/WFG/ Warhammer Fantasy General

I'm not here to ruin anything, merely correct untruths.

I'm fond of the unwinnable war. Struggling isn't pointless because it buys more time, but ultimately everything gives way to entropy.

>headcanon

You more actual fluff that disprove your lies.

Let me make an impression of you.

>MUH WEEDIES THEY ARE IN THERE IN DA WEEDEES

Spoiler warning they weren't in any White Dwarfs. The guy intentionally used some guy's rejected fanfiction and tried to pass it as fluff.

I know that feel, brah

He's getting an entire AoS faction based on him if it's any consolation.

That's some strange Henrich Kemmler you have here...

It was there to inspire heroism and the players to do epic shit. Like where the Combine are destined to dominate Earth and win, or the Archdemon was destined to overrun the world with Darkspawn.

Not only was it a single brief passage in a single book designed to inspire players to change the fate of a world via epic and dark adventure, it was also a passage forgotten and moved on from by Games Workshop. In those days Warhammer Fantasy barely had any fluff at all. WHFRP 1E was really the first true look into the deeper history of the Old World, its people, and its workings. There are other passages too which contradict each other or newer works and passages that have also been abandoned.

It was turned into a prophecy in the Everchosen book that Archaon discovered which drove him mad and convinced him wholeheartedly of Chaos' utter triumph and inevitable victory, and he sought to herald it. If the world was to be destroyed, he wanted to live in its wake with the victors as a demigod in his own right.

Of course, he failed.

It was an interesting passage, one first designed to get players interested in a hitherto unknown world, and later a passage in a story of man's own hubris and corruption, how one individual so great in stature and esteem could betray all things good in the world via his own pride and selfishness, and how it ultimately led to his humiliating defeat at the hands of those he once called brethren.

A fittingly poignant tale and a morbid prophecy in a grim world that people overly biased in favor of Chaos took and twisted into something it isn't. A shame, really, but like Archaon they're destined to fail. The End Times may've brought them the power fantasy they wanted, but now Chaos is even weaker in Age of Sigmar, though of course neither that nor the End Times is lore here, fortunately.

Like Archaon they've lost in the end.

Considering they've managed to ruin dwarfs TWICE with Fyreslaeyirs and the tophat meme faggots, I'm not getting my hopes up.

>Dark Eldars
>based on him
Hi shill

>it was also a passage forgotten and moved on from by Games Workshop.

Nope it was repeated throughout the edtions, before and after Archaon was created.

Damn, that asshole is still on it despite getting BTFO last thread?

Ignore Carnac's posts.

Anyone else excited for muh mice machine guns in TW2?

Fyreslayers aren't so bad. I've never been much of a fan of naked dwarfs, but they're basically just slayers and slayers are very warhammer.

?
I heard there was going to be Deep Elves in Age of Sigmar, are they going to be 40k instead?

>ignore the side of truth and justice

FIFY

ok chrischan

>Fyreslayers aren't so bad
>?
>guys I am not shilling here

Speak for yourself user, we've got weeks and weeks of ARG nonsense before they finally show them

What? Fyreslayers are pretty much just an army of slayers. While not to my personal tastes I think they're warhammery enough.

Ratling guns, best pun in the setting. Itsadotyl, Thorskins Isle, fuck all that. Ratling guns.
>guy claims it came from WD
>source bro
>guy claims it caim from unpublished fanwank
>does not question

Keep drinking that Koolaid, bra.

>AoS in a WFB Thread
That being said, the Fyreslayer models were abjectly horrible.

Alright, with all this canon bitching, here's a question for you all -

What is the biggest departure from Warhammer lore that you've used in your games?

Actually, yes. For some reason I've been loving the idea of Skaven vs. Bretonnia shenanigans for a while now, and the idea of machineguns chattering and taking down dozens of peasants while knights make desperate charges into lines of stormvermin fills me with a sort of joy.

