. Edgy GrimDark human fags controlled by Chaos. Assblasted Eldar using Eldar separatist to indirectly attack rivals. Greedy governors lets the separatist get stronger to let them ask for more money then embezzle said extra money. I don't think a majority of citizens on these worlds would want to be independent because the Imperium is effectively a hegemonic empire by M.41. Not to mention why would the Emperor allow worlds to be independent just because of a few violent insurgents. Sure on Vox News you see a terrorist attack but to the wider Imperium that is not the norm and it rarely happens.

One of the reasons that the Separatists won't win is because of Oscar's psychology. He was built and raised to serve humanity. It's hardwired in and the way he was raised. He won't willingly let a world leave because out of the Imperium's aegis they will die. And that will be his fault and he couldn't live with that.

Allowing it even once would set a very bad precedent.

Hence the current war with wayward Severan Dominate.

But at the same time, would fighting a war and sacrificing hundreds of thousands of Imperial lives be worth doing so if all you have to do is wait and watch them squirm a bit before running back.

You don't even have to let the WAAAGH! hit them. Just let them stew for a bit seeing how they like it without aid from the AdMech or the Administratum (no trade across Imperial borders without Writ of Trade, remember?) and then when they panic when the WAAAGH! comes ride in to the rescue before they get wrecked ("ride in" being a relative term due to Warp travel).

That's making the assumption that they would have time to squirm and call for help and that call be answered before everyone ends up dead or worse.

This may be one of those cases where it just isn’t possible for Oscar to do an objectively right thing. Leave the planet defenseless in the case of a WAAAGH! or any of the other horrors that infest the galaxy and you leave billions of people to die. Jump in to defend it despite the planet publicly thumbing their nose at the Imperium and other planets start to wonder why they have to pay the tithe if the Imperium is going to come to their defense anyway. The justification of the tithe is basically you give up supplies and send soldiers to other planets and we make sure someone gets sent to your planet when things are rough. Places like Cadia will balk that a planet gets away with paying no tithe and still receives backup when they are constantly fighting for their life and still have to pay a tithe. On the other other hand, leading a war to take back the planet means that millions of people will end up getting killed in the cross-fire, which could end up just as bad as letting a WAAAGH! hit it. Imagine Krieg but with numerous Imperial assets like Space Marines and Titans on-planet when the nukes start launching.
Declaring war may ironically be the best course of option unless the planet is too fortified. As said on the 1d4chan page, “those rules are broken or the boat is excessively rocked the Imperium suddenly does care and that is terrible because it has no sense of proportional escalation and will confiscate your planet”.

I like it.
I was thinking maybe 1% of planets would have a serious separatist movement. Very few of them succeed. While the spectre of separatism gets played up in media and games, it remains a small threat.
Most Shadow Wars have other causes: religion is a big one, organized crime is even bigger, personal grudges between nobles, planets trying to shove another planet into civil war for political gain, AdMech and manufacturers hiring mercs to sneak into laboratories, stuff like that.
It obviously doesn't cover every planet, or even half of them, but it does cover enough to provide a lot of work for the Inquisition.

(same)

You know, thinking about it a little more, the Severan Dominate might be a good way to explore this issue.

Before I checked Lexicanum, I thought the Severan Dominate was in the Segmentum Pacificus/western Tempestus. If that is the case, then they might have never seen an actual war. They might think that things like a Q'orl invasion or the Badab War represent major conflicts. They may have heard of things like the tyranids, a Beast WAAAGH!, or a Black Crusade, but they might think that these are the same scale of conflict they see but with different xenos and the survivors are just exaggerating the scale.

The Severan Dominate might interpret the overwhelming response of the Imperium to occurences in their sector as the desperate attempts of a failing empire to hold onto power, rather than simply what the Imperium is able to do with it's simply fuckhuge army in times of relative peace. They're like the Tau, but even more arrogant. The Dominate might even be stupid enough to try and get backing from forces that they should know better than to negotiate with to achieve their goals.

But the Dominate are in Obscurus, even if they are on the periphery. They should know what a Black Crusade or major WAAAGH! looks like. They are far enough on the outskirts that they should know that having military power to dissuade xenos from the Koronus expanse would be a good thing.

There are a lot of confiscated planets, places where the term "Imperial Governor" is more than title caused by people electing the Imperial Representative to whatever ultimate position they have.
On these worlds, those people were stupid enough to lose their right of self rule. Direct rule by a Governor chosen by Oscar and Eldrad, the tithe is increased to pay for the forces needed to bring them back in, unemployment is reduced as extra work is brought in to support the war efforts (because if you have an entire planet at your disposal, with no local government to work through, you might as well use it), and... Its actually a pretty nice deal. Planets used to try and get themselves under direct imperial rule until Oscar started threatening to hand them over to the AdMech as new forge worlds.

>liking a /tv/ meme

god fucking dammit I hate baneposting

Seriously, didn't we say we weren't going to have gratuitous references? I'm fine with light heartedness or silliness, but baneposting is so fucking dumb.

I mean in fairness, I got a Sensible Chuckle (TM) but not much more.

I would say Oscar and Isha more than Oscar and Eldrad.

Eldrad is not by any means an administrator or a particularly good peace time leader. Times when he assumes direct control is when shit gets real like in the siege of the Imperial Palace during the WotB. If given a handful of assets and a goal he can move those pieces around till the goal is met, grinning manically and dancing like a lunatic, but when it comes to the everyday humdrum he just can't quite cope. He can make good split second decisions and put the ground work in for shit to happen a thousand years from now. Just don't ask him to aim for the middle ground or he gets bored, palms the job off to an underling and wanders off.

Isha can organize things in her own idiosyncratic way, she is a deity, but she is almost as bad at the paperwork as Eldrad.

Oscar is the only one who gives a shit about the smooth running of the colossal but well oiled machine that is the Imperium. He knows well enough to set policy in place and only intervene when it goes wrong or something new turns up and the process needs tweaking.

An Imperial Governor would be appointed under the authority of the Immortal Emperor but the two of them might never have met. In this regard the High Lords have all the authority to act in his name as they see fit and only inform the Emperor if something odd or interesting happens.

This is the reason for the Emperor and Empress going on constant tours and inspections of the Imperium. They are checking up to make sure all those automatic processes that they put in to place are in fact working as intended.

As for Eldrad; he has no official authority beyond that of a Farsser, a role that is primarily advisory in any case. Certainly he has no Imperial title. His authority comes from everyone being either in awe or fear of him, sometimes both at once.

I just did it to see what it would look like if somebody said "Subtle references? Fuck that shit!" and it looks pretty bad. At least my version of Scions makes them pretty much be on par with the Sisters. I know this is trash teir rip-off.