How do you guys feel about sci-fi twists in fantasy settings? The Gods were actually aliens or super advanced AIs...

How do you guys feel about sci-fi twists in fantasy settings? The Gods were actually aliens or super advanced AIs, or those mysterious golems were actually robots, or magic actually works based on some interpretation of physics. Stuff like that.

Alternatively, fantasy twists in otherwise sci-fi settings. The space ship is powered by magic runes or something.

We had a thread about this recently.
Rather than repeat it, how about coming up with a setting?

>"thread about this"
>thread literally isn't about this
Science fantasy/pulp sci-fi got brought up in that thread. It is not the same thing as that being the entire subject of the thread, nor is it what I'm actually asking about.

No, sir, I don't like it.

Ruins the consistency of the world, makes everyone in it look like morons and is about as cheesy as "It was all a dream and you wake up."

Isn't it the premise of Knight Worlds in 40k?

I like it. It can perpetuate the lame "wizards are scientists" trope if done poorly, though.

Sometimes I think it would be neat to have a fantasy setting that was really the cryosleep VR of a colony ship gone haywire and the players need to regain control of the ship's systems from within but other times that seems really lame.

100% execution. As long as you can make it more interesting than "Goblins are aliens, dragons are aliens, magic is aliens, swords are magic" then you have a chance of pulling something interesting.

Might and Magic has the demons being aliens and the angels being ancient robots. It's subtle enough that you wouldn't know right away, and it's done well enough that it fits the setting really well.

So as with all things, it can be done well or badly.

I prefer the "scientists, engineers, and programmers are wizards" inversion like Cthulhutech or The Laundry Files. Given science's historical roots in alchemy it lines up well with the real world.

Nah that still sucks all the mystery and, y'know, magic, out of magic

Nope

I like when fantasy has a kind of sci-fi aesthetic, but still has actual magic. Like, a standard fantasy setting where the planes are actually different planets, or where the gods and other powerful beings live in space. I basically prefer having actual space with fantasy elements rather than spelljammer-style 'aether' or celestial spheres or geocentric universes and whatnot.

It's okay sometimes, but I really feel it's overdone

Every other writer wants to be the atheist king 'Aha look my fictional gods were never actually gods, take that religious people!' as if it matters in a fictional world.

It's why I dislike new WoD.

I'm not really into the whole vampires and werewolves thing but I enjoyed the story we had going where a couple of us were hunters and the rest of the group were a variety of supernatural beings. There were legitimately supernatural powers, god was real, I smote a werewolf with angel prayer spear power, it was cool.

The shrouded mysticism was interesting. My somewhat Christian but really too violent ex-soldier middle-aged hunter had to come to terms with the fact that while his own faith was demonstrably real in a way, so were these other pagan things that disgusted him, and they weren't all evil by default.

Then new WoD happened and god is actually a super-computer, angels are its programs, etc.

There was no need for it, 'all of this stuff is real and scary' was a cool premise.

That's the point. Even in the face of arbitrary, nonsensical laws of the universe, humanity still finds a way to bend it to our will. It's HFY without the spess muhranes cliches or wimpy aliens.

The way I see it, if we were made in God's own image, that only makes our eventual utter mastery of the physical universe right and proper. It's Manifest Destiny on an intergalactic scale. All the world's a stage, and we're the director's overpowered self insert character.
>about eighty thousand years ago, in a plane of reality that encompasses our own
>Dino God: My creations have conquered all within their path! From apex predators of a single continent they went on to tame a star system!
>Bug God: My creations are superior. The hive spans half a parsec after a mere billion years of evolution.
>YHVH: Hold my beer and watch this.

>It's HFY

It's trash garbage for people with shit taste?
Not exactly selling me here.

The fuck does that have to do with what I said?

Get your HFY bullshit out of here.

I wish there were more HFY stories about us befriending space dragons and winning allies due to our skill and creativity with making food. Heck, I don't mind the ones where we accidentally scare the shit out of species through a series of comedic accidents and play it up from then on. I get tired of the "humans are invincible badasses" stories.

Fuck off. Make your own if you're so knowledgeable. Not everyone is here at the same time discussing the same things.

Better if you bring it to the point where the creators tech is so advanced that it might as well be magic.

>I wish there were more HFY stories about us befriending space dragons
The Venusian space dragons story is awesome. I agree.

>I wish there were more HFY stories
Stopped reading there

I like the idea of a fantasy setting that turns out to actually be Scifi, but I've never encountered one that I really like, mainly because they cheat and the scifi is so soft there's no reason to not just call it magic anyway.
Currently trying to design a fantasy setting set in a McKendree Cylinder allowing for as much 'magic' as possible while still fitting physical laws as we believe they work or might work.
So stuff like evocation is generally focusing the lasers that manipulate air temperature for weather control onto a target. Then there's weather control, turning day on/off, spying through habitat security systems (divination), calling different types of drones to you for different purposes (conjuration), holograms (illusion), etc.

Personally I fucking hate it.

>Not quoting Clarke

I like it to an extent. I don't mind something like gods or demons being aliens, but not "we're using advanced technology to get these primitives to worship us ayy lmao" aliens. The setting should still be fantasy even if sci-fi concepts are introduced. The aliens should actually be terrible/god-like, preferably real inhuman - not neccessarily evil but some shit that would blow the mind of a medieval peasant.

