So with D&D being bigger than its ever been how do you think this will effect other Table Top RPG's?
From what I can gather is that its kind of a zero sum game in that as D&D gets bigger other things get smaller. I.E nobody really plays anything else anymore and the numbers will become less and less as time goes on. Add the fact that that is essentially Wizards end game goal and the idea of the "Hobby" as a whole looks a wee bit grim.
But maybe I am just being pessimistic. What do you guys think. Do you think D&D could wipe other RPGs off the map?
Pic unrelated. Was the onlt fantasy themed thing I had.
>Do you think D&D could wipe other RPGs off the map? God damn my sides, ow.
Logan Smith
You've got it the wrong way round. D&D's market share is the lowest it's ever been. It's still the biggest RPG out there, but the scene is growing faster than D&D personally is. We're seeing more variety and more different players of different games than ever before. We're in the middle of a golden age with no sign of stopping, at least for now.
Juan Turner
I mean as D&D becomes a more accepted and adopted product more people will be playing that and others may eventually have to because its the only game in town. Not to mention that wil less sales other RPGs cant support the slice of the buisness
Caleb Robinson
What you're describing was the horror that was the 3.5 OGL. Thank fuck those days are behind us.
Logan Butler
Really? Because from what Im gathering these new games exist but next to no one is playing them. Every time you go to an LGS or a game store its D&D and D&D only.
Jaxson Flores
D&D's new blood flow comes largely from people coming into the hobby, not from it being sucked off from other games. It's a net gain for the hobby as people get into TTRPGs and have the chance to see there are other RPGs besides D&D.
Eli Sanders
>Thank fuck those days are behind us Am I wrong to assume that Pathfinder is still in production?
Camden Lopez
This. God-DAMN this is too funny to be bait!
But to answer your question, you wonderful simpleton, All publicity is good publicity. D&D is great in that it's flawed enough that it doesn't do everything right, arguably anything, and thus people look for something else to do what they want.
It's like saying Futbol is going to replace all other sports... it's too stupid and innocent of a statement to actually BE bait.
Levi Jenkins
>as people get into TTRPGs and have the chance to see there are other RPGs besides D&D Yes. Sadly, usually not other settings but fantasy, but other RPGs than D&D.
Christopher Carter
PF is just one product. The horror OGL days were when every game under the sun tried a d20 version, no matter how awful the idea was, while shitty third party supplements and entire games were so goddamn common some people were convinced D&D was the only model for RPGs in existence.
Andrew Rodriguez
Limited anecdotal evidence is just that. Look at online sales figures and statistics, it paints a very different picture.
5e is huge, sure, but given that D&D's market share was once close to 100%, it has dropped extremely significantly.
Anthony Wilson
Especially with Pathfinder dying slowly, and 5e leveling out. Other systems are getting their shot.
Grayson Allen
I don't know where you're getting your data from, but the indie RPG scene is exploding. Just look at crowdfunding to see how.
Does D&D still have a huge slice of the player base? Yeah, but that slice is actually shrinking every quarter. Add Pathfinder beating the shit out of D&D for half a decade, something they're still trying to recover from, and a new OSR getting shit out every weekend.
Let's also not forget WoD/CofD, they're still a pretty big dog in the market.
Nicholas Morris
>Zero sum game Popularizing the hobby means more people will one day move from entry level systems into other systems. Exposure is good for the whole industry.
It also puts them into contact with stufd such as wargaming, card games, etc.
Luke Powell
Could you point me to those figure possibly? Im just interested in see what they look like.
Kevin Anderson
>Add Pathfinder beating the shit out of D&D for half a decade Two years, while WotC stopped putting out D&D content entirely to focus on the 5e playtests to move away from the poorly-received (but financially successful) 4e.
Hudson Phillips
Fuck you Wayne, you wanted this?
Matthew Mitchell
>more people played 4e than Pathfinder
Holy fuck this thread is a wellspring of gravy.
A leyline of keks.
A geyser of gut bursting laughter
Juan Miller
During the years both games were in production, 4e outsold Pathfinder. The issues came from other factors.
4e rulebooks outsold pathfinder rulebooks, but almost no one was playing 4e.
Plus, Paizo still makes a damn good return from other sources then their rulebooks, something 4e never managed to cash in on.
