How would you go about making an "anti-narrative" game where it's not just a circlejerk to entertain the DM into letting you do impossible bullshit just because you rolled high on a dice roll?
I know that OSR is great for dungeon delving and exploration, 4e is great for having mechanically rich combat but what other games on the market pride themselves on the party actually gitting gud rather than playing a squad of nigh unstoppable badasses who will never die, unless thematically appropriate?
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>baldur's gay
Low point games in GURPS work like what I think you're trying to describe. Characters are normal people who have to overcome using clever tactics, but with support for things beyond hitting orcs in a dungeon, right?
Why not play vidya? It will allow you to do only what its programmers had coded up, so no impossible bullshit.
Literally any game if the DM is on the same page as you.
The Riddle of Steel.
IDK about Song of Swords, the new edition, but in TRoS you either
>are multiple gods'gift to personal combat (and your DM is throwing mooks at you)
>avoid fights like a celiac meeting gluten
>ONLY fight when it's important to the story (it's a narrative-driven subsystem, needed because the main game is just SO deadly and unforgiving)
While possibly an oversight, Morrowind Alchemy is some cheese of the finest degree.
Pretty much every game out there, you scrub. Just don't keep throwing 'easy' fights at your players. Enemies are not always complete morons. The environment is not always padded.
Because why call it a tabletop role-playing GAME if the GAME portion is going to be ignored for the sake of narrative?
I want to fight dragons and win because I pulled off some smart play that's supported by the mechanics, not win because I said a cheesy one-liner as the DM narrates how my slash causes the dragon to explode (which, he makes a point about stating, I do not look at btw).
Not everyone is a shit DM user. Shit DMs can't be fixed by complaining on Veeky Forums and making stupid assumptions like "my current game is representative of all tabletop rpg games".
You see this all over user, it's just the current generation of DM's who value the narrative over the mechanics of the game.
Hell, one of most given advice on this board is to ignore the rules when it gets in the way of the narrative, like what's the point of even owning the rulebook at that point?
I'd make it a comedy.
>the narrative
No, its that rules shouldn't get in the way of the players having fun, and if dungeon crawling with no story whatsoever is what the players want then the only rules I'm going to ignore are ones that get in the way of that. Just talk to your DM like a functional adult and say you aren't having fun, or find another group. Any game can be run as a story minimal, high lethality dungeon crawler if the DM tries to. Although there does exist system that uses random tables for literally everything apparently. Like, towns are to be randomly generated by tables when you get there, merchants and their stock, dungeons+monsters, everything. The DM is basically just there to be a sweaty bookkeeper. Of course, you might wonder if the DM is going to be having fun too.
If thats how you like to play sure.
I Like to follow maybe 80% of the actual rules of D&D when I play because I think it keeps the flow going.
The rule books are a good base line for where you need to be and why ruin the fun of the game because your book says you're too stupid to make that plan. or your charisma is too low to talk to that wench. or you can't throw that sword becuase it isn't a throwing weapon.
Nah, fun first then rules. Every time.
Afmbe
I didn't refresh and we posted basically the same thing.
>random tables for literally everything
You ever read the DMG for D&D? I had a guy run a campaign only using it's tables. it was interesting. Lot's of useless shit all the time.
He also made a chart with random town shops and would roll a d10 to see how many shops and then a d10 or 12 for each shop in the town.
We literally went to a town that had 7 blacksmiths and no inn.
He changed the system later, opting for premade lists of shops in towns based on population.
I'm not saying that's not common, but the people who say that are retarded.
If I didn't explicitly want to avoid freeform roleplaying because I don't enjoy it, I wouldnt be playing a game with rules instead.
>Tables for everything.
This... This matches my GMing style to a large degree. I enjoy reacting to the players actions and having random noise help generate the plot so I don't know what they're going to face.
What game is this? I want to see these tables and see if I can benefit from them in 5e.
My current approach is to make a small region, and assemble tables for sectors of the region for random events and encounters.
The system i'm thinking of seemed like it was designed to have as little DM involvement in every aspect of the game as possible, which can of course fuck right off. The DM is a player too, and the one generally putting in the most work to boot. DMs are entitled to just as much fun as the party.
not that guy, but this guy DMG 5e has a lot.
there's also a few websites that do it too
random encounters tools.goblinist.com
And thats the only one I can remember at 4:30 am.
I'm pretty happy with the idea of skipping the work and being able to just show up and play, as a GM, but pure improv GMs tend to result in boring sessions for everyone, because coming up with everything is hard, especially on the spot.
West coast here. Just going to bed, not up crazy late.
You should get some sleep.
Exactly! I was a forever DM (10 years) until recently (6 months) and I could never get behind running modules or totally random shit.
For a while I did pure improv. Player's were annoyed that the campaign didn't seem to go anywhere because I never connected the sessions. I'm back at doing it again, but only because my players have started driving the story with their own goals. It's pretty nice DESU.
maybe
Tables can be helpful, but there's a difference between using tools to help you and doing nothing but describe the results of tables/read from a module/dungeon map. OP wanted an "anti-narrative" game because apparently all DMs do is jerk off over players prostrating themselves before them, which is pretty much the exact opposite of my experience DMing. I've been running games since I was 13 and I've never done the kind of shit OP is complaining about but I have had players who not only didn't know what was on their spell list, they didn't even know they HAD a spell list.
>didn't even know they Had a spell list.
That's honestly impressive.
Any advice to give for someone trying the same thing?