Triple Skulls Edition

Wow, that's bad. They didn't even make the almost-silence an instant

The big problem is less that Gideon's strong, and more that the number of differing threats we're seeing now from D&T is too much. And I don't think Abrupt Decay is worth it against D&T, at least not in AnT. Forces us to do gymnastics with our mana against a deck that taxes already, costs 3 if Thalia comes down, and doesn't give an appreciable benefit over Push/Chain when Mom is lurking.

I've been considering giving TES a spin lately, and I'd definitely pack a Snare, a Grapeshot, and a Massacre for all this idiocy that's getting printed. What I like about Charbelcher is that you win or lose before all the hatebears become relevant.

Wouldn't want to confuse the newbies. God forbid we have cards that force them to actually know the rules.

What's with everyone's boner for Void Snare? Sure, it's a good card, but many other cards feel straight up better. Like, what matchups do you want it against?

I didn't plan to share these stats until my die roll % tended towards 50, but here's most of my finishes from the last couple of months: docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1E5Xhot100-k7FQkrQKM54QvC3JR-AaICft0CgSQQIWM/edit?usp=sharing
I'm not high on Excel and have therefore not figured out how to show Win% with regards to play/draw, if anyone has a tip I'd be glad to try.

I imagine its just a catch all that can be wished for. like if your opponent plays a gaddock teeg game 1 that you need to get rid of, you wish for the snare and go off anyway

I'd honestly rather Grapeshot it and any other problem creatures/face. I guess I should try Snare again sometime soon though.

yes but you can't grapshot non-creatures, so its a hedge against them as well. its versatility is why its good

I think void snare is kind of weak, and it's by far my least wished for card. I've tried dropping it a couple times and it seems like whenever I do I wish I had it. I actually side it in more than I wish for it. It's a catch-all. Sometimes it just does the trick.

DDFT definitely wants decay vs DnT, but the fact I already play 2 main and play 2-3 more lands makes it easier to cast. Plus it means I don't have to use up more boardspace for DnT specific answers.

what are some opinions on classic UB reanimator? Is dark ritual just too good not to run? I have played it a bit but not the RB version, and I really liked cantrips and countermagic. Sure, it may not be as fast, but you have so many more options for interaction

It's.... just a worse R/B. Given that people are already packing ways to interact with Reanimation (2x Surgical in every board at the very least); having a slightly slower variant of the same deck doesn't bode well.

Once you get the mulligan'ing down for R/B you understand why the cantrips are superfluous for the deck.

I really don't think that is the case. They are different, for sure, and r/b is faster. However, brainstorm is a hell of a magic card, and counter magic is often better than discard. It just doesn't make sense to me how UB was a sold tier ~2 deck for a long time, and RB was some obscure budget version, and then it suddenly becomes fotm and kills UB. there are no new cards that really caused this, it just sort of happened

So I own stock Jund/Abzan in Modern and play Delver in Pauper and I suppose it's time I man the fuck up and buy the Force of Wills I need for Legacy. Should I go Delver or Shardless Midrange? And am I just making myself miserable doing so? Would I be having more fun trying to save for Elves or Infect or something? Qualifier is that I'll be using shocks like a scrub and slowly get my Duals.

What permanents are of relevance? Among what void snare can but Grapeshot can't handle, I'd say leyline (both sanctity and void) as well as RiP are the most annoying permanents, all of which can be brute forced through AdN/more Goblins.

Do you have examples of other permanents that are hard to interact with?

~~Collective Brutality~~
Also it is better suited to the Eldrazi meta we had than UB, as of now the meta's still shaken and needs to get its shit together.

delver with shocks is rough because you play daze. Shardless has fallen out of favor for other 3/4 color leovold midrange, but is probably one of the decks that takes the least hits from playing shocks, although you will still feel it in aggro matchups. another problem is that having shocks encourages you to fetch end step, whereas brainstorm encourages you to hold fetches for as long as possible. having the first of each relevant dual is very good because it gives that option if you don't want to take the 2. elves is not bad with an overgrown tomb or two, but then you need cradles which are just as bad as duals.

well if you have the luxury of not using goblins for your win and instead just drilling them, you don't get blown out by a random ee/deluge/etc. Off the top of my head, there is sphere, thorn, 3sphere, maybe blood moon. The point is that sometimes you just get randomly dicked by something and you want a card that will hit basically anything you will come across. You don't necessarily need it in your wishboard, but it is a nice option to have.

brutality can be played in UB as well. although yes, RB is definitely better against eldrazi, but I also think UB is still favored in the matchup, just not as much.

