The party is facing a sorceress wearing nothing but a bikini

>the party is facing a sorceress wearing nothing but a bikini
>her AC is higher than the fighter in full plate
>with a 75% miss chance on top of that
>and a 50% chance of not being targettable at all
I thought casters were supposed to be squishy?

>Obligatory
Have you tried not playing Pathfinder?

I'm not. I'm playing D&D 5e.

Bounded accuracy makes your scenario impossible in 5.

>mage armor
>18 dex
>some magic item that lets her add Cha to AC
>20 cha
>22 AC
vs
>Fighter chose Defense fighting style and doesn't have a shield
>19 AC

>some magic item that lets her add Cha to AC
Which item is that

The one from the Tiamat adventure.

I wasn't sure where, but I believe it.
>22 AC
>mirror image
>blink
We lost, of course. Two of us died when the other three surrendered.

>armor class

"Each dragon mask is a legendary wondrous item that reshapes to fit the face and head of a wearer attuned to it."

This is literally a unique item of legend.

What level was this?

7th. I think the DM wanted this level's boss to be similar to Rezmir, but a spellcaster instead of a fighter.

So, did you guys have no AoE?
The DM *does* give you advantage if you flank?

No advantage for flanking, no. And yes we had AOE. But our wizard didn't take Dispel Magic so we couldn't deal with her self-buffs.

...

...

Well, the real answer may have been to flee for 1 minute and let her burn out both of her defensive spells.

You mean the universally panned one?

While she's hurling cones of cold and hypnotic patterns at us?

Yes. Possibly winning vs. no chance of winning is rather obvious.

You are not playing 5e.
You are playing DM NPC Quest

>Bosses should be easy fights

Good news is she let our cleric stabilize our dying friends. We're playing again tonight so we'll see how things go.

I'm still baffled how you guys lost.
Did you just not have a plan?
Can your wizard not blast?

I mean, how?
Please, describe the fight in whatever detail you can recall.

>7th level party vs. a sorcerer with high stats, 3 turns worth of buffs, a bullshit magic item, and 5th level spells

Your DM was trying to kill you. Your only hope would've been spamming counterspell and trying to dispel all her shit.

But now I'm curious. Did she have all the buffs on when the fight started or did you guys not manage to stop her from applying them?

>boss has a literal item of legend and infinite spells

This should teach your wizard to ALWAYS prepare Counterspell and Dispel Magic

This should teach you that sometimes the GM doesn't want you to win.

A single hypnotic pattern could cause party wipe if you are bunched up.

I fucking hate casters in 5e.

And martials.

...Fuck me, I'll just go back and play 4e.

Armor Class doesn't literally mean how strong your armor is. In fact it's almost the opposite - how well you can avoid taking damage at all. A traditional ghost would have infinite AC against anyone not using magic because you literally cannot give the one two punch to a ghost. A sorc can easily be believed to be far harder to give a solid hit than someone wearing full plate armor, and the miss chance / targetability thing is par for the course.

>we're exploring the dungeon
>get into a fight with a pair of ogres
>easy enough, wizard spends some spells
>ms sexy and evil appears out of thin air
>her stealth was above any of our passive perceptions, and she was invisible, so she gets surprise
>hypnotic pattern
>half the party is incapacitated
>paladin swings at her
>she hits one of her mirror image duplicates
>cone of cold
>wizard drops to 0hp, rest are hurt
>fighter is incapacitated
>cleric rushes to help our dying friends
>ogres keep attacking
>paladin's turn
>she vanishes from existence
>fades back in
>lightning bolt
>rogue goes down
>fighter falls to his knees, begs for mercy
And that's how we got rekt
He's taking both of them next level.
A mage with 5th level spells is only CR 6. I think he thought the magic item made her a fair boss.
Just goes to show how ridiculous hypnotic pattern is.

They ARE squishy. But you have to hit them first.

I was the paladin by the way

So the boss was prebuffed and everything? Sounds like your GM wants you to work for her or go through a prison arc.

