/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

What line is it from though?

Pre-history.
Mages protect villages from monsters.
Werewolves still have big papa woof to live with, and there's no gauntlet, but "border marches" between flesh and spirit.

Also Pangeans, who are half Spirit half Supernal beings (papa wuffle included).
And gigantic fucking crystal shards of time from The Time Before, which you can scry through into the shattered remains of Atlantis.
And Mages tearing out Pangean souls and breaking them into rocks to creates Demesnes'.

Dark Eras 1.
It covers the Neolithic era, 5000bce.

>Mage

Welp that killed any interest I had in it. Into the trash it goes.

Speaking of the border marches, there is one part about them that doesn't completely make sense to me.

So right now we have the gauntlet. You pass through the gauntlet, like a membrane, and you end up in the spirit.

In Sundered World, with the border marches, you cannot just go straight to the spirit. The border marches stand between, and you have to traverse the border marches to get to the shadow right?

But... if I pass through into the border marches, and I have to go down some border marches path/adventure to get to the spirit... how do I get to where I am in the shadow?

Like lets say I'm standing next to a tree, and I want to be at that tree in the shadow, because there is some funky wizbiz going on.

Can I just pass into border marches, then while still standing in that same spot, pass into the shadow? If that's the case, what is even the difference, why have the border marches pretend to be some realm between? It is the same thing with an extra step.

It's the Arcanum about fucking with Magic itself, and since Magic is truth, and the Platonic Forms which lie above reality, you can do weird stuff with them too.

Read liberally and with custom spells, it's fairly powerful. But so's everything else, and they can actually DO stuff on a day-to-day basis.

So enjoy your lie detectors, green lantern constructs, item imbuing, turning weapons into banes and ramming Angels with trucks. Also the normal shit you'd expect like enhancing yantras, dispelling spells, and hiding your magic from detection.

It's ultimately less proactive, and not that helpful for dealing with mundane situations.
Also it's annoying, as it provides almost no protections in high-grade Mage conflicts with than via Universal Counterspell.
And it can't even solve problems like Hung+Conditional Shifting Sands.

Oh grow up

I don't think the Shadow really "existed" in the Sundered World.

The Spirit World was pretty much entirely distinct, and not as much of a reflection of everything nearby.
I could be wrong, but that's the way I read it.

How powerful were Atlantean mages compared to the ones now?

In what world (of darkness) is being Hung a problem you need to solve?

Why should i have to like Mage? I don't like its themes, I don't like the game itself. I haven't liked any version of Mage, not the old world or the new world. It just doesn't jibe with me.

It says things are still reflections. Like when it describes the shadow version of cities, it talks about how fire spirits tend to defend the spirit side of a village, since everyone pays them respect on the material side.

Atlantean Mages didn't have to worry about the abyss, over-reach, sleepers.
Plus all their Arcana were effectively Ruling, and there was no need for Paths.
So literally anyone could become a Mage with enough effort.

No more powerful but I believe it was easier to Awaken, easier to reach the heights of power, and they just plain understood more about how the world works.

Also they didn't have to contend with the Lie.

No, Atlanteans were 'mini archmages' according to Dave. They had no Paths to speak of. All of the Arcana were Ruling to them. Nothing hampered them.

I can only imagine how powerful Atlantean Archmages were.

Not powerful enough to save Atlantis.

user, it was because of Archmages the Fall even happened. Why save the world when you can unite with a greater one.

But powerful enough to save reality. Have you thanked best girl Gate today?

She is doing a pretty shit job.

Supernal overload when they overreached was probably pretty bad, but not as bad as Paradox can be or rather, could be, if they'd made Paradox more casually relevant.

Her job is done. She stopped the Abyss from swallowing up reality right away.

Yeah. It is bad from both ends with Paradox.

Like, not only do you HAVE to screw around overreach to even worry about it.

But then you could easily take a little damage and it is all K.

Thanks DaveB, for making Paradox boring.

Thanks. There's a bit o text somewhere around that image I've been hunting. I'll go start reading.

Paradox is better than ever before. It was too harsh in Ascension, and made magic boring because you never wanted to risk anything.

You're more than likely only complaining because you're one of the 'muh balance' freaks.

Who the fuck is talking about ascension?

It is worse than Awakening 1e. No one cares about Ascension.

