Is the "your dudes" aspect a reason why the Warhammer fanbase is so toxic?

Yes. We all want one side to win, and its a problem.

I don't understand how you reach a place where you ask, "Are the people who use the openness of a setting to do some creative writing, the reason the fanbase is so toxic?"
Instead, oh say,
"Are the people who sperg out into fits of rage anytime someone brings up old/new fluff they don't like, the reason the fanbase is so toxic?"

Your dudes people are usually the ones trying to frame it as a storyline.

On the flip side, a setting should not be forced to remain stagnant because their exist a group of people who have created their own stuff and yet at the same time operate under the belief that they control the setting and start screeching whenever the people who do actually control the setting decide to do what they want with it.

To me it makes no sense that these people apparently have the brains to create something of their own, yet they can't divorce it from the larger picture and expect said picture to cater to them.

Yes.
No offense, but from an outsider's perspective you guys look like those guys that leave and breathe football and take every game REALLY seriously and religiously follow just one team and get irrationally angry when they loose, only you somehow spend even more money and get even less payoff with significantly less social acceptance.

I mean, it's a fucking game. Relax.

>allot

That's pretty anecdotal evidence you got there. From my experience, it's the people who play canon chapter who want the timeline to move forward so that they can see what happens to their chapter or kabal or whatever.
There's in all probably a ton of overlap between the two so I'm not sure how you got this association that homebrew chapter = wants a stagnant setting. Especially since it makes no sense because the setting moving forward would have no impact on a homebrew chapter, GW can't decide their fate.
I for one, didn't want the setting to move forward because after the the first half of the 2010s I didn't trust them not to ruin everything forever. I for one, have been pleasantly surprised.

This. The problem isnt folks making their own "dudes", its the one who cling to established characters and factions, throwing shit fits whenever its implied they aren't 100% Heroes.

The painting and modelling focused players, which are typically the guys making OCs, are the chillest of the playerbase.

Not really, "your dudes" people might try and frame their games as some sort of storyline, but that can't happen if the whole universe has a storyline.
>My dudes through a decades worth of battles have managed to defend this planet unnoticed by the fluff here against various forces, albeit losing X, Y and Z in the process
>Nope, that planet is in the middle of the warp storm, Rowboat and friends may or may not capture it at some point, bu everything your dudes has done has been pointless and no unnamed by GW guys will ever make the slightest bit of difference to its fate

It's just a simple fact that the more of the setting that is defined by an ongoing story, then the less room there is for your dudes to do anything significant on even the most localised of scales.

As a homebrew player I'd even disagree with that. The Imperium has over a million worlds and 10000 years of history. It would take decades of new fluff before GW could start coming close to closing off creative options for homebrew players; and if GW goes through another spell where they're more concerned of retconning existing events than creating new ones, even longer. There's still no shortage of opportunities for stories for "Your Dudes".
And even if they did come to a point where every single one of "more than a million worlds" was fluffed at any given moment in ten thousand years of history; it would take the highest grade of autist to bother to remember or care for it all.

To be honest the people who don't want the setting to move forward are probably not entirely homebrewers, however it's easy for me to say that at least some are since every time I've seen a counter argument for why 40k should not advance it has always boiled down to it supposedly being entirely about your own stuff and GW should never do anything that could shit on anyone's ideas.

I could understand if said people had quality concerns, but when they complain about the setting advancing or something like the Horus Heresy it seems to simply come down to GW doing something that apparently interferes with their own creativity.

>It's just a simple fact that the more of the setting that is defined by an ongoing story, then the less room there is for your dudes to do anything significant on even the most localised of scales.

This gets at another thing, certain homebrewers acting under the delusion that their stuff actually matters to anyone besides themselves and maybe their associates. Unless you actually get a job at GW or a job working with them and can get your stuff into the setting, there is a vast portion of the fanbase that is simply not going to give a damn about all the backstory you've written for your army. At best you have a chance at getting known if you've chosen a nice color scheme and/or done some interesting conversion work, but people are still going to be more interested in that than whatever backstory you've created.

No. Why would that be the case?

I've rarely seen that about the Horus Heresy. Most people when they complain about the HH (myself included), it's because they think the changes that have been made are dumb as shit compared to what came before. And even if you want to live and let live, and claim loose canon; there's still people walking around who like what they don't like. Which admittedly is a pretty austistic thing to care about, but brings one back to this post:
Also, as a homebrewer, I'm not sure I even understand how someone could claim "creativity" as a complaint against the HH. The parties involved have been established since forever and predates chapters, and the end result ultimately leads to the pretty much the exact same 40k we've always had.
I can't understand maybe moving the timeline a bit, like if someone had placed their homeworld where the Great Rift is and didn't want it destroyed. But even then they could just retcon it two inches south on the map. I doubt anyone's homebrew fluff is so location-dependent that they can just move it a few light years. UNLESS, now that I think of it, they're RPG players. I think one or two of the canon RPG sectors got hit by the Great Rift But even then, just make your own sector somewhere else bitches.

I somehow got "can" and "can't" flipped in that post.

With regards to the Horus Heresy I've heard the word "mystery" a lot, which I've interpreted to mean that perhaps in the past there was something or multiple things that were ambiguous or portrayed that way and the person in question developed their own theory or theories, only for a BL novel to come along and seemingly clear it up and that being taken for fact.