I really hope they find a way to handle the way they're supposed to be able to threaten almost any faction and any time - maybe something like the Waaagh system where you get armies built once you get enough...Skaven-ness, but near certain cities. I hope that they start doing more with agents than they already are, having Skaven agents ruining buildings and using warpstone to poison the water and cause rebellions or something. I hope that with the whole addition of TW:W2, we get the setting amping up in scale and having more factions clashing over a wider area.

My main fear is that they'll include some of the shittier units the Skaven started to field towards the end. Like the Stormfiend. I cannot get over that thing.

>>guy claims it caim from unpublished fanwank
>>does not question

You can readily find it on the internet.
>verrahrubicon.free.fr/documents/WFRP_Realm_of_Divine_Magic.pdf

I was thinking something to represent the Skaven ability to infiltrate the undergrounds of cities and towns and even in caves and mountains. Maybe have the Skaven able to have settlements underneath other settlements, and when their power gets to a certain level, like the Waaagh system, you can try to overtake the surface from underneath its owner, but they can also try to attack you if you're discovered.

Probably be a bitch to implement but it'd be nice seeing a seemingly hostile and fortified land overworld, but then see all your rat hordes underneath it.

The guy claiming it was from the WD is shifty cunt that dodged any attempt to source his material even when given a link that was every old WD ever posted.

The guy who said it was from unpublished fanfiction was right. I didn't take his word on its own merit. I googled the source and got informstion on it. Downloaded it and reada what's in it.

The only fuck who is drinking the koolaid is you because you didn't question anything those anons said and is perfectly okay with supporting lies. You are the reason why the real world is in such a mess, you SHEEP!

not particularly

Skryre was my least favorite of the clans. I do look forward to killing lodse rats tho.

>Fyreslayers are pretty much just an army of slayers.
You have to go back with your homo friends
>, but they're basically just slayers
>no Slayer oath
>just slayers

>are very warhammer.
>picrelated
>very warhammer

I'm not arguing that it wasn't in there - but he doesn't question the notion that it was the first time that idea popped up. To be fair, it's a hard point to prove, but the fact that everyone just rolled over and accepted it gives the impression that it was just one guy talking to himself.

A lot of his posts do reek of samefagging.

So you throwing assumptions around like a total wanker.

And no it's not hard to prove. The WEEDEE cunt kept spouting source after source. And guess what? None of them contained what he was claiming. So why don't you make like WEEDEEH and disappear.

I know they won't do it, but it'd be cool if they reworked the siege system so that way so that there was a central square to the settlement that was actually a full circle or square, and the Skaven could pour in from the center while your troops were waiting expectantly on the walls, forcing a reverse face and having to fight into your own city rather than defending it from outside attacks. The Skaven still wouldn't have the same leadership bonsues and the areas to take would be spread out somehow so they couldn't win that easily, but it'd still be an interesting twist on the quite frankly droll sieges we have now. I'd rather play Medieval 2 than those.

>>, but they're basically just slayers
>>no Slayer oath
>>just slayers

Half naked dwarfs with crests is pretty slayer like to me. I don't know their fluff, but in aesthetic terms they'd fit in with the Fantasy setting easily enough.

>Half naked dwarfs with crests
>Half naked
>Half
Look closer
>is pretty slayer like to me.
Then go back to your general.
>but in aesthetic terms they'd fit in with the Fantasy setting easily enough.
>AoS player talking about Fantasy aesthetic

honestly this is the only way to do it for them. If even a shred of lore is to be had, skaven do not march in perfect battle lines filled with honor and discipline. They need to find a way to make in balanced so sink hole seieges are a thing.

>Look closer

Looks pretty half-naked to me. Their biggest divergence from slavers is that they have helmets.

Yes, they do. You can't fool me. I played Vermintide and read Headtaker (and other 8 peak novels) The Stormvermin march in perfect battlelines with good discipline accompanied with typical army chants.

>>stop assuming he's talking to the same person you weedee wanker cunt!!!

>only one person from this thread and the last uses this same vocabulary

I don't know - I wouldn't use them as rank and file slayers, but one could be converted to look like a fairly convincing Slayer Lord character.