Yeah I figure I'll feel the pain from Daze, I was definitely planning on getting the duals in that order, one of each first.

Is converting from BUG Midrange to BUG Delver particularly difficult? Most of the parts are similar right? And the key differentiating spells for Delver I probably have/aren't that expensive? I mean I do have stuff like Leovold, Sylvan Library, Jitte and Jace in singletons so I guess I'd be more motivated to play the Midrange but after playing it so long in Modern I would like to slowly make my way to more aggressive strategies.

BUG is pretty similar to midrange if you play the hymn version. It goes heavier on the black to play double black spells like hymn, liliana, and tombstalker, and is probably the slowest/most grindy delver list. Overall it plays very similarly to a midrange deck, but sometimes you just get to start attacking with a 3/2 flier on turn 2. Then there are some less popular bug variants that play lower to the ground with cards like stifle, spell pierce, etc. but if you are going for that playstyle grixis or 4 color is probably better.

Seriously cant wait to test out new Gideon in D&T. Curve Thalia into him and drop his emblem thats game over against most combo decks.

In my meta Trinishpere and Blood Moon are common cards, Wish->Void Snare gives you an out with minimal cost.

I'm feeling this post. I built BR with the intention of converting it to UB later. I love blue and I never thought I would want to play a deck that has no cantrips but holy shit, learn how to mull correctly and the deck will bend them over.

>wanting to play cantrips
Fag

How are you going to play a Gideon on turn 3 if you already have a Thalia?

That's part of why I don't think DnT will really want it. They can't curve thalIA into gideon, and they can't tutor for gideon, and you wouldn't probably want more than 1 or 2. Just seems a little awkward, though potentially strong.

Shit my magical christmas land is ruined. Gideon feels so much like a creature.

Im going to run him in Miracles. Turn 3 with Force of Will backup in hand makes it very hard for any combo deck to beat that emblem. They would have to have a Force of their own and a way to bounce it and then win next turn. Against any Storm variant it may just be GG as they would have to have Decay or Bounce and be immediately able to win next turn. It buys me a whole turn to set up a harder lock.

I'm not convinced that'll be that great. Miracles already has a turn 2 lockpiece that can be difficult for combo decks to beat, and most combo decks want to win before Gideon comes down. Plus they can just duress him away before then. Most non-combo decks will have no problem removing him. Seems win-more. No need for a turn 3 lockpiece against a turn 2-3 deck that you already have a 50-50 or better match up against. By all means try it because it has the potential to be just horrifying. But I wouldn't be syprised if it wasnt anything to write home about.

CounterTop isnt really a turn two lockpiece since turn 1 top into turn 2 CB leaves me no mana to spin the top, it only can counter the CMC of the card already on top of my library. It only really starts revving up when I have a lot of mana to activate it in response to spells.

I think it's a better Worship, and Worship was already a pretty decent card. I really wish we had some more spells that interacted with Planeswalkers.

I am excited about the new Liliana. Not because I think it's a powerhouse, but it does do a lot of things I want it to do in a Mono-black control shell.

well it can also counter 1 cmc spells if you flip the top. sometimes just jamming top on turn 1 and cb on turn 2 is enough to slow down combo decks for you to win

Miracles here, if they nut up and ban mentor I will be swapping them out for new gideon. Until then it looks pretty meh

Weee, terror-attack in Sweden prevents me from playing magic tonight. But I found my way to a pub so ~~~

Sucks, senpai. Get yo drank on. I've got a rare legacy FNM tonight for practice for the weekend.

Stay safe famiglia, I miss the Old World too but I'm trying to steer clear of it until the sand niggers have been purged.

American pubs just are nothing like European ones ;_;

Stay safe man. It sucks that Europe as a whole is hellbent on importing dangerous bronze age beliefs that are in direct opposition to western values. It's pretty ironic actually considering Europe fought so hard to kick out the Muslims during the middle ages and now they are importing them as fast as the can.

>tfw no Circle of Protection: Truck

Bump. Anyone doing fnm?

How do I beat D&T as Lands? I know Tabernacle is a godsend in the match up but once they vial in the fucking Sanctum on 2 I feel like the game is over.

Molten Vortex in sideboard?

lol, unfortunately I can't share this in any meaningful way with my non-magic friends ~~
Too good to be true

I got 1 in the main, but revoker shuts that down

Anger of the Gods? Ancient Grudge? More Krosan Grips?

