/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

Now tell them how it's secretly a superhero splat.

This bullshit was started because some moronic asinine thought Celerity could
>1. Somehow mentally gather what the Mage was planning on doing
>2. Defend against being spontaneously combusted, admirably.

Yes, they/he/she/it was an utter and unfathomable idiot.
Yes, the Magefags screeched a mighty screech

Could we please just drop it?

Just this once?
Please?

Wrong user. Don't put words in my mouth.

You were the first person to bring up celerity.

You officially restarted it now. Congrats.

Then stop using the same arguments.

You're not supposed to cross the Templates in the playable sense. They're meant to be used as NPCs.

If you seriously thought balance was a focal point for the development of CofD, you thought wrong.

FUCK OFF superhero fag

That was an opinion, not an argument.

Your standard Moros

Than how come all the other splats are relatively balanced with each other while Mages are a complete outlier and far above anything else?

>implying player crossover was ever a goal of these games outside shitty attempts like beast and at some point in the future crossover chronicles
>implying that splats don't all clash thematically and have little reason to actually be associating on a serious level
>implying mage has to be involved with your silly monster mash for some reason
2/10 got me to reply

Now tell them how this belongs in D&DG.

I mean, except now they have made several books with information on how to crossover.

A whole book of alternate time settings, with built in crossover.

Are developing a second of said books.

A whole splat dedicated to crossover.

And are going to make a crossover dedicated book.

But naw, not a focus at all.

Fear of the logical conclusion of you ideas means there is a flaw in your conclusions

>what is demon
>what is mummy
Don't forget that was why they made one system early on in nWoD development, even explicitly stating it in dev diaries!

You think Demon and Mummy are balanced with the other splats? You think Hunter is, or Geist? You are delusional, my friend.

Mages, Mummies and Demons are above and beyond everything else. Archmages even more so.

Likewise, Hunters are below much and more.

Balance was never a priority, the devs have said this before.

Except Mummy. But they also didn't seem to expect anyone to play Mummy.

If they did, it might have been good.

Your alternative Moros.

Actually it is because your conclusions have no effect on how I'm going to run my games. So having an argument about it would be pointless.

Mummy is good. You just have to play it much more like a WoD game was 'intended' to be played - all very personal, not much power wank at all. Then you go berserk and empty a small office building or something because they stole your mystic undies, then back to the personal aspect.

...

DaveB is an asshat.

No one cares what he says except his personal cult.

Every time he is quoted, it is him saying something so idiotic that you wonder how he still has a job.

Nobody fucking plays mummy and demons are only super Op if they go Loud which shouldn't happen once in a perfect game. Try again superhero fags

You know what FUCK YOU and your SHITTY FUCKIGN MAGE GMAE

balance should be a exist but no you have to storm in here and piss all over everyone "CELERITY IS USELESS HURR DEE DURR DURR" go fuck yourselves

You seem like you have good points, but you really don't. The Dark Eras books will have the potential for crossover, of course, but that doesn't mean player crossover is a focus. Beast actually does very little for crossover beyond trying to give a reason for it to happen at all, and the Crossover Chronicles will suck.

Strange seems like a weird example of a Mage.
In the comics he's a pretty high-tier Mastigos, but the MCU version of him is as close to street level as you can get with a Mage.
youtu.be/Iw1DTDSlQRE
youtube.com/watch?v=4jGkGBsvm_0

The only reason why he got hired was because he was a fanatical mage the ascension fanboy and sucked off it's writer.

Classic Dr. Strange is Archmage levels of bullshit

This isn't even impressive. A tip, you'll be taken more seriously and not immediately dismissed if you actually articulate like a normal person instead of a raging autist.

You know what OWOD did right? All the spalts hating each other all the time, to the point of instantly getting in a fight with each other should they ever meet. Of course, there were exceptions to this. (The Carnival, Blood Treachery etc....)

Wait wait wait...

>Will have potential

The book is already out, numbnuts. I've read it. Crossover is pretty big in there.

Beast was specifically stated as being made for crossover, that was part of the devblogs and all that.

And then you're just like 'the crossover book will suck'. Good to see that time magic is working out.

>Every time he is quoted, it is him saying something so idiotic that you wonder how he still has a job.
Like what?

Wonder Woman obvious Mastigos. chains and ropes + mental lasso

The only thing oWoD did right was end.

That didn't even take. An eternal failure.

No, the author just had a thing for bdsm.

I'm serious.

>Crossover is pretty big in there
Examples of player specific crossover stuff, please?

>Beast was specifically stated as being made for crossover, that was part of the devblogs and all that.
And in practice how much does it do? Can you show me?

>And then you're just like 'the crossover book will suck'. Good to see that time magic is working out.
It's a little rough, but accurate.

>Strange is only a high tier Mastigos
Try again wod fag

I was going to say 'yeah no duh, everyone knows that'. But I'm on Veeky Forums, not /co/. My bad.

Not saying he/she/they didn't, but it still fits the path really well.