Even this I could understand and sympathize with, except such people usually seem to be focused on the Primarchs and are either ignorant of or willingly ignore sources such as the Index Astartes articles which predate the Horus Heresy series from BL and make some of the Primarchs come off as just as bad or worse than BL authors have portrayed them. The only caveat is that I believe the IA articles dealing with the Heresy may have taken an ambiguous tone, leaving it open if someone didn't like that interpretation of events, whereas current Heresy stuff is more presented as is.

I've got no excuse for the "mystery" people. Index Astartes covered the HH pretty well, the basics anyway, and I even point to it when explaining to people what I don't like about the BL novels (specifically Nikaea (and by extension Ward's GK book)).
But that's a whole other mess of skub, I have 0 interest getting into.

To be honest... every fan base as represented by Veeky Forums is cancer, because Veeky Forums is just not that great a place in general.

You guys give each other the benefit of the doubt when it comes to anonymity. I don't. In general I assume that anyone I'm talking with has at some point posted one of the stereotypical bait threds, /pol/ posts, Shitposts, etc... because it's really more than likely that you have.

Please sir, I am a model citizen on Veeky Forums. But you're right. I'm not above the occasional bait.

I might be biased, but as far as 40k and Fantasy are concerned Veeky Forums seems on par or better than the larger forums such as Warseer, Dakkadakka, Bolter & Chainsword, etc.

Yeah, you're biased.

When did people start to think that 'your dudes' is the issue?

Do you Misinterpret the term for people complaining that their Faction does something in the lore or are worse on the Tabletop or shit like that. Or is it about people telling other that they cant give their Ultras special shoulder pads or insignia, at which point it is the opposite?

I mean in a certain way If ppl are playing Ultramarines they aren't 'their dudes' they're Ultras.They're 'GWs Dudes'

BUT! Literally nothing stops you from saying that the Ultras you own didn't partake in X battle or have a special talent in certain types of warfare, though at which point they're Fluff unrelated and officialy 'your dudes'

'your dudes' only really applies if for example they're a specific Company-detachment of the UltraMarines-Chapter or a successor Chapter the player came up with and has his own lore for them. At which point it is one of the best thing you can do in the game, Personalizing "your dudes".

The Reason why the Warhammer Fanbase is "toxic" is because of the amount of (semi-)Autistic people in the Scene, which will literally quote you a Lore-Entry to tell you 'your dudes' dont exist. then spouting around the entire LGS opinions no one cares about. Just fucking leave. There is actually an entire Family in my LGS and the son with severe AD/HD is the most tolerable of them all.

Honestly I am working on a gaming table this very minute because I am Tired of having to suffer Obese guys thinking im their friends, having to remind them every 10 minutes to stop touching me and my models while playing games with actual Lucid people at my lgs.

I feel like the game was marketed at some point for parents to drop off their Autistic Kid at the local Gamestore so the Kid doesnt realize its being shoved off instead of sending it to similarly expensive therapy.

>40k
No, the game itself is shit.

>They get pretty upset with me for mixing and matching regiment tags in 8th edition for Guard. It's all my army, but I like different buffs for different units.

Why would you do that? I can understand a Space Marine list doing that to get the special gear that some of the variant chapters can get, but why would you do that in a Guard list? You're just making them strictly worse.

Definitely a lot better than reddit at any rate.

There's a thread going on about whether people would play a guy that's running a fully painted Kroot mercenary army, with some homebrew approximations for units that can't be "counts as", or an unpainted Tau army using Index rules?

Apparently the Kroot player is a WAAC cheater that is one step away from saying his Guardsmen count as Titans.

Tbh I think it's a mixup of what the games about. 40k, and all warhammer really, was supposed to be about over-the-top dark and gritty worlds where the point is everything is so serious and humorless it becomes light and humorless.

But consumers (Americans) being what consumers are, the fun got lost when people tried to be actually serious. Tbh I think a lot of stuff is doing that- they say "were totally funny" while expecting and trying to be serious, whereas 40k is about "we're totally serious" and making that funny.

I don't think the game retained that as it spread around the world, which figures. It's too bad, but I can't fault GW selling to the edgelords and consuming crowd since the goal is to sell

>Is the "your dudes" aspect a reason why the Warhammer fanbase is so toxic?
the reason for that is that it's so heavily clanified, putting it in Vampire the Masquerade terms. whenever you have such a strong faction structure, the fanbase becomes toxic

prove me wrong. protipp: you can't.

>toxic
One, never say this, it makes you sound like a pussy.
Two, they dunk any complaint about it under extreme 40k memes or just generally being obnoxious, so it's hard to speak out against it.

Fuck 40k, fuck Warhammer. You faggots need your own containment board, I'm sick of seeing it here.

And this is what he was talking about.
Mechanically, it probably is worse, but he may like specific interactions and buffs.

I got railed on for having my Khornate berserkers carry an axe and a sword instead of a pistol, because blood-crazed murderers should be able to shoot at all times OR THEY ARE GARBAGE.

Lists don't always have to be 100% mechanically beneficial, especially if it makes you happy.