Has anyone else ever wondered how Games Workshop got away with selling plastic Fascism to kids for 30 years?

Underrated post.

Its satire and 'everyone is a dick' was able to justify any army having reason to fight another.

But somehow people dont get that. Do people legitimately not know how much 2000AD and the general British style of dark humour influenced 40k?

40k is a joke setting taken too far.

>Nationalism and authoritarianism is the same thing
It has more to do with nature and beauty worship.

You also have to ask why no other group has the same fashion sense, it's not like snappy uniforms would hurt any movement.

40k is a lot of things, but "nuanced" isn't one of them.

Just because it's over the top to the extreme doesn't mean that narrative nuance can't or doesn't exist.

I'm not sure I would use the word nuanced to describe 40k. Generally I would describe it as schlock.

The Imperium in 40k is explicitly shown as a really fucked up place, only hardly heroic because of a few individuals in a few places, and because it's the lesser of all evils.

The Imperium before HH was portrayed in a far more positive light.

In some of the books, maybe. But those books also severely downplay the worst aspects of the Imperium, so I'm not sure if they'd count.

It used to be pewter.

Except for maybe a few BL books the setting is generally heavy handed and basically capeshit tier storytelling.

Because back then people didn't care about find a political message in literally everything. I mean goddammit today we have people arguing over the politics of the color of Starbucks coffee cups.

If something like Warhammer 40k was released in modern times, it'd never see the light of day due to the controversy. However it came out 30 years ago when no one gave a shit about it as much, and now it's here forever because it's had time to ingrain itself into today's culture.

30 years ago the punk movement was still relatively cool despite being on the way out.

>you get absolutely no say in governance or in the creation of the laws that you must follow
Nigga, don't pretend like your vote on anything matters.

Oh my God. Gargamel is Uncle Sam then?

Not that user, but the US is probably not the best choice, considering it has arguably the worst political/voting system of all developed countries.

Gargamel is a caricature of a greedy Jew obsessed with aquiering gold who also wants to ruin the Smurf's glorious collectivist society.

>it was all le parody of ebil right wingers

God, where do you people get these reddit tier alternative theories from?

Pic related for you

>It's a lot more nuanced than good or bad.
Tell that to the mouthbreathers convinced the Emperor did nothing wrong and it would be awesome if the Imperial Creed was real.

This is because society tells them to.

Don't forget communist Star Treck and fascist Star Wars, with its own SS soldiers.

Then there are more than likely thousands of books with fictional themes with many similar themes. Animal Farm anyone?

Star Trek was a social democracy

Damn another great British fictional universe.

Kek, I never heard of a single individual being able to vote on anything, except when they were directly asked for opinions.

No one is paid and society is very elitist and classist to a great extent.

The federation is a military faction who runs everything. Very voter friendly.

Because they wanted a setting of grimdark eternal war, and far-right lunacy is a one-way express economy-class ticket to that.

Then retards decided that there's anything remotely redeemable about the Imperium, and now we get the occasional unironic fascist whining about how Veeky Forums oppresses them just because they want a race war in the 40k general.

Conflict is a cornerstone of human nature. Fucking, fighting, and eating are things that humans have been doing since the dawn of time and not amount of "muh society" will ever change that.

>plastic fascism
sjw

Fuck off, /pol/

Starfleet doesn't control anything besides its own ships, facilities, and voluntary personnel.

In Trek, energy-to-matter converters exist while people have harnessed essentially limitless energy. This society with these capabilities does not fit any current political or economic label of today. Is Star Trek, a work of entertainment fiction, a perfect representation of this scenario, hell no. Depending on the episode, life as a human varies between AnCap paradise and full on Tau-esque space communism. And even that is a gross simplification if not misrepresentation.

It can simply be explained by writers that were handed a world socially and technologically beyond what they could imagine stories and conflicts for, so they took what they knew from modern human society and tried to round off the edges and add in a couple nice trinkets of FOOTOR, like no currency, war, crime, etc., thinking it was enough.

The hero worship of soldiers and conditioning of young boys to admire them and aspire to be them is a product of the government school system and originates in 19th century Prussia.

Boys taught to love soldiers become men willing to die for politicians as soldiers.

Yeah but at least you get to vote on things, right?

How much of an effeminate bitch are you to believe that boys wanting to be badass warriors is a result of brainwashing?

Running on that logic, experience has shown that you can't trust a small group with the power, and you can't trust everyone with the power, and you certainly can't trust one person with all the power.
So we're screwed in each and every direction, because you can't trust anyone,not even yourself. The only people you can trust are the saintly, and we kill them or hate them or ignore them.