>sorceress wearing nothing a bikini

Was this her? 22 Cha indeed OuO

>So the boss was prebuffed and everything?
Yep. The DM has a specific philosophy--he always plays all his baddies to the absolute max of their abilities. He never pulls any punches. Whether it's kobolds designing their lair to fit them best or casters prebuffing, he insists on not holding back. As a consequence he tends to field lower CR monsters.

>Sounds like your GM wants you to work for her or go through a prison arc.
Both are possible, but I think he expects us to kill/capture her before too long. For all her power and combat skill she seems to be pretty inexperienced when it comes to locking up prisoners. Even forgot to take the wizard's component pouch.

Tonight I'll try and have us break out. My character would rather capture her alive if possible, but I get the feeling the wizard wants her dead. The rogue is smitten with her and wants to redeem her.

Pretty much what I imagined actually, though the DM said dragon sorc. So maybe that with scales.

>Character with multiple high level stats and an extremely powerful magical item can beat Joe fighter with his basic class abilities.

Water wet, sky blue, OP a fag

I'm just imagining this chick and it's hot as shit.

>not reading the thread, the post

Prebuffing is okay.

Prebuffing and giving her a one of a kind, unique artefact that would probably eat her weak soul for breakfast is stupid.

Not if she's mean't to be a serious boss in the campaign.

If the GM isn't gonna pull punches then he is a hypocrite. Either kill the party or make things even in a fight, don't wipe the floor then show mercy.

Honestly depends, it's easy enough if she's the BBEG and epic-class.

Not him but what if she wanted them alive? If she's not going to lose anyway then not showing her full abilities is actually the smart thing to do while not pulling any punches.

I mean, the whole party seemed to enjoy it. And we're eager to get some payback tonight.

She seemed pleased with our surrender, so I imagine she did want us alive.

Hey Swifttail. You should have gone assassin instead of mastermind.

Fun is the most important thing. I wish my players didn't throw fits when they lost and got taken alive.

We tend to be a pretty relaxed bunch. This just means we get to hate somebody evil, which is always great.

AC *IS* miss chance

No, I mean stacked on top of the AC. Mirror Image gives a 75% chance to target the wrong "her".

That miss chance decreases with every miss, though.

CR 6 can still party wipe with the right spells and doesn't account for magic items, prebuffing, and surprise. Throw ogres on top of it and you're fucked.

I say your DM is either an idiot or wanted you to lose.

Doesn't matter if the party wipes in 2 rounds.

>party is level 3 with 1 level 4
>traveling through wilderness
>DM has us roll on an encounter table
>roll "Hard Enemy Encounter"
>traveling through wet swampy area
>one party member notices a bunch of bubbles in the water as if something is under there
>suddenly Young Black Dragon emerges
>dragon ends up being second on the initiative list
>flies in and uses breath weapon
61 damage
>only had 30 HP
>dead before I get a turn

still salty over this

I guess a deadly+ encounter in the middle of a dungeon would make that happen, yeah.

Shit happens user.
Would you rather DM always "give you a chance" effectively meaning HP and death is meaningless because the DM always gives you an out?

Could have given signs a dragon was in the territory.

I'd rather death be a punishment for poor positioning or falling into traps than "you rolled on a table, unavoidable death"

>I'd rather death be a punishment for poor positioning or falling into traps
So in other words you'll never die because you'll never associate any death as being your own fault.
You'd always have the excuse of incomplete information so the DM shouldn't have killed you.

I already had another character die and it was my fault so you're wrong

Nigga, that death was just two rolls into death with nothing they could do.

That death was your fault too for fighting the dragon instead of running away or trying to talk to it.

...

There should've been signs a dragon was around. This is no different from rolling 1d4 and having an Epic Wizard show up as a level 1 party if you roll a nat 1.

I couldn't run away. Dragon killed me before I had a turn. Only way to run away was to metagame as if my character saw "hard encounter" in the clouds and decided to go somewhere else. Also I didn't speak draconic.

Well thems the breaks.
DM established his style as the kind where you can die at any time.
Maybe you'll be more careful next time. Maybe take the long way around instead of going through the swamp.

