/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

Yeah, it's just aggressively bland. I think the animations lose me almost instantly, and there's nothing to really win me back, even though I have given it several chances.

The Fall of the Camarilla had some very serious undertones for vampirekind, the consequences of which still reverberate, and are starting to look potentially very ominous (the whole Strix thing).

Boy why the fuck is Mage Revised still so expensive, fucking 2 dollars less than 2nd edition awakening

Though of 'em. Sorry, should have made it clear: Things with huge metaphysical impact on the world.

So how about this for a fucking alternative to the Free council art? a group of mages from diffrent cultures/techne styles giving small demonstrations that might job peoples imaginations on how to work their own inspired path.

Because people are still buying it because M20 is shit.

Enjoy your dickgirl werewolf nun.

So does revised/better versions of Mage that aren't M20 acutally have like, dots for each sphere in a smilair vein as Awakening? what does Ascension spell casting look like, casue I sure can't fucking tell with M20

>2 threads

Geez louise

It'd be nice if they'd publish some 2e versions of the Vampire covenant splatbooks. The Invictus one was a work of art. They're still pretty much applicable to gameplay, but eh. Rehashing is their thing right now, so another version couldn't hurt.

Yes, and it lists common sphere effects for each level in that sphere (as in, say, an isolated Prime 2 effect that involves no other spheres.) as well as all of the permutations on the magic system. It has less clutter and accomplishes more than M20 does in half of the page length. If you go get M20, just consider it a list of hacks for the previously published versions of mage.

Ignore the "Ascension war is over" BS and you're good to go.

Darkling or Wizened with a slightly altered Venombite Kith.

There is so much wrong with this sheet

"True Hermaphrodite" is not a Metis deformity, first off.

Of course it's over. Everyone knows that the Technocracy won.

Also, ignore Revised's paradox rules, because they're just ridiculously "fuck you"

Normally i don't answer to mage stuff but you are right. The Ascension war is over. Dead and done. What the Technocracy does is essentially an extended policing mission.

The consensus is fixed and the magical worldview is broken.

That looks like a council of diverse individuals. Almost how the free council is described! Too many white males, queer it up. I want a dickhead peaking out of that woman's skirt on the far left. Draw some gender confusion in the eyes of the fucking white male to the right of her. Make that monk guy next to the pround beautiful african woman in the back look more african too, curl up his beard. This too thin moustachioed guys look queer enough. Their leader's a woman, so they're properly matriarchal, we don't need to change that... Okay, just make those changes and...

WHITE WOLF APPROVED!

So i was the guy designing his own Arisen for VtM in the last thread. Thanks to the fuckheads Opening 2 threads btw both of them not Working.

Anyways i want your experiences with antagonists or allies from other splats. Best if you redesigned the splat to fit your needs but its also cool if you used them as written.

And lets Refrain from political debate. Thats 10 times worse than the lowest depths of magefaggotry.

Mmmmm.. a clean street... my anus is relaxing and my bowels are stirring. But to street shit alone, or with just one other man is like being a man without a moustache. So my brothers, prepare your anuses, and join me!

Pants down, squat, and squirt!

I'm planning Giovanni Chronicles, but it seems like you get bounced around left and right.

Has someone run it before? What did you change about it?

It's ... just one railroad after another, not my kind of story.

pretty much all of vamp pre-mades are just being railroaded.

The opening scene is pretty cool. And I'll expand on the setting, crib elements from transylvania chronicles, make people act less retarded and offer more sidequests.

I'm less running it, more using it as the overaching plot.

I ran the Transyvanian Chronicles & the Giovanni chronicles together, i stretched the Sires from Giovanni chronicles back to the start of the TC, and it worked ok.

You have got to run your own stories in between though which is pretty easy to do since in TC the characters are given the chance to become princes of towns in transyvannia, we had alot of fun with each player being a prince of a town and what happened during the various wars, when the sabbat started to be formed etc

Do you have your notes?

fraid not, this was at least 15+ years ago and i didnt even write many notes at the time

Understandable. Any examples of stories that you told? Inspiration for DA intrigues?