Sure, the State may exploit this feeling for their own gain, but the instinct is already innately there.

>19th century Prussia
I sure love how those time traveling Prussians made every single culture since the beginning of time bow to their idiotic ways. Yes siree, the people who provide for a random Turkish tribe three millennia before Prussia existed would never have told stories of their bravest warriors and hunters if it weren't for the damn Prussians and their crazy ideology.

A soldier and a warrior are two very different things

you know what fuck it, lets hear your point. whats the difference

>God, where do you people get these reddit tier alternative theories from?

Rick Priestly.

I don't think any of the Warhammer 40k races really endorse anything. Depending on who's writing, the Imperium is either a dystopian space bureaucracy, space fascism, or Noble Heroes doing what's necessary in a doomed universe out to kill them.
I don't think there's any cohesive "theme" or "moral" to 40k, because it's a decade-old fantasy universe with dozens of writers behind it.

how the fuck is this a /pol/ thread

Warriors and soldiers are different things.

>It was meant to be a riff on Thatcherite England, but then for some reason a bunch of assholes without a sense of irony missed the joke and took it seriously
Not everything has some fucking hidden subtext or societal criticism. The "joke" of warhammer has always been its over the top absurdity, not "maggie is bad" or "fascism makes you want to saw up aliens".

The bulk of the original creators still had a hand in the creation and building of the setting through to the early '00s, and they did it in the style of things they enjoyed (2000AD, hard metal) rather than shit people were fucking tired of hearing about all the time.

>OK I'll bite, just for fun, please explain in 2000 words or less how the advent of mass education and nation-states have changed perceptions of soldiery compared to those of 3000 years ago.

Dunning–Kruger effect in action.

Soldiers are state agents who kill on the orders of politicians.

Admiring someone for their strength of will or skill with a weapon is not the same as adoring someone who would blindly kill and die for politicians.

The latter in its modern form does originate from 19th century Prussia, where the first compulsory government schooling began. Boys were taught that serving the state was good and honorable, especially in martial capacities.This became popular with nation states possessed of disposable martial male populations, and the results of this can be seen as the towering body counts and lost generations of the 20th century's myriad of horrendous wars.

...

>Boys were taught that serving the state was good and honorable, especially in martial capacities
As opposed to God, king, emperor, [insert authority figure]?

lol

fascists were the OG faggots

B T F O
T
F
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I mean, before public schools, most boys weren't really taught anything standardized.

>i cant even come up with a rudimentary explanation of my assertion so ill just accuse you of a random bias that has literally no relation to the question you asked
come on user, i'm not asking for much, just explain your damn point, what are the fundamental difference between soldiers and warriors that make them distinct separate entitys

You should read this vvv

And (you) should read this vvv

First paragraph covers it.

Games Workshop didn't go to shit until they sold out with their IPO in 2004, then they went full retard. Games Workshop sucks shit now. Deal with it.

was that so hard user

Good thing you got another parody of a fascist to back you up. I was really skeptical on fascism being bad but now that a cartoon meathead who murders people has told me the shortcomings of democracy I will know embrace the right-wing.

totalitarianism=/=fascism

Since when has a fascist state not been a totalitarian one?

And even then, the Mega-Cities of Judge Dredd are clearly fascist shitholes, or would be if the Judges had the control they wanted.

A authoritarian police state isn't inherently fascist. Words have meanings and ''fascism'' doesn't mean ''big mean government''.

Yeah, that's Utopia...

they straight up sold it as fascism. that was the point. the point is that it's fucked.

Technically correct. Its still a hell hole whether you're being reported by your own child to the Stasi or to the Gestapo.

There is a word for what you are doing. It is quibbling. You are quibbling because you don't actually have a real argument.

2000AD had it's share of social and political criticism as well. It was just cool at the time to shit on authoritarianism.

LoL, no. It is necessary to shit on authoritarian regimes. They are invariably full of shit and bad for human people. The only people that want them are bullies and cowards.

People seem to forget that a lot of 80s and 90s nerdy shit wasn't political. It was just cool shit being cool.

40k's original design has nothing to do with any political stance. It was purely "lets make warhammer in space" and went from there. The Imperium wasn't some fascist state, it still isn't but people don't understand that. They lost the concept of "it's fun to do random shit and having super cops fighting space elves is neat"

An argument for what, you dumb nigger? I'm not trying to defend fascism.

But yes, it's just nitpicking.