The spirit world would still be a mirror, but there would be sort of a world between worlds, a wild place, not quite fully grounded reality, not quite fully shadow spirit. Villages and civilized lands were islands of stability/firmament echoed in the shadow, to a point, and then the shadow itself was of course its own thing as it got deeper beyond, with the wild/border marches between them.

I get the impression that these border marches were huge, they WERE the wild, the wilderness to a large extent. And the sin of the wolves fucked things up bad. Father wolf WAS the wild in a sense and in killing him, the Forsaken committed a much greater sin than "simple" patricide. I'm not saying the Pure are right.

But the Pure are right.

Ascension 1e was fucking amazing, before it got Brucattoed.

>they think Paradox has no bite in Awakening 2e

A telltale sign that certain peeps haven't actually played the game

It's better than Awakening 1e. I always hated that every vulgar spell induced Paradox just by being vulgar. I'm glad that shit is gone.

I've been persuaded by your amazing explanation of your stance, user.

I see another user has taken up the torch of Gateposting

I want to play Deviant, so I'll buy it when it come out, how fucked am I?

Based on how many people actually play Mummy and Demon.

You're pretty boned.

Now there are at least three of us! All hail best girl.

Literally the most funded kickstarter rpg project ever after 7th sea and Exalted 3e. Brucatobux $$$$.

Fuck, I'm already having a hard time pushing Geist

Buddy, we all know damn well that no one who posts about Mage here has played the game. You can't get a group, I find the game a farce, but we've all read the book and know how it functions. If you are complaining about the "bite" of paradox in 2e you are being fucking ridiculous, because it has been gutted compared to even 1e, and is a complete non-factor compared to Ascension. If you are suggesting it has bite, then your idea of paradox having bite is that it even exists as a possibility, which is no surprise, because well, you're a would be MtA 2e player.

Oh no, the "nobody has played anything" user. Fuck off.

Is there really such a dearth of CofD games? I'm in two Mage: the Ascension and one Werewolf: the Apocalypse game currently.

I honestly can't get why folks don't like Demon. It's playing rogue Matrix agent. It's fun.

I mean, there are probably plenty of games of it out there.

But people seem to generally stick to the big three + changeling. They are the most popular.

So it is just so niche that it would be surprising to find a game unless an ST you already play in games for decides to make one.

Congrats user, you (I assume) found the unicorn WoD game that isn't filled with retard, furries, edgelords or tumblr.
It isn't a lack of WoD (Even though it is pretty niche compared to PF or D&D) it's just that 90% of them are shit

>Buddy, we all know damn well that no one who posts about Mage here has played the game
No "we" don't all know. I hate that this is becoming a meme argument.

FATHERS THRUSTING COCK INTO ORGANIC LOCAL FOOD!

No. There isn't. It's often better to play them with a real life group, though, one you've played with before and like. But it's like that with every game, I guess. The internet brings out dickheads, especially into tabletop.

How 'hot' is the conflict between seers/pentacle?

Are people being shot on the streets? Shot for walking into the wrong neighbourhood? Are people mostly just staring at each other angrily while all the nameless/apostates on the side sit around with lawnchairs and drink heavily waiting for the show to start?

It varies. In some cities it can be all out war. In others, a stale mate or a cold war type deal. And then there's Pentacle dominated cities and Seer dominated cities.

so how is everyone liking the new hunter the vigil stuff they posted?

I'm a little leery of some of it, but a lot of it looks solid. I'd prefer torturing other supernaturals be higher on the list of sins and maybe have something about it being for pleasure instead. Other than that: it's pretty much what I expected. Especially like the whole 'lost to the hunt' thing measurement.

All Mages have access to nukes. All. Of. Them. They *know* this very, very well. They understand what sorts of bullshit they can do with magic and they understand what every other mage can do as well, a lot of which they can't do themselves. Hell, it's the main reason the consiliums even exist. So the 'war' is usually cold and fought through proxies and patsies.

Is there a practical way to play a blind Awakening Mage? I'm not sure if Mastigos would be the best way to go.

Sure. Mage sight can be interpreted as anything. Someone could use space as a form of echolocation, or just constantly scry everywhere they go. Life 1 would let them immediately know the location of every living being nearby, forming a sort of 'web', especially in more 'natural' areas. That sort of thing.