Link isn't loading for me.

How does TW:W compare to the Gehemisnacht mod for Crusader Kings?

>What is the biggest departure from Warhammer lore that you've used in your games?

Archaon died screaming at Valten's hand.

Valten died by...someone. Not the Skaven. It was blamed on rogue members of the Cult of Sigmar who thought he was a fraud. This may touch off a war.

Be'lakor's annoying bullshit finally got him completely deep sixed by the Four.

There one person and it's me that's using WEEDEE to describe a certain guy from the other thread. This is his name now. The WEEDEE guy. Forever more. Whenever Gods of Law are mentioned I will make sure to remind all of the WEEDEE guy and the fact that Solkan is a lie

>Looks pretty half-naked to me.
>More than 50% of body is open
>half

Storm Vermin, sure. But they're not a good indicator of regular Clanrats or Skaven slaves.

Worked for me.

Try not to inculde the ">" when you highlight the link

>Valten died by...someone. Not the Skaven. It was blamed on rogue members of the Cult of Sigmar who thought he was a fraud. This may touch off a war.

What inspired you to make that change? I was a bit of a fan of the Skaven offing Valten - but I was less of a fan of how obvious it seemed. I went with a double blind in my game - Valten was offed by Ulrican's who made it look like Skaven.

Then youd know the bulk of the army is loads and loads and loads of clan rats. Stormvermin are, just by numbers, rare. The discipline is there but more in the form of directed savagery. They are about as trained as attack dogs, literally brutes that march to a beat. Queek is an incredibly odd case (not just the fact that hes mad and hears souls), but one of the very few skaven to march in front.
Alot of skaven battles are won by 3 things:
1. Black hunger. They literally turn full animal and rip and tear, often each other.
2. Skaven are much more scared of their superiors then they are of the enemy.
3. They had the ambush/trap/sabotage set up long before the battle.

Skaven do not like open field and will use underhanded tactics when ever possible. I love skaven, but cowardice and cheating are deeply ingrained into them.

That's all fine and good but what does Arch-Hammer have to say on this?

Mostly because I found that the plot of the Church-in-Exile in Marienburg and the general discontent of many priests with hardliners like Volkmar or Luthor Huss was wasted.

I thought it'd be interesting to have it seem as if Valten was killed ostensibly by agents of Esmer, with the actual reality not being certain. I figure it would bring tensions to a head regardless.

Still no luck - google is getting the same result. But cheers, I'll check it out another time.

I'm curious though - people arguing it wasn't Tzeentch who locked up Arianka - who do you think it was then?

Is...is that metal M on his belly actually in the flesh, Jaffa style?

The Doomstones were what caused the fall of the Dwarven Civilisation.

Good taste, user. Fingers crossed your game goes well, because I'd love to hear how that turns out.

What other plothooks do people think were underused or ignored?

For me, it'll always be Constant Drachenfels. One good book, and then dropped for Nagash.

>I'm curious though - people arguing it wasn't Tzeentch who locked up Arianka - who do you think it was then?

Going by what's in the previous thread, according to the user who knew what he was talking about, she was just some bitch goddess that was trapped in a box. Official GW material did not expand on that at all.

Comparing TW:W to Crusader Kings isn't a fair comparision - one has to somewhat awkwardly split the turn-based civilization side with battle maps and commanding units in a real-time strategy side, while the other focuses solely on the civilization side with far more detail.

Except WD was officially authorized by GW as was the Realms of Divine Magic, even if it was never published officially. It was still authorized.

You're really dead set on degrading and attacking and ignoring the Law Gods though, so I doubt it'll sway you.

Authorised my ass.

>Rolston wrote a complete manuscript for a magic system for Games Workshop to use in their Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay RPG, but they rejected it; Rolston's manuscript thus circulated on the internet for years.[5]

From the author's wiki. Now back to the real question. Why do feel the need to lie?

Why does no one answer MY QUESTIONS, crucial as they are.