Tried moving here? ;)

How do you guys feel about burn? Thinking of leaving modern and don't want to go through the process of building another deck unless I have to

Burn is a perfectly fine deck and by far the best legacy deck in terms of cost to efficacy. I just lost to it first round of fnm. The only thing about burn is its played by brain dead window lickers. Like the guy I played against.
I hate him, he's a douche. Yes I'm salty

>have casual game with guy
>tells me he only has an experimental deck, it's not real serious
>tell him that's cool, I have casual decks
>his turn one is ancient tomb, sundial of the infinite
>interesting
>play a land, pass turn
>turn two is city of traitors, smokestack
>the rest of the game, he ticks up the counters on smokestack then uses sundial to end the turn before he has to sacrifice anything
>I'm sitting there with a 100% empty board
>smokestack is up to 6 counters, I'm wondering what he's going to do because he'll have to wipe his own board as well
>ask him what the win condition is here exactly
>"Well, I'm skipping my draw step. so you'll draw out before me"
>mfw

STAX'D

I built my first "legacy" deck today.
I was playing against my buddy's casual elf combo deck and pulled off the dream halls to enter the infinite to board wipe to elixir of immortality to one with nothing to battle of wits win.

It feels good.

Play some lands. They lose.

It's the epitome of value. Definitely better than Shardless, Jund, or any of the white decks that seem to think the color is worth something (except the elephant in the room). Keep in mind, though, that you'll (paradoxically) need to splash white (maybe green) to deal with left-field hate like Leyline of Sanctity.

Yeah, it feels pretty win-more to me, and Mentor's better in Miracles. Speaking of Mentor, I'm surprised Venezuelan Legends still exists, not to mention Angels.

Almost certain you're not serious.

Apologies to everyone post facto; I've been pretty tetchy lately.

no burn deck ever needs to splash a color (unless you think ur delver is just blue burn). just stay mono-red, it makes price better and you are immune to wasteland. Leyline of sanctity is not common in legacy

I play mono-red Burn, and I'm seriously thinking of splashing white. I would change the manabase (duh) and the list would be:
4 Goblin Guide
3 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Rift bolt
4 Lightning bolt
4 Chain Lightning
4 Lava Spike
4 Price of Progress
4 Fireblast
2 Searing blaze
3 Sulfuric Vortex

3 Plateau
4 Arid mesa
4 Bloodstained Mire
9 Mountains

mono red sideboard:
3 Ensnaring Bridge, 2 Searing blaze, 1 Pyrostatic pillar, 4 Leyline of the Void,
what the sideboard would be in Rw:
3 Wear // Tear, 3 Leyline of sanctity, 3 Deflecting palm, 3 Tormod's crypt, 3 {Pyroblast or Exquisite Firecraft}.

I have a lot of Miracles, Show & Tell and Eldrazi in my metagame. Like everyone else I guess. What do you think of this splash? would it be an improvement?

I don't see why you'd need leyline. Deflecting palm seems like a trap vs sns. Like you leave rw up into their emrakul and it just screams defecting palm. Bridge just seems better there.

Well deflecting palm is intented as a trap against (Big) Eldrazi, Sneak and Show or even Elfball. In my experience, while SnS is an almost automatic game loss, the games against Eldrazi are pretty close, and bouncing 4 or 5 damage would probably give me the edge. I have the feeling that Bridge is slightly too slow to save my ass...

The white Leyline can be useful against ANT, DDFT, burn or weird milling strategies. I've never tried though, and I'm also pondering the black Leyline, it is probably the most useful card in my mono-red sideboard, or O-Ring to get rid of an Emrakul or Iona.

Speaking from experience, white leyline isn't that great vs ddft. Black leyline is fine vs graveyard strats but I think crypt or surgical is better since you dont need to mull aggressively to it

White Leyline isn't that good against TES, they'll just make a million goblin tokens and beat down or Burning Wish for Void Snare and kill you with Tendrils anyway. Leyline of the Void is really good against Reanimator and Dredge but not as good as Surgical against Lands and other random strats. Also leyline would be a dead draw if it wasn't in your opening hand. Nothing sucks more than drawing uncastable bricks when your living off the top of your deck.

>opponents turn
>he casts something
>counter it with this
>can't immediately use the other part because it's a sorcery

???

i guess you can use it next turn in case he didn't have enough mana to cast it another time???