So here is my first ever Werewolf for W:tF
docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1j0VW4CVFFi8S-i1xWLYyqEgspwUP6eG3eoBVVPWw1hA/edit?usp=sharing

His first pack was from Chippewa Falls Wisconsin and on the outside appeared to be a biker club called the Hellhounds. All of the Wisconsin packs were formed into one big alliance against the powerful spirits in the great lakes, and the vampires in Chicago. When something stirred in Lake Michigan the Packs moved on it and tried to put it down. They were devastated as what was thought to be old champ acting up turned out to be something far more ancient, powerful, and alien.

The survivors fled inland, as far away from the great lakes as they could get. Which is why he is currently in the great plains as far away from the lakes and large bodies of water as he can get.

So how does he look?

Looks very boring. Better than the gayapalooza but not what I would go with. Also, what's really Free Council about it? The Free Council is the Order closest to Sleepers, so showing them as using these traditionally occultic and mystic practices and tools doesn't really strike me as representative of what they're about. I mean you've got chalices, a ritual athame, beads, and what looks like a bowl of blood? Shit, the chalices and dagger are actually explicit magical tools for some of the Paths and other Orders. A fair few of them straight up look like old Mages as well. No, ideally to me they should be shown as integrated with Sleepers and studying them. Been a while since I brushed myself up on Awakening fluff, but I recall that they had things like a program grimoire, a magic automaton, a grimoire made from a very popular Sleeper fantasy series that parodies the Diamond Orders, Sleeper tools and electronics as magical tools, and even a different interpretation of magic entirely known as the Ars Nova. They should also be dressed relatively normally, in my opinion. Relatively.

I would like to address the issue of sidebars.

There is a concept called "cultural erasure". Loosely put, if a person feels their particular tribe is not represented in the dominant culture, they feel invisible. They are more prone to suicide, depression and general poor mental health.

For some time (centuries), trans and gay people have been on the fringe. They have not been represented, or if they have, it has not been positive.

The sidebars, the heavy use of LGTBIQ characters in the writing, all of these are efforts by White Wolf and OPP to be inclusive, to show people who are isolated - and who, despite what many of you would like to believe, play these games and pay cash for the cash throne - that they can and should be concluded.

That was my point, and nothing more.

Since then, observing the... comments... I conclude two observations. First, it is heavy handed and awkward because that is historically how White Wolf writes about things they don't understand or know about (Gypsies, KoTE, Hengeyoki, city books for places they never went, etc.). This is not the fault of the cause they are trying to advance - it simply shows the lack of skill and nuance necessary to do it effectively without devolving to satire.

Second, that over-representation comes at the cost of other people feeling their voices are heard. If the default character is fringe, then by necessity, all other minor characters and villains become mainstream. In some ways this echoes the themes of the protagonists being eternal outsiders, but it ignores other people who might be outsiders for other reasons.

I agree completely that "gay" is a preference, not a defining characteristic. Just more lazy writing, folks.

We need to be reasonable here. There is bugger all moderation, it's on us all to act like adults. We need to avoid forcing words in each other's mouths, drawing conclusions about a person's entire life and character from one political assertion.

my only regret is not getting to play the 4th giovanni chronicle.

Not sure my players would have liked it, since they would have had to stop playing their 800+ elders and played new giovanni with their elderss playing the antagonists but i liked the story in the 4th one.

I vaguely remember some stories involving Baali in them, one of the characters played a salubri (and was fully prepared for his death which happened and was really a cool moment esp alongside the last of the cappadocian storyline) and he and the group were trying to root them out in their domains. They really hated the Tremere (one character was an assamite and once the convention of thorns was done he went full on fuck the tremere which was amusing when he ended up in the sabbat he had to share it with Goratrix and , and so there was alot of posturing and fighting with them)

I think they main thing you have to do is make the NPC's in those book come to life, my players loved Anatole and Lucita, they were friendly rivals with Vycos and eventually Goratrix and hated Etrius and co.

The problem, user, is that I don't like to be preached at.

I don't mind trans people, nor gay people, not other minorities - I'm not american, so I'll use the word loosely.

However, the writers have an agenda, and an americentric one, american-left "woke" aligned. Fuck, on reddit people were bitching about 16 years old in clubs drinking being pedophilia.