It's Veeky Forums. Even without quests you can still find everything from poorly researched arguments on quantum physics to poorly disguised specialised fetish pornography. It's pretty easy to lose track of where you are.

But guys, am I right? Does this make any sense?!?!

He.

It's never really been discussed. Maybe in Geist, but I'm not a hundred percent certain on that and Geist as a gameline scares me.

Most theories involve them being an echo or the actual soul, yeah, bound by some strong emotion or desire. Demonically tainted ones like father lollipop from inferno are different, but there needs to be some serious pull for them to stay.

>maybe this will work
I'm playing a Moros, so now this question is mage related. Spam to your heart's content.

How would one rank the lines based on how strong they are then? Or even better, how does one rank them based on compatibility/?

Go back about two threads using the OP links. We had a million of those rankings.

Close, but not quite. I'm not totally clear on the how, but a ghost isn't identical to the original person, unless his corpus is in really good shape, which barring a Mage restoring it for him, isn't likely. The imprint stuff is pretty accurate, but the ghost won't always be coherent, or intelligent, or whole, etc.

Ghosts are *not* the actual person in question, no matter what they say, believe or act like. This is made clear by the fact that you can have ghosts form from someone that is very much still alive. As well, a person, dead or alive, can have multiple ghosts running around.

God Tier
>Archmage

Semi-God Tier
>True Fae
>Incarnate Beast

Overpowered Tier
>Prep Mage
>Loud Demon
>Fresh Mummy

Higher Tier
>Mage
>Sin-Eater w/Boneyard
>Demon
>Mummy
>Beast
>Sin-Eater
>Werewolf
>Changeling

Lower Tier
>Promethean
>Vampire
>Surprised Mage
>Prep Hunter
>Hunter

Rank them based on compatibility?

Easy to merge:

Geist (They deal with ghosts, ghosts are almost always present.)
Vampire (Vampires don't operate in daylight, but most creeps try not to anyway. They can deal with some spooky stuff using their powers)
Werewolf (They deal with spirits well, spirits are as ever-present as ghosts. They also touch some other spooky stuff if they have to.)
Promethean (While they can't stay in one place for a long time, they can fight anyone's antagonists pretty well, and they naturally want to belong.)

Okay Compatibility:
Changeling (Nothing stopping them from working with people but their own paranoia. But they don't bring a lot to the table when it comes to fighting other people's problems)
Demon (While they could help anyone out, their problems are unique, and they scare too easy.)
Beast (Sure their powers are built to be compatible. But playing with one is like playing with a Kinder in DnD, why do that?)

Low Compability:
Mage (Wankers)
Mummy (Either they are in maximum big balls mode and they throw the balance off, or they aren't being played because who cares.)
Hunter (They want to help, and tier 2 Hunters CAN help. But if they are Tier 2, they are probably also looking to cut your head off first chance they get. They are built to not be compatible in that they want to murder everyone else on the list)

I forget anyone? I'm sure I did.

God Tier
>Archmage

Semi-God Tier
>True Fae
>Incarnate Beast

Overpowered Tier
>Prep Mage
>Loud Demon
>Fresh Mummy

Higher Tier
>Mage
>Sin-Eater w/Boneyard
>Demon
>Mummy
>Beast
>Sin-Eater
>Werewolf
>Changeling

Lower Tier
>Surprised Mage
>Promethean
>Vampire
>Prep Hunter
>Hunter

ftfy

Well, holy shit. How does a person spawn a ghost while still alive? You have like my total attention. Please tell me that if a person goes through a decent amount of drama in a small amount of time that the emotional stress will spawn that ghost.

The other person will be able to answer better.

But say, for instance, you die and get brought back in some way. Magic, vampire stuff, whatever. You can easily have a ghost of yourself running around.

Not him, but Death 5 allows you to create a ghost, and model if after a person if you want.

One of the few constants for Ghosts is that you need to be a dead man to make one. We really don't know much else. You've got ghosts who are basically fa/tg/uys - completely apathetic, happy to sit in one place and be ignored - and homicidal maniacs who froth at the mouth as soon as someone comes within sightline.

One game line has a small section reading "Ghosts are born of death, the remnants of humans who
have perished in sudden or traumatic fashion. Many ghosts are
shattered, insensate phantasms locked into an eternal replay of
their deaths, but others are spiteful terrors fully cogent of their
lifeless torment and eager to share their misery. Ghosts are
common wherever humanity is to be found, clinging to physical
Anchors of their former lives, but they are drawn through Irises
to the Underworld."

And that's it. Geist goes a bit further into it, but it basically says that if your life was incredibly shitty and you are *not* at peace with it, yeah, you'll leave some form of ghost as your soul vacates. Wether that's you, your soul or a ghost. But ghosts are the second most common supernatural entity in the world of dakrness, so god only knows there are probably some living varieties.

Still waiting for text saying spellcasting is concealed just because a mage doesnt use a rote mud rack or high speech, provide text to say its concealed and I'll let you away with it otherwise casting without rotes or high speech is still noticeable

What's your favourite variety of nwod blood sorcery? Why?