So, if I take your advice into account:
- remove white Leyline
- remove deflecting palm, even if I think it's a cool trick...
- don't add black Leyline
- add bridge
- you didn't say it explicitly but add surgical extraction
am I right? I can see myself playing
3 Ensnaring bridge
3 Tormod's crypt
3 Wear//Tear
3 Exquisite firecraft
3 Surgical extraction

It's a bit of a pity playing 3 dual lands (maybe just 2?) for one half card that costs W, but meh. Gotta buy these duals someday anyway.

On a side note, as you guys seem pretty wise about burn, what do you think of Grim Lavamancer? Vexing Devil? would you include Raze? Boros Charm? Lightning Helix?
Thanks for your advice

>Lavamancer
It works if you run fetches, I dont know if its better or not than the 18 mountain version.
>Devil
This is a trap but it "can" work. You basically are rolling the dice on if your opponent has a removal spell or not. Most of your creatures will hit for 4 anyways so its the 6th or 7th choice of a deck that runs at most 4
>Raze
How much damage does this do? Thats the question you ask about every what if in burn.
>Boros charm/lightning helix
You dont want to splash. Wasteland is a very common thing and being down lands is the worst pain for burn. There is enough mono red efficient burn that the splash really isnt going to justify the chance to cast lightning bolt + healing salve.

2-0 in the Worcester open. Beat burn and dredge so far. Hoping it keep working out.

Good luck, man! Couldn't make it this year, unfortunately.

Too bad. I lost r3 to deadguy ale. Never had more than 1 land in either game.

Bumperooney. Beat the reid duke bugw deck 2-0. 3-1 now.

Doesn't really mean that much since there were only 10 players but hey, free sealed at ptq and $90 emrakul promo is always nice

oh shit wrong thread nvm

I'm rooting for you user

Well I'm 3-2 now. Lost to burn in 3 games. T2 kill game 1, butt blasted by eidolon in g2, then played a super weird long game that involved a tendrils for 4 storm to buy time, but I ended up losing. Couldn't beat Pyroblast and fireblast.

4-2 now. 2-0'd miracles to beat some b-class pro.

5-2, riDE the lightning motherfuckers

The dream is dead. Screwed up a pile and threw away a match vs lands. Apparently 7 rounds is my limit for playing well.

Went 2-1 last night at FNM with Grixis Delver

First round beat Dredge through good calls on my Cabal Therapies as well as timely Surgicals
Second round lost to Elves (dude is a really good player and elves is a bad matchup = got wrekceedddd)
Third round beat MUD with a Gurmag G1 and then a Price of Progress dealing 10 damage G2 after some previous attacks

Just bought a Sudden Demise to deal with Elves
>pic related

Yeah he's great in Miracles

Goodnight sweet prince

Is Sudden Demise really better than Bonfire? Bonfire seems like it would be easy to set up.

Commiserations, man. In fairness, my limit is usually about 4 before I pretty much forget how to play Magic.

Also one of my teammates got ejected for drunkenly photobombing the coverage stream. So there's that. Hoping to get back for the classic tomorrow but not sure I'll be able to.

If it doesn't work, you can always hit Black Moon!

Seriously, sound like your team pulls pretty top shenanigans. Wish I didn't live in the woods.

>Is Sudden Demise really better than Bonfire? Bonfire seems like it would be easy to set up.

Nice repeating 3's my friend

Um, so big thing with Bonfire vs Demise is that Bonfire has to be set up, and Bonfire is only good when it Miracles.

Otherwise, Sudden Demise is probably better. Sudden Demise is something that you can have in your opening hand and it'll be good, whereas with Bonfire you need to Brainstorm.

tl;dr: It depends but I prefer the reliability of Sudden Demise
That being said, I do also have a Fire Covenant in my sideboard and I really like the idea of Bonfire instead.

Deadguy master race

Well it was a rough night and I'm awake a few hours early but I'm playing in the classic this morning. Gonna make some slight sideboard tweaks. I'll tell you guys how it goes.
my team is funny when they're drunk, but when they cross the line into "wasted" they turn into belligerent babies and are a chore to be around. And they're far too big and fighty for me to wrangle. But i never regret hanging with them.

Lost round 1 of the classic to dredge. Mothrfucker opened with city, led, breakthrough, looting in all 3 games. Kind of fishy but I couldn't see any cheats.

Yeah, that's pretty much the nut draw for LED dredge. Either that guy was lucky as fuck or he was stacking his deck.

I didn't see any cheats so I didn't say anything. I lost r2 to Emma handy. Lightning bolt is the best counterspell in the format. The burnout is real, folks. Dec is exhausting.