Present me with a situation. Let me form my own conclusions. However, don't tell me that a man embraced by the Ventrue in 1500s would be okay with embracing a modern-day tranny because vampires don't have gender, therefore they subscribe to gender queer theory.

same guy above, i became a Cappadocian fan boy after running the Giovanni chronicles. I remember reading about the Harbingers of Skulls in revised and i was so happy, i fucking love them.

They do the whole tragic downfall thing alot better than the Salubri, and have a much better revenge angle. I hated what they did with the salubri antitribs.

I wanted to ask: Did you already choose the Utterances for your antagonist?

What does a 16 year old drinking have to do with the love of feet?

Paedophilia. ESL here.

>This is not the fault of the cause they are trying to advance
I'm actually fairly sure that in the course of these discussions, very few, if any, people took issue with the politics and minorities themselves. It was really just the presentation and oversaturation that irked people.

To respond to your post in general, I sincerely doubt that these sidebars do one lick of actual good to help LGBTQ whoevers avoid cultural erasure. Or at least they don't make any meaningful difference. Gay people and such have a very large and vibrant presence in first world countries and the internet. Large Pride events that have been taking place for decades, an abundance of characters representing them in fiction across all platforms despite them being such a small minority. So please don't assert or imply that these sidebars somehow contribute to LGBQTEs being represented. If there are LGBLTs clinging to these sidebars for representation, I would say that they need a life outside of these games.

Fuck man, the issue isn't even gay and trans people being in the books and games. I'm all for it. The issue is please don't slap me in the face with your double-ended rainbow dildo.

I know that's what they meant, I was just subtlety hinting that they spelled it wrong.

That's right, there is a "a" between being a foot fetishist (creepy but okay), and the sex offender registry.

What would be a good way to play an Apostate character? Like in terms of what they think magic is and how it works, and their stances on the various groups and creatures? I'm thinking of making an Apostate character to hold in reserve, maybe with that merit that allows you have your Daimon as sort of a mentor/magical spirit guide.

Atmajakki probably liked them, though I think they just somehow took solace in games about horrible misery to calm their own horrible misery.

i cant tell if this is oWoD or Chron

Awakening.

>I think they just somehow took solace in games about horrible misery to calm their own horrible misery.
Seems counterintuitive.

>However, don't tell me that a man embraced by the Ventrue in 1500s would be okay with embracing a modern-day tranny because vampires don't have gender, therefore they subscribe to gender queer theory.

Before there was a Humanity cost to embracing I could actually see it. Remember, one of the most common embrace practices is to find someone who will be completely loyal to you while also explaining new and strange concepts. Yes its also done with Ghouling, but the point still stands, and its still a thing that is done.

Doesn't nescessarily mean that every 1500s Ventrue is gonna agree with the concepts they are then informed about, but then again you never really know how the mind of someone who's been around and kicking for 500 years is gonna work

Could be anything from exceedingly embracing of new concepts (and running around in a cringeworthy display of crossdressing and misused terminology) to a violent reaction of a desire to kill because to them its something utterly repugnant, or anything in between those two extremes, and possibly some things outside of those two extremes.

Don't ask me, I know not the horrors of having body dysmorphia does to the mind and what forms of escapism might help it, friend.

That is a pretty vague question desu.

decide on the reason they are an apostate first is it their own choice or are they just a smelly bastard and other groups wont invite them?

Without proper training i expect they think magic is more like miracles that happen to them if they concentrate really hard, esp if they have a Daimon mentor, probably developing a Jesus complex or some shit.

Perhaps the jesus complex is the reason they are an apostate, who the fuck wants a somebody who things they a miracle worker and the 2nd coming around ;)

You should refer to the last thread with the guy who was on about Beast. You've got to hone your craft. Sidebar trolling and mage posting won't get improve your trolling. It's boring. Predictable.

Perhaps I expressed myself poorly. I meant that the motivation for his embrace, despite societal norms of the present and the time of embrace, is some sort of kinship because "Vampires have no gender too."

I'm not against trans characters, I'm against the whole "stunning and brave" thing WW has going on.

>Atmajakki probably liked them

Yeah but Atmajakki is yet another sycophant of the OPP forums, just like users like Arcane Arts who would suck the non-gendered dick of anything OPP releases for Chrod.

It would probably buy into a Chrod version of Gypsies if all OPP did was change the name to Romani and put 2 sidebars about transexuals every page.