>Roll hard encounter on road
>Red dragon swoops down and kills party

Who?

Yeah. What scares me though is this table also includes such things as "deadly encounter" and "deadly encounter: ambush"

Our rogue. He's falling hard for the sorceress.

There's a difference between dying in combat where you could at least theoretically win, and dying because the GM goes "rocks fall, everyone dies."

But DM didn't go
>rocks fall everybody dies
He rolled a hard encounter, dragon rolled better initiative, user failed the saving through, the DM rolled high damage
Completely different.

>But DM didn't go
He might as well have.

No, because at any of those steps user would probably not have died
You're a shitty babby "there shouldn't be a threat of death ever" player.
Go play a storygame kiddo because that's clearly what you want.

I have a feeling that this did not actually happen, but anyways:

>Level 7
>Enemy has 18 dex, 20 cha, perfectly prepared spells + very powerful magical items
>And ogre henchmen

Had you encountered her before? Did you have any idea that she might have been in the dungeon? Did the non-caster have anything to do this fight other than hit the ogres?

Is the sorceress one of those 10/10 20yo level 20 girls?

A level 3 party has no chance of either out-fighting or out-running a young black dragon short of a miracle.

>Roll hard encounter in the tavern
>Bartender is a young black dragon
>Entire tavern is made of young black dragons
>Entire town was actually just young black dragons

Your fault desu

We'd met her before but didn't know she was a bad guy. Rumor was there was a spellcaster in the dungeon. Once she showed up we switched to focus her.
Level 9 actually, I believe, but other than that yes

>No, because at any of those steps user would probably not have died
That's like expecting a level 1 to solo three Shadows and saying "well sucks to be you haha".

>implying she's a bad guy
She's just lonely user :(

>young black dragon are replacing the kingdom's populace

>Roll encounter dice
>Die is a young black dragon, total party wipe again.

Hah! Well, I guess we'll see tonight if Swifttail's dashing kobold good looks will thaw her half-elf heart.

Something like this, perhaps?

I'd play in that world

Wrong.
>Mage Armor, Shield, Mirror Image, Blink
All of these can be used at the saved time.

What bounded accuracy does do is limit the AC the martial characters can hope to achieve to an extremely low number, so good job.

>saved
Same*, Blink is the only one that uses concentration.

Oh god, Shield. Her AC would have gone to 27.

>OuO

What people think bounded accuracy does: Wow, martials hit a lot more often than they did in 3.5 and player AC actually matters beyond the first few levels!

What bounded accuracy actually does: makes high AC enemies annoying as all fuck to fight for the entire game unless you're bypassing AC, makes only the lowest of the low AC enemies able to be hit on a 2 by a max level Fighter, and not even that when you consider GWM. Monster attack bonuses still get out of control at high CR so you really have to pour on the magic items to make AC do work.

I still don't understand why people think bounded accuracy means martials hit more.

could not be, Tharja is not a villain

Pretty much.

I found pic related. Looks just like the DM's description sounded.
Game's about to start, I'll tell you how things shape up this time. Hopefully we'll do better in this fight.

Course you would.
>Roll stats.
>Noobish character generator but whatever

>Get a 18
>Dm rules you are now a young adult black dragon.

That sounds fun as fuck

...

Goddamn that's hot. Somebody in your party better fuck her.

>magic
Well gee whiz bucko.
There's your answer.

>Fighting for Plegia when you first encounter her
>Creepy stalker
>Abuses her daughter

The only good thing about Tharja is that she made bodystockings more popular.

The young black dragon is a CR7 encounter. Most parties can hit above their CR level because we're not stupid, but a level 3 party can't do this. Its breath weapon does anywhere from 8 to 88 damage with an average of 49 with its breath weapon or 32 damage in melee. They stand no chance. This is not a "threat of death" it's ensured death.

There are exactly two theoretical upsides to Tharja: Her daughter, and making her daughter.
For all her faults and creepiness, she is pretty much walking sex.
Though, again, her daughter is the superior waifu.