A Forces Knowing spell of light can literally act as eyeballs for you. Alternatively you could use sound and get echolocation.

Oh god, David Hill is shilling his new horrible book about the supernatural on twitter. Someone fucking get at him.

What is it?

Not your personal army?

Apparently it's about 'hunting monsters in the gig economy'. And killing skinheads, apparently, 'cause that's what monster-hunting protagonists do.

He needs to seriously reevaluate himself.

If by personal army you mean the three guys who live down my block that play WoD in person only? Yeah.

No, it's just that the MtAw 2e asshats here are known to be the pariahs of the gaming community. Add to that the fact that every time they've been called on to answer questions about actual gaming related experiences, one can expect dead silence, every goddamn time. It's all theorycraft and dickwaving, with liberal amounts of DaveB references every thread, but nary anything genuinely play related.

>I hate that this is becoming common knowledge.

Fixed that for you.

It IS a meme argument, every time someone says "No one plays Mage", a shit ton of people come out of the woodwork and point out they are in fact in mage games.

Hell I'm running one of Ascension right now. I'm having fun and everything.

Yes but why not just ask a Life Mage to fix your eyes?

It's not like their lack of actual play related experiences stands out. Very little play related stuff is posted here, period. And let's be real, if they did post it you would accuse it of being made up.

By the way, I posted earlier in answer to the favorite antagonist question with the Cult of the Red word. We ran that game with Boston Unveiled adapted to 2e and changed a bit so that there were more Adepts and Disciples instead of nearly everyone being an Apprentice if they weren't a Master. My group commonly runs Awakening 2e since it came out.

I've always been a bit confused about how healing someone else works. Is it just done once they're healed? Do you have to hold the spell in your pattern? Do they? If it's dispelled do their injuries return? We've always just treated it as being done.

They've moved goalposts to specifically target people who use the most recent version of Mage as a matter of course in arguments.

Regenerating organs via a strict reading of the rules is possible at Life 5, but must be maintained.

Add in creative thaumaturgy, GM permission, and adding on animal regenerative properties?

Who knows.

It's a troll thing. You see it in the other generals too. The only difference here is that it requires anecdotal evidence to disprove, rather than a book reference like most threads.

At least the only person who posts this shit uses the same pictures every time.

Personally I'd allow it as a +2 reach effect on Life 4 'regeneration'.

Mostly because at that point you'd already have so many other ways to permanently regenerate a body part that it's a pointless hurdle.

And add 'ETERNAL LIFE' as one of the side effects of an indefinite Regeneration spell. You know, for bait purposes.

There's probably some Archmaster who has a combination dynamics/entities spell that routinely follows people who age well around until they hit 200 or so, then creates an antimagic zone around them to let them die horribly. Then replays it in the Golden Road as some sort of bizarre version of Funniest Home Videos.

Haunted Grimoire (Spirit •••• + Prime •)
Practice: Patterning
Primary Factor: Potency
Cost: 1 Mana
Withstand: Total Arcanum dots used in the rote and Rank

Suggested Rote Skills: Crafts, Intimidation, Occult
The mage binds a spirit into the a Grimoire, writing its Essence into the vessel's Pattern. Unlike a fetish, a haunted Grimoire doesn't host the spirit's Numina or Influences, nor does it have an Essence pool. Instead, the spirit is a part of the words and runes themselves, trapped inside the Supernal symbols. The Grimoire gains the Resonant and Open Conditions for that spirit, which is a Lasting effect of the spell until resolved as usual.
Whenever someone casts a rote from the Grimoire, she automatically increases the rote's primary factor by the spirit's Rank instead of by her own Arcanum rating minus one, but the spirit has the chance to escape by riding the vessel's Mana out into the world. It rolls its Power + Finesse in a Clash of Wills against the caster. If the spirit succeeds, the spell ends and the spirit is released into Twilight, although multiple spirits can be bound into a Grimoire with separate castings of this spell.
Whenever someone memorizes a rote from the Grimoire, the spirit has an opportunity to possess her, again rolling Power + Finesses in a Clash of Wills. The mage learns the rote regardless, but if the spirit succeeds, it transfers the Resonant and Open Conditions from the Grimoire to the mage and may immediately use the Possession Manifestation even if it normally couldn't, at no Essence cost.
Casting this spell constitutes an Act of Hubris against Understanding Wisdom.