I find it fitting that Chaos Gods of Law who are reported by a "reliable" source to be LIES to actually have a lot of lies spun about and for them by their fans/worshippers. It's almost like GW planned for this. Almost.

In WFRP 1ed, it's stated that an unnamed Chaos God locked her in the box. I'm curious - if people don't think it was Tzeentch, who do they think did it?

That's a fair point, but I'm not expecting perfectly unbiased opinions. I'm curious as to which people prefer from a Lore aspect - which feels truer to the heart of Warhammer?

What was your question? It's not like you're namefagging here.

>I'm curious - if people don't think it was Tzeentch, who do they think did it?

The Great Horned Rat for all we know.

>What was your question? It's not like you're namefagging here.

It's just one above the post. Why do anons feel the need to lie about things here?

I mean Ron sent a manuscript he wrote for the RPG to GW. GW read it and then rejected it. Ron then uploaded it to the web. This user thinks that the rejected manuscript is something authorised by GW and actual canon.

I guess if I sent my fanfiction to GW to the BL's writing contest, and they rejected it means its canon. What kind of logic is that? Damn fanboy logic or anti-fanboy for that matter. Why can't we act like adults?!

Is that his hair, or a plume on the helmet?

And if it is his hair, how the fuck do you get that helmet on? Does that helmet hinge open and closed?

Skaven were the real BBEG of the Old World.

Based necromancer is based. It was weird to see him name dropped in The Dresden Files.

What's the story with the ol' Cthulhu Mask?

>It's just one above the post. Why do anons feel the need to lie about things here? Why won't people answer my question?

Probably because it's got nothing to do with WFB and is really a deeper philosophical argument that doesn't really fit here.

>The Great Horned Rat for all we know.

What's your logic there?

No, it's not philosophical. It's a analysis of a certain subset of the fandom the so called "AntiChaos-fag". This sort is plagued by the need to rewrite history and spin lies to further their wicked agenda. We need to know what motivates them to do this. Why do they hate Chaos this much?

>What's your logic there?

No logic. I just thought it would be funny.

The problem is it's a White Dwarf issue that deals with Tzeentch locking her because he views her as a threat to the Chaos Gods. He deceives her somehow with one of his quintillion just-as-planned plans. To prevent Solkan from rescuing her and to keep Solkan busy so he doesn't just come after Tzeentch personally, he locks her coffin with his magic and dispenses the keys all throughout the Warp. His plan is never elaborated on, though it's speculated he wants to destroy her but can't, or wants to corrupt her. While Solkan goes out for vengeance Malal walks in and decides to use the whole affair for his own gain at the expense of Tzeentch and Solkan, and tries to find a champion to rescue Arianka for some unknown reason.

Say what you want regarding Realms, but White Dwarf WAS canon.

>but White Dwarf WAS canon.

Cite the ISSUE. We have WD collection link with us. Just give the issue number and we can check it. DO ET. DO ET NOW. All we want is the truth.

I am gonna be right back in 30 minutes or more. You better have the issue number by then or ELSE.

First off, it's pretty funny you'd say they're the ones twisting and rewriting history when that's exactly what the Carnac subset does, that or use Age of Sigmar fluff in WHFB discussions, and it's exactly what Geedubs did with TET where they rewrote Storm of Chaos, Archaon, and the Chaos Gods themselves, as well as a good chunk of Old World history.

Secondly, why do people dislike Chaosfags? Gee, I have no idea.

>hey guys chaos is unbeatable and will never lose haha sucks to be you bitches
>lol the world got blown up by chaos and you couldn't do anything isn't that neat huh
>everything of over two decades worth of content was destroyed in around a year by games workshop and their sudden infatuation with chaos
>if you think chaos won't win then you're a bitch headcanoner lol btfo
>hmm a whfb thread where chaos is being discussed better come in and post about belakor and call people degenerate retards for disliking age of sigmar
>chaos rocks and all of your factions suck and lose why even play lol haha chaos is the best

It really makes you wonder just why anyone would dislike a Carnac Chaosfag.