Trannies have been through so much already though, the transformation into a vampire wouldn't be that hard.

Trannies make the best new vampires. They already have the experience...

I would by Romani 2e aswell.

As a rough outline I was thinking something like a guy who refused membership into the Orders just to be left alone, but still winds up getting involved in things. No Jesus complex, guy knows he's a wizard and that what he's doing is magic. That would fit more for an Ascension apostate, or just a Hollow One I suppose. Rationalizing reality warping as being the second coming sounds like a paradigm.

Honestly i'd give Romani 2e a peep, there was some.... okay ideas that could have been done when completly seperated from that awful book.

hmm, seems abit mish mash. Wants to be left alone but gets involved in things...

Pick one. Your either a hermit or not.

Not that guy but a player charecter kinda -has- to be someone that gets involved in things, he doesn't say that they do it willingly after all.

Fellow Changeling fans! Please help an user out and offer some feedback on this idea for a new hobgoblin:

pastebin.com/dSySwTJi

There are plenty of reasons why a character desiring to be left alone might still be involved in conflicts. Mages don't exist in a vacuum after all, and even their internal conflicts can be enough to swallow up people at the fringes.

This. The whole shtick is pretty retarded and to reflect american Problems in an RPG is at best retarded. Most European Continental first world nations don't have the toxic Climate between gays and the right Wing. The most extreme Position in the political discussion that matters in Germany for example is that you shouldn't call it marriage to protect the normal family and instead call it lifepartnership (little oversimplified nur our right Wing populists are lead by a lesbian).

So the whole leftie american shtick is really retarded. Don't bring your University campus Trans special snowflake Identity politics bullshit here. But then Bitch in the next moment that a Vampire that likes young clubbers and freshly embraced vamps (15-16 at the youngest) is a pedophile like a sexually repressed puritan.

Don't know shit about Changeling beyond the basics but I'm a sucker for spooks so I love it.

They can't even cope with the genitalia they were born or sex they were born with, desu I think they'd not be able to handle the battle with the beast any better. Embracing a trans is just dooming a troubled soul to the fate of a draugr.

This. We can pretend that trans people function as well as other members of society but thats not true. Suicide rates clearly show that trans people are not adapted and the overwhelming majority has mental problems.

For the overwhelming majority of clans trans people are not really an option. And they are not really Masquerade friendly either. Older Vamps have experienced enough societal changes to know that Trans people can be banned from mortal society very quick.

man, I'd really fuckin kill for a game

Shada#1090 on discord if anyone is looking for players

Okay so, Lions of Zion, obviously took a knocking during the holocaust but also fought hard enough to stay around. Now I imagine that the Lions of zion are gathering in Israel to see it protected from Nephandi/Technocracy intrusion aaaaaaaand... probably a clash between the Lions that protect israel and the ones still across the globe?

i was more implying that trannies are already beastly so the tranformation into a proper one wouldnt be hard. oh well.

Just read the Monday meetings notes.

Stewart Wieck was great blah blah blah, he created Mage the ascension, blah blah blah..

THEN I RAN IT INTO THE GROUND BY LETTING SATYROS BRUCATTO NEAR IT and he died.

is how it should have read..

Nevermind that the whole age of consent 18 is high even in the developed world.

Thank fucking god V20 is all I need.

Wouldn't embracing a trannie be a horrible idea? Kindred cease to develop mentally at the time of the Embrace, iirc. So as the statistics apparently show trans people as being in very poor health mentally, wouldn't they be stuck like that forever with no chance at getting better? And as the other user pointed out they would have the Beast foisted on them as well.

Um no. Vampires can learn shit after being embraced so they dont cease to develop mentally.

The whole static thing is no longer the case.

See This. After the playtest i am not going to touch V5 with a ten foot pole.

18 is moronic. There are countless really retarded cases were boys end up as sex offenders because of that. And if you meet someone in a club thats clearly a sign that a) He/She was able to cheat the bouncers so probably doesn't appear 13 b) He/She probably has the mental capacity to consent to Sex because the person in question is at least 16.

Developing mentally is different than learning. Like for example a vampire embraced at 20 would always behave like how he was when he was 20. I'm almost definitely sure that this is still the case in Requiem and Masquerade.