Why would I ever cast this?

Where is it from? I can't see why you would, unless you practiced a really weird legacy or had no idea what you were doing.

theonyxpath.com/grimoires-mage-the-awakening/its from the Grimoire thing Dave B just posted.

Can I make the spirit friendly, or is this just a spell you cast to troll people?

How strong of a sympathetic connection do mages have with the aeons if they have a connection at all?

Could a 2nd degree mastigos adept teleport himself across the astral to one of the towers if so inclined?

I suppose it's meant to be one of those stupid things you aren't supposed to do but can seem like a good idea in some circumstances. Using a haunted grimoire, that is.

"blah blah do whatever you want its your world of darkness blah blah"

I'd guess a spirit you routinely fed essence might let you get away with not trying to escape.

>unemployment, sudden relocation, house flooding, illness, and gods laughing at me
These were the issues that made Dave MIA? Sounds rough.

Well now that I think about it,

For a good mage, the spell is terrible, but for a weaker mage, one who wants some free Potency its not that bad.

Normally you get your Arcamum -1 for free for the spells you cast, right? Well for your primary thats going to be 1-2 for most starting mages. With this book, you get the spirits rank.

what if you want to, lets say Cast Prime 2 Ward using this book?
If you get prime 2 and don't use the special book you get 1 free Potency. So shitty short ward.
If you use the book and its got a rank 4 spirit in it, you get 4 potency for free, on TOP of the normal bonuses. All you gotta do is beat it in a clash of wills. You could do some real magic now that I think about it.

>Why would I ever cast this?

As a trap, to get some stupid motherfucker you don't like possessed by a spirit/ghost who proceeds to ruin the fucker's everything.

>Legacy pedagogue

"Hello, fellow Nameless! I, who am totally not a scelestus, have for you here this *fascinating* daimonomikon! Free of charge! Enjoy! Complete legacy! Get your complete legacies here!"

And then laugh all the way to the arcane experience bank, move to the next town, repeat, hide your resonance and hope nobody things to just use the book to annihilate you.

True Fae have a skewered set of emotions, love and hate being the same thing to them, for instance.

So what would happen if a Mind Mage showed them what it feels like to *think* and *feel* as a human? Would they feel regret over being Keepers?

Nothing. They'd need a new morality trait.

I think first we would need to determine if True Fae have minds to be manipulated.

I would argue they don't. They are less beings, more entities. They exist as a merging of concepts and titles, that act according to what they should be.

They don't think, they do.

No, they have minds. Even spirits have minds.

Spirits have more a claim to having minds, so that isn't really surprising.

But that said, since the Mind arcana can probably get it done anyway if the ST says so, I would think that introduced thoughts would be quickly rejected.

It could just lead to them pushing out the invasive 'inceptioned' thoughts. In the weird case, they might take it into their being, and Caring might become part of one of their titles. In which case, prepare for something weird to happen. They would probably feel more regret than any human being could, becoming SO regretful, being the most regrettingest.

If they actually became nice, and thoughtful, they would be quickly banished by their fellow True Fae (that's just not schway).

But just as likely, they twist their caring and feeling into something dark and terrible. I mean, if they need to care and feel for their captors, they should take better care of them right. But what if they let them out into that dark and scary Hedge? They might get hurt. We can't have that. Plus the real world is so terrifying and dangerous, we can't have them be there either.

The only logical thing to do, is to hold them closer. Treat them 'better', but that just means don't harm them. Keep them so close, and never let a single one escape.

I think anything that is self aware would be eligible for having a conscious mind.

If the True Fae aren't aware, then that just makes them a tad bit creepier.

I picture the Cat in the Hat when I think of True Fae making attempts at not!benevolence.

They quickly overstay their welcome.

If the True Fae don't have minds, a Master of Mind could always make one for them. Though I wonder how well they would process the experience.

Well they're not self-aware in the sense that a violent psychotic isn't fully self-aware (except Fae aren't psychotic, they're Psychosis)
But they definitely have a sense of self

It's the ONLY thing they have, or can even grasp.

This guy has it right. Nobody has to like anything. I'd much rather enjoy a neolithic Hunter game where you protect your tribe from monsters with hard-assed caveman badassery.

Having your ooga-booga shaman BTFO-ing everything is lame.

What Clan would the vampires from The Lost Boys belong to?