One last post before I take my temporary leave.

1) The question was about Chaos, not Chaosfag.
2) You are spinning lies and fanfiction about oldie lore that's before the ET lore. You got caught doing it numrous time. Just look at the previous thread.
3) You are trying to deflect blame from yourself instead on looking inward and repenting your wicked ways

And off I go. I better get the issue number.

>Based necromancer is based. It was weird to see him name dropped in The Dresden Files.
At least he was named dropped as the single most powerful human spellcaster who wad known to history. I mean he's basically just mentioned in one book and everyone says over and over that he was the absolute worst, including a character who's basically an evil deity of sorts herself.

I don't particularly care about who wins this argument either way, but I sure as shit hope I'm not the one reporting every single post he makes for so obviously willfully attempting to derail every single thread into an argument.

It came from a late eighties comic called The Quest of Kaleb Daark, by Grant & Wagner.

Go suck an egg.

I figured for awhile he was just genuinely arguing, even if he was wrong, and that it didn't deserve mod interaction, but seeing shit like makes it pretty obvious he's trolling, which is something anons have been saying about him for a long time. Hell, I don't even know if Carnac really is one user or just multiple shitposters playing off the Carnac meme, but it's safe to say it's offtopic shitposting and baiting at this point meant to derail and derail again.

>No logic. I just thought it would be funny.

Welp, it's either Slaanesh or the Horned Rat. WFRP 1ed states she was imprisoned by an unnamed Chaos God - and the only Chaos Gods that were named were Nurgle, Khorne and Malal.

With those out of the running, you're down to Tzeentch, Slaanesh and the Horned Rat - assuming you count him as a Chaos God.

Drop Tzeentch, as these Chaosfags seem want to do, and you've got a coinflip. And the idea of Slaanesh trapping a hottie in a crystal tomb has more than a few weird implications.

My gut says Kemmler will be coming back in later books, assuming we haven't already met him under a different name already.

We went through this last thread. It's reportedly not there. So yeah...

>My gut says Kemmler will be coming back in later books, assuming we haven't already met him under a different name already.
It's possible; Butcher tends to set up shit like that well in advance with foreshadowing.
Kemmler might be well and truly dead though; he's basically just background context for one particular book and isn't really mentioned again after that, unlike say, Drakul, who's been Name-dropped maybe five times in different situations and thus is probably going to show up at some point, if for no other reason then to finally get some details on Kincaid's backstory.

But we're digressing a lot here.

>as these Chaosfags seem want to do

Because there is no GW source that says Tzeentch imprisoned here. The only god that in warhams history went after multiple goddess and put them in various bondages is Nurgle.

Proclaiming reports is a bannable offense.

Yeah, reading through it now - we've got Arianka in the Crystal Tomb, but no reports of Tzeentch putting her there.

>But we're digressing a lot here.

True, but so is the rest of the thread. Also - Justin DuMorne is definitely still around.

>Because there is no GW source that says Tzeentch imprisoned here. The only god that in warhams history went after multiple goddess and put them in various bondages is Nurgle.

Nurgle is out of the running, being a named Chaos God at that point.

>True, but so is the rest of the thread. Also - Justin DuMorne is definitely still around.
Well that's not so much a guess as much as it is tacitly confirmed after Ghost Story; they outright said that there had to be more to his death then what Harry was seeing at the time because there's kind of no way the entire thing would have worked out the way Harry remembers it happening unless it was planned the way somehow.
So even if he's dead then him dying was a part of SOMEONE'S ong-term plan.

>Yeah, reading through it now - we've got Arianka in the Crystal Tomb, but no reports of Tzeentch putting her there.

See? This is what I am telling you. In the Anti-Chaosfag community lies are more important than the truth.

And Butcher flat out confirmed it with his D-E-D comments.

>What is the biggest departure from Warhammer lore that you've used in your games?

Biggest departure is having Boris Todbringer running the show after Karl bites it in the Storm of Chaos.