Child vamps stay Child like. They might learn etc. but they don't have a fundamental change of character. Puberty and aging is stuff that effectively doesn't kick in for static Vamps

No, this argument has already happened. 2e got rid of that shit.

The whole embraced as a teenage, act like teenagers forever is gone. get over it. Theres no excuse for you to play a fucking edgy whiney bitch forever now.

Well seeing as neither Thousand Years of Night or Blood and Smoke have a mention of people being stuck at their embraced level of emotional maturity, I would assume that "being stuck" would be a touchstone functioning like the one where the vampire holds onto the way things were in a desperate attempt to keep their Humanity.

So yes, in theory you could have a Trans vampire with an appropriate touchstone being stuck in the mental position they were embraced at for risk of humanity loss, but its by no means necessary

But muh vampire is dead inside and has no emotions...

which they also got rid off. Thank fuck, Again no more excuses for "im a emotionless badass" now.

I mean, Vampires still have emotions, they just also have the world's hardest nostalgia boner for their emotions before they were embraced

Thats kicking interesting shit from the Game because some players suck.

I think a Child that develops his intellectual capacity for 600 years but from a Child like position can be a real interesting character. The Character has a fundamentally different outlooks and tackles Problems in a very different Way. And whoever believe that children can't be even more dangerous than adults should read Enders Game.

If some fucker is a Problem player don't allow him a childvamp. That easy.

Well yeah, obviously a Child who was Embraced is gonna be an extremely different character than an Adult that was Embraced, but that Child Vampire is not forever stuck with the emotions of a Child. Yeah, they are probably gonna go sociopathic quickly from The Beast, probably have some serious issues otherwise, but they aren't stuck in the mindset of a child forever.

unless of course they got a touchstone which holds them to acting like such. Which is totally a thing that could be. Hell it could even be a thing you mandate a player to take if that is what would fit your game.

I guess we mean the same. I am just saying that a Child vamp has a VERY different Development. He doesn't experience puberty or other mortal Development steps. So he has to develop with a childs mindset as basis. With experience he will stop certain childish behaviours because they damage him but other child like view points will prevail because he has the brain structure of a child and Never had the changes of puberty.

>implying bad players just suddenly stopped being bad players just because they removed things from the game

Could you elaborate on this?

But under the Broken Covenants section in the Core book, it heavily implies that children stay the same. Though it could just be cultural as the children were just pushed out of society into the Children's Crusade. Which wouldn't give them any option to really develop and would just reinforce the mental state.

why a clash? How would other Lions clash with the Lions in Israel?

How do you guys design the shadow for your setting? Do you make a unique one for each possible gameline (mortal, Werewolf, Mage, etc.) or do you have a 'share universe' of some sort.

Is the book of spirits worth getting to help design the local shadow and it's politics?

Much like Arcadia and other locations that are shared in my CofD games I've run they are the same. But location and sometimes game line do color them.

The shadow is the shadow but it is colored by Location. Miller Park in Milwaukee's shadow is not the same (but has similarities) as the shadow in Al Capone's Hotel in Chicago.

Just like Mages take their Shadow Play through the cleaned up Tourist parts of Arcadia, and changelings come from the rest of Arcadia. Think of it as being the difference between going to visit real Mexico vs. Cancun Mexico.

Isn't Changeling Arcadia explicitly separate from Mage Arcadia?

Since vampire's fear of fire seems to be more instinctive/magical than rational, would they be more prone to frenzy/rötschreck in a town located inside a volcano's crater? Not rolling all the time, just a +1 to difficulty with maybe the chance to get used to it after some decades. What if they don't know it's a volcano?

That's not how a touchstone works. The only concievable touchstone for something that *makes* you act like a child would be a parent figure, ghouled and dominated into not questioning your status as an eternal child.

Yes. And Mummy Fate is an entirely different thing to both. There's not enough published about it to make guesses as to how it interacts with the rest of the WoD cosmology, thankfully.

Unless they've printed off that Changeling Arcadia is now an emanation realm or some other bullshit, I guess.

Considering the benefits of Order membership, your character must have some strong feelings to want to remain independent. Maybe they're paranoid, or really abrasive, or somehow they soured on the only Order that would fit them. The last option gives you backstory and plot hooks - what happened exactly?