Eli Clark
What's your source for that?
Isaiah Brooks
the only game that 'competes' with D&D is Pathfinder, and I don't mean that in the sense as the only game that CAN, but in the only game that actually tries.
No small publisher bothers to compete with the industry giants, they just want to exist, and they can do that perfectly fine without trying to overtake competition and by just doing something differently.
Zachary Flores
I can play the devils' advocate and see why they did that based on how people generally react to RPG systems that aren't D&D clones.
Lucas Carter
"The hobby games business marked an astounding eighth consecutive year of growth in 2016, with the hobby channel growing around 10%, according to retailers, distributors, and publishers interviewed by ICv2 as sources for a report in the latest issue of ICv2's Internal Correspondence, #91. The number of people playing hobby games, the number of people shopping at game stores, the number of stores, and exposure of hobby games at major retailers were all up in 2016, reflecting the now-mainstream nature of the hobby."
Congrats anons, you're now normies.
Dylan Jackson
Isnt that all just the new people getting into D&D?
Grayson Peterson
I predict the opposite. DnD might currently be getting the biggest marketing push, but it's far from the only published RPG. If anything, I suspect that the rising tide will get all boats since more people playing DnD will result in more people becoming TTRPG hobbyists, and most hobbyists play multiple systems.
Cameron Gutierrez
>Do you think D&D could wipe other RPGs off the map? No.
Benjamin Evans
>D&D being bigger than its ever been [citation needed]
>WotC said outright during the Stream of Annihilation that 2016 was the biggest year D&D had ever had, ever, and 2017 is slated to be even bigger No source on this, just heard it during the stream and am not going to delve through 20 hours of content to find it.
>online virtual tabletops are bigger and more accessible than ever See Roll20's growth stats
>streaming of tabletop RPGs had led to a boom of new people breaking into the hobby See: Critical Role, Acquisitions Inc., etc.
Landon Bell
Most of the growth definitely seems to come from recruiting new people into the hobby. And there are also plenty of new D&D fans who are out trying new systems. Fantasy systems in particular are probably seeing a nice boost.
But, one of the things that makes RPGs slightly different from some other hobbies is that it requires a significant time commitment from ~5 people. D&D isn't usually my first choice system, but if a friend says "hey, I've never played an RPG but I want to play D&D. Will you DM for me?" I'll probably say yes. Also, in areas with few RPG players, D&D works well as an agreeable middleground. 1 person wants to play Eclipse Phase, 1 wants to play Apocalypse World, 1 wants to play FFG Star Wars, 1 wants to play Shadowrun, etc. So you decide to compromise and just play D&D because it's the one bland, inoffensive, mainstream thing that everyone can agree on.
So in certain cases, I think you will see D&D pulling players away from other systems. But I think the branching-out newbies will probably outweigh that effect.
Levi Baker
>So you decide to compromise and just play D&D That would literally never happen here. The people in my area would sooner compromise and choose any of the other systems listed before D&D.
Jaxon Stewart
I definitely wouldn't consider it a zero sum. Quite the opposite, actually. I personally know plenty of people who started playing in D&D which eventually lead them to try other ttrpgs that they never would have otherwise. Basically I think D&D will be a stepping stone for a pretty significant number of people. A gateway drug, if you will.
Andrew Walker
Every edition of D&D has outsold its predecessor. That isn't a sign of D&D's individual success, it's a sign of the market growing significantly in the time between editions.
Kevin Jenkins
>mfw Ghost in the Shell d20 with Vancian hacking >mfw I have no face
Sebastian Barnes
This is all third-hand information from older sources, but the few graybeards I know claim that, before the OGL, other games were more commonly played and it wasn't JUST AD&D. By their account, OGL flooded the market with horrible d20 games that drew new players to them; other systems floundered and an entire generation of gamers were brought up thinking that d20 OGL was the only RPG in existence. Remember, this is before the days of common Internet access where you were unlikely to hear about new systems unless you had a FLGS *and* the owner felt like putting the new game on the shelf. I lived in a small town and thought D&D 3.5 was the only RPG in existence--the video game store in the big mall a few towns over had a few books stocked for some reason and no others--until my friend introduced me to VtM. I was so confused as to how the game was supposed to work. Where was the d20, the alignment, the skill ranks, the classes?