>What is the biggest departure from Warhammer lore that you've used in your games?

Oh also - no gods. At all. Everyone still worships/believes, but it's just the Realm of Chaos manifesting itself influenced by those beliefs. This includes the Chaos Gods.

That's a little difficult to answer, since each game only focuses on certain parts of the lore...I'd argue Gehemisnacht on how things work politically, the series of nobles and generals that make up the various factions, and even the scale of the area that it covers to some degree (TW:W I noticed made some changes to parts of Bretonnia and other areas to make for more fun gameplay or suchlike). Overall it is truer to the lore just because it doesn't have to break from it as much.

T:WW has some pretty good voiceacting, with Empire characters calling on a variety of deities (ignore for a moment how Bret peasants say 'god help us'), fun lines from retreating troops, etc. You get a vague sense through bits of fluffy text with technology and buildings and events how elements of the setting work which I find fascinating in some cases. But it makes more sacrifices for the sake of gamplay - Heinrich Kemmler is far away from the Grey Mountains he's supposed to be roaming, Azhag the Slaughterer is all the way in the Badlands instead of the Troll Country he's supposed to start in as far the lore goes. As Bretonnia you can pit Leoun against the Fay Enchantress (it hasn't literally happened to me, but Carcassone declares war a few times to no effect for some reason), and several of its dukedoms are oddly absorbed into others. The Moot is not an independent province, the Border Princes, Tilea and Estalia are each unified countries when in the lore they're gaggles of city-states and petty kingdoms. One of the first things you do in the Orc campaign is fuck over Gorfang Rotgut, a canon character - which isn't exactly lorebreaking since all characters eventually do that, but it is kind of like starting off an Empire game by bashing in Boris Todbringer's head.

>What is the biggest departure from Warhammer lore that you've used in your games?

Pretty tame actually. I used Boris in one quest where the players meet him hunting Khazrak after the Storm of Chaos which I guess contradicts him and the Panthers running down and killing off the rest of Archaon's army. I also include the Gods of Law and Malal in my games, but again I don't know if that necessarily contradicts lore or not.

Besides ignoring everything about the End Times, which is Warhammer lore (but not Fantasy lore), I keep things pretty close.

Reminder to gas chaos.

science gone too far

not far enough.

>"I ain't no chieftain's son" starts playing

...

>nyun nyun chaos wins lol
>no it doesn't!

Shut up faggots. Game's dead, headcanon reigns supreme now.

Hence you're both wrong

Also
>chaos achieving anything
>its prophecies not being self-fulfilling lies that somethime happen because soneone is idiot enough to believe them
>taking anything said or shown by creatures made of pure evil and deceit as true
Ok

The game and setting aren't dead, you jackass. GW is making a new warhammer RPG game.

And the issue wasn't about Chaos winning or not. It was about facts. We had more than one moron claim something and say it's total canon but when question about they went into the defensive and lied through their teeth until their lies were exposed. The WEEDEEH guy was the worse of them.

>GW is making a new warhammer RPG game.
Not GW but Cubicle 7.

Semantics.
It's licensed by GW.

THANES A CUTE

A CUTE!

GW is not releasing any more content about the game. There is no more official fluff, nor official rules.
The game as is, is dead.
Licensed content like the new WFRPG and Tw:WH are just a use of already-provided content to create something new. Thy're the same thing as reading again a book you already finished

You can make up your own stories in the provided setting, but that is headcanon territory.

You can play the tabletop game or the Rpgs all you like, but until GW starts making Fantasy again, it is frozen in the state it is now, so it's dead

He's not cute. He's manly

Elves are cute

>Implying it's first time
WHFRP comes back from the grave for like, fourth or fifth time?

Anything they put out is as canon as any other WHFRP publication since what... 1991?

>waaaa waaaa much ded gaem

kys

Appreciated. As far as Drachenfels goes, I think he got back-burnered because of his close association with a character GW didn't own.

You mean good aligned vampire mary sue?

still better than old star wars novels

UNDERWAY A CUTE
CUTE!