I think Bloodborne did it well.

Sci if is an inheritantly weaker setting.

Intodoucing sci-fi into fantasy cheapens the pure nature of fantasy.

...

>It can perpetuate the lame "wizards are scientists" trope
back to tvtropes.com with you newfag

>mystery and, y'know, magic, out of magic
You are fucking retarded and what is ruining the fantasy genre. Magic needs to be defined in order to make sense in the context of the setting.

I prefer it, it's a return to the pulp fantasy and sci-fi of old, when the line between the genres wasn't really there.

If you mean settings that are fantasy but then there's also aliens with ray guns or space AIs or whatever, then those are rad as hell. A bit hard to pull off seriously, but not impossible, and comedic and pulpy settings have their place as well.

If you mean fantasy settings with the SHOCKING TWEEST that the magic is actually done with nanomachines or something like that, then that shit's shit. It doesn't help that nanites as they're usually depicted are basically impossible, so it's magic that's based on "science" that's based on magic. It's just added obfuscation for the sake of being pretentious.

magitech is a word for a reason and I fucking love it, always gives me an excuse to have giant anthropomorphic robots fighting godlings, outsiders, and dragons while keeping the nascent elemental gestalt at its heart under control

If it's presented as a "Epic plot tweest" then so, it's a shit plot twist.
If it's presented as something that either the characters in-universe slowly piece together as the story goes on, or if the characters never figure it out but it becomes obvious over time to us with our meta-knowledge, then yes, it can feel like an interesting development of the setting instead of an attempt to force the unexpected.
Bionicle straddled the line.

You might like the comic book series El Mercenario. Pic related.

Starts out as your typical fantasy knight saves damsel story, everything seems magical. Then it goes into some hard science creative medieval contraptions and later on into some great pulpy sci fi with a cool fantasy edge. The science is fairly hard but not so much it gets in the way of the story.

Can absolutely recommend. Not just for a good read but inspiration for pretty damn near anything.

Vicente Segrelles is based.

What would a wizard that lived from ancient times to the modern times look like though? A lot of people seem to imagine them still rocking the beard and still living in a cave like a bunch of luddites. But since the old they they have always been the innovator of technology and sciences.

>How do you guys feel about sci-fi twists in fantasy settings?

Gay and retarded.

>Alternatively, fantasy twists in otherwise sci-fi settings.

Awesome and wonderful. One of my favorite setting conceits is that automated processes and massive, globe-spanning communications networks become a source of magic. Shin Megami Tensei's demon-summoning program was teenage me's favorite piece if fictional technology and adult me was fucking blown away when Digimon Cyber Sleuth suggested that electrical and network infrastructure could be used as leylines.

Since you mentioned both of them I may as well post this.

Jesus Christ, one picture per panel! I don't see what the fuck any of that means.

Punchlines need PUNCH. If you can't tell your joke with one picture per panel, it's not worth telling.

That's not mine and I agree, for the record.

One of my personal favorite book series is essentially this.
If anyone is interested, it's the Coldfire Trilogy by C.H. Friedman.

Now, you don't get too many hints that it's a sci-fi setting early on, a few things will stand out early, but for all intents and purposes you're reading a fantasy story. The end however explains it quite differently.

Now, this is a sci-fi setting where psychic abilities are a thing, so it's not entirely explained by science.
But the story is internally consistent throughout, and is better for it in my opinion.

>How do you guys feel about sci-fi twists in fantasy settings?

I hate it. Usually it boils down to LOL NANOMACHINES, and I don't think it has ever improved a setting.

>Alternatively, fantasy twists in otherwise sci-fi settings.

I'm like this more, because I like my sci-fi soft.

This. Going to see the oracle in 6 and having the hallway light up to reveal this massive science fiction complex was the most badass thing ever.

I think it's because they don't go out of their way to explain it. It's implied the party just thinks it's more magic (and that it may very well actually be Sufficiently Advanced Magic), and none of the robots really go out of their way to dissuade them of the notion.

You know the demons are aliens from the beginning though. You just think they're fantasy aliens instead of sci-fi aliens.

thank you, undefined Maddox just becomes a deus ex machina that breaks the story.

Keep it reeeal subtle, and it is fine.
Otherwise, it is pretty terrible IMO.

Examples of pretty good: Prince of Nothing series by R. Scott Bakker. (The bad guys are some kind of aliens with a spaceship and stuff)

Examples of pretty terrible: Might and Magic VII, where suddenly your characters start stumbling upon laser pistols around the endgame, and they are flatly superior to everything else.

bloodborne is more cthulhu than it is science fiction, still an excellent setting though.

>Might and Magic VII
>terrible

Did you drink out of the wrong well?

Might and Magic VII was amazing, and I loved it.
The science fiction elements were unfitting and unnecessary, and it added nothing to an interesting story, other than blurring the focus and narrative.

I think it's fine as long as it's clear from the get go that there are more rational explanations to things that appear magical in the setting, or if the scientific elements themselves appear sort of magical in themselves.

I also believe, however, that this is something most fantasy authors, and certainly most fa/tg/uys, are tragically incapable of doing well.

Why not? Chronicles of Morgaine did it, and that was cash.