Magic isn't noticeable if the Mage wills it so.

It would defeat the purpose of coincidental magic if it wasn't.

Shouldn't that be *autistic counting*?

So the order of events is:
In Initiative Vampire wins(likely wins barring Time shit, that dice roll can still fuck ya) because Celerity, Vampire sees Mage doing weird hand signs and speaking in a fucking strange language. From there the Vampire using that information must decide whether to fucking jump the Mage or run like hell out of sight. Unless the Vampire has seen this shit before, he isn't likely to know exactly the effect of the Mage's hand dance but could still act on undead instinct.

>coincidental
the is no coincidental in awakening
failed argument
try again

I think I get it now. This is some sort of weird digital homeland for you. You just like it because it gives you a sense of belonging, community, even though it's through a screen. Like conversing with someone while wrapping in a doona. And when it's quiet, you start trolling. Anything to make it lively again. Fucking phoneposter.

The Mage could simply Will the magic, but it's often much weaker and unreliable. That dice pool is so fucking low. However considering that the Nimbus of a Mage flares whenever they perform strong magic, I wonder if the Vampire's own Predatory Aura wouldn't be irritated.

...

Demon and Mummy aren't anymore crossover friendly. But since no one plays either we really don't get much shit posting about Demons curb stomping vampires and woofs.

Theban. I like Coils too, but I don't really consider them to be sorcery. Gilded Cage and cruac are also neat, but Theban is cooler.

It doesn't work like that. Supernal magic can be detected by mage sight, but otherwise you're shit outta luck. It's on you to prove that vampires have a mage sight equivalent that allows them to detect Supernal magic.

Mages are better in Initiative, assuming they're Acanthus or have an inkling of Time / Fate.

Most Mages aren't going to make their spellcasting obvious.

>"Two! Two entitled magefages! Ah ah ah!"

Count Count is still a Malk to me.

Brace yourself for more autistic screeching.

>Mages can cast spells in a single turn without making any outward sign.

Page 115 of Awakening 2E

>Magic is the act of transforming will to power. A mage needs no more than that, just the ability to think clearly enough to form an Imago is enough to work magic.

Page 119 of Awakening 2E

I'm buckling up as I type.

COWER FOOLS! MERASMUS IS HERE!

Well part of that is because Demon's balance is super weird.

Against normal mortals, Demons are OP. While I love Demon, I actually hate how much their powers read like GM fiat passed off to the players. It is annoying to ST, because Demons can just speed the plot along with so many powers that are just straight answers.

But outside of going loud, their other powers are sort of standard, last I looked.

And if the Demon goes Loud to fight say, a War form werewolf, the clock is ticking more for the Demon than the Werewolf. Because the Werewolf just gained new allies in the angels that are going to show up soon and wreck the Demon's whole life.

Going Loud is an awesome thing to show off when talking about the game, but the uses of it are narrow. If you have a player Go Loud and it isn't to A) Escape a terrible situation, B) really really wreck up stuff GM stuff or C) Take down the big bad because the fight isn't going to go their way... they have probably screwed up.

So bringing it up in a White Room situation isn't really genuine.

That said, I love Demon. I think it doesn't get talked about enough here, and I wish it was more popular.

Get out of here, it's not Halloween.

>In Initiative Vampire wins

But does he really? If anything, Mages hope you attack first on account of how Mage Armor functions. You waste your move and die.

Most Mages aren't Acanthus.
>Most Mages aren't going to make their spellcasting obvious.
Well that's the trade off, you're either covert and have a weaker/less reliable spell. Or your overt bring down the wrath of Supernal Angels because dear fucking god that Vampire has fangs! Yes there is a wide range of actions and responses between these two extremes, but that's why I don't like assuming things before I see it at the table.If a Vampire is paranoid or the Mage is stupid, it throws the equation way off what we expect.

Demon is boring as fuck and better off as a book or movie. Not to mention you can't even use all the good stuff because lol cover. Demon is like Ascension paradox level antifun

>Going Loud
I have a gif for that!

>Most Mages aren't Acanthus.
1/5 of all Mages are. Now add in the other Mages that took Time or Fate as their third Ruling. Or just the ones with that decided to learn it for their own benefits.

No single Arcanum is uncommon.

You're really overblowing things here.

What tier would the Mask be in?

There is no fucking trade off. It's as covert as you want it to be. It all amounts to your creativity.

if anything he's underselling the mage autism

are you retarded?
>covert and have a weaker/less reliable spell. Or your overt bring down the wrath of Supernal

Gee, I think the retarded one here is you. You're labouring under the assumption that Mages have rainbow sparks shooting out from their fingertips.

A spell can be as powerful as it is covert.

So an archmage with questionable wisdom?

What are Yandras, and why would I ever use them?

>Wizard covertly brings down the empire state building, having all its beams shatter by sway of Fate / Matter shenanigans

Weaker and less reliable indeed.